Post-Game Talk: And that should be the end of the Leafs core

[Captain Crunch]

So 6 games in we need change to turn the season around, but that change can't actually be anything that immediately alters the on-ice group?

Rational stuff.

No, it’s more rational to keep drinking the koolaid that management and this core are giving us! And it hasn’t just been for 6 games, it’s been since we lost to Columbus, therefore over 2 years. I think that’s a big enough sample size.

 

[Stigma]

So you feel that having half your cap tied up now in 3 centers and a winger will be better than having it tied up in 2 centers and 2 wingers?
Sorry, I don’t agree. This team is built wrong. Guaranteed we won’t win anything while half the cap is tied up on 4 forwards.

I mean, yeah, you may be right. But, nothing says Tavares can't go eventually. Even the worst contracts get moved.

 

[All Mod Cons]

And after that 15 games, the team is 12-7-2. The new GM decides the group is fine, just had a rocky start. Elects to do nothing.

Firing the GM now accomplished what exactly?

Getting rid of the GM.

 

[Captain Crunch]

I mean, yeah, you may be right. But, nothing says Tavares can't go eventually. Even the worst contracts get moved.

But I believe this core doesn’t have it, meaning that killer instinct. And I also believe that locker room isn’t as comfy and cozy as they’d like everyone to think.

 

[theTTC]

Came here to see the overreactions. Wasn’t disappointed.

Happy to entertain you.

 

[4thline]

Came here to see the overreactions. Wasn’t disappointed.

I am super hopeful that much of this fanbase has someone else managing their money, and rock solid sensible significant others.

 

[Cynical]

Freddy was out played by every goalie he went up against in key situations ...
Could not make a clutch save to save his life ... so let's not open that one up for analysis.

It looked like he was being outplayed because the Leafs play a very soft offensive game. There's a reason why we always hear the phrase "we ran into a hot goaltender" around herev.

Every goalie in the league doesn't get hot when they face the Leafs. The Leafs just do not scare anyone with the way they play. They're too easy to play against and the goalies have it pretty easy seeing their shots. They're underachieving with the talent they have because of how they play.

 

[4thline]

At some point you’ve got to look beyond the short term if you are Shanahan.

If the idea of firing Dubas is on the table... there are 2 major decisions looming with very long term implications:

1. Rielly

2. Matthews


Sign or trade either. Rielly is the most pressing. It’s either a walk for nothing, trade this season or sign to a massive extension decision.

Not fair to burden the next GM with the outcome.

Same with 34. 2 years before a full NMC kicks in. Without an extension heading into that last year, he holds all the cards. A decision to move or sign has to be made soon.

The outcome of those decisions affect assets or cap room. Big stuff. And if there is waning confidence in Dubas, best cut the cord and get things settled.

Even if it costs them some short term games.

I'd add Marner in there in between the 2.

But at this point we don't know what this weekend was. A blip, a wake up call, the start of an early season tail spin. We won't know for a few weeks. Making a decision now is flat out asinine. But if it is a tailspin, you pull the trigger. Dubas has had 3 strikes on opportunities to move Marner and change the direction of this team. Doesn't get a 4th. New GM comes in, makes those decisions. Personally I think you have to move Rielly as a rental and both of Matthews and Marner. Less sure of Rielly, but if you're keeping him the other two have to go. Hard culture reset in the room. Move forward with JT/Nylander/Muzz/Brodie + the trade returns, UFA dollars, and a strong pool.

 

[4thline]

Getting rid of the GM.

Who built a group that is winning and the new gm is happy to stand pat with. Super impactful!

 

[theTTC]

I am super hopeful that much of this fanbase has someone else managing their money, and rock solid sensible significant others.

The posters who might sound the most radical to you actually see clear and cold, as is needed in business and to succeed financially. I bet most of them have parlayed this mental maturity into a decent portfolio at this stage of their lives.

The drink-the-koolaid rah-rah expressions of blind cult following that you seem to be looking for come from younger fans who haven't had the 50+ years of bitter Leaf experience to temper their naive enthusiasm, God bless them.

 

[Koolboss]

View attachment 473591

3 years too late

 

[57 Years No Cup]

We don't need to turn this season around. We need to stop the bleeding. It's absolutely shocking the amount of damage Kyle has done in such a short time frame. He cannot be allowed to make any more decisions. If we have to write off this year to stop the bleeding, so be it.

This should've happened 2 years ago. We've already wasted 2 years, another will not kill us.

Should have happened after the Columbus debacle and most certainly after losing to Montreal.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Who built a group that is winning and the new gm is happy to stand pat with. Super impactful!

Who built a group that is winning? Seriously, what's going on here? Are you a Leafs fan or a Dubas fan? It's OK to not like the current custodians of a team you love. If Dubas was fired and every NHL player on the roster let go tomorrow, we'd still exist. The Leafs will still be a thing.

Please tell me why yourself and a couple of dozen others are so attached to the current GM. There has to be something. You have to actively ignore what is going on in front of your eyes for a bigger agenda I'm just not getting.

Why are you so content with losing trade after trade, not seeing any improvement from 3 years ago, signing a dozen bargain bin players every year hoping 2 may pan out? Why are Dubas fans clinging on for dear life trying to convince people everything is fine and he's going a bang up job.

