Are things as bad as we're saying?

[Bomber0104]

Are the Blues' stars that much more talented than the Leafs? And if big star power were the key factor, how did Boston lose to the Blues?

No worries, won't be changing.

Why? Because St Louis has an amazing collection of defencemen and defensive forwards which Toronto also has none of.

It's an even worse comparison.

 

[Daisy Jane]

how many people here have had a boss who they thought was incompetent? Now how many went to work and under performed hoping it meant your boss would be fired? Exactly, only one being fired would be the worker not doing their job properly.

LOL i had to read that one a few times. i'm like. um... i wouldn't. because i'd be fired haha


honestly - the way i see it is this.

most people here aren't happy about it, but a good chunk of people want to handwave it to being TLFS (Typical leaf Fan syndrome) that people are over-reacting, and things will be fine, and pick last year feel good story (this time being the Blues), that hey - if they did it - the Leafs can do it. TAH DAH!

but is being ignored (I feel) that a lot of the frustration, even removing a lot of the considerations that I would see as factors (Tavares's Baby Brain, having the massive contracts to live up to etc which - are not excuses but are factors of why they are performing poorly) is that a lot of issues that have been issues since Last year (or even the year before) is still there. as a team, they aren't being coached. to the best of their abilities. I think they are being prepared properly, but its obviously that 50 percent of the time it's not executed properly or it's not the best way.

I do think there needs to be some wholesale changes both behind the bench and on the ice. but i've been saying that i would trade some of our offense for better balance else where for years so that's nothing new. and this isn't because i am like. "OOH KEEFE" (because i don't know if he'd be the answer - but i personally don't know if i would make more significant changes (outside of defense) before seeing how they would work with a different coach.

(not to mention with the hand wringing with a lot of people about how 'soft' the team is - which i think is the least of this teams problems, i do feel that maybe if they had a different coach, they'd be more incline to be more aggressive. I don't really remember any Babcock coached team being all known for being outwardly physical).

 

[egd27]

do you think he's blameless? and/or should not be let go?

1. He is not blameless.
2. The players are not playing up to their billing as highly skilled NHLers. While I believe that is more their problem than a coaching problem, the problem nevertheless exists. If this isn't remedied soon with the return of Hyman, Dermott, & Tavares, the next logical step is to see if a coaching change will get them playing up their supposed potential.

 

[Daisy Jane]

1. He is not blameless.
2. The players are not playing up to their billing as highly skilled NHLers. While I believe that is more their problem than a coaching problem, the problem nevertheless exists. If this isn't remedied soon with the return of Hyman, Dermott, & Tavares, the next logical step is to see if a coaching change will get them playing up their supposed potential.

i agree.

 

[4thline]

6-2-1 in games that Hutch hasn't been in(2nd game of the back to back).

That's why i'm not really worried about the team, but this was an awful schedule to have and the team really **** the bed for not addressing the backup problem.

Should be stickied.

 

[Ashdown2]

OF course its bad. It not just points here is the details

- 20th in the league in P% (point per game)
- played the most home games
- played a pretty easy schedule IMO. besides TB, bruinsx2, stl and caps they havnt faced "great teams". was anyone expecting columbusx2, ottawa, detroit, san jose, minny, or montrealx2 to be playoff teams this year? id say all those teams miss
-

so yeah its pretty bad
oh yeah the most claring stat is that their record since last january is like 16-18-6 (or something like that)
teams with records like that finish bottom 4 in the conference.

 

[Trapper]

Everyone needs to watch this team like they don't cheer for them, know who anyone is and meet back in 10 games to tell what they saw.

 

[tmlfan98]

Our defensive problems can probably be fixed with a Nick Jensen-type acquisition to play with Rielly, while offing Ceci from the team and calling up Sandin/Liljegren to play with Dermott in the playoffs. Unless Holl proves he should just remain 6D.

In terms of goaltending, the Blues basically threw **** against the wall last year to see what would stick after Chad Johnson was a trash backup, and Binnington stuck. Not saying we should expect this to happen, but before wasting another asset on another Michael Hutchinson, we should maybe give the other goalies in the system a look.

