Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

[Lemontree]

Couldn't overcome the loss of Malgin.

I think it was Marleau's fault.

 

[All Mod Cons]

The craziest thing about all this, Dubas didn't even force Keefe to dress them every playoff game!

WTF was everyone thinking last playoffs?

We weren't thinking. How we ever f***ed that up with Gus and Laff right there, I will never know. Us fans deserve a do over of last years playoffs.

Couldn't overcome the loss of Malgin.

Our boy Kyle just chose Karlsson over Gustafsson. What a plonker. I imagine the chaps over at the Athletic will come up with some reason why it was a good move.

 

[thusk]

I'm not talking about the ice time average. I'm talking about the number of games. You took total goals against (which is bad enough) and then compared it to players that played ~20 games less than him, in order to misrepresent him and his defense. Of course somebody with 70 games is going to have more total goals against than somebody with 47 games.

And yes, he took on a lot of responsibility during the period of time when we had the majority of our defense out with injury that year. Klingberg has been one of the most sheltered players in the league, and was still much worse.

yeah youre right barrie is a superstar who never be able to defend all his carreer and klinberg just trash player who can defend with the same exact kind of stats in carreer .. go ahead youre right the amaizing healthy barrie playing alongside rielly and muzzin was looking much better than 80% injured klinberg playing alongside mccabe, gio and lagesson

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

- I hate that they couldn't retain Schenn, O-Reilly and Acciari but I understand the cap issues.
- I'm not a fan of any of the players brought in (Klinger, Bertuzzi, Domi and Reaves). Domi looks better lately.
I don't like the fact Matthews and Marner weren't locked up or traded while the team still had leverage and now the Nylander situation is evolving into a situation where they won't be able to keep him.

Can someone explain again how Tree Living is doing a great job? I mean, I don't think he's doing a terrible job given all factors involved but I'm pretty sure I could have done as well.

 

[Lemontree]

It's fine if some people are unsure of Tre as the GM, unless you have built a Stanley Cup winning roster, there should be questions on if you are capable of doing it. This is the bar that the previous Leafs GM set (I posted this in another thread):

2019 1st round pick #22, Sean Durzi, Carl Grundstrom for Jake Muzzin.
2020 1st round pick #13 to get rid of Marleau contract (1 year).
2021 1st round pick #25 for Nick Foligno.
2022 1st round pick #25 and Petr Mrazek for 2022 2nd round pick (#38 - Fraser Minten)
2022 2nd round pick (#58) and 2023 2nd round pick (#57) for Mark Giordano and Colin Blackwell.
2023 1st round pick (#25) and 2024 2nd round pick (# TBD) for Ryan O'Reilly and Noel Acciari.
2025 1st round pick (#TBD) and 2026 2nd round pick (#TBD) for Jake McCabe and Sam Lafferty).
2025 2nd round pick (#TBD) with Nick Ritchie for Ryan Dzingel and Ilya Lybushkin.

Since 2019, talking only about 1st and 2 round draft picks. Dubas traded away 6 Leafs first round picks (including 2025) and 5 Leafs 2nd round picks including 2024, 2025, 2026). What do the Toronto Maple Leafs organization in 2023 have to show for it?

Mark Giordino (roster)
Jake McCabe (roster)
Fraser Minten (prospect)
Jake Muzzin (LTIR until retirement)

I can't imagine that Tre is going to do a worse job from an asset management perspective.

 

[Lemontree]

- I hate that they couldn't retain Schenn, O-Reilly and Acciari but I understand the cap issues.
- I'm not a fan of any of the players brought in (Klinger, Bertuzzi, Domi and Reaves). Domi looks better lately.
I don't like the fact Matthews and Marner weren't locked up or traded while the team still had leverage and now the Nylander situation is evolving into a situation where they won't be able to keep him.

Can someone explain again how Tree Living is doing a great job? I mean, I don't think he's doing a terrible job given all factors involved but I'm pretty sure I could have done as well.

