All Purpose Trade/Roster Building Thread XII - The UFA frenzy aftermath

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I suppose there’s still value in waiving him to be rid of the $2.2M if a team is willing to claim him. Still stinks though to potentially go from Hoglander as a return to nothing.

Cap space though is quite the asset to have.

we can do that in December or so when Patches is ready. No need to rush it.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I suppose there’s still value in waiving him to be rid of the $2.2M if a team is willing to claim him. Still stinks though to potentially go from Hoglander as a return to nothing.

Cap space though is quite the asset to have.

They're not going to waive Bear. Teams know that Pacioretty can simply fit into the roster by waiving Noesen. Canes would not be asking for Hoglander or a similarly-priced asset if waivers was the thought.

 

[bleedgreen]

Hoglander never sounded like an actual thing. Certainly not for Bear. I think of him as a better asset than Bear at the moment.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Hoglander never sounded like an actual thing. Certainly not for Bear. I think of him as a better asset than Bear at the moment.

Well, they've scored at a similar pace this season...

 

[Chrispy]

Hoglander never sounded like an actual thing. Certainly not for Bear. I think of him as a better asset than Bear at the moment.

I never assumed it was a straight-up deal, but they still couldn't agree on what Carolina would add to get Hoglander or Vancouver wasn't interested in general.

 

[WreckingCrew]

I never assumed it was a straight-up deal, but they still couldn't agree on what Carolina would add to get Hoglander or Vancouver wasn't interested in general.

We will add not ONE, but TWO future considerations!!!

 

[bleedgreen]

I never assumed it was a straight-up deal, but they still couldn't agree on what Carolina would add to get Hoglander or Vancouver wasn't interested in general.

There was one report we asked for him, right? Was there any other information that’s what was being talked about? Bear has been on the block all summer it sounds like. We probably asked in June and they said no, with that not being on the table since. Of course I’m making that up and maybe that’s what we asked for last week but asides from hf dreams it didn’t seem like there was much smoke here. They probably want Hoglander to figure it out playing for them.

Dreger says Buffalo could use Bear but they don’t really want to give up any assets. I can’t imagine a scenario where we give up Bear and get a better and cheaper asset. Unless we’re significantly overpaying which seems really unlikely.

 

[MadeUpName]

More of the same from another insider. Maybe the multi-team push gets it done.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

There was one report we asked for him, right? Was there any other information that’s what was being talked about? He’s been on the block all summer it sounds like. We probably asked in June and they said no, with that not being on the table since. Of course I’m making that up and maybe that’s what we asked for last week but asides from hf dreams it didn’t seem like there was much smoke here. They probably want Hoglander to figure it out for them.

I think that HF posters overvalue Hoglander and undervalue Bear and other NHL-caliber RHD depth in general. Hoglander's top-6 potential, while it is there, is a huge long-shot. It still might not make their trade values equal, but I think that they're a lot closer than conventional wisdom has it.

 

[bleedgreen]

I think that HF posters overvalue Hoglander and undervalue Bear and other NHL-caliber RHD depth in general.

That absolutely may be the case. I actually don’t like the proposed trade for that reason. We don’t really have a spot for Hoglander. If we lost like four guys to injury in the top six I could see us trying something like this. He’d be going straight to Chicago. Rod isn’t playing him over anyone in the top six, and you’d think this guy sure as hell isn’t playing in our bottom six.

I think we get a pick for him. Or a depth player that makes sense for Rod.

 

[Joe McGrath]

Never knew Centers aren't supposed to go to the front of the net. Tro did while here. Aho seems to bang in a few up close every once in a while. But I will defer to your knowledge.

Hands of stone. Could care less of what did as a Pen. We are discussing the Jordo of the Canes in comparison of KK. And he got that big contract for more than his D game...

If your definition of net front presence is just a guy who goes to the net, Staal does that plenty. He’s got 140 goals as a Hurricane, how many do you think are from less than 10 feet away? 120?

I was thinking net front presence like Hornqvist, Holmstrom, etc. guys that just park in front and get abused and are then the last guy back.

