C Sam Steel - Regina Pats, WHL (2016, 30th, ANA)

[Goose of Reason]

While I agree that he would likely be better served against pro competition, he'd go back to Regina and Captain them during a mem cup run. That's valuable experience any way you slice it, and I don't think it will hurt him to stay in junior any more than it would to rush him to a level he's not yet ready for.

 

[nbducksfan19]

While I agree that he would likely be better served against pro competition, he'd go back to Regina and Captain them during a mem cup run. That's valuable experience any way you slice it, and I don't think it will hurt him to stay in junior any more than it would to rush him to a level he's not yet ready for.

I don't think it would "hurt" him to go back to the CHL - but I don't think it is the best place he could possibly play next year for his development. It's about opportunity cost. IMO if he isn't ready for the NHL, a year in the AHL would be more beneficial than a year in the CHL. They should really allow exceptions for players like Steel.

 

[Baemon Severson*]

I wonder if in a case like this, it'd make more sense for him to play over in Europe like Switzerland. I would be curious if teams started doing this in the future.

 

[Static]

I wonder if in a case like this, it'd make more sense for him to play over in Europe like Switzerland. I would be curious if teams started doing this in the future.

I think it's been said but his CHL team has first rights if he is not in the NHL. So Regina would have to sign off on a move overseas, pretty much a no brainier no.

 

[TMLeafs18]

If he has a good camp along with his play this year he has earned his 9 game tryout with the big club. If he looks to be doing well extend it. If he starts to struggle send him back let him dominate again no harm done.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

If he has a good camp along with his play this year he has earned his 9 game tryout with the big club. If he looks to be doing well extend it. If he starts to struggle send him back let him dominate again no harm done.

Pretty much, I think I remember RC really liked the pick... and he seems very coachable... with a high hockey iq.... I could def see him getting a long look in preseason and first 9 games... and honestly if we lose vermette there are a couple roster spots to fill him in at. I still think a potential Steel - Rakell - Perry line or Rakell - Steel - Perry (don't no how comfortable he is at the wing) will at least be tried out

 

[AngelDuck]

While I agree that he would likely be better served against pro competition, he'd go back to Regina and Captain them during a mem cup run. That's valuable experience any way you slice it, and I don't think it will hurt him to stay in junior any more than it would to rush him to a level he's not yet ready for.

It's not valuable experience for him at this point. Valuable experience is learning how to play against bigger, stronger, faster players and going back to the CHL (which he has already dominated for an extended period of time) does not accomplish any of that. The NHL and CHL need to come to some kind of agreement that allows one player under 20 from each team allowed to play in the AHL

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

It's not valuable experience for him at this point. Valuable experience is learning how to play against bigger, stronger, faster players and going back to the CHL (which he has already dominated for an extended period of time) does not accomplish any of that. The NHL and CHL need to come to some kind of agreement that allows one player under 20 from each team allowed to play in the AHL

Like an ahl exeptional status

 

[93LEAFS]

Like an ahl exeptional status

If your too exceptional for the CHL at 19, you should be in the NHL. There are always things you can work on to improve. This isn't like Strome or Marner who absolutely tore up their league for 2 consecutive seasons. And even then, Strome still has things he can easily focus on improving at a lower level.

Is the CHL ideal? Maybe not. But, if Steel isn't good enough to make the Ducks outright, there are probably things he can focus on improving at the CHL level. You start draining top talent from the CHL eventually, it starts to diminish its value as a developmental league. Steel benefits by being able to go against guys who would have gotten this exemptional status such as Provorov, Barzal, Juulsen, Fleury, Sanheim etc over the years, and now kids like Woo, the Foote's, Addison, etc benefit by playing against Steel.

I'd say its very rare for a kid to be above playing in the CHL, but not good enough to play top 9 minutes in the NHL.

 

[nbducksfan19]

If your too exceptional for the CHL at 19, you should be in the NHL. There are always things you can work on to improve. This isn't like Strome or Marner who absolutely tore up their league for 2 consecutive seasons. And even then, Strome still has things he can easily focus on improving at a lower level.

