Canadian Government Freezing Hockey Canada Funding- (2018 Canada World Jr Team Alleged Sexual Assault)

[Tufted Titmouse]

YOu are changing the subject now to make yourself out to be right. There is no debating people like you.

So you post asking "what was she wearing" and "did she given the impression for the next guy it was ok to continue"

I flip that scenario into something not attached to this specific scenario but using the same logic.

Now you run away because I've got you pinned on your own bullshit?

lol cowardly actions, at least stand up for what you type.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

YOu are changing the subject now to make yourself out to be right. There is no debating people like you.

Well yeah, I mean you don’t even realize what you’re saying is utterly disgusting.

 

[Stylizer1]

The "we don't know" crowd would be a lot more convincing if their idea of what we don't know didn't seem to revolve almost completely around what the woman might've done to bring this on herself or how the eight young men might be the real victims here. Let's at least pretend that it goes both ways. We can't call anyone a rapist because there's no court verdict but we can turn around and call the alleged victim a liar without any proof. How does that work?

The "we don't know" crowd seem to be the only ones who care about the truth because everyone else has their mind made up.

 

[Thierry]

Her dress didn't matter. It was used as an example that the poster I was reffering to had no idea what hey were talking about. I could have replaced that question with litteraly anything else. How many rings did she have on, what color was her phone case, etc. I understand the narrative from days past where people would say well she dressed like she wanted it. This is not that.

Ok. Still, you ought to understand how dumb it was to use this "example" to prove your point. Now everybody is missing it and it's your only fault.

 

[Stylizer1]

So you post asking "what was she wearing" and "did she given the impression for the next guy it was ok to continue"

I flip that scenario into something not attached to this specific scenario but using the same logic.

Now you run away because I've got you pinned on your own bullshit?

lol cowardly actions, at least stand up for what you type.

View attachment 571497

If you don't know what is wrong with your post #1695 then fine. I'm not going to argue the obvious. It's wosre enough you are a leafs fan.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

The "we don't know" crowd seem to be the only ones who care about the truth because everyone else has their mind made up.

You don't even have the capacity to understand what you are arguing.

We are saying a drunk woman was put into a situation where she couldn't consent or was too intimidated to expect to be able to consent. Either way, her decision in this was removed. Having 8 men walk into the room while you are vulnerable and under the influence is a very dangerous situation.

You, however, seem to be arguing that certain parts of her behavior, drunk or not, are reasons for why this happened, and therefor, she can be blamed equally. That's not me putting words into your mouth, you actually typed and posted that.

Here is a book I reccommend you read. Don't focus on the actual trials, focus on the information given by experts on how the public reacts, the harm that causes, and how it allows abusive people get off the hook.

If my daughter put herself in that position I would be mad as hell at them for doing that and would give my daughter all the love she needed during this time. It doesn't excuse anyone but I would understand that both sides are at fault. I would hope through all the years of teaching my daughter what to and not do in life that she would be smart enough not put herself in that position.

Just to reiterate, this is where Stylizer said that the daughter put herself in the situation and that both parties were at fault.

 

[4thline]

grudg·ing·ly:

adverb
adverb: grudgingly

1. in a reluctant or resentful manner.
   "I grudgingly accepted his apology"
   
   
   ac·cept:
   
   
   
2. verb
   1. 1.
      consent to receive (a thing offered).
      "he accepted a pen as a present"
      
      ​
      
      

Answer the question.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

What happened to her sucks but she is not 100% innocent in this either. She met a guy at a party decided to go home with him and sleep with him. To what point she was comfortable at the time with what came next nobody knows. She regretted what happened after but that doesn't mean she wasn't a willing partner. If she gave the impression she was ok with it then the people involved shouldn't be on trial. At no point has it ever been stated that she was against any of it or that they forced her. This seems like more of an optics thing that angered the mother as it should to any parent.

Everyone deserves justice but you can't make a poor decision and then go back in time and insert your fellings after the fact.

It's weird that you now keep saying your argument was "we don't know". In this post, it seems like you accepted her story, but still decided to victim blame her.

If she was impaired, then she couldn't consent. You seem to both agree with her condition but disagree with the consequence of it.

 

[Stylizer1]

Ok. Still, you ought to understand how dumb it was to use this "example" to prove your point. Now everybody is missing it and it's your only fault.

The broader point that I was making is that not one of the question I asked could be answered by anyone in this thread. If I didn't word it clearly enough to each his own.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

The broader point that I was making is that not one of the question I asked could be answered by anyone in this thread. If I didn't word it clearly enough to each his own.

This is just the dumbest argument I've ever seen anyone make.

"I said something stupid, and you guys read it the way anyone with a rational brain would, but that's not what I meant (even though I made the exact same point earlier in the thread which I am now denying), that's on you guys".

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

You don't even have the capacity to understand what you are arguing.

We are saying a drunk woman was put into a situation where she couldn't consent or was too intimidated to expect to be able to consent. Either way, her decision in this was removed. Having 8 men walk into the room while you are vulnerable and under the influence is a very dangerous situation.

You, however, seem to be arguing that certain parts of her behavior, drunk or not, are reasons for why this happened, and therefor, she can be blamed equally. That's not me putting words into your mouth, you actually typed and posted that.

Here is a book I reccommend you read. Don't focus on the actual trials, focus on the information given by experts on how the public reacts, the harm that causes, and how it allows abusive people get off the hook.



Just to reiterate, this is where Stylizer said that the daughter put herself in the situation and that both parties were at fault.

That’s a good read. I haven’t finished it but I need to. It’s just tough to get through.

