Around the League 36-But Who's Counting...

[tarheelhockey]

I somehow doubt Dundon is that involved in which reporters get access to interview the team. Seems more a President/GM task delegated to the head media guy.

It’s the job of the Communications director.

Source: me, who once interviewed a Canes draftee without permission for a minor publication and immediately got an email hand-slap from the Communications director.

 

[LostInaLostWorld]

Fair enough. But I don't imagine Wadell or anybody else in the org would be super keen on giving special access to somebody who could suddenly turn on them and take to social media for denunciations at the drop of a hat. I'd be more inclined to deal with a good ole boy like Luke Decock or whomever who could be managed and is predictable.

Keep your friends close; keep your enemies closer.

 

[bleedgreen]

Seattle benefitting finally from playing in the weakest division in hockey by a country mile.

Add in they have 8 guys with very high shooting percentages right now. It is unlikely they maintain that level.

Always that guy, I appreciate your consistency.

Sometimes you can just say “good job by them” or I suppose nothing at all vs a need to diminish someone else accomplishing something good. Or a need to give a shout out to someone struggling who used to be here. Maybe you do it for everyone or maybe it’s just for teams/players that used to have connections to us, but it really stands out.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Letang had a stroke. goodness. Sounds like he is okay

 

[Svechhammer]

Considering Kotkaniemi isn’t paid like a 2C in 2022 money, let alone 2030 money, it’s probably inaccurate to think that either he or Canes management ever had him penciled in as a 2C in the long run. At least not unless you count “glue-guy who’s the nominal 2C by virtue of playing with two good wingers” status, like he was this year.

If he improves to be a long term 3C, he will be doing exactly what he’s paid for.

Trocheck is the wrong comparison and has been all along. The only thing that connects them is that Kotkaniemi became the first attempt at a band-aid when Tro left without a replacement.

Its worth reiterating that KK makes over $1m less per year than our current 3rd line center. Expectations very much need to be adjusted when it comes to him, on both the short and long term.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Its worth reiterating that KK makes over $1m less per year than our current 3rd line center.

And that our current 3C is being paid that much at the end of a 10-year deal.

 

[Ole Gil]

"Between the ears" issues are many times harder to fix than some other issues. I just don't see it in him. Hope I'm wrong though.

Brind'Amour doesn't have a choice. It's either Coghlan or Chatfield...and neither are great options. Right now all of Chatfield, Coghlan and CDH are terrible.

The 3rd pairing isn't going to be out there and score a lot of goals, but they get VERY sheltered minutes and are giving up as many goals as the top 2 pairings in much less TOI.

I'm with you. I don't know what he brings to the table. He's a guy that gets beat one-on-one, makes mistakes defensively, and has 0 points in 23 games.

He doesn't kill penalties. He isn't on the power play. He's leading the defense in Penalties taken/60.

Everything he brings to the table is negative.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I'm with you. I don't know what he brings to the table. He's a guy that gets beat one-on-one, makes mistakes defensively, and has 0 points in 23 games.

He doesn't kill penalties. He isn't on the power play. He's leading the defense in Penalties taken/60.

Everything he brings to the table is negative.

I don't see him being nearly as bad as the rep he gets on this forum. Yes he's rough around the edges. He's a rookie defenseman. But rookie defensemen have to play some time, unless you want to have garbage/overpaid veterans back there and your AHL'ers stuck behind a glass ceiling.

 

[Svechhammer]

And that our current 3C is being paid that much at the end of a 10-year deal.

Yep. KK as a $4.8m per year 3rd line center is absolutely fine for the future. In fact, that's probably where he should be right now if not for Jordo being an elite defensive center. The problem is, Jordo is probably getting what we'd like to pay a 2nd line center while blocking KK from playing there, so there's a bit of an issue where we don't have the cap to get an actual 2nd line center, forcing us to scramble on where to put KK.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Considering Kotkaniemi isn’t paid like a 2C in 2022 money, let alone 2030 money, it’s probably inaccurate to think that either he or Canes management ever had him penciled in as a 2C in the long run. At least not unless you count “glue-guy who’s the nominal 2C by virtue of playing with two good wingers” status, like he was this year.

If he improves to be a long term 3C, he will be doing exactly what he’s paid for.

Trocheck is the wrong comparison and has been all along. The only thing that connects them is that Kotkaniemi became the first attempt at a band-aid when Tro left without a replacement.

the problem I have with this assertion, is that the Canes are in a cup window right now, and there's not guarantee that window will last too long depending on what guys like Aho, TT, Pesce, Skjei, etc.. do. Both goalies are around for 1 year more (Kuchetkov has looked promising though).. Pacioretty was a 1 year deal. Burns isn't getting any younger. I get you are saying "long term", but they certainly pencilled him in short term and hoped it would blossom into a long term thing.

