Blues Trade Proposals Part 4

[Alklha]

I'll never understand the obsession that some STL fans have with Kulemin. I watch a lot of TOR games - I just don't see why we should be interested in him (is it because you want to give Tank a Russian teammate?).

He is like a less-versatile version of Alex Steen. His PPG production basically mirrors that of Steen as a Maple Leaf (albeit Kulemin is now a couple of years older than when we stole Steen), his defensive game is excellent and he fits our game perfectly. Whoever gets him out of Toronto will be as happy as are that we got Steen.

There isn't anything I'd move straight up for him though. After what Stewart has shown, he has a good bit more value than Kulemin right now.

I like the idea of trading for Stastny, and using Berglund as the centerpiece of a deal (whether dealing him to COL, or using a 3rd team to facilitate).

I don't think Colorado would want Berglund as a centrepiece. Tough to find a third team to facilitate such a deal, because they'll likely want to get Stastny instead of Berglund!

I think Jackman will stay with Pietrangelo, so anyone will get will play with Shattenkirk, unless it is a clear top pairing player.

I think we could do a Perron-Stastny deal and a Berglund-Giordano deal. Stastny's playmaking abilities would make up for Perron's.

Assuming Steen is healthy, and we add Lehterä (or even Arnott I guess...) then I'd be really happy with that as well. There has to be a bit more of a safety net at C.

Colorado are looking for either a winger of partner for EJ. Perron is by far the best fit we have to what they are looking for, and we get a playmaking C out of it. Again, we'd need to be certain that Stastny is willing to take something like $5m long term before we go for that though.

 

[Honeycutt]

You listed 3 LWers, so that would be top 9, and we'd have Giordano too.

McDonald-Stastny-Stewart
Schwartz-Backes-Oshie
Sobotka/D'Agostini-Steen-Tarasenko
Sobotka/Porter-Nichol-Reaves

Giordano-Pietrangelo
Jackman-Shattenkirk
Cole-Polak

That is a top lineup.

Put Russell in for Cole and i am on board.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

You listed 3 LWers, so that would be top 9, and we'd have Giordano too.

McDonald-Stastny-Stewart
Schwartz-Backes-Oshie
Sobotka/D'Agostini-Steen-Tarasenko
Sobotka/Porter-Nichol-Reaves

Giordano-Pietrangelo
Jackman-Shattenkirk
Cole-Polak

That is a top lineup.

So you want a declining/injury prone 35, turning 36, year old winger on our first line? A rookie who is undersized on the 2nd line? And then either a player all of us have called many times, the most useless player on our main roster, or a fringe 3rd/4th line player (I love Sobotka but his offensive skills are absolute trash.) playing with a player who's prominent role is LW and a rookie who is new to this culture and game play on our 3rd line?

If McDonald continues to play like he has and doesn't get signed for next season, or continues to get injured. Do you understand what our LW depth looks like? Schwartz 1st line, Dagostini 2nd and Sobotka 3rd.

All for a player who hasn't hit 60 points in 3 years and has been said by many Avs fans that he is on the decline?

 

[veganhunter]

What would the price on Berglund be? Does Winnipeg have anything minus Ladd, Kane, Wheeler, Enstrom, Byfuglien, Bogo, Schiefele, Trouba, Lowry, or our 1st round pick that could get him?

 

[Captain Creampuff]

What would the price on Berglund be? Does Winnipeg have anything minus Kane, Wheeler, Enstrom, Byfuglien, Bogo, Schiefele, Trouba, Lowry, or our 1st round pick that could get him?

So are we supposed to just give Berglund to you for your scraps?

 

[Alklha]

So you want a declining/injury prone 35, turning 36, year old winger on our first line? A rookie who is undersized on the 2nd line? And then either a player all of us have called many times, the most useless player on our main roster, or a fringe 3rd/4th line player (I love Sobotka but his offensive skills are absolute trash.) playing with a player who's prominent role is LW and a rookie who is new to this culture and game play on our 3rd line?

If McDonald continues to play like he has and doesn't get signed for next season, or continues to get injured. Do you understand what our LW depth looks like? Schwartz 1st line, Dagostini 2nd and Sobotka 3rd.

All for a player who hasn't hit 60 points in 3 years and has been said by many Avs fans that he is on the decline?

Our need at C is greater than our need on LW, particularly going forward. If we added another C then we can also move Steen back to LW.

