Cam Talbot - Mod warning #251

[Trxjw]

If he could just eliminate that softie from the point he seems to let in at least once per game, he'd be doing fine. I thought his rebound control was much better last night against the Jackets. He didn't get much help on the first two goals.

 

[TheDave1022]

If he could just eliminate that softie from the point he seems to let in at least once per game, he'd be doing fine. I thought his rebound control was much better last night against the Jackets. He didn't get much help on the first two goals.

He needs to stop handling the puck like he is Roy out there. Too many giveaways and last night almost another costly mistake.

 

[silverfish]

I think people need to realize that the difference between an elite goalie at say, .920sv% and a league average goalie at .914sv% despite being only .006 (.6%), is WILDLY monumental.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Talbot allowed less goals than opposition goalies in most of the games. That must mean something.

It means, in a small sample size, the opposition goalies are playing pretty poorly too.

That won't last long, nor will the Rangers scoring 3,4,5 goals every night.

 

[The Beezer]

I've been impressed with his ability to make tough saves around the crease. I'm obviously concerned with his struggles on longer shots. That being said, he's done a good job filling in for an all-world goaltender.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Man, Talbot is getting a really unfair go here.

He played 21 games all of last year. He's on 20 already this year. He's played 9 games in the last 19 days.

He's a backup. A good backup. But there's a huge difference in preparing for your one game a week or every 10 days, and suddenly playing 9 in 19 days. He looks exhausted.

You can't kill the guy for not being Hank. If anything, this should make everyone appreciate Hank more than ever. There's a HUGE difference between Hank and every other goalie (with the exception of a few).

 

[offdacrossbar]

he's given up some awful goals at bad times.

im not confident in his abillty not to do something extremely stupid at any time, be it handling the puck or losing site of the puck near the net or just flat out whiffing on a shot.

again last night, late in a game, i saw a team shooting on purpose from near the blue line. every time they could, they shot it from way out knowing that he struggles to find pucks from that far out.

hank cannot return soon enough for me. cambot belongs as our backup. only.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

I've been impressed with his ability to make tough saves around the crease. I'm obviously concerned with his struggles on longer shots. That being said, he's done a good job filling in for an all-world goaltender.

Well said, although I think "good job" is a bit strong.

If the Rangers weren't scoring at a torrid pace, methinks the opinions of Talbot would be very different.

 

[The Beezer]

Well said, although I think "good job" is a bit strong.

If the Rangers weren't scoring at a torrid pace, methinks the opinions of Talbot would be very different.

I guess that's fair. I'm pretty sure though that no one thought they would be in their current position (standings wise) when Hank went down with the injury. Also, just as important is that they didn't need to move some chips to bring someone in, cause Cam was a total flop.

 

[nyr2k2]

Man, Talbot is getting a really unfair go here.

He played 21 games all of last year. He's on 20 already this year. He's played 9 games in the last 19 days.

He's a backup. A good backup. But there's a huge difference in preparing for your one game a week or every 10 days, and suddenly playing 9 in 19 days. He looks exhausted.

You can't kill the guy for not being Hank. If anything, this should make everyone appreciate Hank more than ever. There's a HUGE difference between Hank and every other goalie (with the exception of a few).

I think most everyone understands this. Those that don't seem to be the folks making outlandish statements like "Cam is a legit NHL starter" and things of that sort. I think most people are very reasonable with their assessments of Cam. Those that are killing him are the same people that kill Lundqvist unfairly, so take anything they say with a huge grain of salt.

 

[NYRangers84]

It means, in a small sample size, the opposition goalies are playing pretty poorly too.

That won't last long, nor will the Rangers scoring 3,4,5 goals every night.

Neither will Talbot in giving up softies.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

I think people need to realize that the difference between an elite goalie at say, .920sv% and a league average goalie at .914sv% despite being only .006 (.6%), is WILDLY monumental.

Exactly!

Semyon Varlamov faced the most regular season shots last year (2013).

I understand this wasn't his svPCT. but let's just use the numbers in Silverfish's example.

2013 * 0.920 = ~1852 saves (rounded up)

2013 * 0.914 = ~1840 saves (rounded up)

That .6% difference translates to at least 12 goals, and if the goalie faces less shots (everyone did by a good margin, the next most S/A being Kari Lehtonen, 1888), the number of goals against via shots faced is magnified.

When you factor in the elite level and tight play in each successive round of the playoffs, .6% is huge!

 

[NYRangers84]

Exactly!

Semyon Varlamov faced the most regular season shots last year (2013).

I understand this wasn't his svPCT. but let's just use the numbers in Silverfish's example.

2013 * 0.920 = ~1852 saves (rounded up)

2013 * 0.914 = ~1840 saves (rounded up)

That .6% difference translates to at least 12 goals, and if the goalie faces less shots (everyone did by a good margin, the next most S/A being Kari Lehtonen, 1888), the number of goals against via shots faced is magnified.

