Canucks News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Let the negotiations through the media begin!

[Mr. Canucklehead]

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[CanucksSayEh]

Team already traded it's best goal scorers from the last 2 seasons, somehow I don't think 3rd time will be the charm.

 

[Nucker101]

man... as always, thank you for these notes.

you should really re-post these summaries on twitter to wipe out taj lol

Taj translation: “Wow Tocchet is apparently pissed that they lowballed Joshua and Zadorov”

 

[alternate]

They won't have enough money for the ??? given that defense, Mikheyev still on the books and signing a forward to at least $5m AAV.

Aside: While Dillon is fine as a 4/5, I want the team to get puck movers first. This is why I treat the Myers signing as OK despite his adventures in the past: He moves the puck. He provides offense from the back end. Guys like Soucy and Dillon do not.

Guess it depends on what you mean by puck movers. The FO clearly wants size on the backend, and this season showed how effective that strategy is. Obviously everyone wants some puck skills from the blueline, but not to the point of having an average or below sized backend.

Myers, Soucy, Cole, and Zadorov are all okay at transitioning the puck. That's the template. We're not going to see a Tyson Barrie brought in to replace Ian Cole, and I'm completely fine with that. Sure, having + transition game with + size would be great, but not realistic through UFA.

 

[Vector]

Taj translation: “Wow Tocchet is apparently pissed that they lowballed Joshua and Zadorov”

*eyes emoji* and/or *laughing face emoji*

 

[thecupismine]

I understand big Z might end up being too expensive, but I don't think you can lose both him and Joshua while retaining the team's identity next year as a hardworking, physical team that's hard to play against.

There's a month until free agency so I wouldn't take too much stock into Joshua and the Canucks being far apart, its typical negotiation tactics (same deal with Hronek). Hopefully something gets done here - he has very few miles on his body for a physical 28 year old, so even something with term should hold up decently.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Guess it depends on what you mean by puck movers. The FO clearly wants size on the backend, and this season showed how effective that strategy is. Obviously everyone wants some puck skills from the blueline, but not to the point of having an average or below sized backend.

Myers, Soucy, Cole, and Zadorov are all okay at transitioning the puck. That's the template. We're not going to see a Tyson Barrie brought in to replace Ian Cole, and I'm completely fine with that. Sure, having + transition game with + size would be great, but not realistic through UFA.

Tyson Barrie is only puck movement and little defense. Myers is a bit of both, and that's what they need more of. If that comes in the package of 'average or below sized' dmen, so be it. Players like DeMelo and Walker spring to mind as solutions.

It's interesting that people see the turtle/passive box strategy as being effective... It's what they had to resort to because they couldn't break the puck out of their zone. It looked effective while they were hemmed in because the bigger dmen could box forwards out. Getting puck movers is to avoid getting hemmed in in the first place.

 

[brock hughes007]

Taj translation: “Wow Tocchet is apparently pissed that they lowballed Joshua and Zadorov”

It's all part of negotiations, not every first offer is accepted. I'm sure something gets done.

 

[bossram]

I really wouldn't want to go three years for Myers unless it is coming with a very steep discount. His aging curve is bizarre but he will be 35 by the middle of the upcoming season.

Yep. 3 years seems pretty unnecessary to me.

If Myers can still play at age 36 or 37 or whatever, then he should be basically on the year-to-year protocol like other veterans at that age. Don't lock in the term.

 

[alternate]

Tyson Barrie is only puck movement and little defense. Myers is a bit of both, and that's what they need more of. If that comes in the package of 'average or below sized' dmen, so be it. Players like DeMelo and Walker spring to mind as solutions.

It's interesting that people see the turtle/passive box strategy as being effective... It's what they had to resort to because they couldn't break the puck out of their zone. It looked effective while they were hemmed in because the bigger dmen could box forwards out. Getting puck movers is to avoid getting hemmed in in the first place.

The big D allowed the team to "protect the gut." Most of the season they did a good job reducing high danger scoring chances. So yeah, they traded defensive zone time for keeping shots to the perimeter, and it worked well.

What happens when a average or smaller d pairing doesn't get the puck out immediately? We even saw stretches where Quinn and Hronek would get stuck in their zone, and they'd get over powered around the net. Didn't happen often because of the quality of the players, but you're not finding comparable players (especially Hughes) on the free agent market.

But really, what you are asking for is a change to the defensive system. Tocchet wants players going to their defensive land marks, to protect cross ice passes, and keep the front of the net clear. You want a defensive system that recovers pucks and starts the transition before the other team gets set up. This team isn't built to play that way, and it's clearly not the style Allvin nor Tocchet want to run.