As for the production of Stastny, it can't be completely dismissed, but lets remember that he hasn't had a half decent winger since Chris Stewart broke his wrist/hand and was then traded. If he was still around a PPG producer then we'd have no chance of getting him at such a modest cost. We have a lot of talented young wingers in the team and nearing the NHL, I don't see any reason why Stastny wouldn't be at least a 65 point player here.

 

[veganhunter]

So are we supposed to just give Berglund to you for your scraps?

No not all I was wondering if there was any interest in Little, Burmistrov, Hainsey etc. I certainly wouldn't call those guys scraps.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

Our need at C is greater than our need on LW, particularly going forward. If we added another C then we can also move Steen back to LW.

As for the production of Stastny, it can't be completely dismissed, but lets remember that he hasn't had a half decent winger since Chris Stewart broke his wrist/hand and was then traded. If he was still around a PPG producer then we'd have no chance of getting him at such a modest cost. We have a lot of talented young wingers in the team and nearing the NHL, I don't see any reason why Stastny wouldn't be at least a 65 point player here.

The problem is finding a center to move Steen to LW. If it were that easy, we would have done it already. So say Stastny gets a 65 point season. What happens when Perron plays on a line with Duchene and racks up 70+ points? Again, this makes us so unbelievably weak one the left side and our wingers aren't that great to begin with.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

No not all I was wondering if there was any interest in Little, Burmistrov, Hainsey etc. I certainly wouldn't call those guys scraps.

I wouldn't call them scraps either. But if a center is going one way, we need a top line center coming back. But if we were to make lateral moves I'm not going to say I really know that much about Jets players other than the ones you listed as untouchables.

Sorry if I came off as rude though, just long frustrating day so far. And if the Blues play tonight like they have been lately, it will surely get longer and even mrore frustrating.

 

[SirPaste]

So are we supposed to just give Berglund to you for your scraps?

He never mentioned Burmistrov, would love to get him here.

 

[veganhunter]

I wouldn't call them scraps either. But if a center is going one way, we need a top line center coming back. But if we were to make lateral moves I'm not going to say I really know that much about Jets players other than the ones you listed as untouchables.

Sorry if I came off as rude though, just long frustrating day so far. And if the Blues play tonight like they have been lately, it will surely get longer and even mrore frustrating.

No worries I probably should have noted those guys rather than just creating a big list of untouchables. If a top line centre is a need coming back then the Jets don't have anything like that to give up as our centre depth is rail thin. Unless of course you consider a slightly washed up Olli Jokinen with a bloated 2 year contract a top line centre .

 

[Captain Creampuff]

No worries I probably should have noted those guys rather than just creating a big list of untouchables. If a top line centre is a need coming back then the Jets don't have anything like that to give up as our centre depth is rail thin. Unless of course you consider a slightly washed up Olli Jokinen with a bloated 2 year contract a top line centre .

Haha no thanks

 

[Blue Goose]

Our need at C is greater than our need on LW, particularly going forward. If we added another C then we can also move Steen back to LW.

As for the production of Stastny, it can't be completely dismissed, but lets remember that he hasn't had a half decent winger since Chris Stewart broke his wrist/hand and was then traded. If he was still around a PPG producer then we'd have no chance of getting him at such a modest cost. We have a lot of talented young wingers in the team and nearing the NHL, I don't see any reason why Stastny wouldn't be at least a 65 point player here.

The problem is finding a center to move Steen to LW. If it were that easy, we would have done it already. So say Stastny gets a 65 point season. What happens when Perron plays on a line with Duchene and racks up 70+ points? Again, this makes us so unbelievably weak one the left side and our wingers aren't that great to begin with.

Agreed, and here's the great catch-22 with this deal: I think Stastny would be a great fit with Perron on his left, so I'd hate for DP57 to be in the deal to COL.

However, If we DO keep Dags, I like having him on the LW (but for the record, I still think he should be used in a trade to land us a solid veteran LD like Tallinder or Klesla).

 

[Alklha]

The problem is finding a center to move Steen to LW. If it were that easy, we would have done it already. So say Stastny gets a 65 point season. What happens when Perron plays on a line with Duchene and racks up 70+ points? Again, this makes us so unbelievably weak one the left side and our wingers aren't that great to begin with.

65 points isn't exactly his ceiling though. Of course Perron could go to Colorado and light it up with Duchene, but a 65 point centre still more valuable than a 70 point winger, particularly to us.

