Confirmed Trade: [BUF/NAS] Jimmy Vesey's Draft Rights for 2016 3rd (#76) Part III

[Kitchener Boy]

I doubt that has anything to do with who he decides to sign with. If it were the case, I would love the Coyotes chances after he sat down with their GM John Chayka. We all know he is an extremely intellectual GM. But in reality I believe Vesey is just looking for the team the will put him in the best situation possible to put up points and be able to cash in on a huge long term deal his next contract.

It's not about money or Vesey would have been burning his ELC off a while ago already.
It's about getting his Harvard degree and then choosing the team he wants to play for.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

Dear god this again.

It's only a third round pick. The chances that one makes the NHL is a shade under 30%. The odds of them becoming a difference making contributor in the NHL are much lower I would assume.

Murray just flipped a 3rd round pick (which we had 4 of) for a shot at an NHL ready prospect that could help the team right away, as opposed to taking a chance on a low percentage player that is years away, if they even make the NHL at all.

I thought the percentages were actually much worse than 30%? Which would only help your argument, obviously.

 

[Palmer2Fitz]

It's not about money or Vesey would have been burning his ELC off a while ago already.
It's about getting his Harvard degree and then choosing the team he wants to play for.

I'm not saying that was his reasoning for going the full four years, just so he would become a free agent. I understand he did it to get his degree. But didn't he come out on record saying he was looking for a team that would play him in their top 6 so he would have the best opportunity to put up points and succeed? maybe that was just speculation or I misinterpreted what I read. if that is the case it doesn't seem like the location of where he plays matters, rather just a really intelligent way of cashing in on that big payday as soon as possible. To me this has Chicago written all over it kind of like what's gonna happen with Panarin.

On a side note can Vesey play RW, and he is a LHS correct?

 

[Kitchener Boy]

I'm not saying that was his reasoning for going the full four years, just so he would become a free agent. I understand he did it to get his degree. But didn't he come out on record saying he was looking for a team that would play him in their top 6 so he would have the best opportunity to put up points and succeed? maybe that was just speculation or I misinterpreted what I read. if that is the case it doesn't seem like the location of where he plays matters, rather just a really intelligent way of cashing in on that big payday as soon as possible. To me this has Chicago written all over it kind of like what's gonna happen with Panarin.

On a side note can Vesey play RW, and he is a LHS correct?

Vesey plays LW and shoots left.

Everyone has there own take but Vesey had a very recent interview it's on CSNNE.com if you want to hear his take.

 

[Dogewow]

I thought the percentages were actually much worse than 30%? Which would only help your argument, obviously.

I found a few articles that have stated different percentages, just went with the TSN one since it seemed the most reputable out of the ones I saw. Though I do admit that I think saying 30% is being generous. Gotta remember though that there are some players that probably play few games during their career.

 

[Pyromaniac]

Dear god this again.

It's only a third round pick. The chances that one makes the NHL is a shade under 30%. The odds of them becoming a difference making contributor in the NHL are much lower I would assume.

Murray just flipped a 3rd round pick (which we had 4 of) for a shot at an NHL ready prospect that could help the team right away, as opposed to taking a chance on a low percentage player that is years away, if they even make the NHL at all.

It really doesn't matter. Murray flipped an asset for a guy that had already announced to the world that he was headed to free agency. Heck even Vesey's agent came out and said that all the Sabres accomplished was taking Nashville's place. They could have made that same pitch on August 15th like every other team in the NHL plans on doing but only poindexter had the arrogance to think he could convince Vesey beforehand. Of course he failed and its surprising that Sabres fans can't see that. I get that the fan base is still in the honeymoon phase when it comes to the new management but its time to wake up and see this dimwit's mishandling of the team.

 

[Byron Bitz]

Dear god this again.

It's only a third round pick. The chances that one makes the NHL is a shade under 30%. The odds of them becoming a difference making contributor in the NHL are much lower I would assume.

