Player Discussion Brad Marchand IV - CONFIRMED signed 8 years @ 6.125/yr

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

The examples you came up with where not accurate at all IMO.

Claude Lemieux? Guy was 6'1", 215. He just looked smaller when he was turtling from Neely.

Avery? He wishes he was as talented as Marchand.

Morrow, Callahan, and Brown played more like power forwards than agitators. Morrow scored 33 goals at the age of 32 and played a much more physical game than Marchand (give and take). Is there supposed to be a cautionary tale there because I see the opposite. Brown scored 33 at 23, then 28 at 26 and it was downhill every year after that. Callahan never score 30 (29 at age 26 was his high).

I just don't see the similarities between Marchand and the guys you rolled out. I'm not sure he gets 37 again, but I could see 30-33 for the next 3-4 years.

comparisons are never an exact science... lemieux was considered better defensively than these other guys. linsman was a center playmaker... vrbeek a 4 time 40 goal scorer and a ppg player

its very hard to find exact comparisons...

guys like backes are 6'2 and 225 and up... this is powersize in nhl... this tends to allow guys to succeed until 35 and more

the guys on my list are mostly under 6 feet... mostly under 200. some might try to be more physical than marchand but all our considered rats. these guys chirp... aggitate... stick... thats their game

when they arent creating chaos they dissapear

vrbeek would draw over 200 pm a year... hes prob the most talented name on this list... probably too talented to be included. i dont include theoren fleury either.

marchand doesnt have fleurys high end offensive game

marchand is an opportunist scorer that throws the opposition off their focus and then capitalizes with a nice shot and quick feet

the other guys on my comparable list arent elite offesive dynamos either but create opportunity through being pain in the butt

morrow did have that high goal total buy then... poof

marchand will be 29 as he begins his next contract... 35 by the time a 6 year deal expires. 36 by the time a 7 year deal expires

i think it makes more sense to us to give him 8 mill per year for 4 years than it does 6 for 6 years.

to me hes worth alot of money the next 3 seasons but after that i fear he will be like these other guys

 

[DKH]

comparisons are never an exact science... lemieux was considered better defensively than these other guys. linsman was a center playmaker... vrbeek a 4 time 40 goal scorer and a ppg player

its very hard to find exact comparisons...

guys like backes are 6'2 and 225 and up... this is powersize in nhl... this tends to allow guys to succeed until 35 and more

the guys on my list are mostly under 6 feet... mostly under 200. some might try to be more physical than marchand but all our considered rats. these guys chirp... aggitate... stick... thats their game

when they arent creating chaos they dissapear

vrbeek would draw over 200 pm a year... hes prob the most talented name on this list... probably too talented to be included. i dont include theoren fleury either.

marchand doesnt have fleurys high end offensive game

marchand is an opportunist scorer that throws the opposition off their focus and then capitalizes with a nice shot and quick feet

the other guys on my comparable list arent elite offesive dynamos either but create opportunity through being pain in the butt

morrow did have that high goal total buy then... poof

marchand will be 29 as he begins his next contract... 35 by the time a 6 year deal expires. 36 by the time a 7 year deal expires

i think it makes more sense to us to give him 8 mill per year for 4 years than it does 6 for 6 years.

to me hes worth alot of money the next 3 seasons but after that i fear he will be like these other guys

The only problem is if Marchand has any brains he's going to ask for 7-8 years at 7-8 M

Why not - he's got the Bruins by the balls

 

[DKH]

I hope so. Sign the kid now .

?- how many seasons has Brad Marchand scored more than 60 points

A- 0

It could get real ugly is they pay him $7+M and he's scoring 25ish goals and God help him if he slew foots again

I'd suck it up and go 6/42 but I would try really hard to get away from 7 or 8 years

If he'd take 5 yrs I would even make the entire thing a NMC

I can see why this is complex - he's negotiationing off a year that is so far out of his norm

 

[GloryDaze4877]

comparisons are never an exact science... lemieux was considered better defensively than these other guys. linsman was a center playmaker... vrbeek a 4 time 40 goal scorer and a ppg player

its very hard to find exact comparisons...

