Athletic: Dubas Job on the Line this Season (contract expiring after this season)

[zeke]

did you read your post i replied too ?

you said they had the resources to acquire any goalie they wanted and choose Murray , i'm saying they only traded for Murray because the rest of the goalies they wanted were all signed

They could have signed Campbell to the same contract he got. They could have outbid for kuemper or husso or anyone else who went. They had the capspace and resources to match any of them.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Wat



Correct. These guys were happier when we were a non playoffs team.

Not happy because a very talented team is being wasted by a rookie GM and coach. Wasting years away with nothing but embarrassing first round losses

 

[hotpaws]

They could have signed Campbell to the same contract he got. They could have outbid for kuemper or husso or anyone else who went. They had the capspace and resources to match any of them.

so what your saying is Murray was Dubies top choice but he waited to trade for him until after Ott had a deal to pay more to dump him to Buff ?

that truly is out of the box thinking by Dubie , lol

 

[justashadowof]

The standards of success should be much much higher for a team gifted with 3 consecutive home runs at the draft. Matthews, Marner and Nylander are probably the best youth trio in the franchise's 100+ year history. Doing nothing in the playoffs with that head start is a failure regardless of the regular season performance.

 

[ToneDog]

Enter the turd polishing to bash his credentials… Same thing I’ve heard everywhere except here. Gambling.


The Athletic?

“Dubas’ roll of the dice in goal, not once (Matt Murray) but twice (Ilya Samsonov), is all the more bold with what’s at stake personally, and for the team”

Roll of the dice, gambling, scrambling, take your pick.

Simmons also used the same phrase.

The difference this year for Dubas and the Leafs is this season begins with a gamble unlike any other. He’s rolled the dice, his reputation and quite possibly his future on the acquisitions of wayward goaltenders Matt Murray and Ilya Samsonov, both of whom were let go by teams wanting to win.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Simmons also used the same phrase.

The difference this year for Dubas and the Leafs is this season begins with a gamble unlike any other. He’s rolled the dice, his reputation and quite possibly his future on the acquisitions of wayward goaltenders Matt Murray and Ilya Samsonov, both of whom were let go by teams wanting to win.

Yes, Simmons said that in his interview with Dubas, but Dubas didn't. Dubas said:
“In Murray’s case, he’s done this before. He’s won (the Stanley Cup). He did it twice. I know (Ottawa) moved on from him. The benefit for me is, I know him personally,” said Dubas. “I believe in him. He played for me (in junior). I agree with Jim Rutherford (former Penguins GM). When he has to prove himself and fight for the net, that’s when he’s been at his best.”

On Samsonov:

What I’ve seen of him this summer is a very strong commitment to his craft,” said Dubas. “That’s impressed me. In terms of why the public should believe in him, well, I’ll say this: He believes in himself.
“That’s why he took a one-year, bet-on-himself kind of deal. He could have taken more. He could have got more. He was insistent on the one-year and insistent he would prove himself in that year.”

SIMMONS: Maple Leafs GM Kyle Dubas on goaltending questions, his future and that of Auston Matthews

Kyle Dubas doesn’t sound like a man on the hot seat.

torontosun.com

So yeah some people say Dubas rolled the dice, gambeled let go by people on teams who want to win (that is every team by BTW). Others don't.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I still cannot believe the presser they had after the season ended. and yes... I am still ticked off!

Agreed those clowns were tone-def.

 

[Racer88]

Agreed those clowns were tone-def.

It’s arrogance plain and simple

 

[justashadowof]

Nothing says controlled and circumspect managing like rolling the dice. Conjures up memories of John Ferguson Jr. rolling the dice on Sleepy Andrew Raycroft. Or Floyd Smith rolling the dice on Tom Kurvers for a 1st round pick in the Lindros draft.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Yes, Simmons said that in his interview
So yeah some people say Dubas rolled the dice, gambeled let go by people on teams who want to win (that is every team by BTW). Others don't.