Murray just flipped a 3rd round pick (which we had 4 of) for a shot at an NHL ready prospect that could help the team right away, as opposed to taking a chance on a low percentage player that is years away, if they even make the NHL at all.

Except trading for his rights at this point didnt do much to improve the Sabres odds of landing him.

 

[Yatzhee]

Except trading for his rights at this point didnt do much to improve the Sabres odds of landing him.

Can you unequivocally say that?
You were at the meeting between the parties?

Do tell......

 

[LongWayDown37]

Except trading for his rights at this point didnt do much to improve the Sabres odds of landing him.

How do you know that? It may prove that it did not help them sign him, but how do we know that it didn't get it closer?

 

[ThatSaid]

It really doesn't matter. Murray flipped an asset for a guy that had already announced to the world that he was headed to free agency. Heck even Vesey's agent came out and said that all the Sabres accomplished was taking Nashville's place. They could have made that same pitch on August 15th like every other team in the NHL plans on doing but only poindexter had the arrogance to think he could convince Vesey beforehand. Of course he failed and its surprising that Sabres fans can't see that. I get that the fan base is still in the honeymoon phase when it comes to the new management but its time to wake up and see this dimwit's mishandling of the team.

I think Murray made a good decision, and I'm no Buffalo fan. Vesey has a chance to be a very solid player as soon as this year. Why not toss a 3rd round pick for a chance at signing him?

Seems like a low-risk high-reward type thing. Glad it failed though. Now maybe we'll get another good, cost-controlled winger in Chicago.

 

[nbwingsfan]

​

I doubt he goes to the Bruins. Their management are not very bright, I can't see a Harvard grad wanting to work for a bunch of knuckle draggers. I also think the Leafs are unlikely, you don't often see Americans willingly leave the country all else being equal. I think his #1 choice would be Washington, his degree is in government and lots of his Harvard connections would end up there. I think he just sees the NHL as a temporary gig for a decade or so, and has aspirations for his career afterwards that will factor into where he signs.

You know how smart they are? Know them personally? Did you give them a test?

 

[Irishguy42]

At least we have this Vesey thing going on to keep our summer more interesting.

Otherwise, we'd have pretty much nothing until next month when the WCH starts.

 

[mashedpotato]

At least we have this Vesey thing going on to keep our summer more interesting.

Otherwise, we'd have pretty much nothing until next month when the WCH starts.

The most talked about prospect to hit the UFA pools since <Insert Name Here>.

I look forward to this saga coming to a close.

 

[Dr Quincy]

You have to admit he was being deceptive to Poile and the rest of the Predators organization. Why else would they spend so many resources on one player if they did not think he was going to sign? Scott Nichol flew twice a month and met with him, and given Poile's reaction when Vesey refused to meet with him it is pretty clear that Vesey was lying. Poile is a GM with 30 plus years experience so I am sure he has been lied to before but Vesey's actions actually seem to hurt him. IMO Vesey had already made up him mind his jr year and wanted to milk the Predators for all the free help he could get and lied to everyone in private and publically said enough to make it seem like he wanted to be in Nashville. His dad and agent hold too much influence over him and they lied to the Predators too.

Did Poile sit down when Nystrom signed his contract and say, "Look we are not going to actually keep you for all those years"?

Did he tell Jackman that they weren't going to keep him for all the years on his contract?

You're stuck on this "lying" thing.

 

[Ciao]

At least we have this Vesey thing going on to keep our summer more interesting.

Otherwise, we'd have pretty much nothing until next month when the WCH starts.

It's entertaining, if nothing else.

I get a big laugh out of the Nashville nose-out-of-jointers inventing a duty of loyalty where none exists. Like this has never happened before.

 

[KnightofBoston]

​

You know how smart they are? Know them personally? Did you give them a test?

It's a hilarious post too considering the Bruins GM went to Harvard


I know we like to think the Bruins are some kind of beat you up first play hockey later organization, but in reality they only had that kind of edge to them when they were also very good at hockey - which is why they garnered so much hate. Nobody cares about a basement dweller.