guys like backes are 6'2 and 225 and up... this is powersize in nhl... this tends to allow guys to succeed until 35 and more

the guys on my list are mostly under 6 feet... mostly under 200. some might try to be more physical than marchand but all our considered rats. these guys chirp... aggitate... stick... thats their game

when they arent creating chaos they dissapear

vrbeek would draw over 200 pm a year... hes prob the most talented name on this list... probably too talented to be included. i dont include theoren fleury either.

marchand doesnt have fleurys high end offensive game

marchand is an opportunist scorer that throws the opposition off their focus and then capitalizes with a nice shot and quick feet

the other guys on my comparable list arent elite offesive dynamos either but create opportunity through being pain in the butt

morrow did have that high goal total buy then... poof

marchand will be 29 as he begins his next contract... 35 by the time a 6 year deal expires. 36 by the time a 7 year deal expires

i think it makes more sense to us to give him 8 mill per year for 4 years than it does 6 for 6 years.

to me hes worth alot of money the next 3 seasons but after that i fear he will be like these other guys

Then don't (make comparisons)...

Last year, Marchand (I'm sure at he urging of the B's) got away from the agitating for the most part...and scored 37 goals.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

Then don't (make comparisons)...

Last year, Marchand (I'm sure at he urging of the B's) got away from the agitating for the most part...and scored 37 goals.

when we dont learn from history we are doomed to repeat.

theres always exceptions to rules but in general, long term deals are risky.

history shows us the greatest success for long term deals is when superstars get them. guys who will one day be in the hof almost always earn their contracts. exceptions occur with guys like lecavilier who have injuries or guys like yashin who stop giving a damn...

we also know that signing very good players in that 22-23-24 age range often is a good idea. marchands last deal looked rich when he signed it but was a bargain... bergerons second contract was very aggressive but became a steal...

after these 2 catagories... long term deals get scary

goalies are a hit and miss even at 4 years. less than 50% of starting goalies can string together 3 good seasons in a row. guys like brobovsky or fleury or bishop can be considered vezina candidates one year... and crap the next...

the big forward that doesnt throw 3 bodychecks every single game tend to be worth their money into their mid to late 30s. you cant teach size and most these guys never relied on their speed. a jarome iginla type is an example... but you need superior size

or great hands

we see guys like mark recchi any ray whitney stay effective because they know how to avoid contact... get position... and have very very good hands.

will marchand trek like these guys? he will need to abandon his agitator style... adapt a style that is less about speed and more about smarts...

are his hands good enough? last season was his biggest success by about 20% more than he ever did before. is marchand a 40 goal scorer or a 50 point guy?

if he becomes his career norm 50 point guy but no longer agitates... is 6 mill a blackhole cap hit?

i love marchand... like i loved lucic... they both remind me of terry oreilly. oreilly was another guy who looked great at 30 and was done by 33...

these are my favorite players but history teaches us that long term deals for these guys usually hurt a team bad

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

The only problem is if Marchand has any brains he's going to ask for 7-8 years at 7-8 M

Why not - he's got the Bruins by the balls

hes borderline a very special player... he should have had 40 last year. and hes probably the best pest in the league.

lucic proved he was worth the money... even though we were afraid to pay there was a market. i think marchand will get at least 6 by 6 on the market too.

not sure if hes 7-8 because i think the cap isnt going to increase and i think chicago and la both see the damage done with their 10 mill deals.

the stamkos deal probably indicates teams want 7-8 for the leagues 20-30 best elite guys and everyone else will need to slot down ino 6-7 range again

in my gut i hope marchand sticks... i hope we contend this year. if we contend hes worth it.

i would have gone rebuild... sweeny and neely chose to contend. now i cross my fingers they pull it off.

the one thing i fear is ending up mediocure. we already had two 17th place finishes. the worst possible spot and we did it twice. a team with bergeron and rask will have a hard time finishing bottom 5... if guys like marchand and krecji are here too a bottom 5 finish seams impossible.

if we are a playoff team thats ok... keep these guys... go for it...

but if we are rebuilding for 3- 4 years time im not sure we shouldnt be trading guys like chara krecji and marchand now

 

[Brewins]

hes borderline a very special player... he should have had 40 last year. and hes probably the best pest in the league.

