Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

[arso40]

I think whatever money they can scrape up should be used for that FA Defense.

Hopefully, one that doesn't end up on LTIR within weeks of the season start.
Imagine this team without XXXXXX right now?

Sure, be great if they could land two(2) 2nd. pairing defenders, but I doubt they'll have the Cap.

It would be a huge win if Treliving could land a first pairing defender, even a lower case one.

Who would you trust to protect the lead late in a game out of the current core of defenders?

Rielly and lily right now as it stands are my two guys over the boards

Brodie averaged 22.5 minutes a game over his entire 10 year career in Calgary and played all situations. That's not a 3rd pair D man

His last year he was on the third pair that’s a fact I was watching Calgary games my friend and I can tell you weren’t you looked at average ice time he went from top pair with gio to the third pair Anderson was gio partner and it was hanifan and buddy from he island that plays for ottawa now im pretty sure

 

[Ciao]

Speaking of GM's ...

Now for some levity.

https://www.cbc.ca/sportslongform/entry/half-a-century-without-the-cup-the-maple-leafs-and-their-50-year-drought

Henderson: After the 1974 season, the WHA came after me and offered me some really good money. I didn’t want to jump to the WHA because I had never won the Stanley Cup. But the Toronto Toros offered me twice the money, a five-year contract and a significant signing bonus. I was debating whether to go or not.

I phoned Frank Mahovlich, who had signed with the Toros, and asked him for advice and he said to me that I was prophetic. He said, "Paul, if you want to win the Stanley Cup, then you’d better get away from Toronto because with Harold Ballard, the Maple Leafs will never win the Cup again." That’s the reason I jumped to the WHA.

When Ballard found out somehow that I was seriously thinking of jumping to the WHA, he phoned my agent [Alan] Eagleson to have a meeting. Our negotiation was so slow.

We went to the Hot Stove Lounge at Maple Leaf Gardens. He told us, "you sure don’t deserve that money but I’m not losing any more players to this WHA. So here’s a five-year contract. You don’t deserve it but here it is. Sign the contract." I looked at him, and he had no class whatsoever. I leaned forward and I told Harold, "take this contract and shove it up your arse." He picked up the table, threw it over and stumped out of the room. That was the end for me.

What a way to go, Paul

 

[Ciao]

Did you ever think he has a high winning percentage due to the amount of star power on the team? You put Keefe behind the teams Brophy and Maloney coached and he'd be just as bad.

No, not really.

There's lots of bad coaches that screw up really good teams, and good coaches that get a lot out of bad teams.

I wouldn't surmise or take it for granted what one coach would have done with another team.

If it's all about the roster, then Shanahan, Lamoriello and Dubas must have done one heck of a good job because the teams Keefe has coached are head and shoulders above the rest.

Coaching, management or players? I think it's all of the above.

By any standard, Sheldon Keefe is not the worst Leafs coach ever, which is the point I'm responding to here.

 

[NMacrules]

No, not really.

There's lots of bad coaches that screw up really good teams, and good coaches that get a lot out of bad teams.

I wouldn't surmise or take it for granted what one coach would have done with another team.

If it's all about the roster, then Shanahan, Lamoriello and Dubas must have done one heck of a good job because the teams Keefe has coached are head and shoulders above the rest.

Coaching, management or players? I think it's all of the above.

By any standard, Sheldon Keefe is not the worst Leafs coach ever, which is the point I'm responding to here.

Really? They are currently in 11th place. That means 10 teams are better than the leafs, certainly not head and shoulders above the rest.

 

[Ciao]

Really? They are currently in 11th place. That means 10 teams are better than the leafs, certainly not head and shoulders above the rest.

The rest of the Leafs teams.

The statement was that Keefe is the worst Leafs coach ever, which is not the case.

 

[NMacrules]

The rest of the Leafs teams.

The statement was that Keefe is the worst Leafs coach ever, which is not the case.

We will have to respectfully disagree.

 

[Ciao]

We will have to respectfully disagree.

Okay.

