Speculation: Armchair GM - Offseason Thread (Summer Edition)

[GoJackets1]

Yawn.

 

[Youngguns1380]

What's funny is I feel like a lot of posters on the general boards would have started to label us a playoff contender if we got Bedard in the lottery. But because we got poor 'ol Fantilli we just continue to suck for 3-5 more seasons.


I think this team is so close to competing that I really don't think playoffs are out of the question.

We get a little luck staying healthy and a little luck with guys taking that next step and we're definitely in the playoff race at the very least.

The biggest issue is goaltending. If we could fast forward and know Elvis is going to rebound - then I say we have a chance.

I would feel better if we could change Elvis for Gibson or Hellebuyck.

If we did and added a top 6C (quality) then I would say we should expect at least competing for a WC.

 

[Long Live Lyle]

Dealing with death is different for everyone, but what is the same is life keeps moving at the same pace. If this is still effecting Elvis, hopefully he is getting the help he needs. Not trying to sound cold-hearted, but you have to move on. Moving on doesn't mean forgetting the person, just getting on with it because he is still here and has a family of his own, and a job to be responsible for.

Yes, of course, but I imagine it’s easier to move on when the guy you shared the tragedy with - and whose house you were at when it happened - isn’t your mentor and isn’t around you every day (which is not something that applied to Korpi’s relationship with Manny but did for Elvis/Manny). That’s the whole point about wanting to see Elvis play without Manny around him every day. Particularly when he has had one great NHL season and another good season already and has a contract that - at the moment - is extremely tough to move (and that’s being kind).

 

[koteka]

What's funny is I feel like a lot of posters on the general boards would have started to label us a playoff contender if we got Bedard in the lottery. But because we got poor 'ol Fantilli we just continue to suck for 3-5 more seasons.

I think it is because everyone looks at the Eastern Conference and thinks it is really tough to compete in. Plus there are teams like Buffalo, Ottawa, and Detroit who are ahead of us on the rebuild. Personally I think the team coming out of the East for the next several years will be one of Florida, Tampa, Carolina, New Jersey, or Buffalo. I don’t see Columbus doing it even if our guys progress very well. Even if we had drafted Bedard I wouldn’t see the Jackets as a playoff team until possibly 25-26.

 

[Youngguns1380]

Ok here is a thought - what about contacting Nashville and trading some roster players + picks for Askarov. Trotz put him in play and maybe he would entertain the call.

Askarov could play in the AHL this season and if needed we could call him up to play. He is a top notch goalie - green but high high ceiling.

Trotz is needing centers so how about Roslovic ++?

 

[ClevelandJacketFan]

I think it is because everyone looks at the Eastern Conference and thinks it is really tough to compete in. Plus there are teams like Buffalo, Ottawa, and Detroit who are ahead of us on the rebuild. Personally I think the team coming out of the East for the next several years will be one of Florida, Tampa, Carolina, New Jersey, or Buffalo. I don’t see Columbus doing it even if our guys progress very well. Even if we had drafted Bedard I wouldn’t see the Jackets as a playoff team until possibly 25-26.

You really believe Detroit is ahead of us?

 

[stevo61]

Ok here is a thought - what about contacting Nashville and trading some roster players + picks for Askarov. Trotz put him in play and maybe he would entertain the call.

Askarov could play in the AHL this season and if needed we could call him up to play. He is a top notch goalie - green but high high ceiling.

Trotz is needing centers so how about Roslovic ++?

I think he was in play specifically to move up in this draft and make some noise while in Nashville. I doubt he actively shopping him

 

[Monstershockey]

Yes, of course, but I imagine it’s easier to move on when the guy you shared the tragedy with - and whose house you were at when it happened - isn’t your mentor and isn’t around you every day (which is not something that applied to Korpi’s relationship with Manny but did for Elvis/Manny). That’s the whole point about wanting to see Elvis play without Manny around him every day. Particularly when he has had one great NHL season and another good season already and has a contract that - at the moment - is extremely tough to move (and that’s being kind).

I haven't been saying we need to move Elvis. I also get why they changed coaches. Their relationship may have soured if he puts any blame on Manny for what happened, or their relationship could have become stronger because they both lost someone each considered family. Sharing a tragedy can sometimes help as the person went through it with him. It was just as hard on Manny as he looked at Kiv like a son, and it was at his house/party that it happened.

For all we know, Elvis' struggles could be that he has been figured out at hasn't been able to adjust or fix his game. Maybe Manny isn't able to help and a new guy can. But it could also be that his first and last years were outliers and he is just an average goalie who had a good first season and a bad fourth season, which wouldn't be bad. It is basically what I have thought of him his whole career so far, that he is just another average goalie.

 

[Youngguns1380]

I think he was in play specifically to move up in this draft and make some noise while in Nashville. I doubt he actively shopping him

Why not call and see of there is a number or possibility. Doesn’t hurt to ask.

