Speculation: Caps Roster General Discussion (Coaching/FAs/Cap/Lines etc) - 2022-23 Season Part 2: Regular Season

[twabby]

My point is that he hasn’t out played some of the guys he is competing with for a roster spot this pre-season.

He's played 2 games and 30 minutes this preseason. What exactly are we expected to glean out of such a sample size? Connor McDavid has had awful 30 minute stretches in his career. So have Ovechkin and Crosby.

It's kind of tough to take any of this analysis of sleepy preseason games seriously.

Suppose he scores tomorrow night and generally looks good. Does that quell any concerns about his play? Similarly if Protas has a terrible game the next time he sees action how does that affect perception of him?

Just give them each significant regular season time and see how they do! It's pretty simple! Why do we need to guess based on some stupid preseason games and some quotes about putting on 5 pounds of muscle?

 

[SecretaryofDefense5]

He's played 2 games and 30 minutes this preseason. What exactly are we expected to glean out of such a sample size?

Connor McDavid has had awful 30 minute stretches in his career. So have Ovechkin and Crosby.

Wrong or right I assume the coaching staff doesn’t see him as a player with a guaranteed spot and thus they will compare that sample vs others like Protas and Snivley. Could be wrong but I get the feeling Lavi and co do not see him as an established player yet so he doesn’t have the luxury of having a meh pre-season yet like the players you mentioned.

 

[twabby]

Wrong or right I assume the coaching staff doesn’t see him as a player with a guaranteed spot and thus they will compare that sample vs others like Protas and Snivley. Could be wrong but I get the feeling Lavi and co do not see him as an established player yet so he doesn’t have the luxury of having a meh pre-season yet like the players you mentioned.

And that's fine. As I mentioned earlier Protas had a similar impact as McMichael last regular season so if they judge him to be the better fit to open on the roster over CMM I'm 100% for it.

All I'm saying is that we shouldn't be drawing any real conclusions about McMichael's progression from rookie to sophomore based on a few preseason games and that he should get a legitimate shot this regular season unless guys like Johansson and Eller absolutely kill it, along with Protas or whoever else. He showed plenty last year to indicate he could be an impactful player going forward:

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

This debate shouldn't be about CMM, Snively, and Protas (and AJF) fighting for the same spot. Guys like Johansson shouldn't be here blocking their spots, and players like Eller and Sheary should be just as much at risk at risk of seeing their ice time chopped or being moved out of position as the less proven players. Heck, even Oshie should be a candidate to have his minutes managed and see maintenance games over the course of the season (especially if they want to keep him off of LTIR for once). This team isn't going to succeed based on who was the best player from 2016-2019, it needs players that are going to be able to exceed expectations (and exceed their paychecks) from 2022 onwards. There should be a path forward for multiple young players to displace middling veterans and guys on the downside of their career, rather than turning into a contest about who has two or three good pre-season games.


He was scoring more frequently at even-strength than TJ Oshie and Nicklas Backstrom last season. How is that not forcing the issue? He would score goals and still find himself benched later in the same game.

It will be next season when they all go FA. For the Kids it will be hard to find ice time this season

 

[DWGie26]

Straying back to the roster and upcoming cuts, I wonder if the Caps will actually send both Protas and McMichael down to Hershey. Gives them a lot of firepower down there and they can get lots of minutes.

In turn, you can keep Snively, Mojo, AJF, and Leason and not risk them to waivers. Injuries will happen early and then you can call players up. In short it solves a numbers crunch and developing Protas, Lappy, CMM, is more important than developing AJF and Leason so they can stay with big club.

Lapirrie is slated to play wing in Hershey already. So like down the middle could be CMM, Scarbossa, Protas, and Rybinski.

I’m not sure they would do this but it solves a lot of business, roster, and development challenges.

 

[RedRocking]

He's played 2 games and 30 minutes this preseason. What exactly are we expected to glean out of such a sample size? Connor McDavid has had awful 30 minute stretches in his career. So have Ovechkin and Crosby.

It's kind of tough to take any of this analysis of sleepy preseason games seriously.

Suppose he scores tomorrow night and generally looks good. Does that quell any concerns about his play? Similarly if Protas has a terrible game the next time he sees action how does that affect perception of him?

Just give them each significant regular season time and see how they do! It's pretty simple! Why do we need to guess based on some stupid preseason games and some quotes about putting on 5 pounds of muscle?

