Post-Game Talk: Blue Jackets @ Rangers | 1/19/20

[Maximus]

i'm glad I missed this one. Sheesh. PLEASE beat the Isles on tuesday, 10 days is a long time to sit on 2 bad losses.

I'm not saying it can't or won't happen but if we actually beat the Islanders again for the 3rd time in 10 days, I think besides the board exploding due to all the Islander fans going absolutely postal, one would think keeping sharp objects away from anyone part of their fan base would be a savvy move as well...they are not going to be able to handle the fact they lost 3 straight games to us...they just won't.

Seriously, it will be epic if we could pull this off. And with Georgie who is no question "Islander kryptonite", it's very possible we will pull of the hat trick.

Can't wait for Tuesday as it's going to be very intense and it's going to be another great learning experience for our young pups who better get used to this shit cause this is the way it's going to be down the road as the team gets better and better.

 

[Anthony5967]

Well....the positive tonight, two of them--Igor is going to be very good, I think, and tonight proved that I shouldn't be suckered/fooled into thinking they have a legitimate playoff shot. ALL SALES FINAL come February 24. Strome, Kreider, Skjei...GONE. Thanks.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

I'm not saying it can't or won't happen but if we actually beat the Islanders again for the 3rd time in 10 days, I think besides the board exploding due to all the Islander fans going absolutely postal, one would think keeping sharp objects away from anyone part of their fan base would be a savvy move as well...they are not going to be able to handle the fact they lost 3 straight games to us...they just won't.

Seriously, it will be epic if we could pull this off. And with Georgie who is no question "Islander kryptonite", it's very possible we will pull of the hat trick.

Can't wait for Tuesday as it's going to be very intense and it's going to be another great learning experience for our young pups who better get used to this **** cause this is the way it's going to be down the road as the team gets better and better.

It definitely can happen and I'm hoping for trifecta.

 

[UnSandvich]

Sorry man and no offense but firing Quinn is ridiculous and it obviously won't happen at least at this point in time. Your not the only one who has publicly stated this and I've yet to hear a good reason why he should be gone. Now if we miss the playoffs next year, that's an entirely different conversation but for now, Quinn is doing what he was hired to do.

Is the team not performing pretty much exactly as was expected before the season? Did anyone seriously think we were a playoff team? Other than Lias are our kids not performing as expected? Even tho Kakko hasn't done as well as we hoped, does anyone doubt that with an intense offseason training regiman that will improve his skating and his stamina, that he won't be much more of a factor next season?

Is our goaltending not primed to be pretty much elite for the next decade with Shesty/Georgie after the King retires?

Do we not have trade chips like Kreider and possibly even Georgie to not add even more pieces? Do we not have as exciting a team that we've ever had in recent memory?

So what exactly hasn't Quinn done that makes him expendable and that a Gallant or Laviollette would do better? I'm serious, I don't get some of the hate for Quinn...I really don't. Maybe I'm just dense but I think he's done a good job and has done what he was hired to do which was to help develop our young pups and keep the team moving in an upwards trajectory as we go thru the final stages of the rebuild.

To me, Quinn has done the job he was hired to do and in no way should the thought of him being fired be even considered. I have a strong hunch JD and Gorton agree with this line of thinking...lol

You list a whole bunch of reasons that have little to do with Quinn, and far more to do with the front office doing a good job. My counter is this:

What has he directly done to help the young kids? Kakko is overwhelmed and flailing, borderline failing. Howden sucks and is force fed minutes. Hajek sucked and was force fed minutes. Chytil's looked okay, but he also looked okay under AV, and he's not putting up the points that he was expected to at the start of the season. Lindgren has been a warm body essentially the whole time he's been up, not BAD, but just kinda there. The Lias fiasco.

Who has taken a meaningful step forward under Quinn? Buch? Same old Buch. DeAngelo? I guess maturity, but his defense still sucks, and that's coming from a fan. Zibanejad is about the only meaningful guy, but how much of that is just natural progression?

