Confirmed Trade: [BUF/NAS] Jimmy Vesey's Draft Rights for 2016 3rd (#76) Part III

[ijuka]

is that prospect really that good? is really worth 3000+ posts? I know it's summer but WTF, Jimmy Vesey...???

I really doubt he's as good as his hype suggests.

His NHLe for last season when adjusted for 82 games is:

14 goals + 12 assists = 26 points

 

[EbonyRaptor]

Vesey would probably be ok with playing with Toews and Hossa.

If the Hawks would be fortunate to get Vesey (and I'm one of the people who thinks he signs with Boston) - but if they do get him, I would prefer to have Vesey-Toews-Hossa and leave PAK as is. The talk of splitting up P&K is based on a comment Q made about playing Hossa on the 3rd line with Kruger.

 

[Hawkaholic]

Not so sure. He's smart enough to know that there is no money in Chicago. Ask Panarin.

You mean the guy who made 3mil last year? And the guy who will make probably 6+mil/yr going forward? Him?

 

[Dogewow]

He's not going to Buffalo. They made their pitch and came up short.

This has been brought up so many times it's become stupid.

He has stated before he even talked with Buffalo that he was testing free agency. He's staying the course.

It's totally possible that he wants to talk to multiple teams to make an informed decision and is just waiting it out.

Still very much possible he signs with Buffalo.

 

[Gnashville]

This would be the greatest troll job in the history of hockey by Pollie and Vessey. Everything in the media just deception to steal a draft pick from another team. I hope this is what happens now.

Not a chance Vesey is persona not grata in Nashville and has actually displaced Ryan $uter as the most hated player amongst Predators fans.

 

[Gnashville]

This has been brought up so many times it's become stupid.

He has stated before he even talked with Buffalo that he was testing free agency. He's staying the course.

It's totally possible that he wants to talk to multiple teams to make an informed decision and is just waiting it out.

Still very much possible he signs with Buffalo.

Do Not trust anything Vesey says

 

[Paranoid Android]

is that prospect really that good? is really worth 3000+ posts? I know it's summer but WTF, Jimmy Vesey...???

and as per what I could read/understand, he'll be in BUF... Jack's buddy and former team mate

So number of HF boards posts is the determining factor for how good a player is?

He's an NHL ready prospect. Nothing more, nothing less. I haven't read too many many posts saying otherwise.

This is getting more attention than usual because 1) it's a controversial rule, 2) Poile created drama, and 3) these player's rights are never traded for

 

[EbonyRaptor]

So number of HF boards posts is the determining factor for how good a player is?

He's an NHL ready prospect. Nothing more, nothing less. I haven't read too many many posts saying otherwise.

This is getting more attention than usual because 1) it's a controversial rule, 2) Poile created drama, and 3) these player's rights are never traded for

... and 4) it's the freakin summer time - what else we got to talk about?

 

[Fogelhund]

You mean the guy who made 3mil last year? And the guy who will make probably 6+mil/yr going forward? Him?

Yes, him.



Vesey joins the team, hits his bonuses as well... you are looking at potentially $5 million in carryover bonus overages for 2017-16.

Starting with a cap hit of $58,800,000 approx, with Vesey, you would have 12 players signed. Add in your bonuses you are at $63,800,000. You given Panarin his $6 million, and you are at $70,800,00 with 13 players signed. Let's imagine the cap goes up to $75 million. You'd have $4.2 million to sign 10 players... If the cap doesn't go up, you are in a poorer position, you've got a decision...

Do you sign the guy, and hope he doesn't hit his bonuses?

Numbers and date from Cap Friendly... I appreciate that you have a number of guys on Entry Level contracts, that can fill in, but at some point, you've got to question what you do, with a stunning lack of depth.

 

[Mustard]

With equally chicken**** justification. Wah wah.

If he had come out and said he was planning to go to UFA or nothing at all, that's one thing. We would have been salty but not mad about it. Suter and Vesey publicly and privately said they were staying in Nashville, then left. No, they don't "owe" the team the courtesy of their future plans, but saying one thing and doing the opposite isn't right and is what makes them targets. Call us whiners if you want but I've never met someone who enjoys being unapologetically lied to.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Yes, him.