Think Allvin's comments about splitting Hughes and Hronek recognize the need to have more plus transition play on other pairings. But can't see the organization completely changing the philosophy that had so much success this season.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Probably a typo. Probably meant "not having Joshua, and Zadorov, Signs staring Haley Joel Osment must be driving Tocchet nuts

Just realized I mixed up Signs and The Sixth Sense

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

I understand big Z might end up being too expensive, but I don't think you can lose both him and Joshua while retaining the team's identity next year as a hardworking, physical team that's hard to play against.

There's a month until free agency so I wouldn't take too much stock into Joshua and the Canucks being far apart, its typical negotiation tactics (same deal with Hronek). Hopefully something gets done here - he has very few miles on his body for a physical 28 year old, so even something with term should hold up decently.

It really depends on what they want. If Joshua signs for 3x4 with say, the Leafs, I'd be pissed. Likewise, if Zadorov bounced somewhere for 5x6. That would make me really nervous management is trying to play cheapskate or has far too much faith in the likes of Podkolzin to replace what we're losing.

Nothing against the kid but I want to see growth before gifting him a top nine role.

On the flipside, if Joshua gets 4x5 from the leafs and we chase the likes of Guentzel, Bertuzzi, Fiala or whoever else that will make a huge impact, all his forgiven and I'll wish Zadorov and Joshua the best.

All I want to see is a consistent direction not throwing money out like candy or penny pinching and having to pick up scraps.

 

[Lindgren]

Dude’s 6’8. Not worried at all.

His long reach and huge body is already a massive deterrent on the rush.

If he just sticks to a more defensive outlook (like what he did this year) and does the simple things he’ll be great for us.

Foote and Gonchar's presence makes me optimistic that he'll keep up with that program of keeping things simple. I think Myers feels the same way, judging by his comments about coaching.

Still, I'd be happier with two years rather than three.

 

[UrbanImpact]

I understand big Z might end up being too expensive, but I don't think you can lose both him and Joshua while retaining the team's identity next year as a hardworking, physical team that's hard to play against.

There's a month until free agency so I wouldn't take too much stock into Joshua and the Canucks being far apart, its typical negotiation tactics (same deal with Hronek). Hopefully something gets done here - he has very few miles on his body for a physical 28 year old, so even something with term should hold up decently.

Why not? Let Z walk and replace him with Brendan Dillon?

Let Joshua walk and replace him with Martinoonk, Duhame, Trenin etc.

These guys arent some unicorns.

 

[wonton15]

Why not? Let Z walk and replace him with Brendan Dillon?

Let Joshua walk and replace him with Martinoonk, Duhame, Trenin etc.

These guys arent some unicorns.

Zadorov is quite literally a behemoth unicorn, which is why he is even getting consideration at numbers like 5x5. Not that I’m against signing Dillon and saving a few bucks, but he is definitely considered a one of a kind player with the way he played for us. We all saw it in the playoffs.

 

[Nick Lang]

Dude’s 6’8. Not worried at all.

His long reach and huge body is already a massive deterrent on the rush.

If he just sticks to a more defensive outlook (like what he did this year) and does the simple things he’ll be great for us.

Every dude that big is a concern to get turn styled due to mobility and speed. It should definitely be a concern. He's decent on the rush but terrible in the corners and he's getting older. I like 2 years but three is probably looking ugly. It's also really important that he's insulated by others that can play the big minutes.

 

[UrbanImpact]

Zadorov is quite literally a behemoth unicorn, which is why he is even getting consideration at numbers like 5x5. Not that I’m against signing Dillon and saving a few bucks, but he is definitely considered a one of a kind player with the way he played for us. We all saw it in the playoffs.

I think we are being too nostalgic on Zadorov because weve never really had that type of player on the Canucks. However, he isnt some unicorn in the NHL. He has a career high of 22 points.

Heck, even Tyler Myers played similar to Zadorov at these playoffs.

He's not unique. There are similar or better versions of him:

Ekholm
Oleksiak
Graves
Carlo
Hague
Mayfiled
etc....

 

[krutovsdonut]

zadorov is tryamkin but he likes smell of pot smoke and is willing to study pronger videos.

 

[alternate]

I'd be okay for 3 years with Myers at sub $3m. But not with a NMC in the final year. Some trade protection will be assumed, but need to be able to remove him from the roster if his play merits it.

 

[arttk]

They won't have enough money for the ??? given that defense, Mikheyev still on the books and signing a forward to at least $5m AAV.