Curious why you hated to see O'Reilly and Acciari go but your not a fan of signing Bertuzzi?

Matthews was signed to a contract extension in the off-season. Did you really expect any GM to come in and trade Marner (while under contract) a few weeks into their new gig?

Do we know that Nylander was ready to sign a contract extension in the off-season?

 

[GoonieFace]

It's fine if some people are unsure of Tre as the GM, unless you have built a Stanley Cup winning roster, there should be questions on if you are capable of doing it. This is the bar that the previous Leafs GM set (I posted this in another thread):

2019 1st round pick #22, Sean Durzi, Carl Grundstrom for Jake Muzzin.
2020 1st round pick #13 to get rid of Marleau contract (1 year).
2021 1st round pick #25 for Nick Foligno.
2022 1st round pick #25 and Petr Mrazek for 2022 2nd round pick (#38 - Fraser Minten)
2022 2nd round pick (#58) and 2023 2nd round pick (#57) for Mark Giordano and Colin Blackwell.
2023 1st round pick (#25) and 2024 2nd round pick (# TBD) for Ryan O'Reilly and Noel Acciari.
2025 1st round pick (#TBD) and 2026 2nd round pick (#TBD) for Jake McCabe and Sam Lafferty).
2025 2nd round pick (#TBD) with Nick Ritchie for Ryan Dzingel and Ilya Lybushkin.

Since 2019, talking only about 1st and 2 round draft picks. Dubas traded away 6 Leafs first round picks (including 2025) and 5 Leafs 2nd round picks including 2024, 2025, 2026). What do the Toronto Maple Leafs organization in 2023 have to show for it?

Mark Giordino (roster)
Jake McCabe (roster)
Fraser Minten (prospect)
Jake Muzzin (LTIR until retirement)

I can't imagine that Tre is going to do a worse job from an asset management perspective.

Ha, what do you know. Dubas left Tre with a stacked roster with no holes. and oodles of talent waiting to crack the roster…oodles…

 

[hotpaws]

It's fine if some people are unsure of Tre as the GM, unless you have built a Stanley Cup winning roster, there should be questions on if you are capable of doing it. This is the bar that the previous Leafs GM set (I posted this in another thread):

2019 1st round pick #22, Sean Durzi, Carl Grundstrom for Jake Muzzin.
2020 1st round pick #13 to get rid of Marleau contract (1 year).
2021 1st round pick #25 for Nick Foligno.
2022 1st round pick #25 and Petr Mrazek for 2022 2nd round pick (#38 - Fraser Minten)
2022 2nd round pick (#58) and 2023 2nd round pick (#57) for Mark Giordano and Colin Blackwell.
2023 1st round pick (#25) and 2024 2nd round pick (# TBD) for Ryan O'Reilly and Noel Acciari.
2025 1st round pick (#TBD) and 2026 2nd round pick (#TBD) for Jake McCabe and Sam Lafferty).
2025 2nd round pick (#TBD) with Nick Ritchie for Ryan Dzingel and Ilya Lybushkin.

Since 2019, talking only about 1st and 2 round draft picks. Dubas traded away 6 Leafs first round picks (including 2025) and 5 Leafs 2nd round picks including 2024, 2025, 2026). What do the Toronto Maple Leafs organization in 2023 have to show for it?

Mark Giordino (roster)
Jake McCabe (roster)
Fraser Minten (prospect)
Jake Muzzin (LTIR until retirement)

I can't imagine that Tre is going to do a worse job from an asset management perspective.

sure his record looks pathetic , but that's only because your not putting it in the proper ''context'' . lol

 

[Dekes For Days]

but that's only because your not putting it in the proper ''context'' . lol

I'd say picking out player assets remaining from the trade deadline additions of a consistently top tier team made 1-5 years ago that involved outgoing picks is missing quite a bit of context of how the GM performed.

 

[Peasy]

I'd say picking out player assets remaining from the trade deadline additions of a consistently top tier team made 1-5 years ago that involved outgoing picks is missing quite a bit of context of how the GM performed.

