Confirmed with Link: [BUF/VGK] Jack Eichel & 3rd-2023(BUF) FOR Peyton Krebs, Alex Tuch, 1st-2022(VGK) & 2nd-2023(VGK)

[Dirty Dog]

Rebuilt the front office. The analytical department is one of the best in the league. He accumulates picks, unlike previous GMs, makes good trades, got rid of the toxic Eichel, develops youth correctly, does not rush them. At the time, he started a refit considering the strong drafts of 2022 and 2023. Promotes the right culture. I think that's not bad for a GM newbie. Past GMs had things much worse, IMO.

Tell him Adams did good on the eichel trade or the expansion draft if you really want him to get going!

but don’t mention finances, he’ll explode!

 

[Fjordy]

Tell him Adams did good on the eichel trade or the expansion draft if you really want him to get going!

but don’t mention finances, he’ll explode!

I also like how he drafting.

 

[TehDoak]

Rebuilt the front office. The analytical department is one of the best in the league. He accumulates picks, unlike previous GMs, makes good trades, got rid of the toxic Eichel, develops youth correctly, does not rush them. At the time, he started a refit considering the strong drafts of 2022 and 2023. Promotes the right culture. I think that's not bad for a GM newbie. Past GMs had things much worse, IMO.

Botterill accumulated picks, hired scouting staff, re-built Rochester. As time goes on, the Botterill drafts are looking actually very strong.

And he was a terrible team builder.

Tearing down is easy. Building is hard.

The idea that Adams > Botterill is something that needs time. One season in, they are at the same spot. Almost eerily the same, actually. Finished last the season before, won the lotto, drafted a franchise d-man, have a ton of picks in an upcoming draft due to trading a top line center. Adams has a bit of an advantage in that Botterill left a partially stocked cupboard whereas Murray burned through nearly all his draft capital.

The idea that this is the "right" culture is far too early to tell. A lot of Adams ideas make for a great sound bite but don't work in reality.

 

[Fjordy]

Botterill accumulated picks, hired scouting staff, re-built Rochester. As time goes on, the Botterill drafts are looking actually very strong.

And he was a terrible team builder.

Tearing down is easy. Building is hard.

The idea that Adams > Botterill is something that needs time. One season in, they are at the same spot. Almost eerily the same, actually. Finished last the season before, won the lotto, drafted a franchise d-man, have a ton of picks in an upcoming draft due to trading a top line center. Adams has a bit of an advantage in that Botterill left a partially stocked cupboard whereas Murray burned through nearly all his draft capital.

The idea that this is the "right" culture is far too early to tell. A lot of Adams ideas make for a great sound bite but don't work in reality.

Botterill was terrible, the only thing, his drafts were decent, otherwise it was bad. He literally didn't use analytics. Have you forgotten what trades he made? Which ones did the UFA sign? Blocked kids. Bad development Mitts and Thompson. Bad coaches. Made the worst trade with St. Louis. I do not know why you have such an opinion, but I think you are very wrong.

Easy choice for me Adams > Botterill

 

[Buffaloed]

Wait what? Adams > Botterill

The new GM is always better than his predecessor until he's not. That process usually takes 2 years.

 

[Fjordy]

The new GM is always better than his predecessor until he's not. That process usually takes 2 years.

Well, Adams didn't come yesterday either. Of course, I do not know what will happen in the future, but Botterill was terrible, and Adams did not make any serious mistakes during this time. He hired his first coach and did a lot of other good things.

 

[TehDoak]

Botterill was terrible, the only thing, his drafts were decent, otherwise it was bad. He literally didn't use analytics. Have you forgotten what trades he made? Which ones did the UFA sign? Blocked kids. Bad development Mitts and Thompson. Bad coaches. Made the worst trade with St. Louis. I do not know why you have such an opinion, but I think you are very wrong.

Easy choice for me Adams > Botterill

I'm not saying Botterill was a good GM. Quite the opposite.

