C Elias Pettersson - Timra IK, Allsvenskan (2017, 5th, VAN)

[DoctorDoak]

I think he's going to be better than like... 4 of those players, at least. And I think he has the ceiling to be better than all of them. I don't have a very high opinion of scouting, but even hockey scouts aren't that bad. They've noticed.

Curious to know the four players in that list you're certain he's better than...

 

[GetFocht]

I want Canucks to select him at 5. I feel like he is going to turn out to be the best player in the first round.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I think he's going to be better than like... 4 of those players, at least. And I think he has the ceiling to be better than all of them. I don't have a very high opinion of scouting, but even hockey scouts aren't that bad. They've noticed.

I don't know about that, As far as Centers go Patrick, Hischier, Glass, Mittelstadt and Vilardi i feel will all be better then Pettersson rather easily. I'm not all that convinced about Pettersson i will gladly take any of those 5 Centers over him.

 

[Legionnaire11]

What position does Pettersson play? I used to only see him as C, then I started seeing C/LW and now I'm seeing a lot of listings that are only LW?

 

[Smeagoal]

I want Canucks to select him at 5. I feel like he is going to turn out to be the best player in the first round.

I don't think he'd be the best player in the first round, but I think he's definitely got potential to become one of the top players. Whether or not he can reach it is another q. I like him a lot and wouldn't be against drafting him.

Anyone know how long the wait would be to see him in the NHL? Are we talking a project 3-5 years, or more 1-3 year away?

 

[XX]

In any case, a guy with a 6'2" frame should easily be able to get around 190 pounds.

All frames aren't made equal. A guy with a very slight frame, as measured at the ankles and wrists, will have a hard time reaching that weight. Then if you add on sub-optimal genetics, he could really struggle to reach even 180. Nobody should be drafting this kid and betting he's a slam dunk to reach a normal playing weight unless he doesn't train, doesn't eat properly, and the same is true of his brother. Then, depending on his measurements at the combine, you could project better.

At some point the upside outweighs the risk, so he will be taken probably no later than the teens, but top 5? I have a hard time seeing that.

 

[Birko19]

In any case, a guy with a 6'2" frame should easily be able to get around 190 pounds.

Not if he has a small frame, which from the sounds of it, he does. It's not impossible, but not as easy as you think unless he uses steroids.

 

[Cupless44]

I want Canucks to select him at 5. I feel like he is going to turn out to be the best player in the first round.

I don't. We just can't afford to get any smaller and softer up front.

Glass, Vilardi, Mittelstadt all have plenty of skill and will play at 200+

 

[lawrence]

I don't. We just can't afford to get any smaller and softer up front.

Glass, Vilardi, Mittelstadt all have plenty of skill and will play at 200+

hilarious... he is a 200 foot player himself, not to mention point per game in a mens leaugue and was 2nd in points on his team that played in a mens leaugue.... Dude has way more skill then Glass and Vilardi. he's for sure far more creative then those 2.

 

[XX]

Not if he has a small frame, which from the sounds of it, he does. It's not impossible, but not as easy as you think unless he uses steroids.

One of the smaller frames I've seen. Scouts should ask themselves if he can play at 175ish on NA ice.

 

[L13]

I don't. We just can't afford to get any smaller and softer up front.

Glass, Vilardi, Mittelstadt all have plenty of skill and will play at 200+

Uh, have you seen any pictures of Glass? He's just as slight as Pettersson.

In any case, this ~we need more size~ thing is stupid. Your team can't afford to get any less talented up front; that's the real danger.

(Note that I'm not saying it would be wrong to prefer any of those three players to Pettersson. But 'size' would be a very silly reason.)

 

[Lebowski]

Not if he has a small frame, which from the sounds of it, he does. It's not impossible, but not as easy as you think unless he uses steroids.

Steroids to get to 190 pounds?

C'mon... He's a 17 years old kid that needs to hit the weigth room, that's all.

All frames aren't made equal. A guy with a very slight frame, as measured at the ankles and wrists, will have a hard time reaching that weight. Then if you add on sub-optimal genetics, he could really struggle to reach even 180. Nobody should be drafting this kid and betting he's a slam dunk to reach a normal playing weight unless he doesn't train, doesn't eat properly, and the same is true of his brother. Then, depending on his measurements at the combine, you could project better.

At some point the upside outweighs the risk, so he will be taken probably no later than the teens, but top 5? I have a hard time seeing that.

The lightest 6'2'' player in the entire NHL is 183 pounds.

The guy is still a kid. He'll put on mass in due time.

 

[Cupless44]

hilarious... he is a 200 foot player himself, not to mention point per game in a mens leaugue and was 2nd in points on his team that played in a mens leaugue.... Dude has way more skill then Glass and Vilardi. he's for sure far more creative then those 2.

I said they will play at 200+ pounds. Peterson is a skinny, slight player. I think Vilardi has more skill than you think. Thats why he is a sure fire top 5 pick and Pettersson isn't in the top 5.

 

[Cupless44]

Uh, have you seen any pictures of Glass? He's just as slight as Pettersson.

