C Joseph Veleno - Saint John Sea Dogs, QMJHL (2018, 30th, DET)
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schnapshot
Mendoza baby
Gonna try to watch him as much as I can in the near future. He’s looked like a whole new player on Drummondville and IMO if he had played all season long as he had since the trade he would be slotted into everyone’s top-5s.
Janne Niinimaa
"Character"
I don't think he was playing badly in Saint John's. In his first few seasons he was behind a lot of good players in the depth chart so his production was understandable. This season, it seems like he was trying to play a mistake free game and be a responsible player to the extreme not to hurt his team at all. He was very good defensively, made simple plays that just didn't lead to anything. I blame this on being the captain of a weak team. In Drummondville, he's playing a more creative game since he has more liberty and it is paying off.
penaltykiller
Registered User
I totally agree; there is a clear positive difference in his own play (style and speed/aggression at which he plays) since the trade. To those who don’t think he has the offensive chops to be a 1C at the next level (i.e. 93Leafs), I have to question how much you’ve seen of Veleno before this year.
penaltykiller
Registered User
Make it 3! He completes the hat trick with an empty netter.
Maybe I have a stricter view of a legit top line center prospect. There are maybe 15 to 20 of those in the league. Maybe he turns into a 1B/2A guy, but I'm highly doubtful of him having legitimate first line franchise center or if he does, of having a strong chance of hitting it.
I've seen a bunch of him before this year. The Seadogs (and the New Brunswick teams) are probably the easiest teams to watch in Ontario considering Rogers picks up their feed.
He's playing well now that he's on a strong team he's done well. Maybe he mainstains this play for the remainder of the year and improves his stock. But, I still don't think he sees the game quick enough to be an elite offensive center at the NHL level. Some guys can excel without that, but I'm not sure he's that level of that type guy.
I can get behind that. I guess I’ve paid so much attention to him for so long - as a hopeful fan - that I’m just focusing on his strengths.
If he continues approximately his current level of play through the end of the year, where do you think he goes in the draft?
He'll go top 10 if he does this, which he has a strong chance of going anyway because this draft is completely devoid of centers and bad teams are generally desperate to acquire him. He could even start making top 5 noise. Like, if you are willing to go against BPA to fill your center need, what are you options? Its basically Veleno, Hayton, Kupari, Lundestrom and Kotkaneimi. Hayton in my eyes has looked better when deployed as a LW both with the Soo and at the Hlinka. Kupari may have a game that moves him to the wing. Kotkaniemi has questions about skating. Lundestrom probably has similar skills to Veleno, but has shown less offensive upside.
Pretty much every top forward in this draft is a winger. Svechnikov, Zadina, Tkachuk, Wahlstrom, and Farabee are wingers at the next level, and haven't played center in ages despite some places still listing them as such (especially Wahlstrom and Tkachuk). This draft really drops around 12 or so, so climbing into the tail end of that range shouldn't be too much of a challenge, especially when you look like the best option to fill a major organizational hole.
I tend to be pretty tough on trying to project guys to be 1st line centers at the NHL level. Its just such a demanding job and skill set, and generally the only kids who are safe bets to become one go very high. It's guys like McDavid, Matthews, Eichel, Barkov and Mackinnon in recent drafts. Then some others guys who end up pulling it off like Monahan and Scheifele. But, in that next tier of centers you also get a bit of a mixed bag like S. Reinhart, D. Strome, Zacha, Patrick, Hischier, Bennett, E. Lindholm and Draisaitl. Hischier and Draisaitl are the safest bet of those guys right now to be a bona fide top 15 to 20 NHL center. Patrick has a chance (he also reminded me of Monahan). Reinhart and Bennett look quite unlikely at this point.
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Sorry to split hairs, but Hayton played centre at Hlinka. 1st unit pp and 1st unit pk.
It varied. I'll double check, as I have all the Canada games backed up, but for some of the games he split duties with Akil Thomas. It was probably just a case of due to how many centers they had, they used guys to take their strong side faceoffs (Hayton on the left, and Thomas on the right). But, Hayton was probably used in the traditional center role post face-off more often as the guy who battled down-low, while Thomas was given more freedom to exit the zone but received more playmaking duties.
Considering how heavy the line-up was on centers they moved guys around.
Edit: Just quickly going through the Finland vs Canada round robin game, it felt like Hayton took less faceoffs than Thomas, which may be why I mis-remembered, but it seem dictated by the side the face-off was on. Surprisingly, Veleno took almost no face-offs when with McBain.
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Hansen
tyler motte simp
Vachon23
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le_sean
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He couldn’t produce when he played for a bad team in the Q, so how could we expect him to produce for a bad team in the NHL?
David Suzuki
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The Great Weal
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schnapshot
Mendoza baby
He is very good but I would cry because I’d like us to pick between 1-5.
Thanks for checking. It was great hockey to watch. There was some fluidity, with lots of traditional centres on that team, but Hayton was mostly centre that week and used a ton in that tourney. You are right about the weak side faceoffs.
1Gold Standard
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- Jun 13, 2012
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ya, I wouldn't take Veleno if I'm picking in the top 20. after that, then sure. but I'd return him to junior for 2 years and then send him off to the AHL for a year, possibly 2 after that.
but good to see him putting some points up finally at 18 years old.
but good to see him putting some points up finally at 18 years old.
schnapshot
Mendoza baby
There is quite a talent difference between the two...
Plus he did produce, at at PPG rate.
le_sean
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He produced at a PPG rate for three consecutive years in the Q, never improving. That is not the sign of a good player. Now all of a sudden he’s improved on an offensive powerhouse and people are impressed. Sorry but truly elite players find a way to produce well in any situation.
He's always been more of a pure passer. He'll only be as good as his wingers. Put him with a solid trigger man and he'll set him up. On the plus side he has a highly advanced defensive game he can always fall back on. Safe player but probably not what you want with a top 5 pick.
schnapshot
Mendoza baby
Always PPG, never improving?
1st season: 0.69 PPG -> 15 years old
2nd season: 0.88 PPG
3rd season: 1.25 PPG, 1.75 PPG with Drummondville
But yeah ok, he never improved
Lebowski
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