Heard they are possibly shopping him for Pesce?

 

[stevo61]

Why not call and see of there is a number or possibility. Doesn’t hurt to ask.

Definitely doesnt hurt to ask. Im just saying I bet he spins it to Askarov that teams asked for him but Trotz couldnt pull the trigger. Maybe you can pry him away, I just think its unlikely. Feels like they wanted Michkov and were willing to deal pieces they were uncomfortable moving

 

[Sdrawkcab321]

We've sucked since the year 2000. No one knows exactly why we've sucked all that time, so there's no answer. So we discuss it here.

I'm only surprised we're not discussing a sacred curse or secret deal with the mafia by now.

PS Don't talk to me about the Tampa series. We win ONE freaking playoff series and that's the highlight of the franchise?!? That's the epitome of suck right there.

Imagine also being a browns fan…

 

[CBJx614]

The biggest issue is goaltending. If we could fast forward and know Elvis is going to rebound - then I say we have a chance.

I would feel better if we could change Elvis for Gibson or Hellebuyck.

If we did and added a top 6C (quality) then I would say we should expect at least competing for a WC.

Even if Elvis rebounds, is that because of Elvis or the defense playing in front of him. If Provorov can get back to close to what he was drafted to be playing with more support both defensively and offensively.. Not to mention a new coach with (hopefully) and actual defensive structure alone could make a massive difference. I just think it's too early to tell just because there's SO many variables that changed in the off-season.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Even if Elvis rebounds, is that because of Elvis or the defense playing in front of him.

I think that depends on who you ask.

If you ask some people on here, they will say his sole job is to stop pucks and if he stops pucks they probably will still try to find a way discredit him.

I however think it would actually be a combination of the 2 because the team does need to get better at not giving up high danger changes all the time and put the goaltender in a position to have a better opportunity to make saves.

 

[BB88]

Ok here is a thought - what about contacting Nashville and trading some roster players + picks for Askarov. Trotz put him in play and maybe he would entertain the call.

Askarov could play in the AHL this season and if needed we could call him up to play. He is a top notch goalie - green but high high ceiling.

Trotz is needing centers so how about Roslovic ++?

You’d have to give up a franchise/A tier forward prospect for him

It was rumoured that Nashville really wanted a top4/5 pick and most likely Askarov was available for that.

Roslovic+ b assets does nothing for them

 

[koteka]

You really believe Detroit is ahead of us?

Yes. They have a better general manager. They have identified who their centers are. They have done a great job drafting defensive players and not rushing them. Neither team has a goalie, but they have Cossa in the pipeline. They look like they have been following the same plan for several years, and it is about to pay off. Their cap situation is great. Their only long contract is Dylan Larkin through his age 33 season for less than a $9 million cap hit. I’d say they are ahead of us. We have better wings. You really think we are ahead of them?

 

[majormajor]

Yes. They have a better general manager. They have identified who their centers are. They have done a great job drafting defensive players and not rushing them. Neither team has a goalie, but they have Cossa in the pipeline. They look like they have been following the same plan for several years, and it is about to pay off. Their cap situation is great. Their only long contract is Dylan Larkin through his age 33 season for less than a $9 million cap hit. I’d say they are ahead of us. We have better wings. You really think we are ahead of them?

Yzerman has done a lot of things smarter but he's playing on hard mode compared to Jarmo. The asset base in Detroit was gutted by Holland. I can see the approach paying off for Detroit but they'll need more time.

 

[Viqsi]

Ok here is a thought - what about contacting Nashville and trading some roster players + picks for Askarov. Trotz put him in play and maybe he would entertain the call.

Askarov could play in the AHL this season and if needed we could call him up to play. He is a top notch goalie - green but high high ceiling.

Trotz is needing centers so how about Roslovic ++?

Getting Askarov would have meant giving up Fantilli; he was only available as part of an attempt to trade into the top-5.

And starting with Roslovic would be an insult.

 

[DoingItCoolKiwi]

Getting Askarov would have meant giving up Fantilli; he was only available as part of an attempt to trade into the top-5.

And starting with Roslovic would be an insult.

That's a stretch. The word is Preds tried to trade 15th pick + Askarov for a high pick (let's say top 5). Fantilli's value significantly higher than what 5th pick was this year. I mean, imagine the price it'd have taken to move from 5th to pick Fantilli.

But yeah, Roslovic has no value. If Preds like Mateychuk you could maybe work something out there. Those two are somewhat in the same league

 

[cbjthrowaway]

What I will continue to say is, I don’t think he was a better or different goalie before or after the accident.

he was, statistically speaking, a top 10 goalie for the two years before the accident. since the accident he's been the worst goalie in the league.

you can think whatever you want but this particular view isn't accurate.

 

[thebus88]

he was, statistically speaking, a top 10 goalie for the two years before the accident. since the accident he's been the worst goalie in the league.

you can think whatever you want but this particular view isn't accurate.

