Confirmed with Link: Brady Tkachuk - The decider: signs 3 year ELC

[Do Make Say Think]

posted this in the radio talk thread, but simmer said the other day on tsn1200 that in conversations while interviewing for the AGM job, he learned that Dorion et al prefered Tkachuk over anyone by Hughes in the 2019 draft, so that's why they didn't give up the pick.

And as good as Tkachuk is going to be, this is exactly why no one trusts our management.

Hell I wouldn't be surprised to find out they lied to Simmer to see how he'd react to Melnyk barking orders. I'd bet Simmer cocked his eyebrow at such an assertion being made this early (a year is a long time when it comes to 17 year olds) and they instantly knew he wasn't fit to work for The Euge Dbag.

 

[Hale The Villain]

posted this in the radio talk thread, but simmer said the other day on tsn1200 that in conversations while interviewing for the AGM job, he learned that Dorion et al prefered Tkachuk over anyone by Hughes in the 2019 draft, so that's why they didn't give up the pick.

Big difference between preferring Tkachuk over a guy like Zadina and preferring him over the likes of Kaapo/Dach/Cozens.

The latter are looking like they are a tier above Tkachuk in terms of upside.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I love Tkachuk. He's gonna be an excellent complementary top line player who leads the team during the playoffs.

He and Stone are pillars any championship team would wish to have on the wings. However there definitely needs more skill everywhere else, especially centre. That's why we desperately need Brown to pan out.

I cant believe we traded EK man. I desperately wanted him gone at the deadline at least. Tkachuk would change the entire attitude of our future forward group and he and Karlsson would have made a serious impact with the already set talent on the team like Stone and Duchene.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I think there's a philosophical idea accepted by this team that character comes first, and is the most important element to building a successful team. Especially a budget team that will face more adversity as a result of their limitations of what can be spent both on coaching, and in terms of bringing in stars.

As long as Melnyk is the owner, this team is going to continue to be a circus. I can see the logic in selecting a young star who can handle the absurdities of this team.

I don't buy that we liked him better than everybody other than Hughes. Are they saying we take Tkachuk at 2 over Svechnikov? Is there not another player as good as Svechnikov behind Hughes in the 2019 draft? I think it's probably that we'd take him over everybody from 3rd or 4th onward next year because of his character.

If I had to guess, I think the genuine thought process was maybe if we land at 1 or 2, maybe 3, we get a player who ECLIPSES Tkachuk in skill (assuming it is a deep draft). But if we land in that 4-8 range, we're getting a comparable player, but missing out on a "12/10" leader who is best suited to handle this circus of a team. So playing their interpretations of the odds, they took Tkachuk.

 

[swiftwin]

I think there's a philosophical idea accepted by this team that character comes first, and is the most important element to building a successful team. Especially a budget team that will face more adversity as a result of their limitations of what can be spent both on coaching, and in terms of bringing in stars.

As long as Melnyk is the owner, this team is going to continue to be a circus. I can see the logic in selecting a young star who can handle the absurdities of this team.

I don't buy that we liked him better than everybody other than Hughes. Are they saying we take Tkachuk at 2 over Svechnikov? Is there not another player as good as Svechnikov behind Hughes in the 2019 draft? I think it's probably that we'd take him over everybody from 3rd or 4th onward next year because of his character.

If I had to guess, I think the genuine thought process was maybe if we land at 1 or 2, maybe 3, we get a player who ECLIPSES Tkachuk in skill (assuming it is a deep draft). But if we land in that 4-8 range, we're getting a comparable player, but missing out on a "12/10" leader who is best suited to handle this circus of a team. So playing their interpretations of the odds, they took Tkachuk.

This is such a bad take, I don't even know where to start.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

This is such a bad take, I don't even know where to start.

If it's such a "bad take", it should be very easy to start. I'd be glad to have you enlighten me.

 

[Samsquanch]

And as good as Tkachuk is going to be, this is exactly why no one trusts our management.

Hell I wouldn't be surprised to find out they lied to Simmer to see how he'd react to Melnyk barking orders. I'd bet Simmer cocked his eyebrow at such an assertion being made this early (a year is a long time when it comes to 17 year olds) and they instantly knew he wasn't fit to work for The Euge Dbag.

Listen I will crap on our owner and GM anytime the mood is right (which is almost always these days). But Im going to go out on a limb here and agree with Dorion that we made the right decision on the pick (or that is was at least not nearly as easy a call as some here would make it).

Some players just have "it", special something that makes them greater than the sum of their parts. And I think that Tkachuk is showing already that he is exactly one of those types of players. His attitude and style of play are going to help change the culture of this franchise in a super positive way imo.

