Player Discussion Brady Tkachuk (LW) - Part XI

[JD1]

He's not a good leader

Your insight is legendary

 

[JD1]

I think he will be gone in the 2025 offseason before his NMC kicks in if we do not make the playoffs again.

He will leverage his NMC to get out of here and the team will give in because once a superstar wants out it's too difficult to keep them long-term and if they try to convince him to stay beyond when his NMC kicks in, they lose all leverage in a trade.

Winning solves everything. So if they have a strong 2024-2025 season, then it's like none of this ever happened.

Ultimately, the team Dorion built is very flawed, and fixing it in such a short period of time with so many big contracts is going to be very difficult. I suspect we are in for a major retool/rebuild around Sanderson/Pinto/Greig with everybody else, including Stutzle, possibly being moved.

The problem is that fixing this team is not a 1 year problem but they only have a year before Giroux is a UFA and Tkachuk's NMC kicks in.

I'd add Tkachuk and Zub to your build around list.

It's going to be fascinating because Staois indicated to Mendes that he's open to moving guys with term so something big is likely coming

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I think he will be gone in the 2025 offseason before his NMC kicks in if we do not make the playoffs again.

He will leverage his NMC to get out of here and the team will give in because once a superstar wants out it's too difficult to keep them long-term and if they try to convince him to stay beyond when his NMC kicks in, they lose all leverage in a trade.

Winning solves everything. So if they have a strong 2024-2025 season, then it's like none of this ever happened.

Ultimately, the team Dorion built is very flawed, and fixing it in such a short period of time with so many big contracts is going to be very difficult. I suspect we are in for a major retool/rebuild around Sanderson/Pinto/Greig with everybody else, including Stutzle, possibly being moved.

The problem is that fixing this team is not a 1 year problem but they only have a year before Giroux is a UFA and Tkachuk's NMC kicks in.

Building around Sanderson/Pinto/Greig is a significant downgrade compared to Chabot/Tkachuk/Stuzle.

I could see giving it a go if this was the Bedard draft and we had a great chance at getting that pick....but in a regular draft year and no apparent generational kids on the horizon (that I've heard of) for the next 3 years.....it's going to be a tough sell.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

I'd add Tkachuk and Zub to your build around list.

It's going to be fascinating because Staois indicated to Mendes that he's open to moving guys with term so something big is likely coming

I think they want to build around Tkachuk, no GM is going to willingly trade him, but the timeline of his NMC and the amount of work that needs to be done to fix this team is what will screw them out of being able to keep him.

The list was meant to say, if we have another disastrous season, that's who we likely end up building around after a retool or shorter 3-5 year rebuild.

At this point, it's not outrageous to expect Tkachuk to ask out if we miss the playoffs again. It's a lukewarm take, not a hot one. A player with an upcoming NMC, seven years no playoffs, power agent-uncle, and a family history of using any leverage they have to improve their careers.

Building around Sanderson/Pinto/Greig is a significant downgrade compared to Chabot/Tkachuk/Stuzle.

I could see giving it a go if this was the Bedard draft and we had a great chance at getting that pick....but in a regular draft year and no apparent generational kids on the horizon (that I've heard of) for the next 3 years.....it's going to be a tough sell.

Sanderson is going to be a franchise D.

Pinto will be our ROR.

Greig is fine.

The reality is that if we build around those three, there will also be other major pieces coming back from trading Tkachuk, and possibly Stutzle. Ideally, we keep Stutzle and he wants to stay and we're all a big happy family because he is one of the best young offensive players of the last 20 years.

 

[Tuna99]

Is this a joke

Nope, all part of the plan

 

[JD1]

I think they want to build around Tkachuk, no GM is going to willingly trade him, but the timeline of his NMC and the amount of work that needs to be done to fix this team is what will screw them out of being able to keep him.

The list was meant to say, if we have another disastrous season, that's who we likely end up building around after a retool or shorter 3-5 year rebuild.

At this point, it's not outrageous to expect Tkachuk to ask out if we miss the playoffs again. It's a lukewarm take, not a hot one. A player with an upcoming NMC, seven years no playoffs, power agent-uncle, and a family history of using any leverage they have to improve their careers.

Well, I think Chabot is gone and possibly Chychrun along with him. There just isn't someone "with term" that sticks out as much. Issues with compete not being there? Chabot. Maybe Norris too but that's a this year thing with his shoulder. I could see Batherson getting moved too but despite his warts I think he provides good value for his contract

 

[Micklebot]

Well, I think Chabot is gone and possibly Chychrun along with him. There just isn't someone "with term" that sticks out as much. Issues with compete not being there? Chabot. Maybe Norris too but that's a this year thing with his shoulder. I could see Batherson getting moved too but despite his warts I think he provides good value for his contract

I find it unlikely we'd move both Chabot and Chychrun. Even with their warts, d of their caliber aren't easy to acquire.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Rah rah
Led the team in takeaways last night, he’s much better under JM,
you have blinders on like usual, but your hate gets in the way of judgement.