Let me see if I can be of any help here. I really doubt coaches are making decisions based solely, or even mainly, on these lazy pre-season games. You’re absolutely right that roster spots shouldn’t be decided on such little ice time. Especially with fewer and fewer preseason games - 6 is silly.

But, that rather a lot depends on what’s going on behind the scenes in practices, what certain goals the coaches set for guys during camp, etc... You can call that stuff an appeal to authority - but the fact is, they are privy to WAY more information than us.

I heard Lavi talking positively about CMM on the radio stream during one of last week’s games. He was excited that CMM stayed in DC last year, got that experience, and is looking forward to his play this year. I know it’s blah blah coach speak, but he seemed a bit pleasantly surprised with Protas’ play (“making our decisions even harder”).

Still, in this last week when the lines start to coalesce for opening day, CMM is in, and Protas is not. So I don’t think anything is settled yet (or needs to be anytime soon really - let ‘em both have time in the regular season). Maybe Protas is that RB that surprises in the NFL preseason and the staff stashes him away on the practice squad (i.e. Hershey).

Some of this speculation about CMM’s work ethic (or lack thereof) based on 30 mins of preseason, and his stated weight gain - is going a bit too far and grasping at straws, imho. We have no idea how these guys are being evaluated in practice, and what the coaches expectations are for each guy.

And it honestly seems, from Lavi’s words, that CMM has earned some measure of respect from his play last year (not to mention his draft pedigree), and may not be in some imaginary dog house just cause Protas has exceeded expectations. I’m personally of the belief that CMM was more sheltered, rather than held back, last year.

Sorry I don’t have a link to this spiel from Lavi as I just heard it during intermission.

 

[SecretaryofDefense5]

Let me see if I can be of any help here. I really doubt coaches are making decisions based solely, or even mainly, on these lazy pre-season games. You’re absolutely right that roster spots shouldn’t be decided on such little ice time. Especially with fewer and fewer preseason games - 6 is silly.

But, that rather a lot depends on what’s going on behind the scenes in practices, what certain goals the coaches set for guys during camp, etc... You can call that stuff an appeal to authority - but the fact is, they are privy to WAY more information than us.

I heard Lavi talking positively about CMM on the radio stream during one of last week’s games. He was excited that CMM stayed in DC last year, got that experience, and is looking forward to his play this year. I know it’s blah blah coach speak, but he seemed a bit pleasantly surprised with Protas’ play (“making our decisions even harder”).

Still, in this last week when the lines start to coalesce for opening day, CMM is in, and Protas is not. So I don’t think anything is settled yet (or needs to be anytime soon really - let ‘em both have time in the regular season). Maybe Protas is that RB that surprises in the NFL preseason and the staff stashes him away on the practice squad (i.e. Hershey).

Some of this speculation about CMM’s work ethic (or lack thereof) based on 30 mins of preseason, and his stated weight gain - is going a bit too far and grasping at straws, imho. We have no idea how these guys are being evaluated in practice, and what the coaches expectations are for each guy.

And it honestly seems, from Lavi’s words, that CMM has earned some measure of respect from his play last year (not to mention his draft pedigree), and may not be in some imaginary dog house just cause Protas has exceeded expectations. I’m personally of the belief that CMM was more sheltered, rather than held back, last year.

Sorry I don’t have a link to this spiel from Lavi as I just heard it during intermission.

Agreed. I have to say though if Protas doesn’t make the roster than their whole “you have to earn it” spiel about making the team will become laughable. The dude has played his ass off and deserves to be on the roster.

 

[Hivemind]

It will be next season when they all go FA. For the Kids it will be hard to find ice time this season

You could have said that last year too. Then they decided to re-sign Johansson, re-sign Dowd, re-sign Sheary, keep Eller, keep Hagelin, trade for Connor Brown, and sign Strome. And this is in spite of knowing that AJF had already been claimed on waivers once, that Leason and Snively would have to pass thru waivers to be sent down, seeing Lappy make the team out of camp last year, having CMM wear a sweater in 68 games, and having 33 games of Protas in the NHL. So none of these camp contenders were exactly a surprise.

Individually, each of these moves is fine (I think the Strome addition is a big value add, for instance) - but the net result is no space for kids. And if Lavi and GMBM keep leading the team the way they are, I'm not sure it will be any different next season.