Your (and many other fans) views on players abilities or “skill” changing so DRASTICALLY year to year are NOT accurate.

Just because the “results” or “stats” are different, doesn’t not mean that the player is different. There are all types of variables and aspects of “chance” or “luck”.

The shutout numbers from year 1 are not representative of who or what Elvis IS as a goalie. And they have a huge impact on what his end of the year statistics looked like. Not only that, but, you guys continue to ignore the fact that in 19-20, Korpisalo’s “statistics” were not much worse than Elvis, he had a better record than him, AND he was chosen as the starter in the POs.

No different than in 19-20, in 20-21 many people (IMO) just continued to vastly OVERRATE Elvis, for a variety of different reasons IMO. He’s never been a good goalie, I don’t care what the “statistics” say. It’s worth mentioning that he played just 60 games over these 2 years.

Looked it up, in 2019/20, the CBJ were tied for 3rd in goals against. How much of that has to do with Torts and the defense and how much has to do with Elvis Merzlikins?? He played 33 games out of 70.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Your (and many other fans) views on players abilities or “skill” changing so DRASTICALLY year to year are NOT accurate. The shutout numbers from year 1 are not representative of who or what Elvis IS as a goalie. And they have a huge impact on what his end of the year statistics looked like.

he had a long stretch in 19-20 (from new year's eve through valentine's day) where he put up a .948 sv% across 17 games. he didn't have a single full game this season where he had a sv% that high.

talent, skill and execution are different things. even if elvis's physical talent hasn't changed, his performance has shown clear degradation in his game.

i'd also argue that his actual physical ability has been diminished due to poor conditioning and injuries that have resulted from that. as someone who has depression myself… well, i can sure see a lot of validity to the idea that his mental health contributed to him developing poor habits or losing focus.

Not only that, but, you guys continue to ignore the fact that in 19-20, Korpisalo’s “statistics” were not much worse than Elvis, he had a better record than him, AND he was chosen as the starter in the POs.

literally no one is ignoring korpisalo. i was responding to your comment that was specifically about elvis. if anyone's ignoring korpisalo here, it's you.

No different than in 19-20, in 20-21 many people (IMO) just continued to vastly OVERRATE Elvis, for a variety of different reasons IMO. He’s never been a good goalie, I don’t care what the “statistics” say.

liking/disliking players is one thing, but if you're dismissing production entirely, your evaluation can't be taken seriously as at that point is is solely based on vibes/personal feelings.

at that point it's not a discussion, it's just you digging in and refusing to be swayed, while also bringing nothing to the table that will reasonably sway someone else (see also: any discussion you've been involved in about patrik laine for the last few years).

Looked it up, in 2019/20, the CBJ were tied for 3rd in goals against. How much of that has to do with Torts and the defense and how much has to do with Elvis Merzlikins?? He played 33 games out of 70.

let's use your logic and keep following that line of thought.

he was voted as a top-five goalie in a season when the jackets had a top-five defense. last year they gave up the second most goals against and he was a bottom goalie in the league.

you are arguing that it's solely because of the team, not because of elvis, who you say is the exact same goalie he was in 19-20.

the jackets, having added a veteran defensive coach (babcock), getting werenski back, adding provorov/severson and drafting fantilli, much more closely resemble that 19-20 team (which wasn't even in a wild card spot at the end of the season) than the teams the jackets had the last two years.

so… by your logic – because you think production doesn't align whatsoever with player quality – you're actually saying we should expect another .923 sv% season from elvis. that's just what your logic says.

 

[thebus88]

How soon we forget.

 

[BB88]

Yes. They have a better general manager. They have identified who their centers are. They have done a great job drafting defensive players and not rushing them. Neither team has a goalie, but they have Cossa in the pipeline. They look like they have been following the same plan for several years, and it is about to pay off. Their cap situation is great. Their only long contract is Dylan Larkin through his age 33 season for less than a $9 million cap hit. I’d say they are ahead of us. We have better wings. You really think we are ahead of them?

What has the Gm done to suggest he’s better?

Have you missed all the Gubranson contracts he’s been giving out?

In a way Detroit is ahead because they started their rebuild earlier but as built their ceiling is lower.

Larkin/Raymond/Kasper really isn’t a high end F core& if DeBrincat will be their superstar addition it still won’t be because they’ll have the same problem. Zero franchise forwards

 

[stevo61]

How soon we forget.

Now post this year vs Edmonton

 

[VT]

What has the Gm done to suggest he’s better?

Have you missed all the Gubranson contracts he’s been giving out?

In a way Detroit is ahead because they started their rebuild earlier but as built their ceiling is lower.

Larkin/Raymond/Kasper really isn’t a high end F core& if DeBrincat will be their superstar addition it still won’t be because they’ll have the same problem. Zero franchise forwards

DeBrincat can be superstar only if Detroit finds new Patrick Kane. An overrated player.