C Shane Wright (2022, 4th, SEA) Part 4

[Bone Density]

For all this development talk, Wright needs to play hockey and lots of it. Not sure what they are thinking giving him the jump around.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Bennett was drafted 4th overall and at the time of the draft there was talk about him going 1st. THN draft preview even had him listed as their #1. At the NHL level he's turned into a solid, but not spectacular, 2nd/3rd line player. Hardly a good example of Kingston developing someone who had the potential to be a top line player and turning him into a middle six player who seems to top out at around 40-50 points.

As for Robertson, there's always exceptions to the rule. Citing one example of a kid panning out to counter what I said about decades of futility in Kingston is questionable. This is one area I'm not backing down because I'm a KINGSTON FAN and have been since the 80's. I know firsthand how many guys came through Kingston who were supposed to be future elite NHLers who then ended up ranging from average NHLers to not even making the NHL because Kingston didn't properly develop their games.

Bennett has 35 goals and 70 points in his last 86 games...

Anyways, I'm not disagreeing that they're track record is terrible, just pointing out that it's not impossible to go through Kingston and still continue to develop into an eventual star player.

 

[Dominance]

1 point per 18 minutes is elite first liner territory. Let’s get it.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Good to see him crack the ice and get his first point.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

Did he even touch the puck on that play?

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Did he even touch the puck on that play?

I thought it hit Dunn's stick. Guess I was wrong. Not the most memorable of first points but I'm sure he'll take it.

 

[Kennerback]

1 point per 18 minutes is elite first liner territory. Let’s get it.

Exactly. Why are the Kraken not giving him a lot more icetime?

 

[Dominance]

Better on ice impact than Beniers now.

 

[nbwingsfan]

So put him back to his OHL club that isn't a great organizaton with a bleh head coach where he basically only faces teenagers is suddenly going to make him better against NHLers?

It hasn’t hurt the 100s of better junior players who have been sent back and ended up great nHL players?

I can definitely make a ton ruined by being rushed and barely playing though

 

[Bone Density]

lol

 

[Artorius Horus T]

Did he even touch the puck on that play?

i dont think he actually did.

its actually not that uncommon in the NHL
ghost secondary assists, player never touches the puck,
or opponent touches the puck after, but gets secondary
assist nevertheless

They say that they (NHL) review every goal and play after each game..
i highly doubt that.

I have super slomo'd lots of goals in recent years
and seen many goals and assists gone for the wrong players,
ghost redirects, secondary assists, or redirects that have not been noticed

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

lol

Dave Hakstol probably was also that kid who ate glue in class in elementary school.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Bennett has 35 goals and 70 points in his last 86 games...

You're including his scorching hot stretch when he first joined the Panthers. Over the bigger sample size (71 games last full season) he had 49 points. And even if you want to go that route, that's still about a 32-ish goal, 65-ish point pace. Nothing wrong with that, but nowhere close to the production one would expect from a guy that was projected to potentially challenge for 1st overall in his draft year.

Which is my point. Kingston seems to have a habit of taking guys who should be elite and turning them into good or who should be good and turning them into average or who should be average and turning them into AHL fodder. So it's not that a player can't ever make the NHL if he plays for Kingston, it's that they seem to limit his ceiling and ends up being a notch or two below what his "projection" was in his draft year.

Anyways, I'm not disagreeing that they're track record is terrible, just pointing out that it's not impossible to go through Kingston and still continue to develop into an eventual star player.

You listed one guy who outperformed his pre-draft projection. That's kind of my issue. Citing one example where one player out of 20 exceeds expectations versus 19 out of 20 that fail to meet draft expectations.

That's like saying "well it's a good chance a 1st overall pick busts" and citing Yakupov while ignoring the vast majority of 1st overall picks have turned into elite players. Saying "it's not impossible" is arguing semantics because Kingston's track record suggests it's the exception rather than the rule.

 

[ijuka]

You're including his scorching hot stretch when he first joined the Panthers. Over the bigger sample size (71 games last full season) he had 49 points. And even if you want to go that route, that's still about a 32-ish goal, 65-ish point pace. Nothing wrong with that, but nowhere close to the production one would expect from a guy that was projected to potentially challenge for 1st overall in his draft year.

You are supposed to include hot streaks... That's a part of the player's overall scoring, and taking it away makes no sense. It's like removing teams' winning streaks when calculating their season totals - that's completely nonsensical. Also, calling 71 games a bigger sample size than 86 is strange.

 

[Gold Standard]

Congrats, Kid! now get that 1st. goal.