The broader point that I was making is that not one of the question I asked could be answered by anyone in this thread. If I didn't word it clearly enough to each his own.

My guy, you said that the girl was partially to blame and then asked some disgusting questions. You don’t get to play it off as if everyone else misunderstood you.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

It's wosre enough you are a leafs fan.

We all have our faults.

I am just glad mine is cheering for a dumb team, and not asking what victims of sexual abuse are wearing so I can decide how much of the blame is theirs.

 

[Stylizer1]

Answer the question.

In that scenario your definition is Grudgingly is an adverb. It implies acceptance. If she implied acceptance then it should not be considered a crime. If it were in a reluctant or resentful way then a case could be made that those young men are guilty of something. It comes down to what she did to give them the impression if she accepted or resented it. No one here knows what was said in the first investigation where the police determined that no crime was committed. That is where the story rests.

 

[4thline]

Another topical book recommendation

Beartown (Beartown, #1)

A dazzling, profound novel about a small town with a bi…

www.goodreads.com

 

[Stylizer1]

It's weird that you now keep saying your argument was "we don't know". In this post, it seems like you accepted her story, but still decided to victim blame her.

If she was impaired, then she couldn't consent. You seem to both agree with her condition but disagree with the consequence of it.

Do you know if she was to impaired to consent?

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

Another topical book recommendation

Beartown (Beartown, #1)

A dazzling, profound novel about a small town with a bi…

www.goodreads.com

Oooh. A Man Called Ove was good (although I gave up at one point, then had to come back to it, glad I did), I will need to check this out.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

How drunk was she? what was she wearing? after she finished having sex with the first guy what gave the second guy an impression it was ok to continue? what did she say? Whose name was the Hotel room under and why weren't they there? You don't know anything and that is my point.

If it comes out that after the first guy 7 guys got naked and gang raped her then I hope they get the death penalty.

Jesus dude.

What next, the Earth is flat? 9/11 was an inside job?

 

[4thline]

In that scenario your definition is Grudgingly is an adverb. It implies acceptance. If she implied acceptance then it should not be considered a crime. If it were in a reluctant or resentful way then a case could be made that those young men are guilty of something. It comes down to what she did to give them the impression if she accepted or resented it. No one here knows what was said in the first investigation where the police determined that no crime was committed. That is where the story rests.

If you have a son, have someone else teach them about consent.

Oooh. A Man Called Ove was good (although I gave up at one point, then had to come back to it, glad I did), I will need to check this out.

Beartown was the last book, (and first in a long time) that had me going to work on ~3-4 hours of sleep.
Hits this, and other sports related issues right on the nose, told in a really compelling way. The follow up Us Against You is also excellent

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

Do you know if she was to impaired to consent?

This is part of the of the original allegations.

In the claim, the woman states that she could not give consent to any of the actions because of how intoxicated she was.​

​

Normally I prefer not to doubt the victim, especially when Hockey Canada settled with the victim and also put out the following statement:

"What happened in London, Ontario in 2018 was completely unacceptable," Hockey Canada's statement said. "And we once again apologize to Canadians, the young woman, and all those who have been impacted."​

​

If you want to say you don't believe her - fine, go ahead and explain to us why you don't believe her and why you choose to believe the players. I would be especially interested to hear why Hockey Canada would settle and then also apologize if absolutely nothing immoral took place. Do you think organizations normally make apologies when their member's have consensual sex with others?

 

[TopCheese]

Do you know if she was to impaired to consent?

Dude just stop. You are digging yourself deeper and deeper. You need some serious introspection and education if you think that what someone wears means that they are partially to blame for being assulted. Its the same as saying the men couldnt help themsleves, she was too attractive, its not their fault.

 

[Stylizer1]

If you have a son, have someone else teach them about consent.


Beartown was the last book, (and first in a long time) that had me going to work on ~3-4 hours of sleep.
Hits this, and other sports related issues right on the nose, told in a really compelling way. The follow up Us Against You is also excellent

If you can find any definition of the word Grudgingly to mean acceptable anywhere on the net I'll take back everything I wrote.

 

[Zippity]

Her dress didn't matter. It was used as an example that the poster I was reffering to had no idea what hey were talking about. I could have replaced that question with litteraly anything else. How many rings did she have on, what color was her phone case, etc. I understand the narrative from days past where people would say well she dressed like she wanted it. This is not that.

Crown appeals Manitoba judge's decision in rape case

A Manitoba judge's decision to sentence a rapist to house arrest instead of prison, partly because of the way his female victim was dressed, is going to a higher court.

www.ctvnews.ca

 

[4thline]

If you can find any definition of the word Grudgingly to mean acceptable anywhere on the net I'll take back everything I wrote.

Check the word next to grudging in the example sentence in definition you provided. Consider what that means.
Apply said consideration to a situation where the "consenting" party is under duress.

 

[SoupNazi]

If my daughter put herself in that position I would be mad as hell at them for doing that and would give my daughter all the love she needed during this time. It doesn't excuse anyone but I would understand that both sides are at fault. I would hope through all the years of teaching my daughter what to and not do in life that she would be smart enough not put herself in that position.

Do explain how it would be her fault she got gang raped by a bunch of spoiled punks.

 

[Bevans]

I hate the "what if it was your daughter" narrative. We shouldn't have to imagine our daughters/mothers/sisters/friends to understand how awful sexual assault is.

I cringe so bad when I read something like "I use to think a certain way but now that I have a daughter, I finally understand the negative implications of some bad behavior..."

Yes, who are these people who are able to get through life without ever associating with a woman?