The only "knuckle draggers" related to the Bruins at this point are a certain segment of fans that, let's be real, are a part of every sports organization

 

[compan]

Can you unequivocally say that?
You were at the meeting between the parties?

Do tell......

Him not signing with them kinda does suggest that. Anything that wins him over will be post-Aug 15th so you could say talking to him early really didn't do anything that waiting until August 15th wouldn't have.

 

[Kitchener Boy]

Can you unequivocally say that?
You were at the meeting between the parties?

Do tell......

We listened to Vesey's interview after his meeting.

And he wasn't swayed.

 

[Sansbacon]

It really doesn't matter. Murray flipped an asset for a guy that had already announced to the world that he was headed to free agency. Heck even Vesey's agent came out and said that all the Sabres accomplished was taking Nashville's place. They could have made that same pitch on August 15th like every other team in the NHL plans on doing but only poindexter had the arrogance to think he could convince Vesey beforehand. Of course he failed and its surprising that Sabres fans can't see that. I get that the fan base is still in the honeymoon phase when it comes to the new management but its time to wake up and see this dimwit's mishandling of the team.

The vitriol in this post is kind of alarming.

Sabres fans are just happy to have a GM who is hyper actively trying to make the team better, but without completely damaging their future. The ONE 3rd rounder it cost for the chance to sway a good hockey player to come to Buffalo isn't much of a concern, especially when we had THREE more picks in the same round.

You just sound envious that your GM didn't A) think of it first, and/or B) have the means to do so.

 

[Djp]

I thought the percentages were actually much worse than 30%? Which would only help your argument, obviously.

I found a few articles that have stated different percentages, just went with the TSN one since it seemed the most reputable out of the ones I saw. Though I do admit that I think saying 30% is being generous. Gotta remember though that there are some players that probably play few games during their career.

players drafted in the 3rd making an NHL appears may be around 30% but many of those may do a few games.

Getting a top 6/top 3 Dman player in the 3rd round is much slimmer---like under 5%, them being top 9/top 6/starting G is about 15%

It really doesn't matter. Murray flipped an asset for a guy that had already announced to the world that he was headed to free agency. Heck even Vesey's agent came out and said that all the Sabres accomplished was taking Nashville's place. They could have made that same pitch on August 15th like every other team in the NHL plans on doing but only poindexter had the arrogance to think he could convince Vesey beforehand. Of course he failed and its surprising that Sabres fans can't see that. I get that the fan base is still in the honeymoon phase when it comes to the new management but its time to wake up and see this dimwit's mishandling of the team.

He took a shot. Lets see where he eventually signs. TM likely had some intell from Eichel that he is interested in Buffalo and playing with Eichel. He also want to see what is all out there.

I think there are rules in place that prevent a player/agent from stating " when I hit free agency I plan on signing with team X"

Buffalo took a calculated gamble to try and sign him.

If Buffalo didn't have Eichel they likely don't make this trade.

 

[yahhockey]

Him not signing with them kinda does suggest that. Anything that wins him over will be post-Aug 15th so you could say talking to him early really didn't do anything that waiting until August 15th wouldn't have.

Originally Posted by johnnyutah View Post
Except trading for his rights at this point didnt do much to improve the Sabres odds of landing him.

Trading an asset for a player that, this thread is too long so either publicly or through his agent, has stated that he intends to exercise his right to test free agency after August 15th, shows the player that the organization believes he could be a valuable addition to their team. So much so in fact that they were willing to part with an asset simply in HOPES of being given a meeting before the aforementioned free agency period. After the trade was completed Vesey and his representatives could have declined the Sabres request for a meeting and said they will wait until mid August to hear team pitches however a meeting was granted and they were allowed to make their case before other teams. It doesn't mean that he wants to play in Buffalo simply because a meeting was granted, it doesn't mean that he does not want to play in Buffalo simply because he has not signed a contract with them. Had Buffalo not made that trade maybe Buffalo was X on the list of team meetings and a team before them offered him a spot with the franchise forward that Vesey decides was too good to say no. Having already been given a meeting Vesey is now aware of what assets he could play alongside in Buffalo and where the franchise is headed and how it may head there faster with him on board. It doesn't mean he will play for Buffalo or even mean that the meeting went well and they had his attention however it does mean that the team was able to make their pitch, or at least an initial pitch, during a period of time that they otherwise would not have been allowed to talk to him and a time when no other team is allowed to have contact with him.

