Athletic: Dubas Job on the Line this Season (contract expiring after this season)

[Stephen]

I've been pro-retool for awhile now. Enough quality talent that a total tear down isn't required.

And with some nice prospects/youngsters in the mix, they just need to redefine their team philosophy and go from there.

If you think of all these pieces as assets and dispassionately disassembled the team efficiently you could retool very quickly a la 2018 Rangers. Or as long as it takes.

Draw a tight circle around a very small core going forward, make another pool of assets to be purged and scrutinize the guys in the middle. Get the farm system in a healthier state, carve out a big chunk of free cap space. Build a team with skill, but with other strengths to win in a variety of ways. Live to fight another day.

 

[BertCorbeau]

If you think of all these pieces as assets and dispassionately disassembled the team efficiently you could retool very quickly a la 2018 Rangers. Or as long as it takes.

Draw a tight circle around a very small core going forward, make another pool of assets to be purged and scrutinize the guys in the middle. Get the farm system in a healthier state, carve out a big chunk of free cap space. Build a team with skill, but with other strengths to win in a variety of ways. Live to fight another day.

Exactly, and you project with the cap rising and Tavares' deal expiring in 2 years, there is a lot of flexibility coming.

The org is in a lot better of a position than it was 10 years ago in the Burke/Nonis era prior to Shanny coming in.

 

[Stephen]

Exactly, and you project with the cap rising and Tavares' deal expiring in 2 years, there is a lot of flexibility coming.

The org is in a lot better of a position than it was 10 years ago in the Burke/Nonis era prior to Shanny coming in.

Yeah like overall I wouldn't say we're in bad shape. It just needs to be reshaped. But I think the question of who is going to do the shaping will be important since the Dubas vision is really running its course.

 

[centipede2233]

He'll be remembered as one of the biggest mistakes in the organization's history. Which he is.

Actually shanahan should win that prize. Dubas was an epic failure, but shanahan as president is most culpable.

 

[Menzinger]

I think a real message would be a hockey trade at the Rielly, Nylander level. Rielly is quietly a defensive tire fire who doesn't seem capable of providing the transition game for the offense...

But I don't think we need to send messages. Just take a step back and retool the organization on more foundational principles. We've reached a dead end.

Imo if the move is to retool I think got to start with a 10+ million dollar guy. If not, it's just punting the bigger question down the road for a bit longer

 

[Gallagbi]

Imo if the move is to retool I think got to start with a 10+ million dollar guy. If not, it's just punting the bigger question down the road for a bit longer

Marner's the only option at 10+

 

[Stephen]

Imo if the move is to retool I think got to start with a 10+ million dollar guy. If not, it's just punting the bigger question down the road for a bit longer

I'm not against that. Like I said earlier, I think a Rielly or Nylander trade would "send a message" in a meaningful way. But to whom? Who are you trying to reform?

I think the guy at the center of this crap storm is Marner. The Babcock controversy, the endless coddling and fragility under pressure, the pushback on Keefe calling out the core, the circus brand hockey. That's the purge. That's the nuclear, era changing move.

 

[colchar]

Yeah like overall I wouldn't say we're in bad shape. It just needs to be reshaped. But I think the question of who is going to do the shaping will be important since the Dubas vision is really running its course.

Dbas has vision? When the hell did that happen???

 

[capfit9]

The six feet has been dug it's just a matter of occupying it in time

 

[Bomber0104]

Marner's the only option at 10+

Unless Matthews walks after next year.

Then you go from three 10.5M+ players to one in a hurry.

Maybe you trade both Marner and Matthews and absolutely load yourself up for the future.

 

[colchar]

I'm not against that. Like I said earlier, I think a Rielly or Nylander trade would "send a message" in a meaningful way. But to whom? Who are you trying to reform?

I think the guy at the center of this crap storm is Marner. The Babcock controversy, the endless coddling and fragility under pressure, the pushback on Keefe calling out the core, the circus brand hockey. That's the purge. That's the nuclear, era changing move.

It pretty much has to be Marner.

I used to want Nylander traded because all the way back to his Marlie days he was often floating and not engaged. But he's changed, particularly in the playoffs, whereas Marner is still the same.

The only question is, how would Matthews handle Marner being traded?

