C Dylan Larkin (2014, 15th, DET)

[drw02]

I'd pump the break a little on Larkin being a franchise player. I think he will be a great player regardless (he already is one) but I think what I'd consider to be a franchise center capable of winning multiple Cups is a two-way 70+ point player, and I think that's far from a given at this point. He has that potential but he could also end up a solid 2C on the low end.

What more do you really need to see? He's 19 and plays the game like a seasoned NHL vet. He has every tool you could possibly want in a hockey player. Since when is a player required to win a cup(s) to be considered a franchise player. So Alex Ovechkin isn't a franchise player? John Tavares isn't a franchise player? Obviously Larkin has to prove it still, but zero doubt he has franchise player level ability and upside.


Larkin will be exactly what your definition was....70+ point player with excellent 200 foot game....minus the parts about winning cups because no one player can make a team a cup contender...except for like Wayne Gretzky.

 

[MardyBum]

What more do you really need to see? He's 19 and plays the game like a seasoned NHL vet. He has every tool you could possibly want in a hockey player. Since when is a player required to win a cup(s) to be considered a franchise player. So Alex Ovechkin isn't a franchise player? John Tavares isn't a franchise player? Obviously Larkin has to prove it still, but zero doubt he has franchise player level ability and upside.


Larkin will be exactly what your definition was....70+ point player with excellent 200 foot game....minus the parts about winning cups because no one player can make a team a cup contender...except for like Wayne Gretzky.

NHL regular season games??

 

[drw02]

NHL regular season games??

We've seen him play against NHL level competition plenty. The WC's alone are higher competition level than an NHL game.

 

[MardyBum]

We've seen him play against NHL level competition plenty. The WC's alone are higher competition level than an NHL game.

Well, at least I can take away that Hellebuyck is the next Carey Price.

Really though, playing well at a tournament is nice, but it's not the same as doing it through 82 games in the NHL.

Larkin's looking great, and he may be great, just as Nylander, Ehlers, Virtanen, etc may all be great.

 

[nbwingsfan]

What more do you really need to see? He's 19 and plays the game like a seasoned NHL vet. He has every tool you could possibly want in a hockey player. Since when is a player required to win a cup(s) to be considered a franchise player. So Alex Ovechkin isn't a franchise player? John Tavares isn't a franchise player? Obviously Larkin has to prove it still, but zero doubt he has franchise player level ability and upside.


Larkin will be exactly what your definition was....70+ point player with excellent 200 foot game....minus the parts about winning cups because no one player can make a team a cup contender...except for like Wayne Gretzky.

Let's wait for him to play an NHL regular season game, that might be something we need to see? Before last season, Larkin was NOT viewed anywhere close to a player with franchise level potential. He was almost unanimously viewed as a future #2/3C with great defensive play who best case could end up as a Bergeron type player.

Yes this past season has made most are he can definitely be a #1C, but I think most of us Wings fans need to temper our expectations a bit until we actually see what he can do. Saying that teams missed out on drafting him is asking us to look bad in a couple years if he doesn't pan out.

 

[drw02]

Well, at least I can take away that Hellebuyck is the next Carey Price.

Really though, playing well at a tournament is nice, but it's not the same as doing it through 82 games in the NHL.

Larkin's looking great, and he may be great, just as Nylander, Ehlers, Virtanen, etc may all be great.

I don't disagree with anything you said. All I'm saying is the skillset is there for Larkin to be a franchise level player. I don't need to see a full season to know if a guy has the talent to be an elite NHL player. Show me 15 or so games against NHL level competition and I can formulate an opinion. It's the same as scouts who are scouting for potential draft picks. Most organizations don't scout a given prospects every game, they only want to see a handful of games because once you start seeing more you can begin to over analyze. Hakan Andersson, Wings head euro scout has even said he only likes to see prospects play 2-3 times.

 

[LarKing]

The Larkin Hype Train is going faster than the speed of light right now, some of you really need to relax with the superstar comments he hasn't even lit up the ahl for a large enough sample yet

 

[Menzinger]

Red Wings management did. And did it without almighty Jim Nill. Who cares about what fans are thinking. We don't know a **** in reality.

1. FLO - Ekblad - D
2. BUF - Reinhart - C
3. EDM - Draisaitl - C
4. CGY - Bennett - C

5. This 5th overall should have been the place where Larkin goes. But everybody started picking wingers or defencemen. Wingers after wingers. When there was a TOP5 pick Overall Center and probable Franchise player available.

5. NYI - Dal Colle - W
6. VAN - Virtanen - W
7. CAR - Fleury - D
8. TOR - Nylander - F (possible center but everything point to career winger)
9. WPG - Ehlers - W
10. ANA - Ritchie - W
11. NSH - Fiala - W
12. ARI - Perlini - W
13. WSH - Vrana - W
14. DAL - Honka - D

15. DET - Larkin - C

Those ten organizations before Detroit can look in the mirror. You missed. You got good players, but not a great player Detroit got. Not against drafting defencemen if you need them, but those wingers, everybody of them would be ready to be traded for Larkin in next few years.

