Auston Matthews 69 goals in 81 games, most goals scored since Lemieux in 1995-96

[All Mod Cons]

The Leafs never get enough PPs for Matthews to truly set records. Always near the bottom of the league. If they had as many PPs as the Avs 9
or Oilers this last 5 years, Matthews would be pushing 80 goals a season.

 

[Drytoast]

Even if 60 is the new 50, it’s still very impressive because not everyone is doing it. Right now he’s the best sniper in the NHL. Although Pasta is right there with him, I give a slight edge to Matthews.

None of it really matters if he can’t, or worse, doesn’t want to do it in the playoffs.

Matthews has played 115 less games. More than a full season and still has scored more goals than Pasta....ya. "Pasta is right up there with him..." lol

 

[Namikaze Minato]

He also has 31 goals in 33 home games, wonder if he can go a goal per game at home over a full season!

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Goals carrer highs
This year: Mackinnon , Kucherov. Matthews
Last year : Mackinnon, McDavid, Pastrnak
2 years ago: Draisaitl, Matthews, McDavid
We obviously in high scoring era, nothing debatable about it.

If goals are easy now, every player I mentioned should be having a career year in goals. None are.

 

[The Podium]

Goals per game are way higher right now then when Ovechkin was in his prime.

The Leafs also get 0 PPs and Austin Matthews has significant less PP time than Ovechkin had in his prime.

For example

Matthews has 15 PPG in 3:18PPTOI/GP this season
Ovechkin had 22 PPG in 5:37PPTOI/GP in 07-08 when he scored his career high 65

Pretty much negates the whole higher scoring argument

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

View attachment 840840
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Matthews has played 115 less games. More than a full season and still has scored more goals than Pasta....ya. "Pasta is right up there with him..." lol

He absolutely is. Desperation to overlook the playoff disappointments has led to this absurd need for Matthews to be the absolute #1 at everything. #1 over McDavid. #1 goalscorer by a significant margin. Selke level two way center.

Pastrnak was drafted late in the 1st round. Naturally early seasons will favor a 1st overall draft pick. Pastrnak lost a child which far outweighs any obstacle Matthews has had (prepare for injury excuses). Pastrnak is on a low talent roster and still leading the team offensively by far.

Matthews may have the argument as the better pure scorer at this point but embarrassing to state it as quoted, as though an insult.

 

[Strangle]

That is not how it works.

You have no idea how it works

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Matthews has sure cooled off. He may not even hit 65 at this rate. But if he's saving his goals for the playoffs then the trade off is well worth it.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

The Leafs also get 0 PPs and Austin Matthews has significant less PP time than Ovechkin had in his prime.

For example

Matthews has 15 PPG in 3:18PPTOI/GP this season
Ovechkin had 22 PPG in 5:37PPTOI/GP in 07-08 when he scored his career high 65

Pretty much negates the whole higher scoring argument

We had several seasons of "Toronto's PP greatest in history" theme here as well. No lack in talent to set Matthews for goals on the PP. Hardly negates the scoring era point.

 

[Strangle]

Even if 60 is the new 50, it’s still very impressive because not everyone is doing it. Right now he’s the best sniper in the NHL. Although Pasta is right there with him, I give a slight edge to Matthews.

None of it really matters if he can’t, or worse, doesn’t want to do it in the playoffs.

Auston Matthews (2017-2024) vs. David Pastrňák (2016-2023): Head-to-Head Stats Comparison | Stathead.com

Compare Players: Check out the head-to-head stats of Auston Matthews (2017-2024) and David Pastrňák (2016-2023) including their awards, honors, championships, playoff and regular season stats, and much more on Stathead.com

stathead.com

From ages 19 to 26, with similar amount of games played, Matthews destroys pasta

It’s not ‘an edge’, Matthews is much better

 

[Strangle]

Yes, it's magic. Definitely not the smaller goalie equipment, the lack of defensive defenseman in today's NHL, the advent of 3v3 OT, and various other changes that have factored into increased scoring.