 

[um]

nevermind

 

[Ovechkins Wodka]

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

#6 in goalies. I hope they are right!

 

[HTFN]

Let me see if I can be of any help here. I really doubt coaches are making decisions based solely, or even mainly, on these lazy pre-season games. You’re absolutely right that roster spots shouldn’t be decided on such little ice time. Especially with fewer and fewer preseason games - 6 is silly.

But, that rather a lot depends on what’s going on behind the scenes in practices, what certain goals the coaches set for guys during camp, etc... You can call that stuff an appeal to authority - but the fact is, they are privy to WAY more information than us.

I heard Lavi talking positively about CMM on the radio stream during one of last week’s games. He was excited that CMM stayed in DC last year, got that experience, and is looking forward to his play this year. I know it’s blah blah coach speak, but he seemed a bit pleasantly surprised with Protas’ play (“making our decisions even harder”).

Still, in this last week when the lines start to coalesce for opening day, CMM is in, and Protas is not. So I don’t think anything is settled yet (or needs to be anytime soon really - let ‘em both have time in the regular season). Maybe Protas is that RB that surprises in the NFL preseason and the staff stashes him away on the practice squad (i.e. Hershey).

Some of this speculation about CMM’s work ethic (or lack thereof) based on 30 mins of preseason, and his stated weight gain - is going a bit too far and grasping at straws, imho. We have no idea how these guys are being evaluated in practice, and what the coaches expectations are for each guy.

And it honestly seems, from Lavi’s words, that CMM has earned some measure of respect from his play last year (not to mention his draft pedigree), and may not be in some imaginary dog house just cause Protas has exceeded expectations. I’m personally of the belief that CMM was more sheltered, rather than held back, last year.

Sorry I don’t have a link to this spiel from Lavi as I just heard it during intermission.

Agreed. I have to say though if Protas doesn’t make the roster than their whole “you have to earn it” spiel about making the team will become laughable. The dude has played his ass off and deserves to be on the roster.

Sounds like textbook Laviolette so far. Last year McMichael arguably earned more than he got, this year Protas could reasonably "take" his spot but it looks like he won't because... earn it more.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

#6 in goalies. I hope they are right!

Pretty amazing they got 100 points last year with all of the injuries and a .898 save percentage, which was worst among all teams who qualified for the playoffs.

New Jersey with Vanny came in at 19th and Sammy with Toronto 23rd.

 

[g00n]

He's played 2 games and 30 minutes this preseason. What exactly are we expected to glean out of such a sample size? Connor McDavid has had awful 30 minute stretches in his career. So have Ovechkin and Crosby.

It's kind of tough to take any of this analysis of sleepy preseason games seriously.

Suppose he scores tomorrow night and generally looks good. Does that quell any concerns about his play? Similarly if Protas has a terrible game the next time he sees action how does that affect perception of him?

Just give them each significant regular season time and see how they do! It's pretty simple! Why do we need to guess based on some stupid preseason games and some quotes about putting on 5 pounds of muscle?

Once again, why invoke Ovie or Crosby when they clearly have mountains of evidence throughout their entire careers to not even need an evaluation period, much less worry about 2 preseason games?

What has CMM done to even come close to invoking such a hyperbolic whatabout?

Yes, it's too early go give up on him as a player. Way too early. He's 21 with 69 NHL games.

No, we can't use people like Ovie and Crosby as peer comparisons. That's just ridiculous.

Everything beyond that is just opinions based on limited exposure to team activity, including preseason games and press clippings.

 

[Langway]

Straying back to the roster and upcoming cuts, I wonder if the Caps will actually send both Protas and McMichael down to Hershey. Gives them a lot of firepower down there and they can get lots of minutes.

In turn, you can keep Snively, Mojo, AJF, and Leason and not risk them to waivers. Injuries will happen early and then you can call players up. In short it solves a numbers crunch and developing Protas, Lappy, CMM, is more important than developing AJF and Leason so they can stay with big club.

Lapirrie is slated to play wing in Hershey already. So like down the middle could be CMM, Scarbossa, Protas, and Rybinski.

I’m not sure they would do this but it solves a lot of business, roster, and development challenges.

No one should care about losing AJF or Leason to waivers. Protas has earned it. Lapierre playing wing initially, if true, sounds bad.