How about we compare it to the Avs (a contending team and has won a cup). I'll do since 2019-2020 and only include trades they moved out a 3rd or better:
2 2nd round picks for Toews (still with them)
1st and 3rd for Kuemper (not with the team, but was their goalie winning the cup and was there entire season)
2nd and Helleson for Manson (still with them)
2nd and Baron for Lehkonen (still with them)
3rd, 5th, 3rd for Georgiev (still with them)
2nd for Lars Eller (no longer with them)
2nd for Ross Colton (with them on contract for 4 years)

So in 4 complete seasons, only a 1st, 2nd and 3rd have been lost from players still not on their roster, and they have a cup to go along with.

Dubas' work just looks silly when compared to that.

 

[All Mod Cons]

How about we compare it to the Avs (a contending team and has won a cup). I'll do since 2019-2020 and only include trades they moved out a 3rd or better:
2 2nd round picks for Toews (still with them)
1st and 3rd for Kuemper (not with the team, but was their goalie winning the cup and was there entire season)
2nd and Helleson for Manson (still with them)
2nd and Baron for Lehkonen (still with them)
3rd, 5th, 3rd for Georgiev (still with them)
2nd for Lars Eller (no longer with them)
2nd for Ross Colton (with them on contract for 4 years)

So in 4 complete seasons, only a 1st, 2nd and 3rd have been lost from players still not on their roster, and they have a cup to go along with.

Dubas' work just looks silly when compared to that.

Member when Dubas fans went nuts because we traded 2nd round picks for Boyle and Plekanec?

They're a walking contradiction.

 

[TheRumble]

Man, if you guys are gonna blame Dubas for Muzzin getting injured, why don't you blame him for drafting a guy who ended up dying of cancer as well?

 

[Mess]

Since 2019, talking only about 1st and 2 round draft picks. Dubas traded away 6 Leafs first round picks (including 2025) and 5 Leafs 2nd round picks including 2024, 2025, 2026). What do the Toronto Maple Leafs organization in 2023 have to show for it?

Mark Giordino (roster)
Jake McCabe (roster)
Fraser Minten (prospect)
Jake Muzzin (LTIR until retirement)

I can't imagine that Tre is going to do a worse job from an asset management perspective.

Just think !!!!

If you would have put a Pumpkin in the Press box for the previous 5 years as Leafs GM, and as a result he could and made Zero trades and Zero signings protecting the Leafs from himself, and instead Leafs amateur scouting staff would have drafted prospects with Leafs surviving 6 X 1st rounders and 5 X 2nd rounders that he foolishly traded away for virtually nothing residual in return, just think how much better the Leafs would be today and how much brighter the future for Treliving would be?

Leafs were capable of losing in the 1st round each season without sacrificing all those 11 X top 60 picks. How bad a GM do you have to be to need to prop up losing teams with high draft picks?

Dubas has already been fired, and still Leafs are already missing 4 X 1st or 2nd round picks in the future that BT inherits. Treliving doesn't have a 2nd round pick until 2027.

Setting the Bar for Treliving to begin with..

As you said the bar for Treliving has been set so low for comparison purposes to the previous GM's resume, that its virtually impossible to under perform.

 

[Stephen]

Though it would have been smarter to have just extended Gustafsson than go after Klingberg. Could have given the team a few extra million for another forward or D man

You know what’s interesting. I’ve been saying for a couple of years Dubas had his issues in free agency spending in the $3-$5 million mark but did better at the league minimum level.

This pattern seems to be proving somewhat consistent with the hit and miss factor of a Klingberg, on and off Domi and Bertuzzi. Reaves is a massive bust even though he’s under that level.

But don’t look now, Benoit and Lagesson are solid at the bottom of the barrel. And no complaints with Gregor.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

Actually both are wrong. Foligno was healthy before coming to Toronto. He then had multiple weeks in quarantine to clear up any bumps and bruises. He was very good in the first few games with us, playing decent minutes in a top 6 role, and going PPG. He got a debilitating injury in the next game, and struggled from there.