Im a big believer in him at this point, and I think that all the stars aligned perfectly for us to luckily end up with him (the habs will rue the day that they passed on him).

At best we had an 18% chance of landing Hughes, and while he's obviously a much superior talent and prospect than Tkachuk currently, he's more of a Hischer level 1st overall in my mind as opposed to a McDavid or Mathews level franchise center (the size is real a concern for me as top centerman - I see him on the wing eventually).

The other top picks look very nice as well, but Im still not sold that any of them would be better players for the Senators to build around, and Im not disturbed by the fact that Dorion also sees it that way.

With Tkachuk you literally could not ask for a player with a better attitude and play style to be the first pick of a rebuilding franchise that is in shambles. Its a match made in heaven in terms of needing to change the identity and culture here.

We need players to keep their heads up during dark times, to push hard every night and not sulk (like we are seeing with guys like Eichel who are supposed to lead their teams out of the darkness), and thats what we have here with Brady.

 

[Ice-Tray]

I think there's a philosophical idea accepted by this team that character comes first, and is the most important element to building a successful team. Especially a budget team that will face more adversity as a result of their limitations of what can be spent both on coaching, and in terms of bringing in stars.

As long as Melnyk is the owner, this team is going to continue to be a circus. I can see the logic in selecting a young star who can handle the absurdities of this team.

I don't buy that we liked him better than everybody other than Hughes. Are they saying we take Tkachuk at 2 over Svechnikov? Is there not another player as good as Svechnikov behind Hughes in the 2019 draft? I think it's probably that we'd take him over everybody from 3rd or 4th onward next year because of his character.

If I had to guess, I think the genuine thought process was maybe if we land at 1 or 2, maybe 3, we get a player who ECLIPSES Tkachuk in skill (assuming it is a deep draft). But if we land in that 4-8 range, we're getting a comparable player, but missing out on a "12/10" leader who is best suited to handle this circus of a team. So playing their interpretations of the odds, they took Tkachuk.

I think the reference was to next year's Hughes, and was referring to keeping or deferring the pick.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Listen I will crap on our owner and GM anytime the mood is right (which is almost always these days). But Im going to go out on a limb here and agree with Dorion that we made the right decision on the pick (or that is was at least not nearly as easy a call as some here would make it).

Some players just have "it", special something that makes them greater than the sum of their parts. And I think that Tkachuk is showing already that he is exactly one of those types of players. His attitude and style of play are going to help change the culture of this franchise in a super positive way imo.

Im a big believer in him at this point, and I think that all the stars aligned perfectly for us to luckily end up with him (the habs will rue the day that they passed on him).

At best we had an 18% chance of landing Hughes, and while he's obviously a much superior talent and prospect than Tkachuk currently, he's more of a Hischer level 1st overall in my mind as opposed to a McDavid or Mathews level franchise center (the size is real a concern for me as top centerman - I see him on the wing eventually).

The other top picks look very nice as well, but Im still not sold that any of them would be better players for the Senators to build around, and Im not disturbed by the fact that Dorion also sees it that way.

With Tkachuk you literally could not ask for a player with a better attitude and play style to be the first pick of a rebuilding franchise that is in shambles. Its a match made in heaven in terms of needing to change the identity and culture here.

We need players to keep their heads up during dark times, to push hard every night and not sulk (like we are seeing with guys like Eichel who are supposed to lead their teams out of the darkness), and thats what we have here with Brady.

I enjoyed this post from top to bottom, cheers!

 

[HSF]

People still sleeping on Brady I see

Dude has top line potential and most scouts saw that.

 

[swiftwin]

If it's such a "bad take", it should be very easy to start. I'd be glad to have you enlighten me.

1- You're still perpetuating the myth that character is the only reason Tkachuk was picked high.
2- Nobody cares about what's happening in front office. Players only care about the dressing room and the ice.
3- You're thinking a top 3 pick is likely. It isn't.
4- You're assuming 4-8 next draft would be comparable to Tkachuk. It isn't.
5- You're ignoring other reasons not to keep the pick.

 

[HSF]

I think there's a philosophical idea accepted by this team that character comes first, and is the most important element to building a successful team. Especially a budget team that will face more adversity as a result of their limitations of what can be spent both on coaching, and in terms of bringing in stars.

As long as Melnyk is the owner, this team is going to continue to be a circus. I can see the logic in selecting a young star who can handle the absurdities of this team.

I don't buy that we liked him better than everybody other than Hughes. Are they saying we take Tkachuk at 2 over Svechnikov? Is there not another player as good as Svechnikov behind Hughes in the 2019 draft? I think it's probably that we'd take him over everybody from 3rd or 4th onward next year because of his character.