lucic proved he was worth the money... even though we were afraid to pay there was a market. i think marchand will get at least 6 by 6 on the market too.

not sure if hes 7-8 because i think the cap isnt going to increase and i think chicago and la both see the damage done with their 10 mill deals.

the stamkos deal probably indicates teams want 7-8 for the leagues 20-30 best elite guys and everyone else will need to slot down ino 6-7 range again

in my gut i hope marchand sticks... i hope we contend this year. if we contend hes worth it.

i would have gone rebuild... sweeny and neely chose to contend. now i cross my fingers they pull it off.

the one thing i fear is ending up mediocure. we already had two 17th place finishes. the worst possible spot and we did it twice. a team with bergeron and rask will have a hard time finishing bottom 5... if guys like marchand and krecji are here too a bottom 5 finish seams impossible.

if we are a playoff team thats ok... keep these guys... go for it...

but if we are rebuilding for 3- 4 years time im not sure we shouldnt be trading guys like chara krecji and marchand now

I know it would/couldn't happen, but i wonder if there is a deal to be made for a team like chicago for chara+spooner/Pasta++ for Keith. Chara is still very valuable for a win now team, pasta/spooner are cost effective offensive players to supplant kane and toews while hossa slows down maybe a first to help restock the pool or a few more developed prospects like vatrano/senyshyn. A d with high potential should go back. Maybe chiller/lauzon?

Chicago gets to rejuvenate their prospect pool a little while alienating cap issues and staying competitive for a few more years.

Hjalmerson-Chara
Seabrook-Campbell
Tvr-Chiller

Bruins get that #1 d who is young enough to be effective while the youth come in, but old enough to help supplant bergy/krejci/marchy

63-37-
39-46-88
Heinen-Backes-Hayes/Czarnik
Nash-Moore-Hayes/Czarnik/Accari

Keith-Krug

Mcq-morrow/russel/idk

Killer-Gryz/morrow/FA

A true #1 minute eater could really help, our d is still weak but we have a true number one.

Not saying chicago would do it but maybe cap issues force them to, maybe im insane and nothing would work for a subban/doughty.hedman/vlassic type.

Maybe if burns outprices himself from SJ but he is a defensive liability imo.

 

[sarge88]

I hate the fact that I can't get away from thinking that moving him for a legit, young, potential top 2 defenseman, is the best long term move Sweeney can make.

And, I don't think too many people out there have been more supportive of Marchand than me.

I just think that forwards, even very, very good ones are easier to replace.

 

[PB37]

The only problem is if Marchand has any brains he's going to ask for 7-8 years at 7-8 M

Why not - he's got the Bruins by the balls

I would offer him 6 years/6.875 mill per - the same terms Bergeron has left on his deal.

 

[Fierce1]

I don't even want to get into the numbers of it anymore, Sweeney just needs to be successful in getting Marchand signed, (sign and) trade him for a D and move forward with the season. He just can't drag this stuff on threw the entire season.

 

[DKH]

I don't even want to get into the numbers of it anymore, Sweeney just needs to be successful in getting Marchand signed, (sign and) trade him for a D and move forward with the season. He just can't drag this stuff on threw the entire season.

Takes two to tango or in Marchand's case tangle

Veddar bang on with term & money

Give him the nmc if you have to - he is getting better and his mind programming clearly looks to succeed and not be stopped

I would think of butterflies and ice cream but if you have to bend over and take 7/6 yrs where the sun don't shine I do it but over 6 years and getting near 8 M for a love able agitator who's likely a 60 point guy nearing 30 is tough and probably why not done

I do think if they give him 6/40 AND control of those last three years he takes it - I would

 

[GloryDaze4877]

when we dont learn from history we are doomed to repeat.

theres always exceptions to rules but in general, long term deals are risky.

history shows us the greatest success for long term deals is when superstars get them. guys who will one day be in the hof almost always earn their contracts. exceptions occur with guys like lecavilier who have injuries or guys like yashin who stop giving a damn...

we also know that signing very good players in that 22-23-24 age range often is a good idea. marchands last deal looked rich when he signed it but was a bargain... bergerons second contract was very aggressive but became a steal...

