it's not 2016 anymore. the time for waiting for guys to develop or improve that have been here since the new regime is over. Anderson has shown us his hand for 4 years. He starts bad and ends bad. In the middle he is good. That's not good enough. If we make the playoffs, and guys like Marner/Nylander have another atrocious run, then I think you also need to move one of them. Before you know it, our core will be old and broken up and it will be because these guys keep getting chance after chance. I would rather move on from Freddy. He is who he is. He is a good goalie but he is awful when you need him the most and a slow start in a shortened season will be the difference between making it and missing out.
Andersen decision looming for Leafs
- Thread starter LeafsNation75
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BAM
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- Nov 21, 2016
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I think one of the biggest issues right now not just with the Leafs but across the league is depending heavily on 1 goalie as opposed to a tandem. Having two guys battling each other over the course of the season only benefits the team. The only way this can be excused is if you have a top 5-10 goalie in the league and Andersen doesn't look like that guy anymore.
Murray wasn't even 25 when he did it and he did as a rookie twice, he won't be Jack Campbell current age for 3 more years
Crawford won a cup at 29 but he had back to back seasons of 57 games prior to that.
Binnington won a cup as a rookie and was only a couple years older than Matt Murray when he did it.
The only example in my list that supports Jack Campbell being a starter is Tim Thomas there is a reason for that it's because Tim Thomas is rare, Tim Thomas is like winning 50 million, sure you can do it but it's never expected
You're conflating two different topics
-Jack Campbell emerging as a cup capable starter
-needing a player proven as a high end starter before the season starts to win a cup
and then seeming to mix in the misconception that only the goalies that *have* won cups were good enough to do so.
I'll repeat, three of the last 11 cup winners did so on the backs of goalies that - at the start of the season- you would have vehemently argued were incapable of doing so.
if belfour was in net for this team you’d see a cup.
ottomaddox
Registered User
As soon as Dubie put him out there this past summer for a trade Freddy is as good as gone and he knows it. I mean he is swimming like crazy in his net. He used to be a goaler who relied on size and technique but now he is swimming big time. Like you said we won't even get a bag of pucks from him now. We should have got whatever best offer was this summer and moved on. Even a couple lower round picks would have been better. This has been massively screwed up. I think we kept him cause he is Matty's friend.Is he even worth a bag of pucks?
Nothing in Campbells resume points to him being a capable starting goaltender over an extended period of time. He hasn't ever been anything more than average in the AHL under a modest workload, and short of a 31 game sample two seasons ago where he put up a .928, he's been eerily consistent as a .905-.915 goaltender at every level.
It's hard for me to envision a scenario where Andersen is a Leaf next season as well. If he plays well he'll be lookimg for his retirement contract which will price him out, if he plays poorly both sides will probably want to move on after a couple of down seasons.
I suspect this is a problem that will have to be addressed through trade this summer.
It's hard for me to envision a scenario where Andersen is a Leaf next season as well. If he plays well he'll be lookimg for his retirement contract which will price him out, if he plays poorly both sides will probably want to move on after a couple of down seasons.
I suspect this is a problem that will have to be addressed through trade this summer.
You never want to put your life on da line with a key guy who decides game on his own who is dead to you
OldTimeHockey
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- Oct 20, 2003
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Coachcorner
Senor Martinez
- Sep 28, 2017
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He's been the first minder for a real reason. Many of y'all will see and witness that tonight again for example. They pay (professionals the gm's etc) for a reason. I got mad respect for these fools. They know their thang hard. But yeah, he needs to be a bit better too, as does our whole squad. Interesting to see if simmonds plays 8 minutes tonight or something like that. We need a high scoring fool team tonight, doing their thang. Expecting to see a matthews goal tonight for example. He that hart and lighter now. Mayne we bout our money and game!
It means you don't go with a goaler whose days are numbered here ... he knows it ... Dubie knows it .. most of fans know it
OldTimeHockey
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- Oct 20, 2003
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I don't know it. Unless you can present me with a better option, I wouldn't be surprised if he was extended.
If he could play like last night every game including playoffs then I am fine with it as long as Zach and Morgan can be resigned. But his history of blowing up in 8 straight big time pressure packed deciding games tells me he will do same once again. Some guys, it is sad, they just don't have what it takes. Great guys but they can't win. And at 31/32 it is a risky proposition of getting stuck with his contract. If they did resign then 1 year at a number that allows them to resign both guys above. If he wants big $$$ or big term then he must be told thanks but no thanks. And if it was me I would move him for an asset. We are not winning a Cup with this team this year so to me I would want to get something back. Now if it is 2021 pick then I would keep him on roster because that draft just sucks. But if we can get another solid defensive minded D with both size and speed then I would do it. I think Dubie already tried and it not available so likely, unless an injury occurs, he will walk in summer. And if we can get past a round in playoffs this year then fine. We have to focus on making progress and at least getting through round 1. Hopefully round 2 but minimum round 1.