I disagree Trocheck is the wrong comparison. They didn't make any move to replace Trocheck other than sign KK and move him into that role. There were a number of rumors as to who the Canes were going after (Kuzmenko, Pacioretty, Tkachuk, Marchment, etc..) and they are all wingers. Therefore, their actions of not "apparently" going after another top 6 center and with the team aspirations, it's an apt comparison right now. It's "last year's 2C vs. this year's 2C" which is valid.

I agree if he ends up being a good 3C long term it's still a good deal and nobody is complaining about that, but we need a 2C now and a lot can happen between now and down the road.

 

[tarheelhockey]

the problem I have with this assertion, is that the Canes are in a cup window right now, and there's not guarantee that window will last too long depending on what guys like Aho, TT, Pesce, Skjei, etc.. do. Both goalies are around for 1 year more (Kuchetkov has looked promising though).. Pacioretty was a 1 year deal. Burns isn't getting any younger. I get you are saying "long term", but they certainly pencilled him in short term and hoped it would blossom into a long term thing.

I disagree Trocheck is the wrong comparison. They didn't make any move to replace Trocheck other than sign KK and move him into that role. There were a number of rumors as to who the Canes were going after (Kuzmenko, Pacioretty, Tkachuk, Marchment, etc..) and they are all wingers. Therefore, their actions of not "apparently" going after another top 6 center and with the team aspirations, it's an apt comparison right now. It's "last year's 2C vs. this year's 2C" which is valid.

I agree if he ends up being a good 3C long term it's still a good deal and nobody is complaining about that, but we need a 2C now and a lot can happen between now and down the road.

I agree with all of that, but signing Kotkaniemi and letting Trocheck go doesn't amount to Kotkaniemi being Trocheck's replacement.

We simply didn't have a replacement. Trocheck's departure left a big hole in the lineup, and we are still figuring out what to do with it. In a world where Tony DeAngelo has better social skills, we would have been figuring out what to do after Dougie Hamilton left. Maybe we stick Ethan Bear into that power play role to see if he can hack it, but that doesn't mean anyone ever planned on Ethan Bear being a #1 PP quarterback. He's just the dude who happened to be there at that moment.

Is it a problem for a win-now Cup contender to have a huge gaping hole at 2C? Yes it absolutely is. I can't quote the post, but here's what I was saying in June before we knew for sure that Tro was leaving:

I think the make/break dynamic comes from the part about "move on and find affordable replacements". That's not easy to pull off when talking about a Trocheck or TDA or Nino. Frankly they got insanely lucky to pick up TDA at the exact moment that Hamilton left... that kind of luck won't keep falling into place. Likewise, Trocheck and Nino are not easy players to replace. They bring both top-6 offensive production and physicality/edge, a combination which excludes the possibility of affordable replacements. If they let one of these guys go, the replacement is almost certain to be a downgrade or more expensive (or both). Several of the leading candidates just had a huge spring and are going to get big money on the market. If they can't backfill via UFA, and there are no obvious candidates coming up through the system, then it's down to making aggressive trades or accepting a hole in the lineup.

On the other side of the coin, it's even more damaging to be so afraid to lose these guys that we give them UFA-market money. That's where we set an end-date on the development of this version of the team, because there's no way we're paying market money to guys like Nino and Trocheck and also fitting the star players under the cap and also remaining a decently deep team. Something would have to give in a couple of years, and once you start stripping away talent it's hard to get the momentum back.

Management was in a tough spot with that contract. Tro had his warts but he was a very good 2C and it hurt us to lose him. I'm still not sure it was a smart thing to let him go at only $5.6M, even at 7 years, if he was willing to sign here for that kind of number. But I understand why they made the choice. The downside is that he wasn't easily replaceable, and here we are suffering for that choice. To me this has nothing to do with Kotkaniemi and it's a disservice to a young player to hold him to a Trocheck standard when he is not on that kind of trajectory at all.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Fair enough. But I don't imagine Wadell or anybody else in the org would be super keen on giving special access to somebody who could suddenly turn on them and take to social media for denunciations at the drop of a hat. I'd be more inclined to deal with a good ole boy like Luke Decock or whomever who could be managed and is predictable.

Funny you mention Luke, since it's a well-known secret that he stopped being the Canes beat writer because he was calling out terrible decisions made by the management. It's why we have Chip "Dry as toast and just as interesting" Alexander as the N&O's Canes beat writer. And probably why Alexander treats the Canes as an afterthought to anything ACC related.

Very rarely do sports organizations interfere with the affairs of the media covering them. Because generally speaking, if a team/player is getting called out in articles, there's truth behind it, and causing a fight about the coverage would only generate MORE coverage. There's exceptions, of course (Brooks' feud with Torts, for example), but I don't think Sara was in any danger of losing her access anytime soon.

 

[Negan4Coach]

You have no idea how hilarious this statement is. It is fine comedy on its own, but...on the heels of bitching about Civian being an anti-Canes mouthpiece, no less? <chefs kiss>

The "Chef's Kiss" is you white knighting for this

 

[LostInaLostWorld]

Covid killed Sara's access not management.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The "Chef's Kiss" is you white knighting for thisView attachment 615166

LOL, He's not "white knighting" for her. He's pointing out your laughable assertion that Luke DeCock was manageable and predictable.