Meanwhile we've ranked pretty consistently across Quinn's tenure at the very bottom of the league analytically. We've been carried by exceptional goaltending, that's masked Quinn's poor job actually deploying the team and lines. Not to mention his incredibly inconsistent policy of benching some players for a single bad play, and allowing others to consistently torpedo the team. The team has consistently appeared unprepared for opponents over the past 2 years. We are tied for 3rd in the league for bench penalties this season, and are tied for 2nd over his tenure.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

agreed. But, we don't really have anyone to replace him. And with everyone in this thread demanding we trade Kreider, Buchnevich, Strome.... who the **** are we going to dress at forward? Still a lot of games to go.

Anybody from Hartford like Nieves, DiGiuseppe, Beleskey, Gettinger, Lettieri.

 

[Whoot Whoot]

What did DQ say in his post game? Any comment about the Strome play?

 

[Maximus]

You list a whole bunch of reasons that have little to do with Quinn, and far more to do with the front office doing a good job. My counter is this:

What has he directly done to help the young kids? Kakko is overwhelmed and flailing, borderline failing. Howden sucks and is force fed minutes. Hajek sucked and was force fed minutes. Chytil's looked okay, but he also looked okay under AV, and he's not putting up the points that he was expected to at the start of the season. Lindgren has been a warm body essentially the whole time he's been up, not BAD, but just kinda there. The Lias fiasco.

Who has taken a meaningful step forward under Quinn? Buch? Same old Buch. DeAngelo? I guess maturity, but his defense still sucks, and that's coming from a fan. Zibanejad is about the only meaningful guy, but how much of that is just natural progression?

Meanwhile we've ranked pretty consistently across Quinn's tenure at the very bottom of the league analytically. We've been carried by exceptional goaltending, that's masked Quinn's poor job actually deploying the team and lines. Not to mention his incredibly inconsistent policy of benching some players for a single bad play, and allowing others to consistently torpedo the team. The team has consistently appeared unprepared for opponents over the past 2 years. We are tied for 3rd in the league for bench penalties this season, and are tied for 2nd over his tenure.

So are you saying you don't like the trajectory that the team is on and that a coaching change is in order?

Do you blame Quinn for Kakko not being in shape due to his not having time for an offseason training regimen due to his participation in the world tournaments he was in besides his playing in the elite Finnish league he was in?

Why is Quinn to blame for Buch not progressing and being more consistent?

No offense but if you think Chytil has just been "OK" than I'd argue you haven't been watching him alot. His lack of points belie the fact that he's constantly forcing play, he's been extremely unlucky and he might be the best two way player on the team.

Why is DeAngelo lumped into the same category with Buch? Tony D has emerged as probably a Top 10 offensive dman in the entire league. Does Quinn not get some credit for that and putting him in the best position to succeed as in putting him on #1 PP instead of Trouba who was originally there?

Does Quinn not any credit at all for our goaltending being so good this year? Does Quinn and his system he has employed which has allowed Panarin to morph from a point a game player to one of the top 5 offensive threats in the sport...does he not get any credit for that?

Does Quinn not get any credit for figuring out that Chytil rather than Strome as the #2 center was a better fit and that Strome alongside Bread was the best way to make uses of his skills.

Does Quinn not get any credit for putting Fox and Lemieux in the best positions to succeed to the point where both players look like integral pieces of the teams future going forward?

I mean I can go on but I'll stop. The point being, the positives that have gone on here since Quinn has come on board far far far outway any of the perceived negatives. I'm not saying your not correct that our slow starts in some games are'nt concerning....they are.

I'm not saying Quinn hasn't' gotten outcoached in some games this year...he has with tonight vs Torts a good example.

But overall, he's done what he was hired to do which was get this rebuilding very very young team on winning trajectory to where the teams future is very bright indeed.

How do you fire a guy like that? The answer is you don't. Now like I also said, if the Rangers somehow don't make the playoffs for example next year which should be an absolute expectation from all....management thru the fan base, than we maybe are having a different conversation about Quinn's future.

