C Connor Bedard (2023, 1st, CHI) Part 6

[daver]

Anyone throwing out the Kane comparison is just being a contrarian at this point. He is statistically more dominant than McDavid was at the same age.

But of course, if you reeeeaaaaallllly watch the games like @JustLinda obviously is doing, you will be struck, nay, overwhelmed, by the incredible shortcomings of his game.

 

[Deleted member 339941]

 

[Hamilton Bulldogs]

Ducks need this young man.

 

[cupface52]

Anyone throwing out the Kane comparison is just being a contrarian at this point. He is statistically more dominant than McDavid was at the same age.

But of course, if you reeeeaaaaallllly watch the games like @JustLinda obviously is doing, you will be struck, nay, overwhelmed, by the incredible shortcomings of his game.

Except Kane is a year older. As a 16 year old he played for the USNTDP u18, again at 17, at 18 he went to the OHL. Bedard was eligible for the u18 his draft year, Kane wasn't because of his age.

If Kane was the same age as Bedard in his draft year, by the same logic, so was Tavares. Therefore, Tavares' first year in the OHL he played as a 14 year old, not 15.

 

[Just Linda]

You have very clearly been anti Bedard since you proclaimed Fantilli was your #1 in December. Of course people are going to rub it in your face when Bedard has a historic WJC and Fantilli slowly gets demoted down the lineup. Is BFan not allowed to bring up his production tonight after you said Bedard would likely struggle to produce this series?

I completely agree that Bedard will have to play drastically different away from the puck and change some of his habits that he has developed in the dub but there are 2 reasons why I am not overly worried:
1) He has shown the ability to change his game and adapt very quickly if needed. In game 1 of the world juniors he was Regina Bedard - trying to beat D 1 on 1, floating a bit, unnecessary turnovers, long shifts, etc.. Game 2 on he played a completely different - better puck management, effort on both sides of the puck, engaged physically, and doing a great job of identifying the high probability plays (which usually meant being a facilitator since teams were over defending his shot). Was he perfect? No. But promising that he can adjust so quickly at his age in such a pressure cooker.
2) Paddock openly admitted in an interview on their BC swing that he was actively giving Bedard extra rope in regards to shift length, flying the zone early in the defensive end, etc. in the name of producing offence. It’s not as is Bedard is being asked to play an ultra responsible 200 foot game and he is ignoring it or not able to do it. Regina’s roster necessitates that he take chances to produce. I have no doubt that he will play differently when an NHL coach asks (hammers on him) to do so.

He’s never going to be a Bergeron or even a Crosby defensively but I think he will round out his game to be acceptable away from the puck, while providing world class offence. Crosby and McDavid are the only No-doubt generational players in the last 20 years and Bedard’s pre-draft resume has essentially matched them step for step so forgive the other posters for getting excited that we might have another player of that caliber in the makings. His path to get there certainly seems more unlikely than Cros and McDavid given his skill set and size but there is something special about this kid, an “it” factor if you will, where everyone he goes he blows the doors off the expectations and finds a way - usually in the biggest moments.

- Bedard has evolved his game quite a bit over the past season but I've been more impressed with Paddock. A big part of why Saskatoon lost tonight (other than Elliot looking rattled and things just not clicking) is because Saskatoon was out coached badly. I don't have the stats but I'd wager that this was Bedard's lowest ice time in quite a while, he didn't seem to be on the ice every second shift which made Saskatoon not able to match him as well as they'd hope.

Paddock has done a fantastic job developing the Pats. 6 months ago it was a team that was hopeless without Bedard on the ice but now it's playing like a playoff team should. I've said it elsewhere but I've preferred how Howe looks away from Bedard even though he's not putting up near the same production, Howe on his own line means they have more than one dangerous line and Howe gets to play his game more. I know Paddock took a lot of online heat for separating them but I feel it's made the team look a lot better.

- I know it's unpopular but I do still stand behind my Fantilli pick. Not sure if I'd still do it (haven't had as much time to watch Fantilli over the last couple months) but I'm not pretty sold that Bedard's game is more suited for NHL wing, I don't want him to change his whole playing identity because it's as good as it is. I also have been drumming the Tavares should've been a winger drum ever since Tavares was 15/16 lol, same reasons even though they are as different as players as they are (though the CHL stat guru Eilles likes to point out the similarities in their takeaway scores and shooting indexes, I'm thinking he's the only one who thinks it's a good comparable). My assessment of Fantilli over Bedard had nothing to do with Bedard though, Fantilli is going to be an amazing, play driving, all situations centre on a great team IMO.

