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Best player in the world: 2018

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Best player in the world: 2018

  • McDavid

    Votes: 142 69.3%

  • Giroux

    Votes: 2 1.0%

  • Kucherov

    Votes: 7 3.4%

  • Malkin

    Votes: 11 5.4%

  • MacKinnon

    Votes: 9 4.4%

  • Hall

    Votes: 3 1.5%

  • Kopitar

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Crosby

    Votes: 14 6.8%

  • Ovechkin

    Votes: 16 7.8%

  • Hedman

    Votes: 1 0.5%

  • Doughty

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Rinne

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Hellebuyck

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    205
  • Poll closed .
Toby91ca said:
Crosby was near the top of the league in scoring, was near the top of voting in the major awards and Ovechkin was not near the top of scoring or major awards.....the only argument you make is that Ovechkin scored more goals and was more physical. You mention they contributed the same on defense, which I won't bother arguing because you'll just talk about a Cdn media conspiracy and it really doesn't matter anyway.....Crosby did everything and won everything Ovechkin did except more....so I don't get the argument.
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The top handful of players can vary significantly year over year.

In 2017 it just so happened to be not an amazing year for top players. Same for 2014 and 2015. Same for 2016 with the exception of Patrick Kane.

2018 saw the emergence of Kucherov and MacKinnon, and some of the best seasons in years from veteran players - Malkin, Giroux, Hall, Kopitar, Ovechkin, and Wheeler. The fact that these things happened in the same season is mere happenstance. It doesn't reduce the quality of Ovechkin's contributions.

Evaluating top individual seasons in a vacuum invites arbitrary distinctions. Evaluating top seasons within the context of surrounding seasons provides a better context IMO.

Hall won the Hart but I could very easily argue that Ovechkin was the better player. I could also make a case for any of 9 or so players.

There was no clear #1 player in 2018. You have to remember this was before McDavid had any huge separation form the pack and his playoff contributions at that point in his career were jack squat.
 
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Video Nasty said:
I’m not going to downplay your momentum point. Things don’t exist inside a vacuum and it’s an argument I make myself plenty of times.

The problem is that you addressed nothing about defense and goaltending. We’ve seen better, more mature McDavid superhuman efforts crumble and go to waste, due to these things.
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What about defense and goaltending? Oilers in 2018 were not a good roster and they didnt play well. Defense and goaltending too, obviously, i dont disagree with that.

So if McDavid was scoring more and leading league in first half and despite that Oilers were way out of playoff race bc of bad goaltending/defense, id like McDavid's season more.

I dont think you'll have to look very far for a parallel. Oilers are off to a very rough start this season, and goaltending and defense has been really bad. McDavid himself is producing, but already far off league leaders for ppg and points (closer to ~10th or so). Not that dissimilar to 2018.

I fully expect McDavid to go supernova soon, put his team on his back (with Drai) and climb back up the standings. They'll win games despite poor goaltending/defense, or those facets will improve naturally as wins start to roll in.

I think McDavid maybe could have done a bit more of that in early 2018.

Best player - McDavid in 2018.
Best year/season, Kucherov.
 
Midnight Judges said:
It is solid evidence of significant bias.

It's not that Crosby is getting more votes than Ovechkin - it's that he got any votes at all - over Thornton and over Jagr especially. There is no thinking or rational basis behind that. It's simply "Crosby is my guy" and nothing more.
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I don’t disagree, but I’d argue the same for Ovechkin…which is why I suggest…who cares?
 
Toby91ca said:
I don’t disagree, but I’d argue the same for Ovechkin…which is why I suggest…who cares?
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Because again, Ovechkin had twice as good of a case for #1 in 2006 and got half the votes.

So it's not the same proportion of homerism.

And again, I voted for Jagr.
 
Midnight Judges said:
It's the other way around. Scoring was approximately 7% higher in 2018 relative to 2017. So this adjusts Crosby's season to be relatively better.
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Yes, we agree…scoring was higher in 2018 vs 2017….Ovechkin had similar (but less in more games) in 2018 vs 2017….so yeah, how is that an argument for Ovechkin having the better season?
 
daver said:
In 17/18, McDavid's PPG in games where he played under 21 minutes was 1.74 (61 points in 35 games), In 18/19, McDavid's PPG in games where he played under 21 minutes was 1.61 (42 points in 26 games).