Imagine all of the productive things we could do without the incessant Vesey chatter but alas it's the summer and there's nothing else to talk about so lets try to hit Part IV before the 15th and keep the dream alive!

 

[compan]

Trading an asset for a player that, this thread is too long so either publicly or through his agent, has stated that he intends to exercise his right to test free agency after August 15th, shows the player that the organization believes he could be a valuable addition to their team. So much so in fact that they were willing to part with an asset simply in HOPES of being given a meeting before the aforementioned free agency period. After the trade was completed Vesey and his representatives could have declined the Sabres request for a meeting and said they will wait until mid August to hear team pitches however a meeting was granted and they were allowed to make their case before other teams. It doesn't mean that he wants to play in Buffalo simply because a meeting was granted, it doesn't mean that he does not want to play in Buffalo simply because he has not signed a contract with them. Had Buffalo not made that trade maybe Buffalo was X on the list of team meetings and a team before them offered him a spot with the franchise forward that Vesey decides was too good to say no. Having already been given a meeting Vesey is now aware of what assets he could play alongside in Buffalo and where the franchise is headed and how it may head there faster with him on board. It doesn't mean he will play for Buffalo or even mean that the meeting went well and they had his attention however it does mean that the team was able to make their pitch, or at least an initial pitch, during a period of time that they otherwise would not have been allowed to talk to him and a time when no other team is allowed to have contact with him.

Imagine all of the productive things we could do without the incessant Vesey chatter but alas it's the summer and there's nothing else to talk about so lets try to hit Part IV before the 15th and keep the dream alive!

Like our actual jobs most of us are posting here instead of doing or while on a break? No thanks, I'll go back to fantasy land

 

[Butt Ox]

They could have made that same pitch on August 15th like every other team in the NHL plans on doing but only poindexter had the arrogance to think he could convince Vesey beforehand. Of course he failed and its surprising that Sabres fans can't see that.

Here's what TM (the arrogant *******) had to say:

“I told him he doesn’t owe anybody anything,†Murray said. “He went to school for four years and he became a free agent. So now he’s got to make the right decision for him. There’s no timetable. I felt really good about the meeting. I got great feedback about the meeting. But this is his show right now. If he wants to come in here, or if he wants to reach out to us and have another meeting, then we’re there. But for me, this is his court. I don’t sit at home and speculate about this. He’s either going to sign here or he’s not.â€

TM told Vesey to look around and make what is felt to be the best choice. Good on Murray.

 

[Pyromaniac]

The vitriol in this post is kind of alarming.

Sabres fans are just happy to have a GM who is hyper actively trying to make the team better, but without completely damaging their future. The ONE 3rd rounder it cost for the chance to sway a good hockey player to come to Buffalo isn't much of a concern, especially when we had THREE more picks in the same round.

You just sound envious that your GM didn't A) think of it first, and/or B) have the means to do so.

If Bowman had done something this stupid, I would have criticized him just the same. Just like I did when he traded a 2nd for Rundblad or two 2nds for Timonen.

Murray deserves criticism for this trade.

 

[PB37]

I actually have to tip my hat to Buffalo and TM. Fortune favors the bold. He wanted the chance to change Vesey's mind and get his team a young, top prospect who's NHL ready before any other team could. He burns a mid round pick for a chance that could end up not working out for the Sabres, but I can't fault him for wanting to gamble and go for it.