Around the League - Offseason Edition

[notbias]

Guentzel is out until November earliest?

They will have about $5.9mm in Cap Space.

Not sure they can use it on anyone if he is coming back though.

 

[rocketman588]

When you look at a trade and go I guess on all sides it is probably an ok one. Retaining 25% on petry and paying 10 mil a year for karlsson is kinda weird but whatever.

The team that won this was the Habs unfortunately they got assets to cap dump Hoffman

Guentzel is out until November earliest?

They will have about $5.9mm in Cap Space.

they only have 6 because if guentzel so I assume like 1.5 mil if he's back in nov. You can probably save that to use at the deadline.

I wouldn't like their bottom pairing D if this was us and guentzel being out will be an issue. They also need to rely on neither Letang, Crosby or Malkin getting hurt but it's worth a shot I guess.

10 mil is so steep but I guess you can retain 50% and dump in two years if they truly go off the rails

 

[notbias]

Betting it all on a 37 year old Malgin and 36 yr old Crosby, seems pretty risky. I don’t see it, but he’s doubling down and further mortgaging the future. If it works he’s a genius, odds are it doesn’t.

What is the alternative? Wait out Crosby/Malkin and rebuild? Trade them?

Pittsburgh was pretty much the only place that made sense for Karlsson, and it seems like a fair trade for all.

They will take a last run and then probably rebuild.

Their future has been mortgaged for 10 years.

 

[Jozay]

Slam dunk trade for the Pens.

 

[andora]

I love the idea of the speed demons in the pens forward group are going to have to skate more now to rotate with karlssons rushes

They will be fun though

 

[Sypher04]

Their top 6 and top 4 are great.

Guentzel - Crosby - Rakell
Smith - Malkin - Rust

Graves - Karlsson
Petterson - Letang

Will be fun to watch.

Their 3rd line could be alright too.

X - Ellers - Acciari

Still have Carter too

 

[notbias]

Still have Carter too

Based on how Pen fans talk about him, he is another dump.

 

[rocketman588]

What is the alternative? Wait out Crosby/Malkin and rebuild? Trade them?

Pittsburgh was pretty much the only place that made sense for Karlsson, and it seems like a fair trade for all.

They will take a last run and then probably rebuild.

Their future has been mortgaged for 10 years.

I mean if they want to trade Sid GM knows Tavares pretty well maybe he can sell him on Pittsburgh. We can dream at least lol

 

[ULF_55]

Not sure they can use it on anyone if he is coming back though.

Not for the season, but it gives them room to experiment and there are always waiver players as teams cut down their rosters.

 

[notbias]

Not for the season, but it gives them room to experiment and there are always waiver players as teams cut down their rosters.

I am curious about what someone like Tatar is going to do, I think he may be a buy-low option right now for some team, and the Pens have about 2.5 million if they run 20 skaters. He's probably worth more... but we are also 1 month into free agency and he doesn't have a home.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

I think we just saw with the Bruins how well it works to rely on star players of that age, as talented as they might be. I would have thought Tavares would teach Dubas that just because he can add a player doesn't mean he should, but I guess not. He certainly does like to make moves

 

[francis246]

I think we just saw with the Bruins how well it works to rely on star players of that age, as talented as they might be. I would have thought Tavares would teach Dubas that just because he can add a player doesn't mean he should, but I guess not. He certainly does like to make moves

This situation is completely different than Toronto. Dubas when he took over in Toronto didn’t have to accelerate the rebuild. He could have took his time.

In Pittsburgh, you have the owners, players, fans and other shareholders telling you they don’t give a damn about picks. They want to push for another cup. If all it takes to add a 100 point dman is a protected Top 10 first rounder and a few salary dumps, you do that every day of the week. Easy win for the Penguins. If shit doesn’t work out, they still keep their first in this years draft. If it does work out they make the playoffs and hope their core’s experience of winning takes over.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

This situation is completely different than Toronto. Dubas when he took over in Toronto didn’t have to accelerate the rebuild. He could have took his time.

In Pittsburgh, you have the owners, players, fans and other shareholders telling you they don’t give a damn about picks. They want to push for another cup. If all it takes to add a 100 point dman is a protected Top 10 first rounder and a few salary dumps, you do that every day of the week. Easy win for the Penguins. If shit doesn’t work out, they still keep their first in this years draft. If it does work out they make the playoffs and hope their core’s experience of winning takes over.

Pittsburgh missed the playoffs last year, this trade doesn't vault them into being cup contenders. Just because the fans want another cup doesn't mean that's where they actually are as an organization. The most likely result is they don't come close to winning and just hurt their ability to rebuild

 

[andora]

Pittsburgh missed the playoffs last year, this trade doesn't vault them into being cup contenders. Just because the fans want another cup doesn't mean that's where they actually are as an organization. The most likely result is they don't come close to winning and just hurt their ability to rebuild

You cant tightrope walk that line in their position though.. not when you can ice a number 1 dman for 2/3rds of the game

 

[kb]

Pittsburgh missed the playoffs last year, this trade doesn't vault them into being cup contenders. Just because the fans want another cup doesn't mean that's where they actually are as an organization. The most likely result is they don't come close to winning and just hurt their ability to rebuild

they missed the playoffs on the last day of the season, and they added good players while subtracting older ones. They gave up one top-10 protected 1st.

I know you hate Dubas, but this is.....reaching for excuses. This was a slam dunk trade no matter how you look at it.

They aren't trading off for a rebuild because no one in Pittsburgh has the appetite for that while Crosby is still productive.

 

[francis246]

Pittsburgh missed the playoffs last year, this trade doesn't vault them into being cup contenders. Just because the fans want another cup doesn't mean that's where they actually are as an organization. The most likely result is they don't come close to winning and just hurt their ability to rebuild

Context is important. Pittsburgh missed the playoffs by like 2 points, they blew the lead in a game they should have won and that cost them their playoff spot.