I'll thank all those organizations who picked from 5 to 14 rebuilding the Red Wings future Center core for next 15 years. Without tanking. Thank you all.

Let's hold off for a few years before definitively claiming that Larkin will be better than thr 14 players picked ahead of him.

Having a good camp and preseason is hardly the mark of being a franchise player. Plenty of guys look impressive and then have pedestrian careers afterwards.

 

[Semantics]

8. TOR - Nylander - F (possible center but everything point to career winger)

Can you stop making assertions about prospects you're obviously unfamiliar with? There's absolutely nothing pointing to Nylander being a career winger. In his entire life he's played maybe 50 games on the wing. He played center exclusively throughout camp, will play center exclusively in the AHL this year, and Leafs management have said they view him as a center.

 

[ForumNamePending]

We've seen him play against NHL level competition plenty. The WC's alone are higher competition level than an NHL game.

Some games... sure, but games against the likes of Slovenia or Belarus... probably not. Besides, and I'm not saying he won't be a franchise level player, but are this year's WC really what you want to be using to prop up his franchise player credentials at this point? Most franchise players, even ones with 200ft games, post more impressive stat lines than GP 10 G 0 A 1 +/- -2.

 

[MardyBum]

I don't disagree with anything you said. All I'm saying is the skillset is there for Larkin to be a franchise level player. I don't need to see a full season to know if a guy has the talent to be an elite NHL player. Show me 15 or so games against NHL level competition and I can formulate an opinion. It's the same as scouts who are scouting for potential draft picks. Most organizations don't scout a given prospects every game, they only want to see a handful of games because once you start seeing more you can begin to over analyze. Hakan Andersson, Wings head euro scout has even said he only likes to see prospects play 2-3 times.

And everyone else is saying he has the potential to be a #1 Centre, which I agree with.

Franchise Center? As someone else said, pump the brakes a bit.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Larkin has franchise center potential in the same way Toews did. I consider Toews to be a very good 1st line center. Not a franchise player.

 

[drw02]

Let's wait for him to play an NHL regular season game, that might be something we need to see? Before last season, Larkin was NOT viewed anywhere close to a player with franchise level potential. He was almost unanimously viewed as a future #2/3C with great defensive play who best case could end up as a Bergeron type player.

Yes this past season has made most are he can definitely be a #1C, but I think most of us Wings fans need to temper our expectations a bit until we actually see what he can do. Saying that teams missed out on drafting him is asking us to look bad in a couple years if he doesn't pan out.

It doesn't matter what he was viewed as (which is debatable anyway), it's what he is now. The eyes don't lie, what more do you need to see? What more could he possibly do to prove to you he's got future franchise player ability? Again I'm not saying he currently is a franchise player, just that he has that potential level. He has proven that with his play and production.

 

[drw02]

And everyone else is saying he has the potential to be a #1 Centre, which I agree with.

Franchise Center? As someone else said, pump the brakes a bit.

Ok I guess we may have different opinions as to what a franchise player is. I'm saying he's gonna be very good, probably the best player on the Red Wings in the near future. I'm not putting him in the hall of fame or anything.

 

[drw02]

Some games... sure, but games against the likes of Slovenia or Belarus... probably not. Besides, and I'm not saying he won't be a franchise level player, but are this year's WC really what you want to be using to prop up his franchise player credentials at this point? Most franchise players, even ones with 200ft games, post more impressive stat lines than GP 10 G 0 A 1 +/- -2.

He played a 3rd-4th line checking role. That's what they asked him to do and he did it. He still displayed a lot of talent, created some great scoring opportunities. The final stat totals don't always tell the whole story.

 

[member 147413]

Ok I guess we may have different opinions as to what a franchise player is. I'm saying he's gonna be very good, probably the best player on the Red Wings in the near future. I'm not putting him in the hall of fame or anything.

Don't temper those expectations, let's say best Wing ever?

 

[drw02]

Don't temper those expectations, let's say best Wing ever?

Hey you may be right, but he'll still pale in comparison to the future best player the world has ever seen in Mitch Marner

 

[newfy]

I tihnk its reasonable to say he has a very good shot at being a number 1 center. It does depend on your definition though. When I say number 1 center I include guys like Krejci or Bergeron, probably David Backes as well. Basically if you have a great defensive game and can score ~60 points you are a number one in my books. With strong wingers like the wings seem to have thats all he needs to become to keep the wings forwards solid for years though. I think right now this is a fair and safe based on hows hes played to project for him.

Once you start talking about Franchise level guys, youre talking in the point per game range. You dont have to be a Crosby but that next level of guys. A Getzlaf top 10 to 15 center in the league that a winner can be built around and can carry a team if they must. I wouldnt say this is a safe projection for Larkin at this point, but its not that far off also. If things go right and he keeps developing at the rate he has the last couple years,he could get into this range and become a great centerman. Not a safe projection but hes somewhat trending that way. With his defensive game and leadership I dont think he has to hit point per game to be included in this group of centermen, he can score a little bit less than some of them.