But unless something like that happened and I truly doubt this team of ours won't be playoff bound next year, his job should be safe and if anything I wouldn't be surprised if he was extended which would probably really throw the anti-Quinn folks in a full tizzy...lol

 

[ohbaby]

That one stings

Understatement of the year. What was perhaps our best defensive effort of the season, was inexcusably thrown away with seconds left...
To throw away such a strong effort of backchecking, good tight gaps, and collapsing/protecting the middle,... only to fall asleep with the game not over yet, was not just disappointing, it was pathetic. Had we gone on to overtime, we would have had a very valuable point or two.

This game was very meaningful for all the wrong reasons. You could say it was a microcosm of how our season has gone. Take two steps forward, then one step back. We have had only one 3 game win streak this entire season. At this rate, we don't nearly deserve a playoff spot.

We let this one slip away. Valuable points left on the table. And a great effort wasted.

Tearing the Isles a new A-hole next game will not take the sting away from this disaster.

 

[Thirty One]

What did DQ say in his post game? Any comment about the Strome play?

Yeah, he said it was a really bad change. He didn't mention Strome's name, just said F3.

 

[Stasis]

HANK shouldn't have a choice. Eli has won two super bowls and he didn't have a choice. Hank has won nothing! Regular season wizards don't get a choice.

Shouldn't and won't are two very different things, though. What I want isn't what will occur necessarily. In this case there's very little chance of it happening. The organization simply will NOT do Hank like that and any decent-term Rangers fan should know it. So what I've done is simply express what has a higher chance of happening. Would I love to have a Georgie/Shesty tandem for a cup run? Of course! That's a dream. But the reality is that we're not at all ready and won't be before both of them are commanding decent salaries and wanting to be a starter. We can't keep both. Not how it works. Want to keep both for now, for fun? Sure. If Hank accepts to hang them up and take a job in the org (and we do know he'll get his $8.5M from them one way or another, for sure) somewhere... long long shot but maybe. Maybe he opts to ride out this off-season. I doubt it, but maybe. Even then, we're still stuck with the issue that both of our young studs want to be starters and can be starters.

Losing Hanks $8.5M helps us a LOT when trying to re-sign some guys this off-season, for sure. I wouldn't hold my breath on it, though. And if he DOES stick around through next season, then Georgie is a goner whether we like it or not. If he hangs them up, we get 2 years of affordable Shesty/Georgie tandem. Not a lot. One way or another we're parting with one of them before we're a contender.

It's a tricky situation right now.

And whether Hank had won something or not wouldn't influence what happens at all. I feel like I shouldn't need to even say that. Hockey =/= Football. Not to mention you literally just said someone who wins championships doesn't get a choice, so in your world it's a given that someone who hasn't won one doesn't either. Why mention it at all?

I want him to retire mate. I really do. He's riding more pine than he ever has. He's worse than he's ever been and has two better younger guys sharing games with him. That's as close as the org is going to get to saying "hang 'em up, bud". I hope he does but he's still talking like he has a lot more to give and wants to. I WISH he would see that retiring would really help us moving forward. It's literally the best thing he could for us. $8.5M off the books at a crucial cap junction when he's very obviously not going to be playing much and isn't going to win a cup. Would be the right move for the team. Not sure he's capable.

 

[Maximus]

It definitely can happen and I'm hoping for trifecta.

Dude as I said it would be epic if we could pull off the hat trick. With the Islanders being 3-7 in their last 10 games and with Georgie possibly being in their heads as he's been fantastic vs them this year and last, this is probably as good a time as any to try and pull off the trifecta.

Going to be fun come Tuesday night...can't wait!!

 

[Kaapo Bustfreniere]

Overreactions aside, I guess everyone is going to ignore them playing with really good structure basically all night. They made two mistakes and CBJ made them pay for it twice.

That's the way it goes sometimes.

So much this.

Doesn't make it any less frustrating though. Still angry at Strome. Not at the coach though. I really thought we played very well overall.