 

[saffronleaf]

he's awful

worst gm in the league

 

[Lemontree]

It's going to take a while to clean up the mess that the former GM left here. Rebuilding of the D core will need to take place in the off-season, thank god Brodie's contract is over at the end of this season.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

It's going to take a while to clean up the mess that the former GM left here. Rebuilding of the D core will need to take place in the off-season, thank god Brodie's contract is over at the end of this season.

The mess that the former GM left was a team that tied for 4th place and had around 17 million in cap space, and the clean up process so far has been to turn that into a team that's mediocre at best. All while doubling down on the same core and extending Dubas' coach

 

[Dekes For Days]

Dubas had 7 yrs to fix the D and never did..

5 years, and he did. Both Muzzin and Brodie especially were massive additions for us.
Defensive ranking:
2016-2017: 25th
2017-2018: 25th
----------------------
2018-2019: 23rd
2019-2020: 16th
2020-2021: 6th
2021-2022: 3rd
2022-2023: 11th
----------------------
2023-2024: 20th

We really needed some type of replacement for Muzzin this offseason (even a lesser version to fill a top-4 spot), and Treliving replacing a bunch of our defensively strong forwards with defensively weak forwards at the same time we inserted youth certainly didn't help.

Brodie was not a top pair guy

Brodie was a #2D for a decade on two different teams.

His last year he was on the third pair that’s a fact I was watching Calgary games my friend and I can tell you weren’t you looked at average ice time he went from top pair with gio to the third pair Anderson was gio partner and it was hanifan and buddy from he island that plays for ottawa now im pretty sure

Calgary had a rather deep defense that year and spread the minutes around more, including scaling back Brodie's special teams time, but Brodie was in no way a 3rd pairing defenseman. They occasionally shuffled up partners, but he played the most - by far - with Giordano that year, on the top pairing, and he was still a 20+ minute defenseman eating up 18+ ES minutes a game with good results.

 

[thewave]

11.5m and NMC for 8 years is not a good job.

 

[horner]

Sammy Kampf and Brodie talking a huge step back added to our defensive wows and loses.

Sammy and Kampf treliving couldn't have forecasted that.
Brodie we were hoping it was a one of in the playoffs.

What we have found out is that we need at least one top 4 dman and find another Benoit

TDL
Middleton
for
3rd rd pk + Robertson

Mo Hakanpaa
Middleton Ljiligren
Benoit McCabe

Treliving now knows what we have in the system

All of these players could be with the big club in 1 or 2 yrs
Forwards
Cowen problem next yr
Minten probably next yr
Holmberg finally showing what he can do
McCann finally showing what he can do
Grebyonkin
Tverberg

Defensemen
Niemela
Kokkonen

Goal
Hildeby

 

[hotpaws]

The mess that the former GM left was a team that tied for 4th place and had around 17 million in cap space, and the clean up process so far has been to turn that into a team that's mediocre at best. All while doubling down on the same core and extending Dubas' coach

so your telling me if Dubas was still here Gio and Brodie wouldn't look washed , Sammy wouldn't look like an echl'er and Tavares wouldn't be skating/playing like he should be earning 4m per ?

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Absolutely and I think that's the case. We need to wait for Tavares to go regardless. But I also think we need move Marner's money elsewhere.

We should spend this year and next trying to stockpile some tradeable assets ready for the 25/26 push. Although I acknowledge it's easier said than done.

Like I mentioned last year I would like to see Jakob C from Sens in our D lineup .. he would give us a solid #2 guy to anchor a 2nd pair who is big fast nasty and has a decent shot too .. he could help us for many years too .. and he fits well with Lily's skills

Rielly ?????
Jakob Lily
McCabe ?????

then Brodie is one placeholder and Gio/Timmer 2nd placeholder .. likely easier to get a 3rd pair guy who fits da role

 

[Apex Predator]

so your telling me if Dubas was still here Gio and Brodie wouldn't look washed , Sammy wouldn't look like an echl'er and Tavares wouldn't be skating/playing like he should be earning 4m per ?

No becuase Dubas wouldn’t have cursed them since he’s still here.