Admittedly, it does leave us somewhat exposed on the LW in the short term. However, going into next season we could have Schwartz, McDonald and Steen for that role and there is a pretty good chance Jaškin will be knocking on the door very quickly so we wouldn't be relying on McDonald for very long.

You can't overlook the fact that a playmaking C is going to improve the wingers that end up on his line as well. We have light at the end of the tunnel on LW is we made a deal like this... there isn't any light beyond Lehterä at centre...

No not all I was wondering if there was any interest in Little, Burmistrov, Hainsey etc. I certainly wouldn't call those guys scraps.

The biggest drawback I have with Burmistrov is that he isn't very good at faceoffs and his offensive potential is somewhat questionable. He is a very impressive player to watch, I'm just unconvinced he'd be worth the price to acquire.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

65 points isn't exactly his ceiling though. Of course Perron could go to Colorado and light it up with Duchene, but a 65 point centre still more valuable than a 70 point winger, particularly to us.

Admittedly, it does leave us somewhat exposed on the LW in the short term. However, going into next season we could have Schwartz, McDonald and Steen for that role and there is a pretty good chance Jaškin will be knocking on the door very quickly so we wouldn't be relying on McDonald for very long.

You can't overlook the fact that a playmaking C is going to improve the wingers that end up on his line as well. We have light at the end of the tunnel on LW is we made a deal like this... there isn't any light beyond Lehterä at centre...

Jaskin plays RW if I'm not mistaken. Also highly unlikely we would run with 3 rookie wingers (well I know Tarasenko and Schwartz would be in their 2nd year, but still are both not ready for as many minutes as they would get).

Stastny would only help Stewart's and Tarasenko's production, Oshie never really gets set up sort of does his own thing with his work ethic to score goals and set other people up, and Schwartz is a playmaker and don't expect more than 25 goals at his peak (but could very well be a 50-60 assist guy). Also imagine what Stastny could do with both Perron AND Stewart on a line together, that is what a first line should look like and moving Backes to #2C is what your 2nd line should look like.

And I think we can't rely on McDonald as it is now. We'll see when he comes back though because he somehow always looks better after coming back from an injury.

 

[Jzk]

Jaskin plays RW if I'm not mistaken. Also highly unlikely we would run with 3 rookie wingers (well I know Tarasenko and Schwartz would be in their 2nd year, but still are both not ready for as many minutes as they would get).

Stastny would only help Stewart's and Tarasenko's production, Oshie never really gets set up sort of does his own thing with his work ethic to score goals and set other people up, and Schwartz is a playmaker and don't expect more than 25 goals at his peak (but could very well be a 50-60 assist guy).

And I think we can't rely on McDonald as it is now. We'll see when he comes back though because he somehow always looks better after coming back from an injury.

Jaskin plays both wings.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

Jaskin plays both wings.

Still would rather keep Perron and move Berglund if we are acquiring a #1C. No reason for 3 good centers, one playing 3rd line when your 3rd line would be brutal. That way when Jaskin does come up lines could look anywhere like this

Perron-Stastny-Stewart
Schwartz-Backes-Oshie
Jaskin-Steen-Tarasenko

rather than

Steen-Stastny-Stewart
Schwartz-Backes-Oshie
Jaskin-Berglund-Tarasenko

Excluded McDonald because I don't see him on the team after this year and Jaskin would be a viable option over him immediately anyway.

 

[Alklha]

Jaskin plays RW if I'm not mistaken. Also highly unlikely we would run with 3 rookie wingers (well I know Tarasenko and Schwartz would be in their 2nd year, but still are both not ready for as many minutes as they would get).

Stastny would only help Stewart's and Tarasenko's production, Oshie never really gets set up sort of does his own thing with his work ethic to score goals and set other people up, and Schwartz is a playmaker and don't expect more than 25 goals at his peak (but could very well be a 50-60 assist guy). Also imagine what Stastny could do with both Perron AND Stewart on a line together, that is what a first line should look like and moving Backes to #2C is what your 2nd line should look like.

And I think we can't rely on McDonald as it is now. We'll see when he comes back though because he somehow always looks better after coming back from an injury.

Jaškin has played LW all year and has made it clear he is equally comfortable on both wings. He will almost certainly be LW in Peoria next year considering our options at RW are looking like they will be pretty deep.

Tarasenko will be ready for the minutes. He has been playing in a mens League for 4 and a half years prior to this, once he gets camp and pre-season next season then he won't remotely be comparable to Schwartz in those terms.