I was going to say, isn't that technically what happened with Campbell and Kuemper too? We want to win and we let Campbell go (and Andersen last year). It is not like we couldn't have given him 5 years. We didn't think he was good enough to be worth it.

Colorado wants to win and let Kuemper go, but that was less out of their hands. And their solution was paying assets for Georgiev, who has been practically as successful as our new backup has been the last 3 years but will make twice the money.

A lot is made out of our goaltending, but there are a ton of questions marks for other competitive teams too.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Simmons also used the same phrase.

The difference this year for Dubas and the Leafs is this season begins with a gamble unlike any other. He’s rolled the dice, his reputation and quite possibly his future on the acquisitions of wayward goaltenders Matt Murray and Ilya Samsonov, both of whom were let go by teams wanting to win.

Simmons hast lost the respect of most sports fans because of his ridiculous "clickbaity" hot takes. All he does is try to stir up shit and he's thus the perfect go to guy for people that want to stir up shit. You found him, congrats. I'm sure you'll get a lot of mileage from him.

 

[kb]

Simmons hast lost the respect of most sports fans because of his ridiculous "clickbaity" hot takes. All he does is try to stir up shit and he's thus the perfect go to guy for people that want to stir up shit. You found him, congrats. I'm sure you'll get a lot of mileage from him.

LOL.....yup, so true.

Let's hold up Steve 'frikken' Simmons as a bastion of unbiased journalism. I guess that is all the proof we need......liars and losers unite!!

 

[The Masters]

 

[Ciao]

The headline that Dubas is effectively on probation now seems to me to be exactly correct.

Just the fact that he is not being offered an extension is now out in public is big news. Normally, that would stay behind closed doors.

It really puts Dubas in a bad spot. If he passes the test, he would be a hot commodity elsewhere and might be inclined to flip the bird at the Leafs and go to another destination with better job security.

If he fails the test, it will be time for him to regroup and start over.

Coaches and GMs are hired to be fired. Being let go with some term left on a contract is one of perq's of sports management. There's no cap consequences to firing a coach or GM, and MLSE can easily afford to carry some terminated contracts.

The fact that the Leafs are not stabilizing Dubas' position with a new contract that might be terminated early suggests to me that Shanahan is also under pressure from ownership, and that he too is on notice that he might be dismissed if and when Dubas is let go -- at the end of this season or otherwise.

Whether or not the Leafs intend to dismiss Dubas at the end of this season -- or sooner -- having him hanging in a lame-duck position is bad news for the Leafs. Extending him wouldn't stop them from firing him anyway, and not extending him sure doesn't help stabilize the organization.

 

[Havoc]

Lock up the Dubas passed the tests thread. Shanny said no

 

[Ciao]

Lock up the Dubas passed the tests thread. Shanny said no

If Dubas hasn't passed the test, then neither has Shanahan.

I would be surprised if Shanahan, Dubas and Keefe don't all suffer the same fate: win now, or walk.

 

[Fogelhund]

The headline that Dubas is effectively on probation now seems to me to be exactly correct.

Just the fact that he is not being offered an extension is now out in public is big news. Normally, that would stay behind closed doors.

It really puts Dubas in a bad spot. If he passes the test, he would be a hot commodity elsewhere and might be inclined to flip the bird at the Leafs and go to another destination with better job security.

If he fails the test, it will be time for him to regroup and start over.

Coaches and GMs are hired to be fired. Being let go with some term left on a contract is one of perq's of sports management. There's no cap consequences to firing a coach or GM, and MLSE can easily afford to carry some terminated contracts.

The fact that the Leafs are not stabilizing Dubas' position with a new contract that might be terminated early suggests to me that Shanahan is also under pressure from ownership, and that he too is on notice that he might be dismissed if and when Dubas is let go -- at the end of this season or otherwise.