As for floor, I guess if he cant score at all at the next level compared to how hes projected hes a safe bet to be an amazing third line centerman. I would say with his speed 40 points, PK and defensive play are his floor. Hes played well enough and is looking to make the league at 19 on a patient team, if he doesnt do better than this I will be extremely surprised and disappointed because with how hes trending this isnt good enough

 

[nbwingsfan]

It doesn't matter what he was viewed as (which is debatable anyway), it's what he is now. The eyes don't lie, what more do you need to see? What more could he possibly do to prove to you he's got future franchise player ability? Again I'm not saying he currently is a franchise player, just that he has that potential level. He has proven that with his play and production.

Of course it matters what he was viewed at before. One great season does not negate that he was never viewed as one before that season. The majority of franchise level players were hyped well before, unless your definition of Franchise player is very relaxed.

If you're basing it on simply "ability" then there's about 10 potential Franchise players from the 2014 draft, when in reality there might be one or two.

I'm very high on Larkin, but using the "franchise" title before he's even played an NHL game is a little drastic when he isn't a McDavid type talent.

 

[DanZ]

What more do you really need to see? He's 19 and plays the game like a seasoned NHL vet. He has every tool you could possibly want in a hockey player. Since when is a player required to win a cup(s) to be considered a franchise player. So Alex Ovechkin isn't a franchise player? John Tavares isn't a franchise player? Obviously Larkin has to prove it still, but zero doubt he has franchise player level ability and upside.

The goal for the Wings is to win Cups. I'm obviously not implying that he has to Cups by himself... I said that for him to be a franchise center he needs to be capable of being a first line center on a Cup-winning team. It's far from a guarantee that he will be able to do that. I never said he doesn't have that potential though.

Larkin will be exactly what your definition was....70+ point player with excellent 200 foot game....minus the parts about winning cups because no one player can make a team a cup contender...except for like Wayne Gretzky.

If Larkin becomes that, than he is a franchise player capable of winning Cups, but like I said, that's far from a given at this point.

 

[obey86]

Of course it matters what he was viewed at before. One great season does not negate that he was never viewed as one before that season. The majority of franchise level players were hyped well before, unless your definition of Franchise player is very relaxed.

If you're basing it on simply "ability" then there's about 10 potential Franchise players from the 2014 draft, when in reality there might be one or two.

I'm very high on Larkin, but using the "franchise" title before he's even played an NHL game is a little drastic when he isn't a McDavid type talent.

No player is guaranteed to be a "franchise player"....even the top 5 pick types. Projections for a single player vary from year to year. Players don't develop linearly..some break out early and some break out later. A top 5 pick could disappoint and bust...a 2nd round pick could surprise and be a franchise guy. Expectations should be adjusted accordingly.

Overall point is, draft position doesn't matter. Draft position is just how they were viewed during the draft. Things change fast. There's a reason there are so many busts and surprises in the draft....future years and how a player will develop is incredibly hard to predict.

 

[DanZ]

Of course it matters what he was viewed at before. One great season does not negate that he was never viewed as one before that season. The majority of franchise level players were hyped well before, unless your definition of Franchise player is very relaxed.

If you're basing it on simply "ability" then there's about 10 potential Franchise players from the 2014 draft, when in reality there might be one or two.

I'm very high on Larkin, but using the "franchise" title before he's even played an NHL game is a little drastic when he isn't a McDavid type talent.

It's not really as relevant for an 18 year old (at the time). Larkin is likely to get better from here on out considering he's only a teenager, not regress. Yes, one great season as an 18 year old, after being held back on the second line behind Eichel, does tend to dramatically change people's opinions of a player, and rightfully so. This shouldn't be a shock to anyone.

 

[McNurse]

I like the kid. *insert shrugging face*

 

[nbwingsfan]

No player is guaranteed to be a "franchise player"....even the top 5 pick types. Projections for a single player vary from year to year. Players don't develop linearly..some break out early and some break out later. A top 5 pick could disappoint and bust...a 2nd round pick could surprise and be a franchise guy. Expectations should be adjusted accordingly.

Overall point is, draft position doesn't matter. Draft position is just how they were viewed during the draft. Things change fast. There's a reason there are so many busts and surprises in the draft....future years and how a player will develop is incredibly hard to predict.

When has a player drafted 15th overall or later ever given the "franchise player" tag before playing a single NHL game? I can't think of one.

 

[DanZ]

When has a player drafted 15th overall or later ever given the "franchise player" tag before playing a single NHL game? I can't think of one.

How much research did you actually do on this? Getzlaf and Perry were both drafted at the end of the first round. Giroux had a lot of hype. I'm sure there are plenty of examples.

Also, this was one poster. His opinion is about as meaningful as the rest of ours.