 

[twabby]

Once again, why invoke Ovie or Crosby when they clearly have mountains of evidence throughout their entire careers to not even need an evaluation period, much less worry about 2 preseason games?

What has CMM done to even come close to invoking such a hyperbolic whatabout?

Yes, it's too early go give up on him as a player. Way too early. He's 21 with 69 NHL games.

No, we can't use people like Ovie and Crosby as peer comparisons. That's just ridiculous.

Everything beyond that is just opinions based on limited exposure to team activity, including preseason games and press clippings.

If truly elite players can put up poor 30 minute samples, then surely it's reasonable to expect anyone to put up poor 30 minute samples. So what new information has truly been gained from these preseason games?

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

It’s quite obvious the game time is only part of the evaluation process. So little doggie, let that bone go and stop trying to find excuses for your favorite new toy.

If he was otherwise dominant in camp, he’d likely be getting more ice time to show better.

 

[g00n]

If truly elite players can put up poor 30 minute samples, then surely it's reasonable to expect anyone to put up poor 30 minute samples. So what new information has truly been gained from these preseason games?

If people sneeze and rabbits sneeze then surely rabbits are people.

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Thank the lawd there’s a game today so we can talk about something new.

 

[um]

Thank the lawd there’s a game today so we can talk about something new.

I was enjoying the McMichael and Crosby comparisons.

 

[kicksavedave]

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

#6 in goalies. I hope they are right!

Curious what our raking would have been last year, both pre season and post. Pretty bad I imagine.

 

[zappa4ever]

There are several degrees between "Elite" and "Mediocre." Your post was both downplaying CMM's physical attributes and ignoring his hockey sense and ability to execute plays at speed.

No. Simply describing 3 attributes. Not addressing anything else, not ignoring.
Please tell me you're going to argue he's Big/Fast/Strong somehow.

You want to CMM to play like Jay Beagle to make the team.

No. I want McMic to work and study as hard as Beagle, who was one of the most hard-working NHL'ers ever whose work ethic allowed him to have a successful NHL career

You'd rather CMM make no mistakes himself rather than play an attacking style that forces the opponent to make mistakes.

No. No idea how you can come to this conclusion.

You'd sooner bench CMM for a turnover than reward him for making a play.

No. No idea where this comes from either.

You clearly are jumping to some very incorrect conclusions and projecting.
Very odd to try to create something out of nothing.

 

[DWGie26]

Agr

No one should care about losing AJF or Leason to waivers. Protas has earned it. Lapierre playing wing initially, if true, sounds bad.

Agreed to some extent. I’m not worried about AJF. I think Leason has more value at 6’4 and a right shot. Certainly capable NHL with 30 games under his belt. Could easily be a 4RW replacement for Hath if he ends up leaving. And yes, Lapierre is playing wing. We have a LOT of centers in Hershey. His path may be more as a wing. Or he plays center in Hershey next year and NHL a year later.

 

[RedRocking]

No. Simply describing 3 attributes. Not addressing anything else, not ignoring.
Please tell me you're going to argue he's Big/Fast/Strong somehow.

No. I want McMic to work and study as hard as Beagle, who was one of the most hard-working NHL'ers ever whose work ethic allowed him to have a successful NHL career

No. No idea how you can come to this conclusion.

No. No idea where this comes from either.

You clearly are jumping to some very incorrect conclusions and projecting.
Very odd to try to create something out of nothing.

 

[DWGie26]

No GDT, but I’ll be at the game tonight! About 60 minutes to departure! LFG!

 

[Langway]

Agr

Agreed to some extent. I’m not worried about AJF. I think Leason has more value at 6’4 and a right shot. Certainly capable NHL with 30 games under his belt. Could easily be a 4RW replacement for Hath if he ends up leaving. And yes, Lapierre is playing wing. We have a LOT of centers in Hershey. His path may be more as a wing. Or he plays center in Hershey next year and NHL a year later.

Yeah, not good re: Lapierre. The Bears have, uh, Sgarbossa...and...? Borgstrom should play wing. Same with Gersich. Seems like a waste of speed and playmaking not putting him in the middle.

I don't really see scoring-line upside with Leason so it's not a huge deal. Pilon could be that 4RW or many potential value UFAs if need be.

Thank the lawd there’s a game today so we can talk about something new.

You mean like dissecting McMichael's every shift?