Is the CHL ideal? Maybe not. But, if Steel isn't good enough to make the Ducks outright, there are probably things he can focus on improving at the CHL level. You start draining top talent from the CHL eventually, it starts to diminish its value as a developmental league. Steel benefits by being able to go against guys who would have gotten this exemptional status such as Provorov, Barzal, Juulsen, Fleury, Sanheim etc over the years, and now kids like Woo, the Foote's, Addison, etc benefit by playing against Steel.

I'd say its very rare for a kid to be above playing in the CHL, but not good enough to play top 9 minutes in the NHL.

of course it is rare, but that's why they would be the exception and not the rule.

 

[SmellOfVictory]

of course it is rare, but that's why they would be the exception and not the rule.

How would it be applied and enforced? How do you convince the CHL to do something that is effectively guaranteed to cause them to lose the next tier of their best players every season? "Hey guys, we just want to take away all of your superstars who are over 18 but can't hack it in the NHL. You cool with that?"

 

[93LEAFS]

of course it is rare, but that's why they would be the exception and not the rule.

It should stay the way it is, on a macro level it starts to deplete the quality of the league. If Steel isn't good enough to get a top 9 role on the Ducks next year, there is still stuff he can learn playing for Regina. Put it simply, if you are too good for the CHL where you won't learn anything, then you are good enough to play in the NHL. That is the exception.

 

[Exit Dose]

It should stay the way it is, on a macro level it starts to deplete the quality of the league. If Steel isn't good enough to get a top 9 role on the Ducks next year, there is still stuff he can learn playing for Regina. Put it simply, if you are too good for the CHL where you won't learn anything, then you are good enough to play in the NHL. That is the exception.

And he could learn more playing in the AHL.

 

[93LEAFS]

And he could learn more playing in the AHL.

Do you think he's as developed right now if you took out the top 18 and 19-year-olds out of the WHL for the last 3 years? It's not an individual issue. Long term it erodes the development quality of the CHL. Corey Perry destroyed the OHL at a 18 year old, I don't think him having to play his 19-year-old season in the OHL hurt him.

 

[Killerjas]

I disagree with above said comment. He shouldn't go to CHL next year. A consistent season with 131 points has proven that he is done with the CHL. I believe that a player can get better by playing with more elite, rougher and physically stronger men. He isn't gonna get that in the CHL.

Honestly, players like these need an exceptional status where NHL teams have a say where he goes next. If it is perfectly clear that he has outgrown the CHL, the organisation should have a say in the matter, not the CHL team. Long term it might have an impact on the CHL, but we are talking about maybe a handful to 10 players a year that are leaving the CHL.

 

[Exit Dose]

Do you think he's as developed right now if you took out the top 18 and 19-year-olds out of the WHL for the last 3 years? It's not an individual issue. Long term it erodes the development quality of the CHL. Corey Perry destroyed the OHL at a 18 year old, I don't think him having to play his 19-year-old season in the OHL hurt him.

Yes, I do.

 

[eternalbedhead]

It should stay the way it is, on a macro level it starts to deplete the quality of the league. If Steel isn't good enough to get a top 9 role on the Ducks next year, there is still stuff he can learn playing for Regina. Put it simply, if you are too good for the CHL where you won't learn anything, then you are good enough to play in the NHL. That is the exception.

This is what it boils down to. The AHL would be ideal for his development, but if he can't stick with Anaheim, there's still room for improvement in juniors.

To put his production in perspective: The last U-19 season that anyone had where they outscored Steel this year was Jarome Iginla, over 20 years ago in 95-96. Iginla joined the Flames after his WHL season ended in an upset, and would finish 2nd in Calder voting the next year. Also, Iginla's great WHL season only saw him finish 4th in WHL scoring; Mark Deyell was 1st with 159.

Now production isn't everything, and I don't really put much stock into things like NHLe, but if Steel can't even find a top 9 spot on our team after what has been, in terms of productivity, a historic season, then honestly, there's a lot of benefit to be had from going back to Regina and being THE guy for their Memorial Cup run.