I'm saying is there is zero evidence based on the teams Adams has iced that Adams is a good GM.

Is he doing some good things? Sure. It's too early to really judge his drafts, but early returns look promising.

Analytics department? Great. It certainly isn't a guarantee of any sort of success (many teams have built robust analytics departments to little or no on ice success), but its good to see.

The proof of a good GM is building a good team.

He had an owner willing to spend to the cap last season, plenty of cap and roster space to turnover a good portion of the roster....he built a last place team. Not Terry, not Ralph, but Kevyn, the GM, built a last place team with a good bit of resources at his disposal.

This year.....it may not be a last place, but its a likely a bottom 5 team. He is handicapped by a shoe string budget this year. This years finish will obviously be a bit more planned than last years, but, bottom of the league is still bottom of the league.

The real judgement of Adams comes next year when he needs to address significant needs and will have actual expectations of improvement from the fans and ownership.

 

[jc17]

The new GM is always better than his predecessor until he's not. That process usually takes 2 years.

Agreed, but Adams would really have to mess things up to look bad a year from now.

 

[Jim Bob]

I'm not saying Botterill was a good GM. Quite the opposite.

I'm saying is there is zero evidence based on the teams Adams has iced that Adams is a good GM.

Is he doing some good things? Sure. It's too early to really judge his drafts, but early returns look promising.

Analytics department? Great. It certainly isn't a guarantee of any sort of success (many teams have built robust analytics departments to little or no on ice success), but its good to see.

The proof of a good GM is building a good team.

He had an owner willing to spend to the cap last season, plenty of cap and roster space to turnover a good portion of the roster....he built a last place team. Not Terry, not Ralph, but Kevyn, the GM, built a last place team with a good bit of resources at his disposal.

This year.....it may not be a last place, but its a likely a bottom 5 team. He is handicapped by a shoe string budget this year. This years finish will obviously be a bit more planned than last years, but, bottom of the league is still bottom of the league.

The real judgement of Adams comes next year when he needs to address significant needs and will have actual expectations of improvement from the fans and ownership.

Last year's team was tanked by Eichel's injury and the head coach that Adams inherited. Plus, Adams was a rookie GM with a barebones FO with a short runway to the off season.

Given the situation that he walked into, getting Staal and Hall for as little as he did wasn't bad. The team imploded after the injury bug bit off the team's franchise 1C. I don't know what GM could have made that not happen.

And you can't measure roster building during a tear down of the roster. As long as Adams keeps acquiring good picks and prospects and keeps cap flexibility, that is doing the job that is called for right now.

I won't be surprised if '22-23 is more of the same as '21-22 and '23-24 is the season where he is looking to add to the young core.

 

[elchud]

Sounds like Krebs became available approximately 27October, give or take.

The Calgary report may have nudged Vegas a little. The Eichel interview may have nudged Buffalo a little.

Once Krebs was in, Tuch/Krebs/1st was set. It was minor quibbling after that (add another prospect, another 1st or 2nd, does Buffalo add, any protections). But the three key pieces and zero retained salary were set a week before the trade.

After reading and listening to every extant piece of the puzzle provided the past week, that seems like the story. All that's left is emotion and arguing I think.

 

[Fjordy]

I'm not saying Botterill was a good GM. Quite the opposite.

I'm saying is there is zero evidence based on the teams Adams has iced that Adams is a good GM.

Is he doing some good things? Sure. It's too early to really judge his drafts, but early returns look promising.

Analytics department? Great. It certainly isn't a guarantee of any sort of success (many teams have built robust analytics departments to little or no on ice success), but its good to see.

The proof of a good GM is building a good team.

He had an owner willing to spend to the cap last season, plenty of cap and roster space to turnover a good portion of the roster....he built a last place team. Not Terry, not Ralph, but Kevyn, the GM, built a last place team with a good bit of resources at his disposal.