 

[gimbznyr]

1st you said hes only great on the PP, not a great ES player

Then you said he can't put up points like McDavid

When both happened, now you just rely on "hes just not as good as Crosby/McDavid" with no substance

Its comical.

Lol I check on this thread every here and there to see what takes the guy

I don’t see much wrong with any of the posts you quoted. You continue to have bold, negative takes about Bedard - people strongly disagree with you - you are almost instantly proven wrong and people rub it in your face - you double down and the cycle starts again. That’s a message board for you. If you don’t like it, stop being so wrong!

This guy and that whiskey devils guy has been trying to convince the world he "is good but isn't THAT good" for ages.

 

[Panthaz89]

Anyways.

We’ve all heard about this theoretical “clutch gene” before, but I don’t think there has ever been such an embodiment of it as Connor Bedard. This kid has just risen to the occasion in every big game or step-up in competitiveness, without fail.

Literally everyone is waiting for him to falter that the magnifying glass on him is being shoved up his nose at this point.

 

[prongertheman9]

- Bedard has evolved his game quite a bit over the past season but I've been more impressed with Paddock. A big part of why Saskatoon lost tonight (other than Elliot looking rattled and things just not clicking) is because Saskatoon was out coached badly. I don't have the stats but I'd wager that this was Bedard's lowest ice time in quite a while, he didn't seem to be on the ice every second shift which made Saskatoon not able to match him as well as they'd hope.

Paddock has done a fantastic job developing the Pats. 6 months ago it was a team that was hopeless without Bedard on the ice but now it's playing like a playoff team should. I've said it elsewhere but I've preferred how Howe looks away from Bedard even though he's not putting up near the same production, Howe on his own line means they have more than one dangerous line and Howe gets to play his game more. I know Paddock took a lot of online heat for separating them but I feel it's made the team look a lot better.

- I know it's unpopular but I do still stand behind my Fantilli pick. Not sure if I'd still do it (haven't had as much time to watch Fantilli over the last couple months) but I'm not pretty sold that Bedard's game is more suited for NHL wing, I don't want him to change his whole playing identity because it's as good as it is. I also have been drumming the Tavares should've been a winger drum ever since Tavares was 15/16 lol, same reasons even though they are as different as players as they are (though the CHL stat guru Eilles likes to point out the similarities in their takeaway scores and shooting indexes, I'm thinking he's the only one who thinks it's a good comparable). My assessment of Fantilli over Bedard had nothing to do with Bedard though, Fantilli is going to be an amazing, play driving, all situations centre on a great team IMO.

I honestly haven’t been a huge fan of Paddock’s all in all since he took over last year but he certainly unlocked Bedard’s offensive game - even if it was at the expense of developing his 2-way game.

So you stand by your Fantilli take but not sure if you’d still do it??? Doesn’t sound like you are standing behind it too firmly!

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

He's so good, maybe he won't be the player McDavid is now but he is the most skilled and all around most dangerous offensive talent to come into the draft since McDavid , and Crosby before that. The combination of being that slippery and gifted while manuvering offensively combined with his release is ridiculous . He not only has the best shot maybe ever at 17, but he is also able to get it off because of how incredibly gifted he is with the puck and moving through space offensively

 

[J bo Jeans]

Exactly, it's 8 months, that's the timeframe that's relevant not this 'age 17 season' vs. 'age 18 season' when comparing Draft prospects. All NHL draft prospects are within a 365-day period in age. The early birthday guys get every advantage growing up on the January 1 - December 31 deadline and now people want them to get an edge in the Draft as well, but it doesn't work that way. NHL teams don't give a crap about when you registered for Mites.

It 100% does matter. Because they have a late birthday, they get drafted a year later and thus get an extra year of junior before being draft eligible.

Theres a huge gap in development between an 17-18 year old and a 18-19 year old.

Fact is you would have to compare next season for Bedard.

 

[WarriorofTime]

It 100% does matter. Because they have a late birthday, they get drafted a year later and thus get an extra year of junior before being draft eligible.

Fact is you would have to compare next season for Bedard.

Bedard is in his third year of Juniors...

(don't use COVID as an excuse because that was the same for everyone, it didn't only effect him)

Both players would be in their "17 going on 18 year old" season. That's how the Draft works. It's just a different cutoff than Mite Registration. Neither is particularly more meaningful. Extra year of hockey development doesn't matter by that point. That is long in the rear view window and only matters at extremely young ages (and is dependent on when they actually registered, for instance McDavid was 4 and playing with 6 year olds because his parents lied about his age, and his January birthday helped his physical development relative to most kids in his birth year born later).