Additionally to that context, Crosby, Malkin and Letang are all unwilling to to leave. So that’s another factor.

 

[Menzinger]

Given the Pens focus on short term competitiveness, adding EK for a couple picks seems like a fair enough gamble.

They get at least 2 years of final competitiveness with their old core, and if things flop it won't matter if EKs a capdump in 2026/7 since they'll be rebuilding anyways by that point.

I'm surprised this trade ended up happening regardless given the cap complexity of it all

 

[notbias]

I think we just saw with the Bruins how well it works to rely on star players of that age, as talented as they might be. I would have thought Tavares would teach Dubas that just because he can add a player doesn't mean he should, but I guess not. He certainly does like to make moves

Vegas relied on people similar age to Karlsson...

Stone, Petro, Marchessault...

They have young talent too, but Petro was their big splash in free agency and Stone/Eichel were the big ones through trades.

Older players can win too.

Adding onto this... not sure Karlsson is Norris level, but he did just win, it isn't like he is completely washed.

 

[Leaf Rocket]

I think thats a very good deal for the Penguins. Well done by him, think Canadiens got the least out of it all but makes sense being kind of the facilitator.

 

[rocketman588]

they missed the playoffs on the last day of the season, and they added good players while subtracting older ones. They gave up one top-10 protected 1st.

I know you hate Dubas, but this is.....reaching for excuses. This was a slam dunk trade no matter how you look at it.

They aren't trading off for a rebuild because no one in Pittsburgh has the appetite for that while Crosby is still productive.

This isn't really a slam dunk trade. Do they really have a shot at the cup, not unless Sid goes insane. And they're going to have short term cap issues because of it. The biggest win in this was dumping granlund. It is an ok gamble but I wouldn't say slam dunk. They're incredibly thin and don't have a complete defense.

My assumption is that FSG wanted 1/2 years of Sid then this fits their timeline for blowing it up after. But the long term cap ramifications are nothing special especially when weighed against the possibility of them actually winning a cup. They need 0 injuries (on a team that's already had one with latang coming off a stroke) and a miracle run to even have a chance.

If they would have gotten karlsson at 6 mill a year then yes this is the deal of the century but they didn't really open up any cap space within their winning window and have to pay guentzel next year. While getting significantly less depth especially on the blueline

I think thats a very good deal for the Penguins. Well done by him, think Canadiens got the least out of it all but makes sense being kind of the facilitator.

I mean you're never going to get much being the third team in but they got a second, rid of Hoffman and two pieces they can dump

 

[notbias]

This isn't really a slam dunk trade. Do they really have a shot at the cup, not unless Sid goes insane. And they're going to have long term cap issues because of it. The biggest win in this was dumping granlund. It is an ok gamble but I wouldn't say slam dunk. They're incredibly thin and don't have a complete defense.

My assumption is that FSG wanted 1/2 years of Sid then this fits their timeline for blowing it up after. But the long term cap ramifications are nothing special especially when weighed against the possibility of them actually winning a cup. They need 0 injuries (on a team that's already had one with latang coming off a stroke) and a miracle run to even have a chance.



I mean you're never going to get much being the third team in but they got a second, rid of Hoffman and two pieces they can dump

I really think this is a win for all teams.

You take your final shot with Crosby over the next few years.

If they rebuild in 2 years, then flip Karlsson at 50% for some assets, he will only be ~34 at the time, and at 5 million, that's probably a good player still.

I don't see a team who lost in this trade, I think every team accomplished what they wanted, and I think the Pens went from might make the playoffs to likely making the playoffs, and then who knows what happens there, they have a lot of game-breaking talent.

As for injuries... probably the biggest concern... but that is probably the biggest concern for anyone who has Malkin on their team, let alone the rest of the players.

 

[fahad203]

Everybody won in this trade. Karlsson makes the Pens a better team today.

Big W for Grier considering he only had 2 teams to work with

Pens had to go for it. I mean why not. Crosby and Malkin deserved another shot

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

they missed the playoffs on the last day of the season, and they added good players while subtracting older ones. They gave up one top-10 protected 1st.

I know you hate Dubas, but this is.....reaching for excuses. This was a slam dunk trade no matter how you look at it.

They aren't trading off for a rebuild because no one in Pittsburgh has the appetite for that while Crosby is still productive.

It's not a slam dunk trade no matter what. If they don't win a cup this year, it was a bad trade. Teams that go all in to compete when they aren't quite there tend to regret it when the inevitable rebuild ends up being far more painful. Look at Detroit pushing to just make the playoffs to keep their streak alive and how unnecessarily long their rebuild has become.

It's fine to like the trade, we can agree to disagree. But don't talk to me about bias when you're unwilling to even conceive of a world where this trade isn't a slam dunk

 

[rocketman588]

I really think this is a win for all teams.

You take your final shot with Crosby over the next few years.

If they rebuild in 2 years, then flip Karlsson at 50% for some assets, he will only be ~34 at the time, and at 5 million, that's probably a good player still.

I don't see a team who lost in this trade, I think every team accomplished what they wanted, and I think the Pens went from might make the playoffs to likely making the playoffs, and then who knows what happens there, they have a lot of game-breaking talent.

As for injuries... probably the biggest concern... but that is probably the biggest concern for anyone who has Malkin on their team, let alone the rest of the players.

It's an above average but not great gamble I would classify it as that rather then a slam dunk but I guess that is splitting hairs

Its success will rely on what dubas tried to rely on here. Superstars coming up big in the playoffs. Which is a significantly better chance with sid at least I'll give him that

 

[The Nic]

San Jose didn't have to retain any salary for Karlsson ???