 

[ohbaby]

I spoke earlier, of the Rangers great defensive effort just being thrown away due to a fatal unforgiveable lapse. But before that happened, all I could think about is how well our goalie of the future looked. He is gonna be a star. The likes we have never seen before. We have never had a goalie that is excellent handling the puck, making outlet passes. He will garner assists. Plus his poke checking is incredible. 4 times tonight he broke up quality chances with his stick. Add that to his great glove hand and catlike reflexes, I can clearly say, we might get along without Georgie. I rather not lose him, but I think we will survive without him. I wouldn't have said this yesterday. Shesty really impressed me tonight. I should reserve my judgement until I see a few more breakaways, but I was that impressed with his skills.

 

[Maximus]

Shouldn't and won't are two very different things, though. What I want isn't what will occur necessarily. In this case there's very little chance of it happening. The organization simply will NOT do Hank like that and any decent-term Rangers fan should know it. So what I've done is simply express what has a higher chance of happening. Would I love to have a Georgie/Shesty tandem for a cup run? Of course! That's a dream. But the reality is that we're not at all ready and won't be before both of them are commanding decent salaries and wanting to be a starter. We can't keep both. Not how it works. Want to keep both for now, for fun? Sure. If Hank accepts to hang them up and take a job in the org (and we do know he'll get his $8.5M from them one way or another, for sure) somewhere... long long shot but maybe. Maybe he opts to ride out this off-season. I doubt it, but maybe. Even then, we're still stuck with the issue that both of our young studs want to be starters and can be starters.

Losing Hanks $8.5M helps us a LOT when trying to re-sign some guys this off-season, for sure. I wouldn't hold my breath on it, though. And if he DOES stick around through next season, then Georgie is a goner whether we like it or not. If he hangs them up, we get 2 years of affordable Shesty/Georgie tandem. Not a lot. One way or another we're parting with one of them before we're a contender.

It's a tricky situation right now.

And whether Hank had won something or not wouldn't influence what happens at all. I feel like I shouldn't need to even say that. Hockey =/= Football. Not to mention you literally just said someone who wins championships doesn't get a choice, so in your world it's a given that someone who hasn't won one doesn't either. Why mention it at all?

I want him to retire mate. I really do. He's riding more pine than he ever has. He's worse than he's ever been and has two better younger guys sharing games with him. That's as close as the org is going to get to saying "hang 'em up, bud". I hope he does but he's still talking like he has a lot more to give and wants to. I WISH he would see that retiring would really help us moving forward. It's literally the best thing he could for us. $8.5M off the books at a crucial cap junction when he's very obviously not going to be playing much and isn't going to win a cup. Would be the right move for the team. Not sure he's capable.

Well said my brother. I'm with you, don't see Hank simply retiring tho it would be in the best interests of the team. He is so competitive which is the reason he's going to be inducted into the Hall of Fame the second he is eligible, he still thinks he can perform well enough to win hockey games.

And he probably is right...he still has the skills to win games and important games but not for us. We simply don't have the defensive system in place to support him and he's not as great as he used to be where he could stand on his head and win games despite no support at all. Oh and yeah we have two other goalies who are better than him at this point.

So what I'm hoping and praying for is that seeing he won't retire, is that some unknown team(hello Colorado) who is poised to make a Cup run but may think their goaltending might need a boost for this Cup run approaches Gorton and says they are interested in acquiring Hank. Gorton than has a chit chat with Lundy and he explains the situation and maybe just maybe Hank decides that winning a Cup is more important than finishing his career with us.

That's the only scenario which I see is plausible other than him simply staying here and which would be a win/win for all concerned. So what we should all hope for is for Grubauer to continue to be inconsistent and Sakic finally making the call to Gorton...one can hope...