 

[ryan callahan]

Another proof that elite players become even more paramount in the playoffs. imo Bedard is enough to beat any WHL team not named Seattle, Winnipeg and Kamloops in the playoffs.

 

[Just Linda]

I honestly haven’t been a huge fan of Paddock’s all in all since he took over last year but he certainly unlocked Bedard’s offensive game - even if it was at the expense of developing his 2-way game.

So you stand by your Fantilli take but not sure if you’d still do it??? Doesn’t sound like you are standing behind it too firmly!

It's not November anymore, opinions grow and perspectives grow. If I haven't grown your opinion after a dozen player viewings of players, that would be an issue. I do stand behind my November opinion, doesn't mean it's the same as my April opinion.

The difference between now and November is that Bedard has developed more than Fantilli IMO, Bedard fixed some of the lumps in his game in a short time frame. The biggest change I've noticed in Bedard's game was on the breakout and in the neutral zone, he used to cheat behind the d on nearly every play (even at the WJC) and his team would end up icing the puck like a dozen times a game trying to reach him (though they still ice the puck tons, now it's just when he's not on the ice). Now he's learned to support the puck carrying player and uses the pass to him as an option to facilitate zone entries. He's not great at it yet but it's showing that he's getting better at reading teammates, something that he's still got a ways to go but is at least partially answered.

 

[Blue and Green]

He's the best prospect since McDavid. Period. He is a better prospect than Matthews, Eichel, Hughes, pick any name you like. From what I've read it's almost unanimous among scouts that Bedard would be #1 even if Michkov was immediately available for NHL duty-- and the expectations for Michkov are quite high, he's thought to be the best prospect out of Russia since Ovechkin and Malkin.

 

[lucaseider]

This isn't twitter dude, screw off with your attempt at hot takes. Bedard had a so so game by his standards, he got a penalty on his only time he battled for a puck and he was completely invisible when the puck isn't on his stick.

Nobody has ever doubted his ability with the puck but if that's your takeaway from the game... Stop watching stats and actually watch games and analyze games. Nobody gives a shit about your hot twitter takes, this board is designed to watch and analyze prospects. Something you don't contribute to at all, you just troll stats around.

Funny considering your hot Twitter takes of shitting on him after 1 turnover, which you did above, then again pretty much everything you have to say is negative, maybe you should take your own advice.

 

[prongertheman9]

It's not November anymore, opinions grow and perspectives grow. If I haven't grown your opinion after a dozen player viewings of players, that would be an issue. I do stand behind my November opinion, doesn't mean it's the same as my April opinion.

The difference between now and November is that Bedard has developed more than Fantilli IMO, Bedard fixed some of the lumps in his game in a short time frame. The biggest change I've noticed in Bedard's game was on the breakout and in the neutral zone, he used to cheat behind the d on nearly every play (even at the WJC) and his team would end up icing the puck like a dozen times a game trying to reach him (though they still ice the puck tons, now it's just when he's not on the ice). Now he's learned to support the puck carrying player and uses the pass to him as an option to facilitate zone entries. He's not great at it yet but it's showing that he's getting better at reading teammates, something that he's still got a ways to go but is at least partially answered.

I mean if you have changed your opinion then you have essentially admitted that your prior opinion was wrong no? Especially considering you have "watched these guys play for several years and knew who they were by now". If you had actually watched Bedard play more instead of stat watching you would know that his game really hasn't changed all that much since December - he just happens to be producing more now.

Your point about support on breakout and neutral zone couldn't be further from the truth imo. I actually think that his puck support is one of his most underrated traits. He wants the puck on his stick so badly that he always makes damn sure he an easy option for the puck carrier - and this has been the case since his 15 year old year. The questionable habit he has really developed this year is flying the zone/trying to get behind the d immediately after his team forces a turnover either in the defensive end or off the rush. But to be fair he probably scored 10-15 goals this year due to it so I'm sure the Pat's are okay with it.

 

[Mercedes Benn]

It 100% does matter. Because they have a late birthday, they get drafted a year later and thus get an extra year of junior before being draft eligible.

Theres a huge gap in development between an 17-18 year old and a 18-19 year old.

Fact is you would have to compare next season for Bedard.