 

[hockeyes]

I don't know how anyone can look at the last year and think there isn't a valid reason for concern, this isn't just a rocky start, it's a continuation of the same uninspired hockey. Who cares if they squeak into the playoffs just to get embarrassed again?

 

[Gary Nylund]

6-2-1 in games that Hutch hasn't been in(2nd game of the back to back).

That's why i'm not really worried about the team, but this was an awful schedule to have and the team really **** the bed for not addressing the backup problem.

I was trying to console myself with this simple fact but it didn't work. People can moan all they want about our schedule but it hasn't been all bad as we've played some really bad teams as well. IIRC we've yet to beat a good team in regulation, that's pretty bad no matter how much you try to rationalize it. Also, blaming Hutch is easy but we didn't lose all those games because of him, against MTL for example, he played a lot better than most of the other guys on the team.

As a team, we've been pretty bad, that's the bottom line. And it's not just the W/L record either, almost everything about our performance has been bad.

 

[X66]

I was trying to console myself with this simple fact but it didn't work. People can moan all they want about our schedule but it hasn't been all bad as we've played some really bad teams as well. IIRC we've yet to beat a good team in regulation, that's pretty bad no matter how much you try to rationalize it. Also, blaming Hutch is easy but we didn't lose all those games because of him, against MTL for example, he played a lot better than most of the other guys on the team.

As a team, we've been pretty bad, that's the bottom line. And it's not just the W/L record either, almost everything about our performance has been bad.

The amount of games they've had to play with their injuries have been brutal.

The second game of the back to back has been against some tough teams as well, Habs x2, Bruins in Boston, Caps in Washington.

Hutch deserves all the blame he gets, the simple fact is he hasn't given the team a chance to win in any of those games. He cannot stop the bleeding has yet to make the big save to help the team out. That's a huge fail for management so far.

Leafs gave him a 4-1 lead against Montreal.
They gave him a 2-0 lead against the Caps.
They gave him a 2-2 game against the Bruins going into the 3rd.
They gave him a 2-2 game against the Habs going into the 3rd.

He has not held up his end of the bargain, no excuse at all.

 

[Ms Maggie]

Why? Because St Louis has an amazing collection of defencemen and defensive forwards which Toronto also has none of.

It's an even worse comparison.

And yet they have only 1 pt more than the Leafs in the standings. Again, it's October. Good luck through the season.

 

[Cobra777]

dunno if this interview worked here but its bang on

 

[Gary Nylund]

The amount of games they've had to play with their injuries have been brutal.

The second game of the back to back has been against some tough teams as well, Habs x2, Bruins in Boston, Caps in Washington.

Hutch deserves all the blame he gets, the simple fact is he hasn't given the team a chance to win in any of those games. He cannot stop the bleeding has yet to make the big save to help the team out. That's a huge fail for management so far.

Leafs gave him a 4-1 lead against Montreal.
They gave him a 2-0 lead against the Caps.
They gave him a 2-2 game against the Bruins going into the 3rd.
They gave him a 2-2 game against the Habs going into the 3rd.

He has not held up his end of the bargain, no excuse at all.

Agree that Hutch hasn't been good. The rest of the team hasn't been good either though (with very few exceptions). From Matthews to the other big guns to the Dmen to our #1 goalie, none of them have been playing well. The bottom 6 has been good, that's about it.

 

[ShaneFalco]

“I feel like everyone’s coming at us like it’s the end of the world here. We’re OK. Every team goes through it, and we’re having some talks, but, I mean, it’s not frickin’ go crazy.”
– Jake Muzzin on the Leafs’ struggles

Naturally, he’s right. This is also what happens when players get paid, though – the honeymoon period is over, and expectations are high.

“These guys are getting great opportunity themselves. Rehearsal has been longer than probably we expected. We are going to have a way to make good decisions at the time when that happens.”
– Mike Babcock on upcoming roster additions​

Toronto Maple Leafs Notebook: Is Mike Babcock to blame for a 6-5-2 start?