Vesey joins the team, hits his bonuses as well... you are looking at potentially $5 million in carryover bonus overages for 2017-16.

Starting with a cap hit of $58,800,000 approx, with Vesey, you would have 12 players signed. Add in your bonuses you are at $63,800,000. You given Panarin his $6 million, and you are at $70,800,00 with 13 players signed. Let's imagine the cap goes up to $75 million. You'd have $4.2 million to sign 10 players... If the cap doesn't go up, you are in a poorer position, you've got a decision...

Do you sign the guy, and hope he doesn't hit his bonuses?

Numbers and date from Cap Friendly... I appreciate that you have a number of guys on Entry Level contracts, that can fill in, but at some point, you've got to question what you do, with a stunning lack of depth.

This just assumes they don't move anyone for cap space. I hate this time of analysis. It's lazy. Hawks clearly are trying to sign him given their full court press at his summer league games. And I'm sure Bowman has figured out a worst case scenario for the cap next year if Vesey and Panarin hit bonuses.

 

[Fogelhund]

This just assumes they don't move anyone for cap space. I hate this time of analysis. It's lazy. Hawks clearly are trying to sign him given their full court press at his summer league games. And I'm sure Bowman has figured out a worst case scenario for the cap next year if Vesey and Panarin hit bonuses.

The problem being, you don't have many bodies left to vote off the island. Hossa, Anisimov, Kruger, Hjalmarsson... I can't imagine Keith, Seabrook, Kane or Toews are even a remote thought.

Maybe you expose Kruger and let Vegas take him, to give cap space...

 

[Kitchener Boy]

Not a chance Vesey is persona not grata in Nashville and has actually displaced Ryan $uter as the most hated player amongst Predators fans.

Who cares?
He's exercising his rights after 4 years of college.
It's happens.
GM's agreed to the CBA.

 

[sfoote]

ok, why is Aug. 15th the day he can become a free agent ? What is the reasoning ? Why not July 1st like the others ?

 

[Toews2Bickell]

The problem being, you don't have many bodies left to vote off the island. Hossa, Anisimov, Kruger, Hjalmarsson... I can't imagine Keith, Seabrook, Kane or Toews are even a remote thought.

Maybe you expose Kruger and let Vegas take him, to give cap space...

I get what you're saying. But two of the guys you named are ~7.5m in cap alone, and movable. Plus Scuderi retained is 1.125m coming off, then incremental cap growth (1-2m?), then bonuses coming off. Point being, they have some levers to pull. But, you're right, there is a lot less people to vote off the island. And you can probably add in Hjalmarsson in that category of remotely unthinkable given his AAV and value of contract. I think the pecking order is Kruger, Anisimov then trying to LTIR Hossa. Whether that happens or not, who knows. But they could clear out >10m in cap space by next year if they wanted to.

 

[Pyromaniac]

The problem being, you don't have many bodies left to vote off the island. Hossa, Anisimov, Kruger, Hjalmarsson... I can't imagine Keith, Seabrook, Kane or Toews are even a remote thought.

Maybe you expose Kruger and let Vegas take him, to give cap space...

Hjalmarsson is more important than Seabrook.

 

[Kitchener Boy]

ok, why is Aug. 15th the day he can become a free agent ? What is the reasoning ? Why not July 1st like the others ?

Because he's a graduating NCAA college player.
It's all in the CBA.
His rights are held up to August 15th in the agreement.

 

[sfoote]

Because he's a graduating NCAA college player.
It's all in the CBA.
His rights are held up to August 15th in the agreement.

Ok, thanks, just seemed like they pulled the date out of thin air. Most rosters are pretty much set now, I know moves will still be made, but seems like the date should have been closer to
July 1st like the other free agents.

 

[Mpasta]

This just assumes they don't move anyone for cap space. I hate this time of analysis. It's lazy. Hawks clearly are trying to sign him given their full court press at his summer league games. And I'm sure Bowman has figured out a worst case scenario for the cap next year if Vesey and Panarin hit bonuses.