This guy keeps giving the same stubborn broken record response just ignore him.

 

[hamzarocks]

Adam Oates play making and Mike Bossy goal scoring

Otherwise hes a bust

 

[wetcoast]

Anyways.

We’ve all heard about this theoretical “clutch gene” before, but I don’t think there has ever been such an embodiment of it as Connor Bedard. This kid has just risen to the occasion in every big game or step-up in competitiveness, without fail.

This is why is is going to be better than some can admit to here.

 

[cupface52]

Bedard is in his third year of Juniors...

(don't use COVID as an excuse because that was the same for everyone, it didn't only effect him)

Both players would be in their "17 going on 18 year old" season. That's how the Draft works. It's just a different cutoff than Mite Registration. Neither is particularly more meaningful. Extra year of hockey development doesn't matter by that point. That is long in the rear view window and only matters at extremely young ages (and is dependent on when they actually registered, for instance McDavid was 4 and playing with 6 year olds because his parents lied about his age, and his January birthday helped his physical development relative to most kids in his birth year born later).

You don't get it.

It's not a 'mite registration cutoff', everywhere else in the entire world, including other pro North American leagues, international leagues, American junior leagues, european junior leagues, etc use age at the end of the calendar year to determine a players age. Until a player is playing in the NHL, they have absolutely nothing to do with it.

If Kane was not eligible for u18s his draft year because of his age, and Bedard was, how are they the same age in their draft year. I would really like an explanation that makes any sense.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Bedard is in his third year of Juniors...

(don't use COVID as an excuse because that was the same for everyone, it didn't only effect him)

Both players would be in their "17 going on 18 year old" season. That's how the Draft works. It's just a different cutoff than Mite Registration. Neither is particularly more meaningful. Extra year of hockey development doesn't matter by that point. That is long in the rear view window and only matters at extremely young ages (and is dependent on when they actually registered, for instance McDavid was 4 and playing with 6 year olds because his parents lied about his age, and his January birthday helped his physical development relative to most kids in his birth year born later).

I mean...he is in his 3rd year because he was granted exceptional status and played his first year in the WHL at 15 lol Bedard is being drafted during his 17 year old season and Kane was drafted after his 18 year old season. I would say most recent evidence completely contradicts your point an extra year of development doesn't matter at 17 and 18. I mean even just typing that out it sounds ludicrous. Of course it does.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Its best to just ignore him at this point, only him and two other poster don't think the draft cut off matters on their production and its ridiculous and no matter how many facts you throw at them they will just keep saying "lol doesn't matter"

They're a waste of time


If Mantha was born literally one or two days earlier he would have been drafted as a 22G scorer instead of a 50G scorer.

But somehow this doesn't matter to these people.

You have not provided any “facts” lol. Al you’ve said is “the u18 cutoff..”

Yes I’m aware of the January 1 cutoff. It’s arbitrary. Just like the nhl draft cutoff is arbitrary. You guys keep not understanding the actual point and misconstruing it to “well a year matters.” Yes a player’s 17 going on 18 season is different than their 18 going on 19 season. That’s what needs to be viewed now your bright line “age 17 season” or “age 18 season”. You guys think a player born December 31, 2004 is a full year older than a player born January 1, 2005. It’s nonsense.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Two guys born the same year.

One born September 10th, one born September 17th

September 10th 2nd year in the league scores 35G/40A and gets drafted

September 17th 2nd year in the league scores 25G/25A, doesn't get drafted due to draft cut off

September 17th now 3rd year in the league scores 45G/40a and gets drafted

Are you going to scream and cry that the September 17 birthday player is a better prospect because he was better in his "draft year"? Or did that extra year of development make his stats look better?

Can't wait for this response.

Dude you don’t get my point and never will. The one guy is nearly a year older than the other guy but a December vs. January guy is only a month older. I’m on team look at their biological age and not if they are eligible to play in the U18 or when they registered for mites or whatever. It’s only you that is holding strong to an arbitrary cutoff as the end all be all of evaluation.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Or, in a shocking turn of events, the extra development year of hockey increased his stats, who knew!

I'm going to take my own advice and just ignore you now, you've been called out enough by other posters already.

Your point still makes no sense, you are just comparing one player's 16-17 year old season to his 17-18 year old season. You are so stubborn to not even understand what I am saying, lol, so think what you want. Have a nice day.

 

[McFlash97]

I just said he was a Matthews level prospect. Jeez your reading comprehension skills are awful.

He's better than Matthews was. Much better.