 

[Cmox]

I spoke earlier, of the Rangers great defensive effort just being thrown away due to a fatal unforgiveable lapse. But before that happened, all I could think about is how well our goalie of the future looked. He is gonna be a star. The likes we have never seen before. We have never had a goalie that is excellent handling the puck, making outlet passes. He will garner assists. Plus his poke checking was awesome. 4 times tonight he broke up quality chances with his stick. Add that to his great glove hand and catlike reflexes, I can clearly say, we might get along without Georgie. I rather not lose him, but I think we will survive without him. I wouldn't have said this yesterday. Shesty really impressed me tonight.

Igor’s movement are top notch. He really reads plays well and he’ll only get better from here on out. The goalie supposed to be the best skater on the team and he’s showing us. I’m trying to place who he reminds me of and I really can’t. He does have elements of Quick’s style but he’ll end up being his own. Pretty exciting.

 

[bobbop]

Who has taken a meaningful step forward under Quinn?

Fox, DeAngelo, Lindgren

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

playoff teams don't lose games like tonight.

Small nitpick. Every team that has ever existed loses games like this. They just win a lot more of the other games if they're really good

 

[ohbaby]

The goalie supposed to be the best skater on the team

Never heard this before. And it's funny because I saw him trip over himself tonight on one play. CBJ forward saw that, and shot at a bad angle to take advantage. But Shesty was quick to recover and hugged the post.

Are you sure it's not, the goalie is suppose to be the best stick handler? Cause then I would agree.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Everyone has losses like this. Even the upper crust like Boston, St. Louis etc. Tampa Bay lost to the f***ing Devils 2-1. We weren't going to win out and i'm kind of tired of people on here going ape shit after every loss.

 

[ohbaby]

When is Quinn gonna sit Kakko. I mean honestly. He is dragging Chytil and Howden. Lemiuex is back. Time to sit Kakko for a couple of days. Give him a rest, let him think about things. He is not contributing anywhere on the ice. If there was one thing he was doing well, then yeah, leave him be. But this is not the case. Maybe the All Star break will re-energize him.

Edit: some are still dealing with the flu. Quinn said Buchy was sick. Maybe Kakko is too. But if not....

 

[Maximus]

Small nitpick. Every team that has ever existed loses games like this. They just win a lot more of the other games if they're really good

In the context of what I said, sure all teams lose games like this...that's obvious but what I was eluding too and I thought I made it clear, is that this year where this team of ours is very inconsistent, is so inexperienced and the closing out of games suspect as indicated by tonight, next year the Rangers will likely be a much more improved team that in all likelihood wouldn't have lost this game and at worst would have figured out a way to have at very worst gotten a point out of it by getting into OT instead of getting no points.

Make sense? If not, not sure what else I can tell ya.

 

[Ola]

Heartbreaking loss.

I think we nitpick give-aways at times. But I know that pretty comprehensive research (i) show that give-aways ultimately vary very little from player to player, and (ii) occur on a regular basis and are deemed to be very hard to do anything about. Its certainly a confirmation bias risk regarding giveaways. When Lidström made one its "wow even he makes them" and then Poti makes one and its "f***ing f*** f*** f*** p***y". Like a risky play results in a giveaway and we all of course attribute it to the risk taken by the player, but when you try to explain the data, its not hard to think of examples were the safe play resulted in a gaffed play and a giveaway. We value them differently.

I do think its a much bigger problem that we as a team give up a 3 on 2 at that point. Its more illustrative and something that shouldn't happen and that we have a few goto player that doesn't do well. Ziba is a big guy and since he doesn't sit back a bit he won't balance the play the same way smaller quicker guy will. I think Chytil does it fairly well, at the same time, he will certainly be better at it when he is 28-32 y/o than he is now. Not bad, but definitely not good/great either. Strome irks me more though. He kind of disappears too often.

 

[Larrybiv]

our PP was brutal

Literally non existent. Can't remember one decent chance.

 

[Larrybiv]

I cant actually say where I saw the refs miss a call on them. Its rare, but can anyone honestly say they missed calls in this one?

I think I saw 1 or 2 possible interference calls and maybe a trip that we didn't go down. (Zbad?)

 

[Ghost of jas]

Reading this thread is more painful than the loss.