I legitimately don't understand why people are desperate to cling onto Dubas and not do what's better for the organization.

 

[Koolboss]

I took the entire season off last year as I'm just convinced until Dubas is gone we can't move forward. When I do watch games I find myself cheering against the Leafs because that's how we get to Dubas gone. But it feels wrong. Too much negativity. I just bitch.

For some reason, I decided to watch the whole game tonight. I was like....Pitts AHL squad. They'll have fun and score some goals.

LOL. Guess I got what I wanted but man.......FIRE THIS MANAGEMENT TEAM. What is it gonna take MLSE?

Been cheering against for the past 3 seasons, unless this core and management is gone I will continue to do so. Really sad to be in this position but here I'm.

 

[Dayjobdave]

Management, like many of the players, believes this team is good enough to win on talent without 100 percent effort. They still learned nothing from the Montreal loss.

playing Hutch on Friday instead of Jack was their signal to the team that they were going for 4 points. Easy Friday night win. They looked right through San Jose and paid for it. Then they got whacked on the back end of the back to back.

they don’t understand or appreciate that while they have some good talent, they are in the best league in the world and only supreme effort and a few bounces will get them home.

 

[4thline]

Who built a group that is winning?

You replied to a very specific scenario with a very stupid answer.

This entire thread is overreaction.

I completely agree that Dubas has had his strikes and is sink or swim with this group, in this season. If major changes need to be made it's not him making them. But we don't yet know if those changes need to be made.

 

[Pookie]

I'd add Marner in there in between the 2.

But at this point we don't know what this weekend was. A blip, a wake up call, the start of an early season tail spin. We won't know for a few weeks. .

Don’t we know though?

Columbus series? Loss

Montreal series? Loss.

2-3-1 start to the year.

Same core. Just tinkered with the extra parts again.

I’ve got a feeling we all know what this is.

 

[RoadWarrior]

The hockey goods are gift wrapping Eichel for Dubas. It's a miracle Eichel hasn't been traded yet. Marner needs a change too.

Eichel is a type A. He and Matthews are buddies but also compete fiercely against each other. That's the atmosphere we need on the team.

This is truly a gift wrapped deal waiting to happen but it might take a Dubas firing to get it done.

 

[Budz22]

The only other person that I dislike more than Marner right now is that piece of garbage who leaked that video of Seattle selecting Kerfoot in the expansion draft.

Man oh man Kerfoot absolutely sucks.

 

[RoadWarrior]

I'd add Marner in there in between the 2.

But at this point we don't know what this weekend was. A blip, a wake up call, the start of an early season tail spin. We won't know for a few weeks. Making a decision now is flat out asinine. But if it is a tailspin, you pull the trigger. Dubas has had 3 strikes on opportunities to move Marner and change the direction of this team. Doesn't get a 4th. New GM comes in, makes those decisions. Personally I think you have to move Rielly as a rental and both of Matthews and Marner. Less sure of Rielly, but if you're keeping him the other two have to go. Hard culture reset in the room. Move forward with JT/Nylander/Muzz/Brodie + the trade returns, UFA dollars, and a strong pool.

Reilly has more value to this team as a 25 minute player than Mitch Marner. If you have to move one you move Marner. Matthews isn’t much better than Marner but he’s coming off an injury so he gets more leeway.

 

[Cpt Maple Leaf]

i love the leafs but they aren’t my whole life. My ultimate happiness isn’t going to be decided on whether they win the cup or not. I get upset that they lose but then I move on lol. Because at the end of the day its just a game. It’s good to be a die heart fan but you should really take a step back if it’s getting to you that much that you’re that angry.

Lol. Ok, Dr. Phil. JK, but if folks want to vent… let em vent. Keeping it in is also not good.

 

[RoadWarrior]

The only other person that I dislike more than Marner right now is that piece of garbage who leaked that video of Seattle selecting Kerfoot in the expansion draft.

Man oh man Kerfoot absolutely sucks.

There’s a reason they took McCann. Protecting Holl over McCann is the head scratcher.

 

[tmlfan98]

I think a lot of "Dubasites" are really just fans who assume and fear the absolute worst; that any new GM will take us back to a 2005-2015 decade of darkness type era where we miss the playoffs way more than make.

 

[Torontonian]

I just wished the threads talked about the game and not about Dubas every loss.

These past two games Toronto has gotten smashed, poor work ethic and bad bad plays with the puck. A trend I have noticed when Toronto is playing poorly is they are constantly getting caught on 3-2 and 2-1. I'm not sure if everyone isn't on the same page in the o-zone or what it is. Toronto played very poorly theres no doubt about that, but 4 of the goals scored against us went off of our own players and into the net, unlucky in that sense.

Its super early in the season, so there's no reason to panic but how these past 6 games have gone, its a worrying trend. Teams that play a hard-nose grinding game will always have the advantage over Toronto.

 

[Bomber0104]

I think a lot of "Dubasites" are really just fans who assume and fear the absolute worst; that any new GM will take us back to a 2005-2015 decade of darkness type era where we miss the playoffs way more than make.

What they fear the most may end up happening inadvertently anyway.

This team not only isn't a contender, but doesn't even look like a playoff team right now.