This year.....it may not be a last place, but its a likely a bottom 5 team. He is handicapped by a shoe string budget this year. This years finish will obviously be a bit more planned than last years, but, bottom of the league is still bottom of the league.

The real judgement of Adams comes next year when he needs to address significant needs and will have actual expectations of improvement from the fans and ownership.

I disagree, it was Krueger's team last season and it has been mentioned more than once that he had a lot of power. Adams got rid of Krueger and now it's his team. Of course, I mean at the moment, I don't know what will happen in the future, but so far I am completely satisfied with what Adams does and he looks like a good GM. Botterill sucked almost from the start.

 

[TehDoak]

I disagree, it was Krueger's team last season and it has been mentioned more than once that he had a lot of power. Adams got rid of Krueger and now it's his team. Of course, I mean at the moment, I don't know what will happen in the future, but so far I am completely satisfied with what Adams does and he looks like a good GM. Botterill sucked almost from the start.

Adams can't be blamed for last years team because he wasn't really the GM?

By that same logic, you can excuse Botterill for the RoR trade because the ownership refused to pay his signing bonus.

It's semantics. The big picture is: Sabres, 31st place, GM: Adams. We can argue circumstances, but that is the bottom line of Adams resume as a GM. That's it. That is all we have to go on. He literally could have not done a worse job last season if he actively tried to tank.

 

[Fjordy]

Adams can't be blamed for last years team because he wasn't really the GM?

By that same logic, you can excuse Botterill for the RoR trade because the ownership refused to pay his signing bonus.

It's semantics. The big picture is: Sabres, 31st place, GM: Adams. We can argue circumstances, but that is the bottom line of Adams resume as a GM. That's it. That is all we have to go on. He literally could have not done a worse job last season if he actively tried to tank.

I disagree. After all, GM does not go out to play on the ice, and it was not he who hired the idiot's coach. GM provided the coach with a good roster last season, the coach did not deal with it. Botterill didn't provide a good lineup, that's the difference. Botterill's trades and roster were terrible, and that's only part of the problem with Botterill. ROR trade is partly on the owners, partly on Jason. He had the best deals from Montreal before the St. Louis deal.

 

[tsujimoto74]

What has Adams built? Both waited too long to fire a coach and drove a top line center out of town and presided over last place teams that won the draft lotto?

What's the difference again?



People say I'm wrong, I cite my sources. Not really ax grinding.



From the Friedman interview:

"We changed management in 2020....and we weren't in a position where we were going to try and go win...I went to the team and said if that is the route they wanted to take maybe it'd be better to move me"

Jack Eichel explains when things went sideways for him in Buffalo - Sportsnet.ca

Your earlier posts highly editorialized that statement.

 

[Sabre the Win]

Adams firing Krueger is A+
Adams return on Ristolainen is A+
Adams return on Eichel is B+ considering what he had to work with, holding out and getting the best return that many of us are happy with
Adams approach to development on prospects is A+
Adams identifying Granato as a good development coach is A+
Adams being the first GM to actually have/use an analytical team is A+

On what level is Adam's the same as Botterill other than position in the standings which both coaches used Ralph Kreuger those seasons.

 

[valet]

That's not entirely an accurate paraphrase. He was unhappy after the Botterill firing as he heard rumblings of another rebuild. He said he didn't want to go through that, and Adam's tried to keep Eichel happy and went out and got Staal, Hall, and made some other moves to try and pump up the roster a little. I actually give Adams credit for threading the needle on doing this without selling off the Sabres future by trading picks or getting into long-term deals. He continued to take this approach with this roster.

it was also bound to be a lost year with covid anyways, coming off the previous season in which nothing really got done to address the quality of the team. i think the whole thing is garbage on jack’s end if i’m being honest. like dude, we had 2 1st overall picks…. we are obviously still in a rebuild situation. then when you add the whole injury thing, it’s like he’s trying to provide two conflicting sets of rationale for why he didn’t want to be here. if you don’t want to be in buffalo, just say it. that’s what RoR did, that’s what Sam did. hell that’s even what Hall did. i just don’t understand the obtuse behavior

 

[valet]

Because three weeks after receiving a vote of confidence by the Sabres he was fired.