I have been thinking of a descriptor for the Senators and I found one. Lack of conscientious.

And no one on the team shows more lack of conscientiousness than Brady, Chabot and Batherson. They are the leaders of it.

And anyone who watches a Senators game can see that with no hate required.

And it's not a huge leap to say that it trickles down from them to the rest of the roster. They are basically big brothers to guys Sanderson, Stutzle, Greig etc.

 

[JD1]

I find it unlikely we'd move both Chabot and Chychrun. Even with their warts, d of their caliber aren't easy to acquire.

Well I agree that D of their caliber are hard to acquire. But the situation is perhaps a bit unique. Both of them could be considered top pair LHD. Just not here because I think Sanderson owns that role.

so, one way to look at it is part of the return including a quality 18-20 minute LHD that can pk.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Well, I think Chabot is gone and possibly Chychrun along with him. There just isn't someone "with term" that sticks out as much. Issues with compete not being there? Chabot. Maybe Norris too but that's a this year thing with his shoulder. I could see Batherson getting moved too but despite his warts I think he provides good value for his contract

I doubt Chabot is crazy about sticking around. He has been here for longer than Brady. He wasted his prime here. The difference between him and Tkachuk is that Tkachuk is a legitimate A++ asset that teams would line up to trade for. That along with the NMC of Tkachuk put him in a prime position to force a trade. It has already been reported that Tkachuk is untradeable as/is with his contract. Asking for a trade would be pointless because there won't be as many avenues to get rid of him.

The only benefit you can make is that he was in the right place at the right time to get an amazing extension. While most people were happy with his contract at the time, not ever team would have had the cap or marketing motivations with the fans to lock down him and White like Ottawa did.

 

[DJB]

I doubt Chabot is crazy about sticking around. He has been here for longer than Brady. He wasted his prime here. The difference between him and Tkachuk is that Tkachuk is a legitimate A++ asset that teams would line up to trade for. That along with the NMC of Tkachuk put him in a prime position to force a trade. It has already been reported that Tkachuk is untradeable as/is with his contract. Asking for a trade would be pointless because there won't be as many avenues to get rid of him.

The only benefit you can make is that he was in the right place at the right time to get an amazing extension. While most people were happy with his contract at the time, not ever team would have had the cap or marketing motivations with the fans to lock down him and White like Ottawa did.

What moron said that?

 

[Relapsing]

First rule to fandom is to not get married to any one player.

Cheer for the team, not the players.

I

I doubt Chabot is crazy about sticking around. He has been here for longer than Brady. He wasted his prime here. The difference between him and Tkachuk is that Tkachuk is a legitimate A++ asset that teams would line up to trade for. That along with the NMC of Tkachuk put him in a prime position to force a trade. It has already been reported that Tkachuk is untradeable as/is with his contract. Asking for a trade would be pointless because there won't be as many avenues to get rid of him.

The only benefit you can make is that he was in the right place at the right time to get an amazing extension. While most people were happy with his contract at the time, not ever team would have had the cap or marketing motivations with the fans to lock down him and White like Ottawa did

I haven't seen a single report saying Tkachuks contract is untradable. Where's the quote bud?

 

[BankStreetParade]

I doubt Chabot is crazy about sticking around. He has been here for longer than Brady. He wasted his prime here. The difference between him and Tkachuk is that Tkachuk is a legitimate A++ asset that teams would line up to trade for. That along with the NMC of Tkachuk put him in a prime position to force a trade. It has already been reported that Tkachuk is untradeable as/is with his contract. Asking for a trade would be pointless because there won't be as many avenues to get rid of him.

The only benefit you can make is that he was in the right place at the right time to get an amazing extension. While most people were happy with his contract at the time, not ever team would have had the cap or marketing motivations with the fans to lock down him and White like Ottawa did.

People who think Chabot is untradeable are crazy. Guys who skate like him and play the minutes he can are worth their weight in gold in the current NHL. He's #1 in EVTOI/GP among all players in the NHL since 2018-19 and #3 in total TOI/GP since then too. It's just a fantasy that his contract can't be moved.

 

[Golden_Jet]

What moron said that?

Made it up, seems like.

 

[PlayOn]

People who think Chabot is untradeable are crazy. Guys who skate like him and play the minutes he can are worth their weight in gold in the current NHL. He's #1 in EVTOI/GP among all players in the NHL since 2018-19 and #3 in total TOI/GP since then too. It's just a fantasy that his contract can't be moved.

I think he’s definitely tradeable, but is he tradeable without taking back a bad contract for a worse player? I don’t know about that. His contract can be moved but I’m not sure it can be moved in a way that helps this team.

What moron said that?

Pretty sure OP meant Chabot

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I think he will be gone in the 2025 offseason before his NMC kicks in if we do not make the playoffs again.

He will leverage his NMC to get out of here and the team will give in because once a superstar wants out it's too difficult to keep them long-term and if they try to convince him to stay beyond when his NMC kicks in, they lose all leverage in a trade.

