News Article: Auston Matthews - August 1st., Contract Crickets

[Canadian Finn]

wait, so we are holding off on announcements because marner is getting married?

nothing makes sense to me anymore.

 

[Suntouchable13]

Matthews is a con man. I don’t believe him for a second that he “doesn’t plan on leaving the Toronto Maple Leafs”. He will drag this out into the season. something also doesn’t sit right with me when a player tries to milk every single penny out of an organization. He just wants to be paid the most money in the league. I don’t think he cares about winning in Toronto.

 

[Canadian Finn]

he doesn't care about winning anywhere.

he just cares about being paid.

 

[Stephen]

Marner is getting married at the end of the month, my guess is they wait to announce Matthews new deal. Matthews and Nylander will be at his wedding (I assume it’s somewhere in Canada) makes sense Matthews does a press conference some time after the wedding .

I have a hard time imagining they’d mix work obligations into a weekend wedding situation.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Who? Who are all these "people in the know" that have heralded Matthews leadership?

Management, coaching staffs, and most importantly, teammates - the ones he'd be leading.

And how is that. He was more involved 2 years ago. He NEVER displays on ice leadership except when he scores with his sword dance, arms spread to accept adulation.
Off ice, no signs of it.

I always laugh when people try to pretend they know about the leadership of a player, because 90% of what being a leader means isn't even visible to fans, but Matthews has shown a lot more than just scoring goals in that other 10%. Unfortunately, some people try to make determinations about leadership based on did their team win, but leadership is a lot more than that.

Who the hell cares about Matthews primary points as an older player. Sounds like something to justify the gap. McDavid signed after his second season, Matthews signed in his third season.

I was talking about their entire ELCs up to signing. They had the exact same primary points per game. McDavid signed after 2 years and Matthews signed after 2.5 years, so not a meaningful difference, and that's largely balanced out by the fact that due to injury, McDavid's second season was much more represented in his average than his first, while Matthews' rookie season was the most represented season in his sample. Primary point production is something that teams and players would "care about", and is just one of the many ways to show that the perceived gap through signing was exaggerated.

Secondly, Ovechkin also signed a contract that is now illegal, the same as Crosby. The contract had nothing to do with it.

The contracts had everything to do with it. It limited their number of signing moments, and pretty much the one signing moment Crosby had to surpass Ovechkin's AAV, he did his weird number 87 thing and instead added on more now illegal years to still guarantee him a certain amount of money.

Matthews got the biggest 5-year RFA contract in actual AAV, with full signing bonuses.

But that's irrelevant. Of course he did. Contracts go up over time with the cap. That's why you use cap hit percentage.

 

[leafan11]

I have a hard time imagining they’d mix work obligations into a weekend wedding situation.

My guess is there going to do a press conference when Matthews resigns , and he’s going to Marners wedding I’m just putting two and two together that it would make sense to announce the extension while he’s still in Toronto( assuming that’s where the wedding is ) but I could be wrong , I’m just guessing .

 

[Niagara Bill]

Management, coaching staffs, and most importantly, teammates - the ones he'd be leading.

I always laugh when people try to pretend they know about the leadership of a player, because 90% of what being a leader means isn't even visible to fans, but Matthews has shown a lot more than just scoring goals in that other 10%. Unfortunately, some people try to make determinations about leadership based on did their team win, but leadership is a lot more than that.

I was talking about their entire ELCs up to signing. They had the exact same primary points per game. McDavid signed after 2 years and Matthews signed after 2.5 years, so not a meaningful difference, and that's largely balanced out by the fact that due to injury, McDavid's second season was much more represented in his average than his first, while Matthews' rookie season was the most represented season in his sample. Primary point production is something that teams and players would "care about", and is just one of the many ways to show that the perceived gap through signing was exaggerated.

The contracts had everything to do with it. It limited their number of signing moments, and pretty much the one signing moment Crosby had to surpass Ovechkin's AAV, he did his weird number 87 thing and instead added on more now illegal years to still guarantee him a certain amount of money.

But that's irrelevant. Of course he did. Contracts go up over time with the cap. That's why you use cap hit percentage.

I am always amused when people like you say they know about leadership. I saw D Sittler be a leader, I saw Salming be a leader, I saw Armstrong, MacDonald, Stanley. My career is about leaders and leadership. AM has little leadership, he had more in first 3 years and even Dubas knew he was not a leader of men. Babcock knew he was not a leader, Lou knew.
Leadership is more than goals and points. Neither he or Mitchy are leader, Trottier was, Gillies was, Potvin was, Bossey was not. Pocket Rocket was, Rocket was not,
AM should get NO contract consideration for leadership.

 

[Squiffy]

My guess is there going to do a press conference when Matthews resigns , and he’s going to Marners wedding I’m just putting two and two together that it would make sense to announce the extension while he’s still in Toronto( assuming that’s where the wedding is ) but I could be wrong , I’m just guessing .

There's one of those quirks of English, huh? Reading that wondering why AM would quit. Re-sign... not trying to grammar police, just completely different meanings from basically the same word. Wierd language sometimes.

Flammable. Inflammable. Synonyms of course right?