In any case, this ~we need more size~ thing is stupid. Your team can't afford to get any less talented up front; that's the real danger.

(Note that I'm not saying it would be wrong to prefer any of those three players to Pettersson. But 'size' would be a very silly reason.)

Glass will fill out. His family is huge.

All those players are ranked ahead of Pettersson on every list for a reason. They are also good players.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

I've always thought the frame thing to be nonsense. Shoulders and hips mean nothing; that's not even where the muscle is going! I don't even know how that would work. All your muscle goes between your shoulder blades, and so there isn't any room left to get more muscular? The idea that thin people with narrow shoulders have some kind of cap on their muscular size is pseudoscience at best. Applying it to overall body weight is... even less founded, somehow.

And while we're debunking myths, nobody really has that different of a metabolism. The whole ecto/endo/mesomorph thing is total nonsense. Pettersson will be able to put on weight with some effort. This kid is not an exception to the laws of thermodynamics.

 

[Lebowski]

I've always thought the frame thing to be nonsense. Shoulders and hips mean nothing; that's not even where the muscle is going! I don't even know how that would work. All your muscle goes between your shoulder blades, and so there isn't any room left to get more muscular? The idea that thin people with narrow shoulders have some kind of cap on their muscular size is pseudoscience at best.

And while we're debunking myths, nobody really has that different of a metabolism. The whole ecto/endo/mesomorph thing is total nonsense. Pettersson will be able to put on weight with some effort. This kid is not an exception to the laws of thermodynamics.

Bingo.

While it's true some people tend to put on mass more easily than others, anyone, given a certain calorie intake, will increase his weight.

 

[The Sweetness]

Lots of bro-science going on in this thread.

 

[lawrence]

I said they will play at 200+ pounds. Peterson is a skinny, slight player. I think Vilardi has more skill than you think. Thats why he is a sure fire top 5 pick and Pettersson isn't in the top 5.

I do agree, being 6'2 and 160 is way off. That said Henrik sedin is 6 feet 2 and playing at 185 lbs.

 

[gretskidoo]

I do agree, being 6'2 and 160 is way off. That said Henrik sedin is 6 feet 2 and playing at 185 lbs.

So is Wayne Simmonds. But no, you need to be at least 200lbs to play in the NHL when Pettersson is being talked about and obviously Pettersson won't be able to gain any weight at all. Completely stopped growing, won't be able to just eat like a fat slob and can't build muscle whatsoever. Weird stuff.

 

[Cupless44]

I do agree, being 6'2 and 160 is way off. That said Henrik sedin is 6 feet 2 and playing at 185 lbs.

Yup and as good as they have been, I am ready for some more gritty players up front than the Sedins after 16 years of it. Watching Getzlaf and Perry only confirmed it tonight. Time for a different mix up front on the Canucks. Peterson more of the same.

 

[VictorLustig]

Yup and as good as they have been, I am ready for some more gritty players up front than the Sedins after 16 years of it. Watching Getzlaf and Perry only confirmed it tonight. Time for a different mix up front on the Canucks. Peterson more of the same.

If you draft for grit rather than skill you are much more likely to end up with a bunch of Virtanens and Kassians rather than Getzlafs.

 

[XX]

Lots of bro-science going on in this thread.

We're all genetic blanks that respond to training and eating in a surplus the exact same way. There's no large, observable differences between trained individuals in the NHL or sports in general. Olympians do not exist.

 

[Lebowski]

We're all genetic blanks that respond to training and eating in a surplus the exact same way. There's no large, observable differences between trained individuals in the NHL or sports in general. Olympians do not exist.

Did anyone suggest that?

No.

Pettersson is currently built like a teenager and won't be a teenager forever. That's all there is to it.

 

[XX]

Did anyone suggest that?

No.

Pettersson is currently built like a teenager and won't be a teenager forever. That's all there is to it.

That's really weird angle to take, considering there's lots of guys his age that aren't so light. Plenty have more muscle, even shorter guys and younger guys. He's a 98 birthday to boot. Your argument only makes sense if he's never, ever set foot in a weight room. I really doubt that. That'd be really dumb on the part of his club and also dumb on his part.

It's also weird considering we have his brother who has presumably had resources available to him and has had to train in a men's league yet hasn't really put on that much weight, despite being five years older. It's almost like there's some sort of limiting factor there that's shared between brothers. hmmm....

He may very well - with a lot of dedication - reach 180. He may even become an effective player at that weight. But I have my doubts, and with so many other equally as good players available, I'd personally avoid him inside the top 10. He did not have a strong WJC. That's not a surprise when you consider he is spotting 20-40 pounds to most of his opponents, even a guy like Tolvanen who is four inches shorter. Not only is he giving up that weight, but he's also taller than average, meaning the difference in muscle mass is even greater.

The best thing that can happen for his draft stock is to weigh in at more than 170 at the combine.

 

[The Sweetness]

We're all genetic blanks that respond to training and eating in a surplus the exact same way. There's no large, observable differences between trained individuals in the NHL or sports in general. Olympians do not exist.

Why are you quoting me?