Winning solves everything. So if they have a strong 2024-2025 season, then it's like none of this ever happened.

Ultimately, the team Dorion built is very flawed, and fixing it in such a short period of time with so many big contracts is going to be very difficult. I suspect we are in for a major retool/rebuild around Sanderson/Pinto/Greig with everybody else, including Stutzle, possibly being moved.

The problem is that fixing this team is not a 1 year problem but they only have a year before Giroux is a UFA and Tkachuk's NMC kicks in.

It's too bad. Dorion got some fantastic pieces through the draft... he just made some weird choices when it came to trades.

Giving up high picks for players that were not a good fit, and he sacrificed the future for it.

Professional scouting and trades are what absolutely did this franchise in under the dorion regime. That and not having the right coach to develop all that talent the right way.

It's fixable, I hope. I guess we will see.

 

[Knave]

I find it unlikely we'd move both Chabot and Chychrun. Even with their warts, d of their caliber aren't easy to acquire.

I agree that you pick one.

I like Chabot because I feel he skates better and has more offensive flair whereas I think Chychrun is an offensive defenseman who feels a bit less creative, a bit more stationary.

I think you trade one and look for a defensive defenseman who can make the basic/obvious pass like Methot was to Karlsson.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

What moron said that?

Sorry, typo. I meant Chabot not Tkachuk.

Garrioch and others have reported on the money aspect.

What I meant to say was that Tkachuk is an A++ asset and has a NMC to leverage, so asking for a trade makes sense. Chabot would be difficult to trade so Chabot asking for a trade would be irrelevant.

 

[Icelevel]

- Made captain
- Signed to a big contract
- Surrounded team with his buddies


But it’s a small group of posters on a freaking random online forum that’s going to run him out of town?!? Give it a rest buddy, if he requests a trade it’s because the team is hot garbage and him listening to his brother/dad following in their footsteps.

Sens fans are so insecure about stars leaving that they think they are the problem lmaoo.

Your post is misinformed and totally irrelevant. Please stop clogging up the forum.

 

[JD1]

Sorry, typo. I meant Chabot not Tkachuk.

Garrioch and others have reported on the money aspect.

What I meant to say was that Tkachuk is an A++ asset and has a NMC to leverage, so asking for a trade makes sense. Chabot would be difficult to trade so Chabot asking for a trade would be irrelevant.

So back to your point about Chabot having wasted his prime here. Ok. You're also saying his contract isn't very movable because he hasn't lived up to it.

Those two statements don't really add up well to me. Maybe if Chabot was clearly playing at a level where teams would be excited he's on the market, his prime wouldn't have been such a waste?

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

So back to your point about Chabot having wasted his prime here. Ok. You're also saying his contract isn't very movable because he hasn't lived up to it.

Those two statements don't really add up well to me. Maybe if Chabot was clearly playing at a level where teams would be excited he's on the market, his prime wouldn't have been such a waste?

Those two things aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[JD1]

Those two things aren't mutually exclusive.

Sure...but you said Chabot wasted his prime here. The irony of the statement is his own play is one of the reasons he's never played in a playoff game.

 

[Tuna99]

Sure...but you said Chabot wasted his prime here. The irony of the statement is his own play is one of the reasons he's never played in a playoff game.

I’d like to see Staois get Chabot a steady partner he can play with for 3 years - be interesting to see a stat on how many Dman Chabot has played with over the last 5 years and how many would be legit top 4 NHL Dman or even established top 6 NHL Dman.

 

[Micklebot]

Sure...but you said Chabot wasted his prime here. The irony of the statement is his own play is one of the reasons he's never played in a playoff game.

How well does he have to play to drag any of the teams he's been on into the playoffs? Closest we came was last year, and we needed 7 more points to pass Florida, how much better would be have had to of played to make up 7 points in the 68 games he was healthy for?

I get that you've couched your claim with "one of the reasons" but the reality is even if he played at a level akin to his contract, at best we maybe have a long shot chance of making the playoffs once in his career.

 

[bicboi64]

What is there to enjoy here? Obviously it wouldn't be good to lose a top 6 winger but teams have survived changing their captains before and shipping out top 6 wingers before.

If you listen to the radio you'd think losing Tkachuk would be this massive hit. And maybe it would be for the short term but we'd be better off for it in the long term.

Again I don't want to see Tkachuk go but I don't understand this "oh my god it would be one of the worst moments for this franchise and the team would collapse". We're already garbage with him. It can't get much worse. And I'd argue it could be for the better after an adjustment period. Why are we married to what we know has not worked for 3 years now? Why is he excluded when we talk about this team's performance?

Pretty much this. Sucked to see the Alfie debacle, sucked to see Spezza not handle the pressure, sucked to see the EK situation, but just like the rest, we'd survive if Tkachuk wants out. He's not as good as either of those players and is a weaker leader.

Not sure how much worse we can get, but I've stopped being attached to any single player.