ATD 2017 Draft Thread IV

[Dreakmur]

I'll take Rick MacLeish, C/LW.

His offensive record is outstanding for this part in the draft, with a VsX7 of 73.3 to go along with a very good playoff record.

He's also versatile enough that he can play either in a scoring or checking role.

What's outstanding about 73.3?

It's a solid pick, but there's lots of better offensive players.

 

[VanIslander]

Based on my own eyes, he's been better than Weber for pretty much the entirety of his career...

Well, that's not what most Nashville fans who were watching both night in and night out thought! Underrated, yeah. But better than Weber? No way. Even the Preds management paid them differently (I recall they signed their first contracts after ELCs the same year).

I miss them being together.

With neither in Nashville this year, it's been painful to watch the Preds try and defend against the rush.

 

[jarek]

What's outstanding about 73.3?

It's a solid pick, but there's lots of better offensive players.

The fact that he has a strong playoff record, and brings a lot of other things to the table as well.

There's definitely better offensive players left, just none that really combine the all around game MacLeish brings.

 

[Dreakmur]

Well, that's not what most Nashville fans who were watching both night in and night out thought! Underrated, yeah. But better than Weber? No way. Even the Preds management paid them differently (I recall they signed their first contracts after ELCs the same year).

I miss them being together.

With neither in Nashville this year, it's been painful to watch the Preds try and defend against the rush.

Weber is not "more flashy" than a lot of guys, but that's why I think he has more recognition than Suter.

 

[Sturminator]

So, I just took a peek at the rosters of the old two-time champions looking for common threads on the rosters - that is, guys who served the same GM(s) on both championship teams. It's an interesting study in ATD history.

Hockey Outsider: Hooley Smith

HO used Hooley at both center and RW. Hooley is an appropriate player for those teams, sort of a microcosm of the "tough-but-skilled" ethos that seemed to define those teams.

Sturminator: Don McKenney, Grant Fuhr, undrafted goalie

Fuhr and McKenney were my guys, and appropriately represent important parts of my old draft philosophy, which included waiting (but not too long...) on a goalie, and drafting a 3rd line center late because there was always value to be had.

TheDevilMadeMe: Tommy Ivan

No common skaters on TDMM's championship teams, but Ivan coached both outfits. TDMM always believed in building teams with real offensive flair that were good enough defensively to win a lot of fairly wide-open contests. No surprise Ivan was his guy.

Rob Scuderi: Ebbie Goodfellow, Rod Seiling

Goodfellow was really Rob's guy, and he fit perfectly the sort of all-around style that those teams mastered. Physical, good in attack and defense, Goodfellow was the perfect Scuderite skater. Seiling...dunno, he feels less typical of those teams, but I guess Rob just really valued his steadiness on the back end.

 

[Dreakmur]

The fact that he has a strong playoff record, and brings a lot of other things to the table as well.

There's definitely better offensive players left, just none that really combine the all around game MacLeish brings.

MacLeish does have a good play-off record, but his "well-rounded" game is probably up for debate.

 

[seventieslord]

I'll take Rick MacLeish, C/LW.

His offensive record is outstanding for this part in the draft, with a VsX7 of 73.3 to go along with a very good playoff record.

He's also versatile enough that he can play either in a scoring or checking role.

Don't really see him as a checker, but obviously a great playoff record. There's no reason Jeff Carter should go ahead of him yet. (he was one of the five I was referring to earlier today)

P.S. I love how when we're drafting spares, suddenly all those obscure secondary positions come out.

 

[seventieslord]

The fact that he has a strong playoff record, and brings a lot of other things to the table as well.

There's definitely better offensive players left, just none that really combine the all around game MacLeish brings.

what do you mean "a lot of other things"?

what do you mean "all around game"?

 

[seventieslord]

The Miami Screaming Eagles select Stefan Persson, D

Persson will be the team's 7th defenseman, and helps provide some offense from the backend.

well he dropped a good 110 picks, I guess I have to be satisfied and understand he can't drop a whole 600 in one year

 

[VanIslander]

Weber is not "more flashy" than a lot of guys, but that's why I think he has more recognition than Suter.

Because he's not more flashy?

Weber certainly got LESS recognition than many, many thought he deserved until he went to a big market, media-frenzied Canadiens club. He might finally get the Norris trophy he was robbed of before.

 

[seventieslord]

Indiana Ice will select D Steve Duchesne to fill in as our 7th D.

Best offensive defenseman remaining, and it wasn't even close.

 

[seventieslord]

Because he's not more flashy?