 

[irishsetter13]

It should stay the way it is, on a macro level it starts to deplete the quality of the league. If Steel isn't good enough to get a top 9 role on the Ducks next year, there is still stuff he can learn playing for Regina. Put it simply, if you are too good for the CHL where you won't learn anything, then you are good enough to play in the NHL. That is the exception.

You are pretty much saying that he should stay in the CHL because it is better for the CHL and the team and the people who watch the CHL.

For Sam Steel, the better option for him would be to play in the AHL or maybe go play overseas. It should really be his choice if he wants to play in Junior or play professionally.

Ducks would surely rather him play in the AHL, Sam Steel would probably rather play in the AHL. But we need to protect a Junior Franchise because they want him to keep playing for them even though he has already surpassed that league. Doesnt seem fair.

Why do we need to protect junior teams who don't even have to pay a salary to their players? (And no a small stipend does not equally a salary) NCAA doesnt get first crack at former college players that dont make NHL Rosters. They go to the AHL.

 

[GetFocht]

So much hype for a guy that will likely top out as a 3rd liner but he will definitely dominate the AHL.

 

[Vipers31]

So much hype for a guy that will likely top out as a 3rd liner but he will definitely dominate the AHL.

You have already elicted one page of responses to a dumb statement in this thread, wasn't that enough? Not that you're the type to actually reply to anything after placing your cheap bait.

Yes, 15 pages of reasonable discussions is "so much hype" for a player doing something that hasn't been done in 20 years.

 

[93LEAFS]

You are pretty much saying that he should stay in the CHL because it is better for the CHL and the team and the people who watch the CHL.

For Sam Steel, the better option for him would be to play in the AHL or maybe go play overseas. It should really be his choice if he wants to play in Junior or play professionally.

Ducks would surely rather him play in the AHL, Sam Steel would probably rather play in the AHL. But we need to protect a Junior Franchise because they want him to keep playing for them even though he has already surpassed that league. Doesnt seem fair.

Why do we need to protect junior teams who don't even have to pay a salary to their players? (And no a small stipend does not equally a salary) NCAA doesnt get first crack at former college players that dont make NHL Rosters. They go to the AHL.

No, what I'm saying is Steel benefitted from the improved quality of the CHL with teams that leave their top players in the league. It is not an individual issue, it is about the overall developmental quality of the three leagues.

The exception is, if you good enough for the NHL, you can play in the NHL. Unless you are Connor McDavid, there is always more to learn at the CHL level. Marner and Spezza spent another season in the OHL after 2 ppg seasons. I really think people over-estimate the nothing left to learn angle.

 

[Randy Randerson]

You have already elicted one page of responses to a dumb statement in this thread, wasn't that enough? Not that you're the type to actually reply to anything after placing your cheap bait.

Yes, 15 pages of reasonable discussions is "so much hype" for a player doing something that hasn't been done in 20 years.

the Leafs will happily trade you guys a good 3rd liner to get Steel back and take the risk out of it for you....good deal?

 

[WhatTheDuck]

So much hype for a guy that will likely top out as a 3rd liner but he will definitely dominate the AHL.

Are you just going to post this garbage every few pages in this thread and then not stick around to provide any sort of reasoning?

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

Are you just going to post this garbage every few pages in this thread and then not stick around to provide any sort of reasoning?

Ignore him.

If Steel was a Canucks prospect (I wish) he'd be singing a different tune.

Just the type of poster he is.

 

[nbducksfan19]

No, what I'm saying is Steel benefitted from the improved quality of the CHL with teams that leave their top players in the league. It is not an individual issue, it is about the overall developmental quality of the three leagues.

The exception is, if you good enough for the NHL, you can play in the NHL. Unless you are Connor McDavid, there is always more to learn at the CHL level. Marner and Spezza spent another season in the OHL after 2 ppg seasons. I really think people over-estimate the nothing left to learn angle.

I understand and hear the points you are making. Selfishly, I think Steel would benefit more from playing in the AHL than the CHL (if he does not make the NHL). Again, it's not that there is "nothing left to learn" in the CHL, it's just a question of whether he could learn more from playing in the AHL at this point.