I honestly can't believe we are discussing that our need at W is more pressing than our need at C. If we could move Berglund in a deal for Stastny instead, then that is obviously preferable, I just think it is more unlikely.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

Jaškin has played LW all year and has made it clear he is equally comfortable on both wings. He will almost certainly be LW in Peoria next year considering our options at RW are looking like they will be pretty deep.

Tarasenko will be ready for the minutes. He has been playing in a mens League for 4 and a half years prior to this, once he gets camp and pre-season next season then he won't remotely be comparable to Schwartz in those terms.

I honestly can't believe we are discussing that our need at W is more pressing than our need at C. If we could move Berglund in a deal for Stastny instead, then that is obviously preferable, I just think it is more unlikely.

I just believe that with Perron, Stastny, and Stewart on a line together, each player could hit 70 points. However if we moved Perron instead of Berglund I could only see a boost in Stewart's production for maybe a 60-65 point season and same with Stastny.

You don't need 3 spectacular lines to win games. If your first line can get a least a point (which I believe they would) every night you don't need to rely on that 3rd as much, but even then our 3rd line would be Jaskin/McDonald-Steen-Tarasenko which would IMO accumulate more points than a Jaskin-Berglund-Tarasenko line would.

You have an oustanding first line, a shutdown 2nd line that 2/3 of the players could be 60 point players while who knows what playing on that line for a full season could do for Schwartz point-wise and a 3rd line that 2/3 of the players could hit 60 points, not sure how Jaskin's rookie year production would go but I think we could count on possibly 25 points playing half the season and 30 from McDonald playing the other half.

 

[EastonBlues22]

Hard to imagine the Blues would be willing to pay the price it takes for Stastny (in terms of real money and assets to acquire).

The fact that he's a UFA after next season certainly doesn't help either.

 

[Captain Creampuff]

Hard to imagine the Blues would be willing to pay the price it takes for Stastny (in terms of real money and assets to acquire).

The fact that he's a UFA after next season certainly doesn't help either.

Berglund+conditional 1st if he resigns. But I'm sure if Stastny was made available they would have better offers but who knows if another team would give up the assets and money for him either.

 

[DatDude44]

I have no idea what it would take. But i would love to get Brendan Dillon. He seems to be exactly what were looking for in a partner for petro and is very very cost friendly. Big, solid, not totally offensively gifted but is smart with the puck and can make good quick passes/decisions with the puck. I KNOW Dallas isn't looking to move him. But still i wonder what it would take.

 

[PocketNines]

Perron and Stewart are on 60 point paces now.

 

[Alklha]

I just believe that with Perron, Stastny, and Stewart on a line together, each player could hit 70 points. However if we moved Perron instead of Berglund I could only see a boost in Stewart's production for maybe a 60-65 point season and same with Stastny.

You don't need 3 spectacular lines to win games. If your first line can get a least a point (which I believe they would) every night you don't need to rely on that 3rd as much, but even then our 3rd line would be Jaskin/McDonald-Steen-Tarasenko which would IMO accumulate more points than a Jaskin-Berglund-Tarasenko line would.

You have an oustanding first line, a shutdown 2nd line that 2/3 of the players could be 60 point players while who knows what playing on that line for a full season could do for Schwartz point-wise and a 3rd line that 2/3 of the players could hit 60 points, not sure how Jaskin's rookie year production would go but I think we could count on possibly 25 points playing half the season and 30 from McDonald playing the other half.

I'm not disagreeing with you, moving Berglund for him is certainly the preferable option, I just don't think is would be hugely realistic.

If the come back and say "Perron or no deal!" you would walk away?

Hard to imagine the Blues would be willing to pay the price it takes for Stastny (in terms of real money and assets to acquire).

The fact that he's a UFA after next season certainly doesn't help either.

Depends on the assets cost. The $ cost is only for next season, and could be absorbed by how we structure the RFA contracts. Any deal for Stastny would need to revolve around the fact he is willing to sign a long term deal in the summer at around $5m. Big salary drop, but in line with his production drop and he'd be coming home and to a young team looking to contend. I don't think it would be unrealistic.

 

[DatDude44]

Perron and Stewart are on 60 point paces now.

lol I know. I feel like you and I are the only ones that realize what would happen to this team if perron was gone. you can't win a cup with only grit in your lineup. YOU NEED SKILL ALSO!!! not to mention what our LW depth would look like without him.