 

[Clark4Ever]

My thoughts in a nutshell:

We are currently underachieving based on the strength of our roster. It should help having Hyman, Dermott, and Tavares return to the lineup but that doesn't absolve Babcock of the team's lackluster performance thus far.

Even if Babcock or another coach can get this group of players firing on all cylinders, we will still likely end up where we were the last few years - a 100 point team that gets bounced in the first round. At some point, Dubas will have to address the lack of grit on the roster, and some difficult decisions will have to be made in order to rectify that.

 

[AreBe]

If you are a Patrick O’Thuggo dinosaur, yes.
If you are an Ivan Svensky realist,no.
Sadly, many dinosaurs here in Leafs Nation, listening to Moron Man, trying to build the team from the penalty box out

 

[ShaneFalco]

My thoughts in a nutshell:

We are currently underachieving based on the strength of our roster. It should help having Hyman, Dermott, and Tavares return to the lineup but that doesn't absolve Babcock of the team's lackluster performance thus far.

Even if Babcock or another coach can get this group of players firing on all cylinders, we will still likely end up where we were the last few years - a 100 point team that gets bounced in the first round. At some point, Dubas will have to address the lack of grit on the roster, and some difficult decisions will have to be made in order to rectify that.

That's pretty much where I'm at too

 

[Madap]

I've pretty much completely soured on Babs. I don't like his roster decisions and I don't like his strategy. I understand Dubas hasn't given him exactly what he wants, but who gives a s***? Dubas has given him enough. He needs to learn how to adapt and change strategies to bring out our strengths. With that being said, I still wouldn't fire him right now. Wait until our whole team is back to make a final judgement call.

I have a feeling that Hyman coming back will have a huge impact on the team. He'll bring some much needed energy to our lineup, and hopefully that will get our stars going too. Don't get me wrong, I think its pathetic that this team needs Hyman (as much as I love him) to get them going, but I think that's what will happen.

 

[rumman]

Everyone needs to watch this team like they don't cheer for them, know who anyone is and meet back in 10 games to tell what they saw.

objective assessments are frowned upon here in my experience, if you mention a concern your a troll or worse. Never take your rose coloured glasses off.

 

[Daisy Jane]

“I feel like everyone’s coming at us like it’s the end of the world here. We’re OK. Every team goes through it, and we’re having some talks, but, I mean, it’s not frickin’ go crazy.”
– Jake Muzzin on the Leafs’ struggles

Naturally, he’s right. This is also what happens when players get paid, though – the honeymoon period is over, and expectations are high.

“These guys are getting great opportunity themselves. Rehearsal has been longer than probably we expected. We are going to have a way to make good decisions at the time when that happens.”
– Mike Babcock on upcoming roster additions​

Toronto Maple Leafs Notebook: Is Mike Babcock to blame for a 6-5-2 start?

and the thing is i don't think people would be "coming at them like it's the end of the world." if they looked like they had some effort. they look kinda poop.

 

[stealth1]

Everyone keeps blaming the schedule, injuries and th backup goalie. You still have your 2 supposed elite players. They should be carrying this team when these things happen.

Look at the Sabres, they have had a few games this season where their top player in Eichel has taken the team on his back. One game he had 4 points to lead the way to a win. When has Matthews or Marner done that.

 

[Maple Leaf]

It's over
Trade Marner for picks

 

[Trapper]

and the thing is i don't think people would be "coming at them like it's the end of the world." if they looked like they had some effort. they look kinda poop.

It's all about attitude.
Oh no we got scored on first again. Who looks like they care?
Would you dare to find some intensity and look like you are going to attempt something out of your comfort zone to pull the team along?
No? I've skated here 20 times and scored, I don't know why nothing is working. Guess it's time to look in the mirror.

 

[Daisy Jane]

It's all about attitude.
Oh no we got scored on first again. Who looks like they care?
Would you dare to find some intensity and look like you are going to attempt something out of your comfort zone to pull the team along?
No? I've skated here 20 times and scored, I don't know why nothing is working. Guess it's time to look in the mirror.

and that's what people are upset about.
I think if they were doing their best and just simply losing we would know this is a funk they'd shake out of. this is the same attitude we've seen for several months with no signs it's gonna go.