The same day they fired Botterill they laid off a good portion of the staff.

Jason Botterill fired by Sabres after receiving directive to cut spending



It should also be noted, Pegula's decision to fire people and be, his words, " effectively, efficiently and economically" that was the last straw for Eichel.

Botterill was a bad GM. But to replace him with an unqualified hatchet man there to cut costs is turning out to be even worse.

uhhhh adams has knocked it out the park so far. what world are you living in?

i think it was more using covid as an opportunity to clean house, cause the team botteril assembled managed to do absolutely nothing with every resource and ‘vote of confidence’ imaginable

 

[itwasaforwardpass]

The new GM is always better than his predecessor until he's not. That process usually takes 2 years.

The process is accelerated for coaches. We hate the new one after 1 year.

 

[itwasaforwardpass]

Adams could sit on his hands and do nothing but give QOs for the next year and he'd be doing a better job than Botterill who actively made the team worse.

 

[threeVo]

Big Head was a terrible GM. So slow to react to anything if at all. All he did was get RD and nothing else

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Big Head was a terrible GM. So slow to react to anything if at all. All he did was get RD and nothing else

He's in Seattle still thinking the return on those D was going to make his team. Someone also forgot to mention the cap, astounding he was up against the cap every night with a bad team.

 

[littletonhockeycoach]

Last year's team was tanked by Eichel's injury and the head coach that Adams inherited. Plus, Adams was a rookie GM with a barebones FO with a short runway to the off season.

Given the situation that he walked into, getting Staal and Hall for as little as he did wasn't bad. The team imploded after the injury bug bit off the team's franchise 1C. I don't know what GM could have made that not happen.

And you can't measure roster building during a tear down of the roster. As long as Adams keeps acquiring good picks and prospects and keeps cap flexibility, that is doing the job that is called for right now.

I won't be surprised if '22-23 is more of the same as '21-22 and '23-24 is the season where he is looking to add to the young core.

Geez, 23-24????? I'll be....... well never mind the number...... OLDER.....

Does Adams think I'm gonna live forever ...... to until the Sabres are GOOD again??? LOL!

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Sounds like Krebs became available approximately 27October, give or take.

The Calgary report may have nudged Vegas a little. The Eichel interview may have nudged Buffalo a little.

Once Krebs was in, Tuch/Krebs/1st was set. It was minor quibbling after that (add another prospect, another 1st or 2nd, does Buffalo add, any protections). But the three key pieces and zero retained salary were set a week before the trade.

After reading and listening to every extant piece of the puzzle provided the past week, that seems like the story. All that's left is emotion and arguing I think.

I’m fully on board with Vegas shitting the bed this season and missing the playoffs, but as it stands, I’m treating their 1st as being roughly the same position as last season.

 

[Jimmybarndoor2]

Adams ask was 4 firsts
Many were thinking 2 draft picks maybe conditional. Regarded prospect. Current roster player. Many thought some retained salary with difference being for how long

adams got unconditional first rounder, krebs, tuch and a second rounder. No retained salary. He threw in a third rounder. Not bad. Since tuch is more established than I thought it was going to be.

 

[Super Cake]

Adams ask was 4 firsts
Many were thinking 2 draft picks maybe conditional. Regarded prospect. Current roster player. Many thought some retained salary with difference being for how long

adams got unconditional first rounder, krebs, tuch and a second rounder. No retained salary. He threw in a third rounder. Not bad. Since tuch is more established than I thought it was going to be.

The first is actually conditional. It is top 10 protected.

If Vegas 1st falls in the top 10, then Buffalo gets their 2023 1st round pick.