When you factor in the elite level and tight play in each successive round of the playoffs, .6% is huge!

Keep in mind that goalie with the .920 is on an elite team and the one with .914 is on an average team.
Elite goalies are on average teams, average goalies are on average teams. And bad goalies are on bad teams.
So are there any elite or bad goalies after all?

 

[OnlyTruth]

Neither will Talbot in giving up softies.

Exactly! Not so long ago Hank gave up 1 soft goal per game on average. But that never gets noticed because of all other good saves he made. Talbot gets no pass on anything.

 

[Doctyl]

Keep in mind that goalie with the .920 is on an elite team and the one with .914 is on an average team.

So you honestly believe all goalies are equal and the only difference between someone like Rinne/Price/Lundqvist and someone like Lindback is the team in front of them?

 

[NYRangers84]

So you honestly believe all goalies are equal and the only difference between someone like Rinne/Price/Lundqvist and someone like Lindback is the team in front of them?

Yes. Pretty much equal.

Not sure about Lindback, but take Devan Dubnyk or Jaroslav Halak.

 

[NYRangers84]

I don't think even Skapski would be below .910 on this team in the long run.
Provided he gets more time with Allaire.

 

[Raspewtin]

Talbot has this uncanny ability to give up god awful goals at terrible times in games. You let that shot in with 4 minutes left in the game? Really?

 

[TheTakedown]

Talbot has this uncanny ability to give up god awful goals at terrible times in games. You let that shot in with 4 minutes left in the game? Really?

he's ALWAYS been that way. Even going as far back as 203 years ago with the pack. They'd be playing a solid game (lacking creativity, but that is moot), and Talbot would just let multiple WTF goals at various points of games.

I went to a lot of pack games during the 12-13 season with the lockout, and holy crap, he was bad at that

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

he's ALWAYS been that way. Even going as far back as 203 years ago with the pack. They'd be playing a solid game (lacking creativity, but that is moot), and Talbot would just let multiple WTF goals at various points of games.

I went to a lot of pack games during the 12-13 season with the lockout, and holy crap, he was bad at that

I didn't expect him to be the King, but he has played significantly worse than he did when he was the back up.

Maybe it's nerves.

Maybe it's playing several games in a row.

He was awesome when he was the back up.

 

[offdacrossbar]

hank tends to stop anything he can see.

as shooters around the league say, hank will stop it if he sees it. he plays very deep but his reaction time is elite. he's very tough to beat if the puck is in front of him. while he's technically very sound, and his reflexes are cat like, his vision is superb. his ability to concentrate on pucks with his eyes and move to where he needs to be before he needs to be there is uncanny. its makes saves look easy when he's already there before the puck gets there. hanks body and pads are right where they need to be in any given shot from anywhere. pucks hitting him are still saves. its what makes him special.

now cambot.

he's big, and he's technically very good. but, his vision and awareness aren't at hanks level. not sure if he takes his eyes off the puck or just doesnt know where to put his body on deep shots. somethings wrong there. he's been beaten by long shots enough lately to tell me theres a problem there.

its mostly experience and intuitiveness.

hanks got it. cambot doesnt yet.

 

[NYRangers84]

I didn't expect him to be the King, but he has played significantly worse than he did when he was the back up.

Maybe it's nerves.

Maybe it's playing several games in a row.

He was awesome when he was the back up.

I agree. Maybe it's something going on in his personal life. Whatever it is I hope he fixes it. Or if it really is the fact that he got complacent playing 1 game here and there.

 

[NYRangers84]

So why are there elite skaters but no elite goalies?

Because the elite skaters are much better than the "elite goalies".
Compare Crosby to Tanner Glass. You won't find that comparison among goalies lol.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

hank tends to stop anything he can see.

as shooters around the league say, hank will stop it if he sees it. he plays very deep but his reaction time is elite. he's very tough to beat if the puck is in front from of him. while he's technically very sound, and his reflexes are cat like, his vision is superb. his ability to concentrate on pucks with his eyes and move to there he needs to be before he needs to be there is uncanny. its makes saves look easy when he's already there before the puck gets there. hanks body and pads are right where they need to be in any given shot from anywhere. pucks hitting him are still saves. its what makes him special.

now cambot.

he's big, and he's technically very good. but, his vision and awareness isn't at hanks level. not sure if he takes his eyes off the puck or just doesnt know where to put his body on deep shots. somethings wrong there. he's been beaten by long shots enough lately to tell me theres a problem there.

its mostly experience and intuitiveness.

hanks got it. cambot doesnt yet.

^This ^This ^This in regard to the bolded statement.

The bolded is what elite goaltenders do, and Hank is neither acrobatic like Richter, nor floppy? like Hasek, so his control of the game is even more subtle.

 

[jniklast]

Because the elite skaters are much better than the "elite goalies".

But how come? You know in every sport or even trade there are people who are better than the rest. Be it track and field, football, basketball, soccer, you name it. Even in hockey there are elite players, but for the position of goalie there isn't?