Anderson has a weak spot. MOST of his soft goals he lets in, between his body and his blocker. The word is clearly out on him. These shots are going thru him, they are not well placed shots.
zeke
The Dube Abides
- Mar 14, 2005
- 66,937
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also between his legs.
his length is also his achilles heel. leaves a lot of holes.
Suntouchable13
Registered User
Leafs simply can not afford to pay a goalie much more than what Andy is making now. Best bets are to re-sign him at around the same cap hit for 3 years or so. OR go with a tandem. Either way, don't expect great goaltending. It'll be average or just above average, at best. Unless you get lucky with somebody. Leafs are going to have to win with that if you wanna keep Hyman, you wanna keep Rielly, and keep the top 40 mil forwards all intact.
OldTimeHockey
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- Oct 20, 2003
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That makes no sense.
You state "the word is out on him" but then state "they are not well placed shots"...Which one is it.
I've been coaching goalies for 25 years. I can tell you that the blocker side, about 18 inches off the ice, is the hardest spot for a goalie to defend. It's not shocking when a goalie gets beat here. It looks bad, but it's a pretty common weak spot on a large portion of goalies. Honestly, I've never seen it as an Andersen "problem".
I'm not a big Andersen fan. I'm really not. I find he gets caught flat out on his belly way too often. His recovery time, is not particularly quick. I also think that he mails it in on occasion. It's funny though. That seems to be a problem with this team's core as well.
HamiltonNHL
Resigning Marner == Running it back
- Jan 4, 2012
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It's actually
5-0-0
1.60 GA
.946 SV%
Not bad for a guy that's no longer an NHL goalie.
makbeer
Registered User
- Sep 28, 2006
- 1,234
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A lot of people made fun of his 5 hole - are those people counting how many Jack has let in 5 hole this season. Not to mention the opening goal in game 7 of the playoffs 5 hole from a mile out with no screen from a noted 3rd line sniper.
If you watch Jack move in his butterfly, the 5 hole is much more exposed than Andersen.
If you watch Jack move in his butterfly, the 5 hole is much more exposed than Andersen.
makbeer
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- Sep 28, 2006
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Anyone who wrote off Freddy just shows they don't have a clue how to evaluate goaltending or predict the likelihood of future success based on technique, talent and frame - they just know how to react emotionally to past results.
This is also the difference between fans and coaches.
This is also the difference between fans and coaches.
Stephen
Moderator
- Feb 28, 2002
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I’m still glad he’s gone because the critical factor here is Carolina. Aka the team in front of him. And they were good enough to insulate a custodial worker to a win in a pros vs Joe’s contest.
makbeer
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- Sep 28, 2006
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If you watch both extensively:
Freddy is better at:
angles, post-integration, lateral movement, speed, size, glove, puckhandling, durability, butterfly block, rebound control, 5 hole, box control
Jack is better at:
Breakaways, scrambles, depth, blocker, being unpredictable, finding pucks through screens, being a nice guy, 7 hole
both are equally bad at finding loose pucks in the crease
Both are good goalies.
Freddy is marginally better, and has proven #1.
Jack's attitude makes him one of the best backups or tandem goalies in the NHL, unproven as a #1 goalie.
I'd rather have Freddy in net for the season. But not necessarily in Toronto. Great goalie but the fanbase had turned on him.
I was hoping for Ullmark who I believe has #1 goalie potential and has started 2-0 with a .935. Mainly because I saw him as a guy who could potentially be our goalie for the next few years.
Mrazek for 3 yrs at over 3m was the worst possible situation, as Jack will be a UFA and probably command more than 1.6 and we can't keep Mrazek as our starter. This means next season's goalie position is going to be either expensive or bad.
Freddy is better at:
angles, post-integration, lateral movement, speed, size, glove, puckhandling, durability, butterfly block, rebound control, 5 hole, box control
Jack is better at:
Breakaways, scrambles, depth, blocker, being unpredictable, finding pucks through screens, being a nice guy, 7 hole
both are equally bad at finding loose pucks in the crease
Both are good goalies.
Freddy is marginally better, and has proven #1.
Jack's attitude makes him one of the best backups or tandem goalies in the NHL, unproven as a #1 goalie.
I'd rather have Freddy in net for the season. But not necessarily in Toronto. Great goalie but the fanbase had turned on him.
I was hoping for Ullmark who I believe has #1 goalie potential and has started 2-0 with a .935. Mainly because I saw him as a guy who could potentially be our goalie for the next few years.
Mrazek for 3 yrs at over 3m was the worst possible situation, as Jack will be a UFA and probably command more than 1.6 and we can't keep Mrazek as our starter. This means next season's goalie position is going to be either expensive or bad.
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