after these 2 catagories... long term deals get scary

goalies are a hit and miss even at 4 years. less than 50% of starting goalies can string together 3 good seasons in a row. guys like brobovsky or fleury or bishop can be considered vezina candidates one year... and crap the next...

the big forward that doesnt throw 3 bodychecks every single game tend to be worth their money into their mid to late 30s. you cant teach size and most these guys never relied on their speed. a jarome iginla type is an example... but you need superior size

or great hands

we see guys like mark recchi any ray whitney stay effective because they know how to avoid contact... get position... and have very very good hands.

will marchand trek like these guys? he will need to abandon his agitator style... adapt a style that is less about speed and more about smarts...

are his hands good enough? last season was his biggest success by about 20% more than he ever did before. is marchand a 40 goal scorer or a 50 point guy?

if he becomes his career norm 50 point guy but no longer agitates... is 6 mill a blackhole cap hit?

i love marchand... like i loved lucic... they both remind me of terry oreilly. oreilly was another guy who looked great at 30 and was done by 33...

these are my favorite players but history teaches us that long term deals for these guys usually hurt a team bad

Just when I thought the comparisons couldn't get any worse.

Terry O'Reilly? Seriously?

First, I hate comparing players from different eras. Guys from the 70's drank beer and smoked in between periods. Hmmmm...do you think maybe that contributed to them falling off after the age of 30?

Second, I'm going to say that Marchand and Taz are probably the two most dissimilar players you have come up with yet. O'Reilly was over 6 ft and 200 pounds, he routinely had 200+ PIM's per season, and he was one of the least skilled successful players in the NHL I have ever watched. He couldn't skate and he had OK hands. With 24 it was all about drive and effort.

Marchand on the other hand, has a great shot, is one of the better skaters in the league (balance and speed), and has very good hands. He rarely fights and has been (knock on wood) one of the more durable B's since he came into the league. I would have to look it up, but he's probably missed more games to suspensions than injury? You are going out of your way with these comparisons to paint a picture of a player that is nearing a steep decline in production based on his style of play. The only problem is...he doesn't play the style you are trying to say will contribute to his downfall. He's not O'Reilly or Lucic (another awful comparison), who are fighting and giving out 200+ hits a year (and receiving that many as well).

Just stop, because he's not the guy you are portraying him to be.

 

[BruinDust]

Just when I thought the comparisons couldn't get any worse.

Terry O'Reilly? Seriously?

First, I hate comparing players from different eras. Guys from the 70's drank beer and smoked in between periods. Hmmmm...do you think maybe that contributed to them falling off after the age of 30?

Second, I'm going to say that Marchand and Taz are probably the two most dissimilar players you have come up with yet. O'Reilly was over 6 ft and 200 pounds, he routinely had 200+ PIM's per season, and he was one of the least skilled successful players in the NHL I have ever watched. He couldn't skate and he had OK hands. With 24 it was all about drive and effort.

Marchand on the other hand, has a great shot, is one of the better skaters in the league (balance and speed), and has very good hands. He rarely fights and has been (knock on wood) one of the more durable B's since he came into the league. I would have to look it up, but he's probably missed more games to suspensions than injury? You are going out of your way with these comparisons to paint a picture of a player that is nearing a steep decline in production based on his style of play. The only problem is...he doesn't play the style you are trying to say will contribute to his downfall. He's not O'Reilly or Lucic (another awful comparison), who are fighting and giving out 200+ hits a year (and receiving that many as well).

Just stop, because he's not the guy you are portraying him to be.

I'd say it's time for the "well this player/player type fell off at such-and-such an age, so assume a similar player will fall off at the same age" comparisons to stop altogether. We go through the same debate with Backes, same debate with Eriksson.

Newsflash, every player/person is different. Different genetics, different styles, different development curve, different etc. etc. etc. Way to many factors at play to make these types of comparisons when projecting out future performance.