3v3 OT raise goals per game league wide, that’s an argument against using league averages to determine ‘level of difficulty’ in individual scoring

The league manufactures hundreds of ‘extra’ goals that shouldn’t exist and really shouldn’t be counted in league averages.

Those should count in a separate category called ‘league manufactured scoring’

You can only really compare regulation goals to reg/OT goals prior to 4v4 or 3v3 OT

We had several seasons of "Toronto's PP greatest in history" theme here as well. No lack in talent to set Matthews for goals on the PP. Hardly negates the scoring era point.

The leafs PP is decent, Matthews doesn’t get to inflate his goal scoring the same way Ovechkin did with massive PP minutes

 

[authentic]

Goals per game are way higher right now then when Ovechkin was in his prime.

Matthews is like 70th in powerplay time instead of first by a whopping margin. Also has 3 seasons at a 65-70 goal pace instead of two from 58-65, as a two-way center. And yes hfboards, Matthews is good defensively whether you believe it or not.

 

[Strangle]

It's even dumber to ignore those very real factors just because they are hard to quantity. You can perhaps disagree on the actual impact on a scorer like Matthews vs a scorer like Ovechkin, but it's not arguable that it's easier to score goals today than it was in Ovechkin's prime.

You aren’t able to quantify a level of difficulty on goals scored in 2008 compared to 2024

It’s just a nebulous ‘less goals were scored equals more difficult goal scoring’ it doesn’t make any logical sense.

The easier explanation is just that the players scored less goals in 2008. There are a lot of factors to consider and one that I never hear about is talent.

That’s because posters who make your argument assume talent level is flat over time in the NHL, they don’t account for (or believe in) talent disparity in the league in different eras.

It’s simple, players today and players prior to the Ovechkin/crosby era are just better, there’s more talented offensive players than there was then.

Same with the 80’s and early 90’s. Dead puck era sucked and having McDavid/matthews/etc/etc in the league then would have raised league scoring.

If you put the top 50 players today in the same environment as it was in 2008, they would score more

 

[Spirits]

Matthews is like 70th in powerplay time instead of first by a whopping margin. Also has 3 seasons at a 65-70 goal pace instead of two from 58-65, as a two-way center. And yes hfboards, Matthews is good defensively whether you believe it or not.

I'd take Matthews over McDavid on the Avalanche tbh. If we could just take one, easily Matthews.

 

[Strangle]

Imo it’s a fool’s game to compare across generations. AM is the best goal scorer of his era. OV was the best during his best years.

Understood. 60 goals is a great year in any era. But in the history of nhl scoring (which you include) it’s not anywhere close to what the greatest scorers put up. Maybe it’s okay to suggest AM is the best scorer of this era and leave it at that? Because comparing him to the greatest scorers makes his 60 look kind of out classed.

No, it’s not anywhere even close to the best

I agree, Matthews is the best goal scorer of his era, but not beyond that.

Brett Hull was a better goal scorer but Matthews has Ovechkin beat on peak

Ovechkin has Matthews on volume and career, and will likely stay ahead.

But Matthews is at least equal to, if not (arguably) better than Ovechkin to this point in their careers

 

[LivingRentFree]

I'd take Matthews over McDavid on the Avalanche tbh. If we could just take one, easily Matthews.

Agreed

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Auston Matthews (2017-2024) vs. David Pastrňák (2016-2023): Head-to-Head Stats Comparison | Stathead.com

Compare Players: Check out the head-to-head stats of Auston Matthews (2017-2024) and David Pastrňák (2016-2023) including their awards, honors, championships, playoff and regular season stats, and much more on Stathead.com

stathead.com

From ages 19 to 26, with similar amount of games played, Matthews destroys pasta

It’s not ‘an edge’, Matthews is much better

Try 20 year old seasons and later? Pastrnak's first two seasons are obviously not a consideration to their peak performance.