If I had to guess, I think the genuine thought process was maybe if we land at 1 or 2, maybe 3, we get a player who ECLIPSES Tkachuk in skill (assuming it is a deep draft). But if we land in that 4-8 range, we're getting a comparable player, but missing out on a "12/10" leader who is best suited to handle this circus of a team. So playing their interpretations of the odds, they took Tkachuk.

So you think all Brady brings to the table is 'character'?

Keep watching him

 

[Samsquanch]

People still sleeping on Brady I see

Dude has top line potential and most scouts saw that.

And I think most people are simply not evaluating just how much impact an elite power forward can have on the game. Even more so in the playoffs.

Wingers on average play a less valuable role than centermen. But elite power forwards are the outlier imo, these guys are as valuable as a #1C , #1D and #1G. I would personally take the big top 5 elite power forward over a good top 20-25 centerman with average size.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

It's just very difficult to get pumped since we all know we are trading Tkachuk for scraps as soon as he asks for lots of dollars.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

It's just very difficult to get pumped since we all know we are trading Tkachuk for scraps as soon as he asks for lots of dollars.

So we have to read 5 more years of Sensungs posts about new investors and Melnyk selling the team .. great

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

And I think most people are simply not evaluating just how much impact an elite power forward can have on the game. Even more so in the playoffs.

Wingers on average play a less valuable role than centermen. But elite power forwards are the outlier imo, these guys are as valuable as a #1C , #1D and #1G. I would personally take the big top 5 elite power forward over a good top 20-25 centerman with average size.

We saw how Wilson allowed Washington to dominate over more skilled teams in TB and Pitts. He played a mighty role in their success.

We saw Tuch give absolutely FITS to Winnipeg and SJ.

Don't get me wrong, you still need a Kuznetsov and William Karlsson on C(as well as a Holtby or MAF in net)

but guys like Tkachuk tilt the ice in your favor if you're playing a team that you're similarly skilled to or they are a bit more skilled than you.

That's why I was over the moon when we drafted Tkachuk. I thought for sure it meant we keeping EK. Having both those guys on the team, and Stone, would have given up a tremendous diverse skill set.

Ah well.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

1- You're still perpetuating the myth that character is the only reason Tkachuk was picked high.
2- Nobody cares about what's happening in front office. Players only care about the dressing room and the ice.
3- You're thinking a top 3 pick is likely. It isn't.
4- You're assuming 4-8 next draft would be comparable to Tkachuk. It isn't.
5- You're ignoring other reasons not to keep the pick.

1- Never once did I say that in my post. Show me an example of where I did. On that topic, our GM himself admitted that there may have been players who were "a little bit more skilled" than Tkachuk but Tkachuk was a "12/10" on intangibles or leadership. (Don't recall his exact wording)

2- (Insert Duchene kick in the balls quote here). We just waived a locker room leader with a flimsy highly suspect reasoning of needing to randomly send a message about a player's performance last year, deep into the pre-season, despite the fact that the head coach had him as our 2C. That clearly upset guys in the room. People like Pagnotta insinuating that placing Smith on waivers was Melnyk's call. Not to mention just the general instability of being unable to keep as many veterans, and the cycling of strong voices and leaders out of the room on a more than normal basis that will likely b caused by that. It's clear how getting a "12/10" leader locked down as an RFA for the next 7 years is valuable to this team.

You can't really expect me to be able to argue points 3/4/5 when you're mostly pulling this stuff out of thin air. (I never said a top 3 pick is likely) and where your point 4 is largely opinion based. It's not useful at all to tell me I am ignoring other reason to keep the pick without actually stating those reasons.

I'd like to point out that you've made a lot of assumptions based on things that weren't said in my post. It's strange. Not to mention, what's the point of replying just calling someone's post stupid without actually explaining why? It's weird way to behave. I am fine with people disagreeing with me, or pointing out where I'm wrong, or where my thought process if flawed with a certain opinion. I don't get the rationale in being a dick online to people when the entire point of a forum is to interact and in turn learn from each other about the topic.

 

[HSF]

atleast all the garbage talk about him going to the London Knights is gone

 

[swiftwin]

My biggest thing with Tkachuk is the fact that he's the perfect "new NHL" player. The game has changed dramatically since 10-20 years ago. Pure shooters aren't a thing anymore. "Wheel snipe celly" pure skill perimeter players aren't a thing anymore. Premier stay-at-home defensemen who chip the puck off the boards aren't a thing anymore.