 

[arso40]

5 years, and he did. Both Muzzin and Brodie especially were massive additions for us.
Defensive ranking:
2016-2017: 25th
2017-2018: 25th
----------------------
2018-2019: 23rd
2019-2020: 16th
2020-2021: 6th
2021-2022: 3rd
2022-2023: 11th
----------------------
2023-2024: 20th

We really needed some type of replacement for Muzzin this offseason (even a lesser version to fill a top-4 spot), and Treliving replacing a bunch of our defensively strong forwards with defensively weak forwards at the same time we inserted youth certainly didn't help.

Brodie was a #2D for a decade on two different teams.

Calgary had a rather deep defense that year and spread the minutes around more, including scaling back Brodie's special teams time, but Brodie was in no way a 3rd pairing defenseman. They occasionally shuffled up partners, but he played the most - by far - with Giordano that year, on the top pairing, and he was still a 20+ minute defenseman eating up 18+ ES minutes a game with good results.

Fair enough 3rd pair is a stretch but……

 

[Dekes For Days]

Fair enough 3rd pair is a stretch but……

I mean, w/w/o stats can be a bit problematic without the deployment context (and I'm not sure why the 2nd one is evaluating Brodie by his offensive production), but I don't think anybody would argue against the fact that Giordano was the better player. He was a Norris winner. But Brodie was still a high-end defensive player that fit exactly what we needed, and he's been awesome for us.

 

[arso40]

I mean, w/w/o stats can be a bit problematic without the deployment context (and I'm not sure why the 2nd one is evaluating Brodie by his offensive production), but I don't think anybody would argue against the fact that Giordano was the better player. He was a Norris winner. But Brodie was still a high-end defensive player that fit exactly what we needed, and he's been awesome for us.

He was awesome for us the mighty have fallen but the stat was to show you that without gio he’s numbers fell suggesting he was the holl to gios muzzin and they reunited them cause as much as gio and hamilton were amazing the other pairs fell off significantly but I say that to say we didn’t need Brodie we needed tanev that’s the truth though Brodie did a great job he shouldn’t have been the primary target we paid Brodie more for a job that tanev was perfect for shoulda fired dubas years ago tre would never make that mistake

 

[TheDoldrums]

Bertuzzi overpaid
Domi meh
Kampf brutal
Reaves lol
Catastrophic decline in team defense

Treliving is doing an absolutely terrible job so far, I honestly don't see how its debatable.

Someone in the GDT said Nylander will be the worst contract in the league. I definitely don't agree with that, but its funny that the easy counter to that is another Treliving special with Huberdeau.

 

[LeafalCrusader]

Remember that summer Dave Nonis lost to a potato? Think Brad did the same thing lol.

 

[Apex Predator]

Bertuzzi struggling this poorly is interesting. He follows the path of other players the play his style but don’t succeed here. He will leave after this season and have a bounce back wherever he goes. The question we have to ask is why these type of players come here and fade away during the season.

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

It's funny that the "better" roster on paper had the same issues in the playoffs as the current roster does today. Couldn't hold leads, inconsistent offense going long stretches of scoring no more than 2 goals, and poor zone breakouts.

I didn't mind the gamble on the new secondary pieces, but keeping Keefe was clearly a mistake.

 

[saffronleaf]

Ruined the Flames and now the Leafs. Worst GM in the league.

On track to snap the Leafs' 7 year playoffs streak. Putrid.

 

[4thline]

Wakey wakey Tre .. we can't skate at speed with Bruins and we can't outwork Panthers .. we gotta a major problem to fix if we want to advance in playoffs .. fix da d*men D Tre .. if you don't you and shanny are both gone with new admin coming in .. fixing our D is da only path forward to give us any playoff success .. we need 2 BIG FAST and NASTY dmen .. one of whom can move a puck .. we can't be a 1 man D with Rielly only

Maybe we tried and they wouldn't come, but
Rielly-Soucy
Graves-Liljegren
McCabe-Brodie

was easily doable under the cap this year and moving forward