 

[Stephen]

I am always amused when people like you say they know about leadership. I saw D Sittler be a leader, I saw Salming be a leader, I saw Armstrong, MacDonald, Stanley. My career is about leaders and leadership. AM has little leadership, he had more in first 3 years and even Dubas knew he was not a leader of men. Babcock knew he was not a leader, Lou knew.
Leadership is more than goals and points. Neither he or Mitchy are leader, Trottier was, Gillies was, Potvin was, Bossey was not. Pocket Rocket was, Rocket was not,
AM should get NO contract consideration for leadership.

I feel like Auston Matthews is a bit like Mario Lemieux. Kind of an unknowable, remote persona, gifted player who doesn’t like being jostled in the fray. Not a natural and easy leader but can lead by virtue of being the lead dog in terms of dominance. But he can also be very chameleon-like in his play style. Sometimes it’s power on power. Sometimes there’s a bite and fire to his game. Sometimes there isn’t. He’s defensively committed. But then he’s not to a catastrophic result. He’s physical and he’s not. It’s like he’s so gifted he can mime just about any play style. And he gets most into trouble the more he gets on that frequency with Mitch.

 

[francis246]

he doesn't care about winning anywhere.

he just cares about being paid.

I made that point in the other thread. Look at his history. He went to Switzerland to make money as a 17 year old (which isn’t a bad decision - I’d love to see more kids go pro).

I don’t think not signing Tavares would have saved us much on Matthews AAV.

In the other thread I pointed out that the Eichel contract was more than likely the comparable that both Matthews and Marner used. October 2017, Eichel signed an 8-year, $80 mill extension. Buffalo overpaid at the time and I think Matthews and Marner both got a hard on when they saw that. Both already were statistically better than Eichel, so my guess is they looked at that contract and knew their starting point would be 10 million.

 

[Dekes For Days]

I am always amused when people like you say they know about leadership. I saw D Sittler be a leader, I saw Salming be a leader, I saw Armstrong, MacDonald, Stanley. My career is about leaders and leadership. AM has little leadership, he had more in first 3 years and even Dubas knew he was not a leader of men. Babcock knew he was not a leader, Lou knew.
Leadership is more than goals and points. Neither he or Mitchy are leader, Trottier was, Gillies was, Potvin was, Bossey was not. Pocket Rocket was, Rocket was not,
AM should get NO contract consideration for leadership.

"Leadership" is not really a significant contract consideration for anybody, but both Matthews and Marner are leaders. You don't really know the leadership of any of these players.

 

[Canadian Finn]

this is the only thing mitchy is leading.

 

[egd27]

Literally none of that is true. Everybody that would know what kind of leader Matthews is speaks highly of him in that regard.

I know for a fact that is not true.

 

[The Apologist]

This fanbase is something special lol. Toxic doesn't even begin to describe it.

this is the only thing mitchy is leading.

Don't you normally go to Disney World after winning a championship?

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

There is no chance McDavid isn't the highest paid player in the league the next time he signs a contract. Discuss.

If he still has not won anything by the time he reaches UFA I would not be surprised he signs for less than the top guy (Matthews) in the salary game. He understands that a team needs to be built and will not want to become a guy who people question because he never won a cup like the other top 5 players. He would make a killing in Toronto in endorsements alone. He is smarter than people think.

 

[Stephen]

I know for a fact that is not true.

From a fan perspective, leadership can really only be demonstrated in 2 basic ways:

One is performative. So an outward display of emotional energy from an individual, whether that's standing up on the bench and verbally, gesturally communicating or an impressive physical exertion that then results in an uptick in performance by the whole team. Over simplifying but not that much more complicated.

Second is reputational. When certain guys are pointed out as leaders and their teams always have success on the ice, they shine in big moments under pressure. Reputational clutch, leadership, by example, whatever.

So if you're not expressive and your team doesn't really win... well, up to others to debate.

 

[Stephen]

If he still has not won anything by the time he reaches UFA I would not be surprised he signs for less than the top guy (Matthews) in the salary game. He understands that a team needs to be built and will not want to become a guy who people question because he never won a cup like the other top 5 players. He would make a killing in Toronto in endorsements alone. He is smarter than people think.

I think Matthews openness about maximizing contract dollars and gaming contract length kind of hurts him in ways that can only be quantified when looking back on his whole career. Seems like a lot of guys can play the virtue card for not being the most expensive house on the block and they all deal with their own shortcomings with a little less heat on them.

At $13.5 million AAV, as rumoured, I kind of wonder what the emotional benchmark for regular season production even is going forward? Of course playoffs are the only thing that matters... but it actually isn't. Spectacular regular season number can't compensate for playoff failure, but that also doesn't mean you're off the hook for producing spectacular regular season numbers. So the bigger the number Matthews demands, the bigger the numbers are expected out of him. Anyway, being the most expensive house on the block is not always a good thing.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

I think Matthews openness about maximizing contract dollars and gaming contract length kind of hurts him in ways that can only be quantified when looking back on his whole career. Seems like a lot of guys can play the virtue card for not being the most expensive house on the block and they all deal with their own shortcomings with a little less heat on them.