The site you're referencing seems to be taking a comment about how the Leafs helped Foligno work through the injury he experienced with us, to still be able to play some games for us after it happened, and for some reason thinking he's talking about something else.

This Foligno thing is a hill you're willing to die on for some reason. I read a quote...from Foligno...right after the injury in Winnipeg where he stated that it was from earlier in the season and he had been managing it and he will be fine in a couple of days. It isn't some conspiracy theory that he was injured before he was traded. Jarmo lied to Dubas to get the draft picks....simple as that.

 

[ToneDog]

This Foligno thing is a hill you're willing to die on for some reason. I read a quote...from Foligno...right after the injury in Winnipeg where he stated that it was from earlier in the season and he had been managing it and he will be fine in a couple of days. It isn't some conspiracy theory that he was injured before he was traded. Jarmo lied to Dubas to get the draft picks....simple as that.

Clearly Foligno was lying.

 

[Stephen]

This Foligno thing is a hill you're willing to die on for some reason. I read a quote...from Foligno...right after the injury in Winnipeg where he stated that it was from earlier in the season and he had been managing it and he will be fine in a couple of days. It isn't some conspiracy theory that he was injured before he was traded. Jarmo lied to Dubas to get the draft picks....simple as that.

There's also a record of Foligno sustaining an injury before the trade.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

And a TSN article about it leading up to the trade deadline...

Foligno (upper-body) out vs. Blackhawks - TSN.ca

Columbus Blue Jackets forward Nick Foligno is out for tonight's game against the Chicago Blackhawks, listed as day-to-day with an upper-body injury.

www.tsn.ca

Report: Capitals believed to have interest in trading for Nick Foligno

One shoe dropped earlier in the day and now we may know why. Sunday, after trading Jonas Siegenthaler to the New Jersey…

russianmachineneverbreaks.com

Jarmo didn't like, the Leafs chose to go through with the trade being aware of risks.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

There's also a record of Foligno sustaining an injury before the trade.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

View attachment 771366

And a TSN article about it leading up to the trade deadline...

Foligno (upper-body) out vs. Blackhawks - TSN.ca

Columbus Blue Jackets forward Nick Foligno is out for tonight's game against the Chicago Blackhawks, listed as day-to-day with an upper-body injury.

www.tsn.ca

Report: Capitals believed to have interest in trading for Nick Foligno

One shoe dropped earlier in the day and now we may know why. Sunday, after trading Jonas Siegenthaler to the New Jersey…

russianmachineneverbreaks.com

Jarmo didn't like, the Leafs chose to go through with the trade being aware of risks.

Thanks for digging up the facts....I bet Dekes still says it never happened because....well ...Duby can do no wrong.

 

[Fogelhund]

sorry barrie was totally trash, he had been 100 % healthy all year long and leafs gave up 71 in 70 when he was in the ice. #2 amount every leafs D was Muzzin at 50...the only d who had been able to make look barrie okay was rielly... Klinberg get injured in pre-season and still played with injury and pain 14 game he llayed and was on the ice 16 in 14 game...but yes for sure Barrie was so much better defensivly... yeah youre right ( sarcasm)

the fact leafs had been better is keefe effect... they move off babcock system with streche pass to a system where foward had to reduce space between D and foward and that way giving more help to D to make their job.

Klingberg injured in pre-season?

Though it would have been smarter to have just extended Gustafsson than go after Klingberg. Could have given the team a few extra million for another forward or D man

Could have done Gus and Schenn, for less money than Klingberg.

 

[thusk]

Klingberg injured in pre-season?



Could have done Gus and Schenn, for less money than Klingberg.

yes klinberg get injured in pre-season and was removed from buffalo game and didn't played again until start of regular season for an upper body injury... he was healthy enough to play but how much healthy he was really?

 

[All Mod Cons]

Andora posted an unbelievable stat that I'm literally gobsmacked about.