Whether or not the Leafs intend to dismiss Dubas at the end of this season -- or sooner -- having him hanging in a lame-duck position is bad news for the Leafs. Extending him wouldn't stop them from firing him anyway, and not extending him sure doesn't help stabilize the organization.

If the Leafs win a couple of rounds or more, Dubas is back. If they win one... it's a question. If they don't, he's gone. I don't think this really puts Dubas in a bad spot, for the most part. He's a professional, and he's always played the long game... and I believe he will continue to play the long game, as if he's going to be back next year.

I don't think the GM position needs stabilizing by offering him an extension now, as you say, even if they offered it, he could be fired anyway... So some pretend contract, doesn't provide any further stability. There is no stability in sports management, or coaching... perform to your employers expectations, or good bye. That's the way it should be.

No contract is a good message to the team. Perform, or there will be changes.

 

[Havoc]

If Dubas hasn't passed the test, then neither has Shanahan.

I would be surprised if Shanahan, Dubas and Keefe don't all suffer the same fate: win now, or walk.

Agreed but we didn't spend an entire summer fighting over if shanahan passed the tests.

I like Shanahan though. I trust him for the next hires if they go that route. We've been trending upwards ever since he came into our lives and that has remained constant no matter what other management members come and go.

 

[sxvnert]

They'll keep him unless he misses the playoffs. The entire media will work overtime to keep "their boy" employed.

 

[hotpaws]

I don’t believe a word from either Shanny or Dubie about Dubas not having already being extended . These two idiots spend half their day figuring out how to spin every move they make so them saying Dubas has to dance for his diner could be more bs to placate the fans who are pissed about another early exist .

 

[Havoc]

They'll keep him unless he misses the playoffs. The entire media will work overtime to keep "their boy" employed.

Shanahan passed on one of the most respected GMs in the entire universe in Lou for an unproven young GM. You think the media will have any sway on what he ends up doing? The guy clearly does whatever he wants without a care what anyone else thinks. If Lou isn't safe then nobody is. Not that Lou was fired or anything, but Lou made it clear he wasn't ready to give up being a GM any more and Shanahan refused to diverge from the original plan they made.

I don't believe for a second Shanahan is ride or die with Dubas. The leash was only long because Dubas did possess blue chip genius potential worth exploring for an extended time but seems patience is running out now both with upper management and the entire fan base. The only issue with fans is that their patience ran out before Shanahans, so that causes tension between them and Shanny now. However, it's fact almost every team in the league wanted Dubas as part of their management in some capacity so I can forgive Shanahan for holding on for too long.

As I said above, we hit a snag in the Shanaplan with all these first round losses, but Shanny's graph is still trending upwards if you plot his time here and that should continue with the next team he assembles. Hopefully a big spike in the graph straight to cup if Dubas still can't make any progress this season and gets shown the door.

 

[DarylO]

Even if his team doesn't get past the first round it would depend on a couple factors, mainly though if there's a good replacement option out there. No sense firing him to replace with someone who is going to do worse or will blow up the roster each year which (ala Seattle)

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

Shanahan passed on one of the most respected GMs in the entire universe in Lou for an unproven young GM. You think the media will have any sway on what he ends up doing? The guy clearly does whatever he wants without a care what anyone else thinks. If Lou isn't safe then nobody is. Not that Lou was fired or anything, but Lou made it clear he wasn't ready to give up being a GM any more and Shanahan refused to diverge from the original plan they made.

That is his personality following being the police officer of the league before coming here.

I believe Dubas when he says shanahan has him on probation. It's not a scheme.

 

[Gilles Meloche]

Toronto Maple Leafs Kyle Dubas Brendan Shanahan | TSN

Toronto Maple Leafs general manager Kyle Dubas said Wednesday he was informed by president Brendan Shanahan this summer that no contract extension was coming at this point in time.

www.tsn.ca

 

[Stephen]

The Dubas non-contract renewal seems to put the GM into an evaluation mode separate from the Shanaplan. Nothing really wrong with it and should be business as usual, but does create a sense of urgency to see some results.