This might be a lazy opinion but if I was Vesey I would be think of 2 things when it came to the Hawks.

Do I want to go to a team where I have a chance to win the Cup in the next few years? If that's all I care about I do it.

Or

Do I want to go to a team that is building right now but will have a much better chance at re-signing me when my 1st deal is over and is closer to home?

 

[nmbr_24]

This might be a lazy opinion but if I was Vesey I would be think of 2 things when it came to the Hawks.

Do I want to go to a team where I have a chance to win the Cup in the next few years? If that's all I care about I do it.

Or

Do I want to go to a team that is building right now but will have a much better chance at re-signing me when my 1st deal is over and is closer to home?

I have a feeling that Vesey plans on making any team he goes to look at him as a must signing when his first deal is over. So much so that the team will move others out to re-sign him. I also believe he will think that any team he goes to will be better because he is there. It's just the nature of things.

With that said, I think he signs in Boston but nothing will surprise me except for if he signs in Nashville or Buffalo. Those teams had their chance, he isn't going to sign there it looks like.

 

[Lemieuxs]

This might be a lazy opinion but if I was Vesey I would be think of 2 things when it came to the Hawks.

Do I want to go to a team where I have a chance to win the Cup in the next few years? If that's all I care about I do it.

Or

Do I want to go to a team that is building right now but will have a much better chance at re-signing me when my 1st deal is over and is closer to home?

OR

Do I go to a team where I can compete for a cup, play on a line with either Crosby or Malkin and ensure my next contract is a money-maker because of my inflated numbers from playing with two all-world centers.

 

[Shady Machine]

OR

Do I go to a team where I can compete for a cup, play on a line with either Crosby or Malkin and ensure my next contract is a money-maker because of my inflated numbers from playing with two all-world centers.

If only this was true, like ever. For whatever reason, the Pens don't have a great track record with persuading talented UFA wingers.

 

[PemIceKing]

Saad would disagree, as will Panarin next season. Top-6 LW on the Hawks worked out pretty well for them.

BTW - word on Hawks blogs is that Q is considering having Hossa play on the 3rd line with Kruger - meaning the top-6 will probably be shuffled around which means Kane and Panarin may be broken up to provide more balanced scoring on the top two lines - meaning Vesey would play opposite Kane either Vesey-Toews-Kane or Panarin moves up with Toews and it would be Vesey-Anisimov-Kane.

Won't be CHI. No $. On down turn. Panarin probably gone too.

 

[kenfury]

is that prospect really that good? is really worth 3000+ posts? I know it's summer but WTF, Jimmy Vesey...???

and as per what I could read/understand, he'll be in BUF... Jack's buddy and former team mate

Its the middle of the off season. What else do we have to ****post about? Is a hot dog a sandwich.?

 

[HockeyMomx2]

If he had come out and said he was planning to go to UFA or nothing at all, that's one thing. We would have been salty but not mad about it. Suter and Vesey publicly and privately said they were staying in Nashville, then left. No, they don't "owe" the team the courtesy of their future plans, but saying one thing and doing the opposite isn't right and is what makes them targets. Call us whiners if you want but I've never met someone who enjoys being unapologetically lied to.

Except you all keep forgetting that right up until the NCAA playoffs he fully intended on doing just that. Then Poile got pushy about him not graduating with his class, and him signing while Nash was still in playoffs. Maybe if your own GM laid off the kid, let him get through graduation (because you know, this kid is the first kid in his family to ever graduate from college, never mind Harvard, and that is a HUGE accomplishment that ANYONE would want to participate in with their family there). Maybe, just maybe, he would have signed down there as soon as he was through with his school commitments. Poile couldn't wait though. Poile screwed it up by not having a clue about this kids personal family history and how important it was for him to walk his graduation ceremony and then treating that reason like it was not an important enough reason to not come to Nash right then and there. You wanna be angry, fine, but be angry at the person who caused this, and it wasn't Vessey.