Aside: While Dillon is fine as a 4/5, I want the team to get puck movers first. This is why I treat the Myers signing as OK despite his adventures in the past: He moves the puck. He provides offense from the back end. Guys like Soucy and Dillon do not.

i mean we need to trade away Mik, if they can't then i presume they will trade away Garland.

this is not a, i want to trade Garland thing. It's more of a, we need to make cap sacrifices to the cap god in order to field a better roster.

 

[God]

I think we are being too nostalgic on Zadorov because weve never really had that type of player on the Canucks. However, he isnt some unicorn in the NHL. He has a career high of 22 points.

Heck, even Tyler Myers played similar to Zadorov at these playoffs.

He's not unique. There are similar or better versions of him:

Ekholm
Oleksiak
Graves
Carlo
Hague
Mayfiled
etc....

Ekholm and Graves don't belong on that list, but part of the Zadorov allure is that he has a perfect personality for this market and we haven't had a guy like that on the team since Bieksa. Easy to replace him with a guy who checks off height and weight boxes, but not easy to replace his attitude.

 

[canuckking1]

Myers was a beast in the playoffs, but you're playing with fire giving him any kind of term at his age and with his inconsistent history

 

[wonton15]

I think we are being too nostalgic on Zadorov because weve never really had that type of player on the Canucks. However, he isnt some unicorn in the NHL. He has a career high of 22 points.

Heck, even Tyler Myers played similar to Zadorov at these playoffs.

He's not unique. There are similar or better versions of him:

Ekholm
Oleksiak
Graves
Carlo
Hague
Mayfiled
etc....

Half the guys you listed are smaller or play much smaller, haven’t played well recently, or aren’t even in the same stratosphere in terms of swagger and physical dominance. Ekholm is an elite defenseman but smaller, and Carlo is pretty damn good, but you’re downplaying the impact Zadorov has had on this team quite a bit. His uniqueness is understanding his size and role, speed, shot, and embracing all of that within the market. Teams didn’t walk all over us for the first time in how many years? And he actually elevated his game when others couldn’t.

Would I sign him to 5x5? Meh probably not, but flip a coin and I wouldn’t be mad.

 

[JohnHodgson]

Every dude that big is a concern to get turn styled due to mobility and speed. It should definitely be a concern. He's decent on the rush but terrible in the corners and he's getting older. I like 2 years but three is probably looking ugly. It's also really important that he's insulated by others that can play the big minutes.

I disagree.

Myers’s mobility has been fine - it hasn't dropped off at all and he’s been very healthy the past five years. He’s coming off his best year where he’s keeping things simple and leveraging his size and reach to defend well.

By year 3, his 2.5M cap hit will be appropriate for a solid #6 defenseman. Not losing any sleep over this at all. Way bigger problems at stake.

 

[UrbanImpact]

I'm not willing to over pay for Z and be stuck with a forward group getting 15 shots a playoff game again.

See how much it cost to sign Geuntzel first at Free Agency, if we have enough money for Z great, if not, downgrade from Z to Dillon or others...im fine with that as well.

 

[UrbanImpact]

Half the guys you listed are smaller or play much smaller, haven’t played well recently, or aren’t even in the same stratosphere in terms of swagger and physical dominance. Ekholm is an elite defenseman but smaller, and Carlo is pretty damn good, but you’re downplaying the impact Zadorov has had on this team quite a bit. His uniqueness is understanding his size and role, speed, shot, and embracing all of that within the market. Teams didn’t walk all over us for the first time in how many years? And he actually elevated his game when others couldn’t.

Would I sign him to 5x5? Meh probably not, but flip a coin and I wouldn’t be mad.

Youre talking about a small sample size of Z where he played way above his norm. He had a good end of the seaosn and a great playoffs. However, remember he was just play so so after we traded for him, there was even talks of flipping him at the deadline.

My point is you cant use such a small example and fall in love with it enough to pay him 5+ mil. Dont forget its contract year as well and we all know how easily it for GMs and fans to fall trap to contract year performances only to have the player go back to their usual norm or worse the following years after..

Big Z is a career high 23 pts.... He is 29 yrs old and we are his 5th team. We need to look at his body of work as a whole and not base our contract offers on the small sample size.

Just look at Joshua, He had a great season but we all know hes not worth 4mil a year because of the sample size of his work compared to a career year on contract yer. Why arent we being that real with Z where we look at his total body of work and not just a hot playoffs

Myers was a beast in the playoffs, but you're playing with fire giving him any kind of term at his age and with his inconsistent history

Same logic needs to apply for Big Z