Weber certainly got LESS recognition than many, many thought he deserved until he went to a big market, media-frenzied Canadiens club. He might finally get the Norris trophy he was robbed of before.

....is it still November?

I thought 3-4 months had passed since Weber was a serious Norris candidate.

 

[VanIslander]

....is it still November?

I thought 3-4 months had passed since Weber was a serious Norris candidate.

I didn't say this season.

Burnsie 2017!

 

[seventieslord]

I didn't say this season.

Burnsie 2017!

Fair enough, though, with him being 31 and his team in decline I think his Norris window is officially closed. I don't think he's the caliber of player who'll explode for an awesome season at 32 or 33 that will outshine better younger players.

 

[BenchBrawl]

Fair enough, though, with him being 31 and his team in decline I think his Norris window is officially closed. I don't think he's the caliber of player who'll explode for an awesome season at 32 or 33 that will outshine better younger players.

Could happen if he scores a crap ton of goals and plays reasonable defense/more physical ... but it's a long shot.

 

[VanIslander]

Fair enough, though, with him being 31 and his team in decline I think his Norris window is officially closed. I don't think he's the caliber of player who'll explode for an awesome season at 32 or 33 that will outshine better younger players.

Oh, no. Burns turns 32 tomorrow(on Thursday, but it's already Wednesday here). Bye bye Norris. 32 year olds cannot win it. Or is there a turning-32 exception clause?

But, you did say Weber isn't "the caliber of player"... maybe Burns is.

I'm surprised by the Weber opinions of dreakmur & seventieslord. Huh.

 

[seventieslord]

Oh, no. Burns turns 32 tomorrow(on Thursday, but it's already Wednesday here). Bye bye Norris. 32 year olds cannot win it. Or is there a turning-32 exception clause?

But, you did say Weber isn't "the caliber of player"... maybe Burns is.

I'm surprised by the Weber opinions of dreakmur & seventieslord. Huh.

Look at what kinds of players in history were able to stay on top of the twentysomethings in their thirties. It's not a disrespect to Weber to say he's not that kind of player.

Burns? He's just weird.

 

[Johnny Engine]

Seems like I've drafted my backup goalies in the 40th-45th range a lot in these drafts. Lots of familiar names available. So I'm going to take one I've never taken, and give myself some reading material.

Gerry Cheevers

 

[King Forsberg]

To me he is the player Ovechkin took a mocking pic of when he was drafted last in the draft for the Nhl alll star

Really? You seem to have an irrational hate for Kessel.

 

[tony d]

Kipper was the runner up when I went with Connell. Me and Dave had him on our ATD team in 2011 when he backed up Terry Sawchuk.

 

[jarek]

what do you mean "a lot of other things"?

what do you mean "all around game"?

Your old bio suggests as much, does it not?

Over the next two season he continued to produce on offense but was asked to take on penalty killing and defensive responsibility.

During the late 70s, MacLeish was a top two-way player for Philly.

Though he was primarily a skill player, MacLeish was prepared to take the physical beating necessary to win.

Although Ricky was never much of a checker, he would often be matched against the opposition's top line by Fred Shero..

Admittedly I overstated the "all-aroundness" of his game. There isn't that much to go on.

As far as his secondary position, that's how he was listed last year and I don't remember anyone challenging it.

 

[King Forsberg]

Nobody is really standing out for me so I'll take Mike Richter, G. Big role in a Stanley Cup Championship, World Cup MVP and winner of perhaps the most prestigious award there is, All Star Game MVP...

 

[seventieslord]

Your old bio suggests as much, does it not?


Admittedly I overstated the "all-aroundness" of his game. There isn't that much to go on.

As far as his secondary position, that's how he was listed last year and I don't remember anyone challenging it.

I think he's gutsy, battle-tested and has the ability to be responsible defensively when needed, but isn't a shutdown guy or an intimidator. He's not flat-out one dimensional, but his offense is still by far his best attribute. Which I think sounds just like Jeff Carter. So, he's a better Jeff Carter by virtue of two higher end regular seasons and two higher end playoffs (until Carter puts together a couple more very good seasons and playoffs to overtake him with longevity).

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

Miroslav Satan, RW.

 

[jarek]

I think he's gutsy, battle-tested and has the ability to be responsible defensively when needed, but isn't a shutdown guy or an intimidator. He's not flat-out one dimensional, but his offense is still by far his best attribute. Which I think sounds just like Jeff Carter. So, he's a better Jeff Carter by virtue of two higher end regular seasons and two higher end playoffs (until Carter puts together a couple more very good seasons and playoffs to overtake him with longevity).

Yeah, that sounds about right to me.