 

[Fierce1]

Takes two to tango or in Marchand's case tangle

Veddar bang on with term & money

Give him the nmc if you have to - he is getting better and his mind programming clearly looks to succeed and not be stopped

I would think of butterflies and ice cream but if you have to bend over and take 7/6 yrs where the sun don't shine I do it but over 6 years and getting near 8 M for a love able agitator who's likely a 60 point guy nearing 30 is tough and probably why not done

I do think if they give him 6/40 AND control of those last three years he takes it - I would

I agree it's not easy, Marchand is so important to this team, it just can't be summed up in his goals and assists. He's learned so much I think from Bergeron and from being brought up in Julien's system. He's a clutch player and he comes to play almost every game. Obviously there is a number that Sweeney just won't/can't swallow but if we can't get Marchand done it'll put a massive monkey wrench into Sweeney's re-build.

 

[BruinDust]

I would offer him 6 years/6.875 mill per - the same terms Bergeron has left on his deal.

I like the idea of having Marchand's deal end the same time as Bergeron's.

But if you want him to take 6 years your not getting it at 6.85. If I'm his agent the minute Sweeney brings up the Bergeron deal signed 3 years ago as a comparable I'd laugh at him.

If he takes anything less than the Krejci extension (6 years, 7.25 per) I'd be shocked. Matter of fact I'd give him that deal in a heartbeat.

 

[Ladyfan]

I like the idea of having Marchand's deal end the same time as Bergeron's.

But if you want him to take 6 years your not getting it at 6.85. If I'm his agent the minute Sweeney brings up the Bergeron deal signed 3 years ago as a comparable I'd laugh at him.

If he takes anything less than the Krejci extension (6 years, 7.25 per) I'd be shocked. Matter of fact I'd give him that deal in a heartbeat.

I would as well.

 

[EverettMike]

This board underrates Brad Marchand.

 

[kdog82]

After the World Cup of Hockey, Marchand may price himself out of Boston. Sweeney is an idiot. This extension should have been completed a long time ago.

Marchand playing with Crosby and Bergeron at this tourney will only increase his annual salary.

Sweeney will probably trade him for a rugged dman, because its just so Bruins.

This organization makes me shake my head sometimes.

 

[DKH]

This board underrates Brad Marchand.

Agree

Underrates Marchand

Overrates Hamilton

 

[Seidenbergy]

This board underrates Brad Marchand.

Pretty sure every home town player gets underrated when it comes to contract time, but then is immediately overrated when it comes to potentially trading them.

 

[DKH]

I agree it's not easy, Marchand is so important to this team, it just can't be summed up in his goals and assists. He's learned so much I think from Bergeron and from being brought up in Julien's system. He's a clutch player and he comes to play almost every game. Obviously there is a number that Sweeney just won't/can't swallow but if we can't get Marchand done it'll put a massive monkey wrench into Sweeney's re-build.

Sadly he goes into a slump 80% of the posters will turn on him. If Evander Kane is going well they can dig up the annual Marchand and a first for Kane

 

[jgatie]

Agree

Underrates Marchand

Overrates Hamilton

I wonder how much of this is due to Julien hate? Marchand flies in the face of so much Claude criticism: He's not a plugger; yet he was willing to start as a 4th liner and earn his way up. He was given a chance as a youngin' to prove himself, he did, and was rewarded. He's a two way beast while also being top 10 in scoring. He's a PIA with questionable off and on-ice antics, yet Claude obviously loves him.

Everything Claude haters hate about Claude is laid to waste with mentioning one name: Brad Marchand.

 

[EverettMike]

I wonder how much of this is due to Julien hate? Marchand flies in the face of so much Claude criticism: He's not a plugger; yet he was willing to start as a 4th liner and earn his way up. He was given a chance as a youngin' to prove himself, he did, and was rewarded. He's a two way beast while also being top 10 in scoring. He's a PIA with questionable off and on-ice antics, yet Claude obviously loves him.

Everything Claude haters hate about Claude is laid to waste with mentioning one name: Brad Marchand.

I'm going to say zero percent.

 

[bearcountry17]

If Marchand scores ~25 goals, ~50 points next year, the crowd screaming at Sweeney to sign him now will be berating him over getting manhandled in negotiations with Marchand's camp.

I really hope Marchy either A: understands he can't be paid long term for what he did in an outlier year or B: is willing to go into next year without a contract and prove it wasn't a fluke.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I'm going to say zero percent.

Yeah, I don't think this has anything to do with CJ. If he's underrated, it's because people still continue to see him as a "pest", and ignore all the other stuff he does as a player.