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Sheldon Keefe has been the only coach that Kyle Dubas has ever hired. That covers OHL, AHL & NHL...they are joined at the hip and the experiment is not gonna end well for either of them.

 

[United35]

If you think of all these pieces as assets and dispassionately disassembled the team efficiently you could retool very quickly a la 2018 Rangers. Or as long as it takes.

Draw a tight circle around a very small core going forward, make another pool of assets to be purged and scrutinize the guys in the middle. Get the farm system in a healthier state, carve out a big chunk of free cap space. Build a team with skill, but with other strengths to win in a variety of ways. Live to fight another day.

Amen. Now, who is the GM and coach to oversee this.

 

[Mickey Marner]

I've already got my GIF picked out for when he's inevitably canned.

 

[klmdg]

Actually shanahan should win that prize. Dubas was an epic failure, but shanahan as president is most culpable.

He was allowed to implement his organizational philosophy from day one, one based on spreadsheets and being nice

He was allowed to spend a major asset to rid himself of his predecessor's mistake, after he himself grossly overspent for no reason

He was allowed to bring in his handpicked coach, the only coach he has ever hired in his managerial career

He was allowed to trade several high draft picks for players that did not move the needle an inch

He was allowed to double, triple, and quadruple down on dime-a-dozen players that have repeatedly failed him in the biggest moments

He was allowed to build the most gutless, most entitled, and now the most unlikable team in the history of this franchise

You are right, Shanahan owns this catastrophe

 

[fahad203]

Fun fact

No GM has left the leafs since probably since Fletcher got a GM with the Arizona coyotes

Brian Burke became a hockey operations guy with 3 teams. But not as a GM. He was an acting GM in Calgary until they found Treivling for a brief moment. But he was never hired as a GM

Pat Quinn was never a GM after he left the leafs, neither was JFJ, Nonis and Hunter

It's safe to say Leafs are a GM graveyard

 

[centipede2233]

He was allowed to implement his organizational philosophy from day one, one based on spreadsheets and being nice

He was allowed to spend a major asset to rid himself of his predecessor's mistake, after he himself grossly overspent for no reason

He was allowed to bring in his handpicked coach, the only coach he has ever hired in his managerial career

He was allowed to trade several high draft picks for players that did not move the needle an inch

He was allowed to double, triple, and quadruple down on dime-a-dozen players that have repeatedly failed him in the biggest moments

He was allowed to build the most gutless, most entitled, and now the most unlikable team in the history of this franchise

You are right, Shanahan owns this catastrophe

i Agree,dubas is a failure, you will not find anyone who is more anti dubas then me. But shanahan basically let a rookie GM do whatever the hell he wants. It’s kind of like a parent letting they’re kid bully and steal other kids candy at the local,birthday party, sure the kids actions were harmful, but it’s the parents ultimate responsibility In letting it happen.

 

[DarkKnight]

When a team has no identity, isn’t that on the architect? How can anyone absolve the GM.

 

[Stephen]

When a team has no identity, isn’t that on the architect? How can anyone absolve the GM.

The team has an identity. We just don’t like it. And it is on the GM.

 

[DarkKnight]

The team has an identity. We just don’t like it. And it is on the GM.

Yes soft and turn it on when the feel like it, no internal pressure, a coddled safe house.

 

[klmdg]

When a team has no identity, isn’t that on the architect? How can anyone absolve the GM.

No doubt, but the architect should have been replaced after the Habs series when it became painfully obvious that his philosophy would never work in the playoffs

 

[PromisedLand]

hey dubas

 

[Trapper]

hey dubas

 

[DarkKnight]

The top heavy, trade picks and look for cheap castoffs to defy the odds, model has finally reached it’s crescendo. We’ve lost countless players because of salary constraints, traded away picks and failed to bring in young hungry talent as a result. We’re left with little depth, less speed and zero character as a team. There is nothing about Dubas’ record that suggests exceptional, which makes it pretty easy for me to move on from him. Good, bad, great, horrible, genius, stupidity, the ledger suggests ”meh”. Factor in a coddled environment, misplaced loyalty and internal arrogance, hard to justify he deserves more time. Gifted an amazing opportunity, and yet here we sit….Where’s the accountability?

 

[rocketman588]

Whoever the fk is in charge of the pro scouting department should be fired.

I think the issue is he doesn't listen to them.

There's no way they're just lining up and recommending dudes from the soo