 

[ItWasJustified]

lol

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

You're including his scorching hot stretch when he first joined the Panthers. Over the bigger sample size (71 games last full season) he had 49 points. And even if you want to go that route, that's still about a 32-ish goal, 65-ish point pace. Nothing wrong with that, but nowhere close to the production one would expect from a guy that was projected to potentially challenge for 1st overall in his draft year.

Why would you arbitrarily exclude a sample to make the total smaller?

It's a 33 goal 67 point pace, and he's done it without getting PP1 minutes for the majority of that span (because Florida has been loaded). Their 2nd PP barely gets any legitimate ice time with the man advantage.

So he's proving to be a 60-70 point 2 way center who can hit, fight, skate, and play in all situations. That's pretty much what the scouting reports were expecting (and we both know he was never a serious challenger to go 1st, he was talked about as a potential 1OA in the same way Cutter Gauthier was).

That's a great outcome for a 4th overall pick.

Which is my point. Kingston seems to have a habit of taking guys who should be elite and turning them into good or who should be good and turning them into average or who should be average and turning them into AHL fodder. So it's not that a player can't ever make the NHL if he plays for Kingston, it's that they seem to limit his ceiling and ends up being a notch or two below what his "projection" was in his draft year.

Bennett was never projected to be an elite offensive player. He was billed as more of a complete forward. He even had a solid 19 year old rookie season coming out of the OHL with 18 goals 37 points in his 78 games. He looked to be ready to take the next step.

Then Gulutzan asked him to center 2 of the worst 5v5 players around in Brouwer and Versteeg as a 20 year old. And when that (shockingly) didn't work, Bennett was completely written off and typecast as a 4th line winger. It's pretty clear his struggles in Calgary were because of Calgary, not Kingston.

You listed one guy who outperformed his pre-draft projection. That's kind of my issue. Citing one example where one player out of 20 exceeds expectations versus 19 out of 20 that fail to meet draft expectations.

That's like saying "well it's a good chance a 1st overall pick busts" and citing Yakupov while ignoring the vast majority of 1st overall picks have turned into elite players. Saying "it's not impossible" is arguing semantics because Kingston's track record suggests it's the exception rather than the rule.

You said "every single highly touted prospect who came through Kingston" stagnated, which is why I highlighted Robertson. Gratton and Chris Stewart were both pretty highly touted and had pretty good starts to their careers and also came out unscathed.

Seems like almost every top end player that's been drafted out of Kingston is huge...

Gratton 6'3
Kilger 6'4
A Stewart 6'3
C Stewart 6'2
Gudbranson 6'5
Bennett 6'0
Crouse 6'4
Robertson 6'3
Wright 6'1

I'm probably missing a few others. Teams need to stop drafting face punchers / power forwards out of of Kingston. I wonder how much that has to do with their lack of success, especially right off the bat, as big guys tend to take a bit longer.

Bennett has really been the only "great" skater of that group. Wright probably next best, which isn't great.

Like I've said a few times, I don't disagree that their track record is terrible, but 2 of the last 3 top guys have come out okay (and Crouse really never should have been drafted as high as he was, his offensive ceiling was very clearly limited).

 

[Jeffrey Pedler]

A player who has never truly dominated the CHL is now "to good for the CHL" lol Mitch Marner went back and dominated in his D+1 season and he has turned out just fine I would think. There are so few players that are actually to good for the league compared to the amount of discussion it generates every fall.

Marner being sent back was due size not skill. If he had been in the 180lbs range, he would've stayed in the NHL in 2015.

 

[kyle44]

Ouch. Just got absolutely wrecked on his first shift on a clean hit by Barbashev. Bounced up quickly and thankfully looks fine.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Took Bennett awhile to get there but crazy to think 30 goal physical centermen are no longer acceptable 4OA picks

 

[Oddbob]

lol

Oh wow, 8 whole minutes! What a nice coach. He always looks like a deer in the headlights behind the bench.

 

[MarioLeMoose]

lol

He deserved his first goal alot more than he deserved that first assist

 

[Favin]

No it hasn't. The majority of the NHL players still come from the CHL. Even last year, I believe the number was 53%.

Its not a majority...it is in mid-40s overall. But I am specifically talking about more recent trends, so players that are 25 and below. Also, worth noting, when this trend started, it was in the 70s).

 

[Rebels57]

I am once again here to remind you all that Dave Hakstol is a fraud.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

You are supposed to include hot streaks... That's a part of the player's overall scoring, and taking it away makes no sense. It's like removing teams' winning streaks when calculating their season totals - that's completely nonsensical. Also, calling 71 games a bigger sample size than 86 is strange.

For clarity I was saying 71 games is a bigger sample size than his scorching 10 game sample when he just arrived, because my point was that 10 game scorching hot streak is what pushes up his overall pace. Outside of that 10 games, he's got 53 points in 75 games (this season so far plus last season) as a Panther.