At $13.5 million AAV, as rumoured, I kind of wonder what the emotional benchmark for regular season production even is going forward? Of course playoffs are the only thing that matters... but it actually isn't. Spectacular regular season number can't compensate for playoff failure, but that also doesn't mean you're off the hook for producing spectacular regular season numbers. So the bigger the number Matthews demands, the bigger the numbers are expected out of him. Anyway, being the most expensive house on the block is not always a good thing.

I agree...I might add that IF McDavid signs for less than what people expect and ends up winning a cup...it's gonna look pretty bad on Matthews if he doesn't win one. I guess maybe AM doesn't care if people think of him as an all time great...the proof will be in the pudding as they say.

 

[Racer88]

"Leadership" is not really a significant contract consideration for anybody, but both Matthews and Marner are leaders. You don't really know the leadership of any of these players.

So if 90% of leadership is not know to the fans how do you know he is a leader……are you implying that you are not simply a fan but someone attached to the team?

 

[Racer88]

Then you either don't really have faith in him, or you're trying to justify that you know that he won't agree long-term to the Leafs.

Crosby had concussions and missed time. His injuries were far worse than Matthews. How many fans do you think said, "I don't want Sid with his wonky head"? If you're a supposed mega elite player, you persevere, overcome injury, compete, and win. Matthews is 25 years old and just entering his prime. Could you imagine saying you don't want a 25 year old Gretzky, Lemieux, Ovechkin, Jagr, Crosby, MacKinnon, Malkin, Bure, Kane, Draisaitl, Fedorov, Sundin, Forsberg, Stamkos, etc. long-term? Lmao.

We keep making all kinds of riddles, puzzles, and odd takes when it comes to Matthews when the issue truly is so simple...

He is a great player but he's soft, greedy, and not as great as the homers suggest. Matthews has a price. He will not be doing the Leafs any favors. Now it's time to decide if we can overpay him in a cap world and hope to fare better than we have the last 7 years (one playoff round win) due to his obsession with taking every possible penny on a short-term deal that only benefits him.

If you truly don't trust Matthews, his wrist, or his ability to win, then trade him today for an absolute haul when he's still 25 so another team can grossly overpay him for 8 years. But playing this tip-toe, walking on egg shells game with this kid every 4 years is nauseating and silly.


Who? Who are all these "people in the know" that have heralded Matthews leadership? Matthews is known for one thing -- scoring goals. His uncanny leadership must be the best kept secret in hockey history.

I’m not trying to justify anything and yes I have very little faith in him. He wants all the money and is not willing to do what ever it takes to get it. He is productive when the games are easier but will not do the hard work when the season is in the line.
He won’t even stand up for himself when Stamkos rag dolls him for Christ sakes. What an embarrassment.
I don’t think I could watch 8 more years of this guy

 

[Leaf Fans]

This fanbase is something special lol. Toxic doesn't even begin to describe it.


Don't you normally go to Disney World after winning a championship?

No, but you get paid for saying it.

 

[Squiffy]

Look, I appreciate the sentiment. We all desperately want a team friendly contract, but living in a fantasy world of the 60's where you hardball a guy to take or leave doesn't exist. He's going to get something about the value of one of the best players in the league, because he is.

I mean, I guess that's the argument right, is he one of the best? Just won a Hart, but 1 year ago is 1 year too many? Playoffs. Playoffs.

I don't see how you give up.

----------------

There is no chance McDavid isn't the highest paid player in the league the next time he signs a contract.

Discuss.

 

[Niagara Bill]

"Leadership" is not really a significant contract consideration for anybody, but both Matthews and Marner are leaders. You don't really know the leadership of any of these players.

If you think I don't know, I am sure you don't know.
They have shown to all, their failure to inspire in the playoffs, their failure to shine in the playoffs, their failure to be all in, in the playoffs.
In fact, it certainly appears they have even rejected Veteran leadership Dubas brought into the club.

 

[Dekes For Days]

I know for a fact that is not true.

No you don't.

So if 90% of leadership is not know to the fans how do you know he is a leader…

Because that's what the people who actually do know say.

They have shown to all, their failure to inspire in the playoffs, their failure to shine in the playoffs, their failure to be all in, in the playoffs.

No they haven't, and you've just exposed that you're attempting to judge "leadership" based on team playoff success.

In fact, it certainly appears they have even rejected Veteran leadership Dubas brought into the club.

Not even sure what you're talking about. They haven't rejected anybody.

 

[Niagara Bill]

No you don't.

Because that's what the people who actually do know say.

No they haven't, and you've just exposed that you're attempting to judge "leadership" based on team playoff success.

Not even sure what you're talking about. They haven't rejected anybody.

I am not judging on team success, I am judging on their personal lack of success. Why did their buddy Dubas feel every season and every playoff season the great need to inject leadership. Why, because he knew these 2 guys did not lead in the room.

They rejected O Reilly last yr. when he came and tried to motivate the team. You need to rewatch a few of those games, watch how AM reacts, sulking thru a number of games when he did not take the opening face-off.
Smokecand fire my good man, smoke and fire.