Now the game is all about pace, possession and net drive for forwards. What do you think makes Crosby so good? It's not just his stickhandling and shooting skills, it's also his tenacity down low. Nobody works harder than Crosby down low, which drives possession. Malkin? Same thing. McDavid? raw pace. He doesn't have an elite shot, but he makes up for it in raw pace and net drive. I could keep going down the list of top players in the league, and guarantee you that they do atleast 2 of those 3 thing better than most players in the league

Brady is the perfect player for that. He's a big fat green checkmark for all 3. The big thing that stood out to me this pre-season is his ability to drive the net, but also have the vision to make small passes in tight to open players around the net. He's going to be an absolute gem. I'm really really really figgin' high on him right now. I'm not even thinking about his character or "intangibles" right now. I'm just talking about his pure technical abilities as a hockey player.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

So you think all Brady brings to the table is 'character'?

Keep watching him

When did I say that in my post? I never said that at all.

My post was validating the idea that our team felt so strongly about taking Tkachuk because of his high level character and it being a very unique asset that we badly need long term given our situation.

Me saying that is not me saying we took a player lacking in skill because of his character. I have never said that about Tkachuk.

We clearly passed on the opportunity to get more skilled players because of his character, our GM himself has admitted that. I think that at least viewing the 2018 draft, that was the right move, because the difference between Zadina and Tkachuk is not great enough to pass on what Tkachuk (supposedly) brings off the ice.

The 2019 draft has been characterized as having a very deep top end. I don't buy that when it is all said and done, Hughes will end up as the only player we wouldn't take Tkachuk over.

That has nothing to do with me saying Brady brings only character to the table. I would never make such a ridiculous claim.

 

[swiftwin]

When did I say that in my post? I never said that at all.

My post was validating the idea that our team felt so strongly about taking Tkachuk because of his high level character and it being a very unique asset that we badly need long term given our situation.

Me saying that is not me saying we took a player lacking in skill because of his character. I have never said that about Tkachuk.

We clearly passed on the opportunity to get more skilled players because of his character, our GM himself has admitted that. I think that at least viewing the 2018 draft, that was the right move, because the difference between Zadina and Tkachuk is not great enough to pass on what Tkachuk (supposedly) brings off the ice.

The 2019 draft has been characterized as having a very deep top end. I don't buy that when it is all said and done, Hughes will end up as the only player we wouldn't take Tkachuk over.

That has nothing to do with me saying Brady brings only character to the table. I would never make such a ridiculous claim.

Source?

 

[BondraTime]

When did I say that in my post? I never said that at all.

My post was validating the idea that our team felt so strongly about taking Tkachuk because of his high level character and it being a very unique asset that we badly need long term given our situation.

Me saying that is not me saying we took a player lacking in skill because of his character. I have never said that about Tkachuk.

We clearly passed on the opportunity to get more skilled players because of his character, our GM himself has admitted that. I think that at least viewing the 2018 draft, that was the right move, because the difference between Zadina and Tkachuk is not great enough to pass on what Tkachuk (supposedly) brings off the ice.

The 2019 draft has been characterized as having a very deep top end. I don't buy that when it is all said and done, Hughes will end up as the only player we wouldn't take Tkachuk over.

That has nothing to do with me saying Brady brings only character to the table. I would never make such a ridiculous claim.

That's because there isn't a lick of truth to it

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I think the reference was to next year's Hughes, and was referring to keeping or deferring the pick.

That's who I am talking about.

The reference to Svechnikov was purely because as of now, there are players in 2019 projected to be as valuable as Svechnikov not named Hughes. So it's surprising to me we'd take Tkachuk over them, and does that mean if we had #2 this year, we take Tkachuk over Svechnikov? That I'd be surprised if that was the case. That's what I was getting to.

In NHL drafts, there's usually a major dropoff from 1 to 2, then 2 to 3. Unless a lot changes by the time the draft roles around, the point is I find it surprising that he's the only player we would not take Brady over.

Just like this year, where there were more skilled players on the board at 4 that we passed on (according to Dorion at least), I think it's entirely plausible that for the same reason we passed on those more skilled players at 4, the team projected onward to where they'll likely be picking in 2019 "4-8", and came to the same conclusion they did about whoever the more skilled player(s) than Tkachuk were in 2018. That Tkachuk's intangibles are well worth passing on the extra skill, so that's why they kept the pick.

That is far from me saying Tkachuk is not skilled. I'm a bit baffled that people would pull something I never said out of my post.

I find it hard to believe that Hughes is the only player they take over Tkachuk next year. That's all I'm saying.

 

[BondraTime]

Source?

Dorion has stated this multiple times that they passed on more skill for Tkachuk, but he has everything else that they wanted over the other guys

 

[HSF]

That's because there isn't a lick of truth to it

At the time of the draft that may have been true. How these guys play or have started the season so far who knows.

If you truly believe Brady will be a top line player there are maybe 2 players in the draft next year that have higher potential and even then things are fluid till closer to the draft