*Disclaimer - I'm not sure if anyone was missed out, but I can't think of any.

28 of the 36 players dubas acquired were out of the organization within a year.. the ones that stayed longer

hyman / kapanen / marincin / muzzin / kerfoot / clifford / campbell / giordano

Jesus, that's incredible.

 

[LeafEgo]

Hands up those that are Treliving fans?

He needs to be given some time but I don't think anyone is happy with him so far.
Team Dubas struggles to get their head around that.

Wouldn't call myself a fan yet, but I am happy with him so far.

The Kampf contract is a bit of a head scratcher, but he came in after a scandal, with a few weeks that probably entailed a lot of damage control, and came out of the offseason with Bert, Domi, and Cowan. I'm happy they're on the Leafs. He approached a difficult situation creatively, giving us a chance this year, but also allowing for flexibility to take time and build a team post 11M-JT. Has to fix the D so that will be the test but he needs time to do that right. We might find the forward group is already set by years end.

His past performance is an ambiguous mix of good/bad. See it as a clean slate here and hoping he does well.

 

[Lemontree]

Man, if you guys are gonna blame Dubas for Muzzin getting injured, why don't you blame him for drafting a guy who ended up dying of cancer as well?

Where did I mention that it was Dubas fault that Muzzin got injured? I posted the trades of the 1st and 2nd round Leaf draft picks moved since 2019 and the assets left in the organization.

Did you notice that Amirov or the draft pick used to draft Amirov was not mentioned because that was not the Leafs 1st round pick. I also didn't include others teams 1st or 2nd picks traded by Dubas, just the picks which is allotted to each team each season (ie: Leafs).

You should examine your life based on your comment regarding Amirov, I haven't noticed a single poster "blame" Dubas or use that draft pick as a negative. You should be ashamed of yourself for brining up Amirov, his cancer diagnosis and his passing in that context.

Andora posted an unbelievable stat that I'm literally gobsmacked about.

*Disclaimer - I'm not sure if anyone was missed out, but I can't think of any.

28 of the 36 players dubas acquired were out of the organization within a year.. the ones that stayed longer

hyman / kapanen / marincin / muzzin / kerfoot / clifford / campbell / giordano

Jesus, that's incredible.

I could be wrong but I don't think Dubas was the GM when Kasperi Kapanen was acquired.

 

[arso40]

Where did I mention that it was Dubas fault that Muzzin got injured? I posted the trades of the 1st and 2nd round Leaf draft picks moved since 2019 and the assets left in the organization.

Did you notice that Amirov or the draft pick used to draft Amirov was not mentioned because that was not the Leafs 1st round pick. I also didn't include others teams 1st or 2nd picks traded by Dubas, just the picks which is allotted to each team each season (ie: Leafs).

You should examine your life based on your comment regarding Amirov, I haven't noticed a single poster "blame" Dubas or use that draft pick as a negative. You should be ashamed of yourself for brining up Amirov, his cancer diagnosis and his passing in that context.


I could be wrong but I don't think Dubas was the GM when Kasperi Kapanen was acquired.

yup it was lou

 

[TheRumble]

Where did I mention that it was Dubas fault that Muzzin got injured? I posted the trades of the 1st and 2nd round Leaf draft picks moved since 2019 and the assets left in the organization.

Did you notice that Amirov or the draft pick used to draft Amirov was not mentioned because that was not the Leafs 1st round pick. I also didn't include others teams 1st or 2nd picks traded by Dubas, just the picks which is allotted to each team each season (ie: Leafs).

You should examine your life based on your comment regarding Amirov, I haven't noticed a single poster "blame" Dubas or use that draft pick as a negative. You should be ashamed of yourself for brining up Amirov, his cancer diagnosis and his passing in that context.


I could be wrong but I don't think Dubas was the GM when Kasperi Kapanen was acquired.

Muzzin left the organization due to injuries which is nobody's fault. If you're gonna list that as a departure, you might as well list Amirov as wasted asset as well since he also left the organization due to injury.