This would be more telling. Pastrnak's lost child included.

 

[CN8]

But not this year. So sandbagging, right? Same with the other great players like Kucherov, Pastrnak, MacKinnon, Draisaitl that are all way behind him in the goal scoring race. All just mailing it in this year? I mean, it's super easy to score goals now right? Shouldn't the best goal scorers in the game be racking 'em up?

Nah, like you say - sandbagging
This year doing 100+ assists. Just making fun at this point

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Nah, like you say - sandbagging
This year doing 100+ assists. Just making fun at this point

I'm clearly talking about goals, not assists. I'm told in this thread goals are super-easy now. How can so many of the best players in the league (some probably the best in history) be behind Auston Matthews by 15 to 30 (!) goals right now if it's all about goalie equipment? Gimme a freaking break.

 

[Strangle]

Try 20 year old seasons and later? Pastrnak's first two seasons are obviously not a consideration to their peak performance.

This would be more telling. Pastrnak's lost child included.

I’d do entire careers, but pasta has played almost a full season more of games at that point

Which messes up any comparison

 

[CN8]

I'm clearly talking about goals, not assists. I'm told in this thread goals are super-easy now. How can so many of the best players in the league (some probably the best in history) be behind Auston Matthews by 15 to 30 (!) goals right now if it's all about goalie equipment? Gimme a freaking break.

I think their point went over your head. Not saying he wouldn’t win by as much just that everyone would lose a percentage .
Just like we’re seeing McDavids 153 is great but not like if he did it the Benn Art Ross year

 

[Golden_Jet]

I'm clearly talking about goals, not assists. I'm told in this thread goals are super-easy now. How can so many of the best players in the league (some probably the best in history) be behind Auston Matthews by 15 to 30 (!) goals right now if it's all about goalie equipment? Gimme a freaking break.

Yes goalie equipment sizes makes a big difference. To say it doesn’t is laughable.

 

[Montreal Shadow]

I'd take Matthews over McDavid on the Avalanche tbh. If we could just take one, easily Matthews.

With their playoff numbers?

Awful take.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Yes goalie equipment sizes makes a big difference. To say it doesn’t is laughable.

Have you seen goalie pads these days that are completely rectangular with cheaters at the top? I dismiss entirely the argument goalie equipment is less effective today. Entirely. Look at the friggin' pads when they put them on the ice to cover the 5-hole. It's like a border wall. That didn't exist 20 years ago. At all.

 

[Drytoast]

He absolutely is. Desperation to overlook the playoff disappointments has led to this absurd need for Matthews to be the absolute #1 at everything. #1 over McDavid. #1 goalscorer by a significant margin. Selke level two way center.

Pastrnak was drafted late in the 1st round. Naturally early seasons will favor a 1st overall draft pick. Pastrnak lost a child which far outweighs any obstacle Matthews has had (prepare for injury excuses). Pastrnak is on a low talent roster and still leading the team offensively by far.

Matthews may have the argument as the better pure scorer at this point but embarrassing to state it as quoted, as though an insult.

Matthews is the league's top goal scorer. He's about to get his third rocket. That's what he's good at. You are going to have to deal with that or do the cope thing where you talk about the "leafs getting knocked out in the first round". Whatever helps your emotions get through this reality. But either way, no...Pasta is nowhere near the goal scorer Matthews is. Not in the same ballpark. Not even close.

Boston has out performed the Leafs in the playoffs and regular season this past decade and a bit. BOSTON. Not Pasta. Matthews has out performed Pasta in goal scoring by a wide margin. Not little. Wide. (Now if we want to expand things to over the course of both Franchise's 100 year history, the Leafs > Boston and it's not even close. For as much as Boston has had the Leaf's number the past decade, your franchise's first 60 years were trash. In a 6 team league you only won what? 3 cups? The Leafs have 13. Still more than double what Boston has)

Cope
Seeth
Mauld

Or let the Leafs live rent free in your head, I don't care. But them's the facts.