 

[Sens1Canes2]

Funny you mention Luke, since it's a well-known secret that he stopped being the Canes beat writer because he was calling out terrible decisions made by the management. It's why we have Chip "Dry as toast and just as interesting" Alexander as the N&O's Canes beat writer. And probably why Alexander treats the Canes as an afterthought to anything ACC related.

Very rarely do sports organizations interfere with the affairs of the media covering them. Because generally speaking, if a team/player is getting called out in articles, there's truth behind it, and causing a fight about the coverage would only generate MORE coverage. There's exceptions, of course (Brooks' feud with Torts, for example), but I don't think Sara was in any danger of losing her access anytime soon.

Luke wrote like he wanted the Canes to leave town. It was a very odd vendetta he chose to have.

 

[hblueridgegal]

Am I missing anyone?

Walt - company man coverage, accurate in play assessments and funny takes
Cory - Once weekly The Athletic article and coverage for NSJ, practice tweets
Chip - An article once or twice a month and some practice tweets
Adam Gold - Podcast and tweets
Tom Gulitti - NHL writer who occasionally covers the Canes
Scott Burnside - Monthly (?) Features
Dom & Shayna - Offer brief assessments - data insights and video clips - The Athletic
The NHL regulars - influencers/shills - weigh in on our trades, rumors and controversy
CanesCast - PR mechanism

 

[LostInaLostWorld]

Luke wrote like he wanted the Canes to leave town. It was a very odd vendetta he chose to have.

Luke's schtick is being the contrarian ahole to whatever he's wtiting about. State, Carolina, high school, NASCAR, whatever. Sometimes it is valid, other times not so much.

 

[Negan4Coach]

LOL, He's not "white knighting" for her. He's pointing out your laughable assertion that Luke DeCock was manageable and predictable.

Well, it's been a while since I've read the News and Disturber, and maybe I get him mixed up a bit with that other guy Chip Alexander, but I never found either of them to be really remarkable.

Either way- he wasn't going to be going on Twitter tirades is the main point.

I always wanted Torterella to come coach here- not for the least than to see those two having to deal with him.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Well, it's been a while since I've read the News and Disturber, and maybe I get him mixed up a bit with that other guy Chip Alexander, but I never found either of them to be really remarkable.

Either way- he wasn't going to be going on Twitter tirades is the main point.

He went on plenty of tirades. Whether you confused him with Chip or have selective memory, you’re just wrong about Luke.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Negan is so against Twitter use (which, arguably, is THE most important tool for any journalists right now) that he‘d prefer someone who “isn’t very remarkable“ than someone who uses the site for its intended purpose.

Weird take, but more power to you, I guess.

 

[mikeyfan]

Question would the Canes and/or Stars consider a Coghlan plus Vancouver’s 5th for Colin Miller. Which I think would better stabilize our 3rd pair and allow CDH to play his game without worrying about covering for Chatfield.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Question would the Canes and/or Stars consider a Coghlan plus Vancouver’s 5th for Colin Miller. Which I think would better stabilize our 3rd pair and allow CDH to play his game without worrying about covering for Chatfield.

Miller was one of my soap box picks for good signings. He has turned out to be a great addition for Dallas. I doubt they would have much interest in that.

 

[Negan4Coach]

Negan is so against Twitter use (which, arguably, is THE most important tool for any journalists right now) that he‘d prefer someone who “isn’t very remarkable“ than someone who uses the site for its intended purpose.

Weird take, but more power to you, I guess.

Oh, trust me pal- I'm TOTALLY down with Twitter use now

But you guys are deliberately once again missing the point I'm making. I'm saying if I were the one in charge with access to info about the team- it wouldn't reward somebody who writes frivolous, overwrought stuff like my example. I'd bet there was lest risk with a standard newspaper reporter. And if you can't understand that IDK what to tell you.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Oh, trust me pal- I'm TOTALLY down with Twitter use now

But you guys are deliberately once again missing the point I'm making. I'm saying if I were the one in charge with access to info about the team- it wouldn't reward somebody who writes frivolous, overwrought stuff like my example. I'd bet there was lest risk with a standard newspaper reporter. And if you can't understand that IDK what to tell you.

There’s also less reward with a standard newspaper reporter. Sara was excellent at driving engagement, both towards her articles and towards the team itself. Those arguments she had on Twitter that I’m sure you hated: They drew views. You know the old saying “There’s no such thing as bad publicity”? She embodied that at times. Her Twitter threads about the Aho/KK offer sheets, the ones about DeAngelo, even the ones where she got into her personal life, they drew views to her account, to her writings and to the team she covered.

Which is more than can be said about DeCock or Alexander, who don’t even come close to her numbers in that regard.