I wonder if TOI has zero correlation with point totals because you play your star player less when you are winning?
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Don't those numbers suggest that icetime and offensive production are positively correlated? Icetime goes up, so does PPG. Also, if the team is winning they're probably scoring more (even if a star player's TOI is a bit lower).
 
Hippasus said:
Don't those numbers suggest that icetime and offensive production are positively correlated? Icetime goes up, so does PPG. Also, if the team is winning they're probably scoring more (even if a star player's TOI is a bit lower).
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No, it shows that in the games his TOI was lower than average his PPG was well above his average. His PPG in games he had over 21 minutes was close to a PPG. I.e. he played more time in games his team was losing, partly because he hadn't scored.
 
wetcoast said:
There is way too much focus on points here and not on the actual question.
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Not sure what you are trying to say here. The winner of each poll has generally been the points leader, not who should have been the points leader.
 
bobholly39 said:
Momentum is a real thing in hockey. By mid year Edmonton was already sucking and not gonna win games.

My issue with McDavids season is - lets use your own words. You say "he potted 54 points in final 33 games and Oilers were still 2 games under 500". Id have liked to see him pot 54 points in the first 33 games instead, where maybe his super strong plays leads to a win or a second and that momentum carries them to a better record than 2 games under 500 to start the year.

You're being too literal when you look at a 5-1 loss in october and say "even if McDavid scored 2 more goals they lose 5-3 so who cares". In an actual game - momentum. If in that 5-1 loss McDavid had set up 2 quick goals for Oilers to take a 2-0 lead, good chance momentum leads to a win vs a 5-1 loss

Best player in 2018 - McDavid (Kuch is close).

Mvp/hart? No way, not McDavid for 1.
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This is fair but then again some players start hot and then fade, sometimes it means something sometimes it doesn't.
 
Toby91ca said:
Yes, we agree…scoring was higher in 2018 vs 2017….Ovechkin had similar (but less in more games) in 2018 vs 2017….so yeah, how is that an argument for Ovechkin having the better season?
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Same points. More goals. More physical presence.

In any case those two seasons are quite similar in caliber.

TheGoldenJet said:
There is no good explanation for either Crosby or Ovechkin to be above Malkin this season.
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For Ovechkin there certainly is - he won a Conn Smythe and was much better than Malkin in the playoffs.
 
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norrisnick said:
Yeah. You don't actually have to be better. You just need more people to think you're better.
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Just like looking at points needs context reading your post needs context.

Simply saying that the guy that won the Art Ross or even Richard means less without context or a more complete look at the players and season.
 
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blundluntman said:
*steps in between the Crosby vs Ovi scuffle* But- but guys... What about Mackinnon?
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He had a great season, but had no business being in the conversation for "best player in the world", since he was playing at a 56 points pace for 300 games prior to his breakout year in 2018
 
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TheGuiminator said:
He had a great season, but had no business in being in the conversation for "best player in the world", since he was playing at a 56 points pace for 300 games prior to his breakout year in 2018
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I wouldn't say that's why he wasn't the best player that year but I was joking when I posted that. It's still McDavid for me
 
TheGuiminator said:
He had a great season, but had no business being in the conversation for "best player in the world", since he was playing at a 56 points pace for 300 games prior to his breakout year in 2018
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I think it depends on whether we want to look at it in terms of not knowing the following seasons or not. Personally I think it makes sense to use all the knowledge we have. We know in hindsight that MacKinnon has been elite since this year, so it’s clear it wasn’t an outlier. I think that’s more important than the seasons before. Not that I’d put him as the best regardless, but suppose he was the clear best player this season and the clear best player in the next 2-3 seasons as well. He would have be the best player starting this year, whether or not we were sure of it at the time due to his prior seasons.
 
bobholly39 said:
The insane thing is he ranks Sidney Crosby 6th all-time. That's higher than most people he bashes Crosby to probably.
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It's not insane at all.

Crosby is an all-time great player and it's based almost 100% on his actual offensive contributions.

There is no need to lie and claim he contributes a lot defensively. He doesn't and never has.

There is also no need to pretend he played more games or that he was somehow great in the 2016 playoffs, or that his 2014 season was anything other than an off year for the top players in the league.

There is also no need to minimize Malkin in order to pretend Crosby carried the team, yet that is obviously happening with a degree of regularity.

So yeah, I bash those ideas, but none of those ideas are coming from Sid. They're coming from overzealous fans. So this idea that I am bashing Crosby represents fundamental confusion.
 
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