There’s no arguing his hands of stone, I was just providing context as to why that might be the case. I guess it doesn’t matter but it might help explain why they thought he was going to better than he turned out to be.

 

[MadeUpName]

Hoglander is interesting, but I'm not sure that this is the season for Carolina to test out if he will boom or bust.

Garland (with added Cap) or Kuzmenko (if he's unhappy) would fit better this year.

 

[bleedgreen]

I’d be interested in Garland.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Well, they've scored at a similar pace this season...

And a similar pace as Staal, KK, Stastny, Stepan and TT(for goals).

He’ll fit right in!!!!

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Hoglander is interesting, but I'm not sure that this is the season for Carolina to test out if he will boom or bust.

Garland (with added Cap) or Kuzmenko (if he's unhappy) would fit better this year.

Garland is unrealistic, to say the least, but I personally would prefer Hoglander over Kuzmenko if Bear is traded to Vancouver. Hoglander has more cost control and genuinely has a shot at being a top-6 caliber player in a couple of seasons, when we would actually need him (Teravainen is a likely overpay candidate in UFA that year).

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I doubt we turn to a roster player trade yet until we know what Pacioretty is going to bring to the table.

Although it will be good to have another lottery ticket for trade in case we go big game controllable player hunting.

 

[cptjeff]

So were the discussions Buffalo asking if they could have him for free?

I mean, it's not remotely unreasonable. He's not in our plans and we need the cap space. I'd be happy to give him to Buffalo for free.

 

[bleedgreen]

Actually I’d love to see Hoglander get an extended chance so he wins the lacrosse goal competition. That guy has the best actual Michigan goal I’ve ever seen. It’s the first one here.



Now THAT would be an amazing one to see in the NHL.

I’d love to see the guy get a good chance and wouldn’t mind him over a handful of players on our team. I’d be pumped if we did that actually. I just don’t see it happening unless JR is doing us favors for the trade in the first place and then we play the guy over the guys Rod seems to prefer. Just doesn’t feel like us.

 

[htdoc]

I appreciate that PR wise the Canes are making it known they will accommodate a player to do what is best for the player so they can play. But I also appreciate that, unlike a TDL UFA with a no trade where we are doing what we can to help the guy go for a cup, we are in a different place as a team right now and Bear may very well be a needed depth piece before the regular season is over... and thus we aren't just going to give the player away. If we were in a cap crunch and we had to give him away to activate Patches its a different calculus... we don't have to do that.

We gain zero accrued cap space by trading Bear. Gardiner LTIR to begin the year creates an LTIR pool we can dip into and use as replacement. But just dumping bear doesn't really do anything for us if we aren't going to replace with something else of exact same contract value...

we have 8 nhl d men on the roster currently. Bear isn't playing because there are 7 dmen in front of him more deserving to play according to the coach. . Unless we are trading him because we intend to do another deal to acquire a dman better than our current top 7, its a pointless exercise besides wanting to give Bear a chance to play...

We could change the makeup of the team by swapping pieces for ones we think overall are better than the bodies already here. But we have limited roster spots and already have to waive current roster players and send them down to even activate someone else already on the team in Patches.

We already have to sit multiple 1 way contract nhl forwards when patches is back. Unless we are doing a deal to add Kane from Chicago to play on our 3rd/4th line there is no need to swap and or just give away Bear. As brindy pointed out, it literally only takes 5 seconds of something going wrong to have a top 6 dmen go down and then Bear is in there and we need him instead of having to think about calling someone up from Chicago, which from what I've read has been a bit of an adventure for the d currently playing down there... sucks for Bear. You never want to sit... but he signed the contract and here we are...

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

I mean, it's not remotely unreasonable. He's not in our plans and we need the cap space. I'd be happy to give him to Buffalo for free.

Based on their actions, I don't think that the Carolina brass agrees with this take at all. Canes don't actually need cap space (again, Pacioretty fits with one Noesen to the AHL transaction) and they clearly think that he has more value than just waiver-fodder. You don't hold onto pieces for the right return if you think otherwise.

 

[Anton Dubinchuk]

More of the same from another insider. Maybe the multi-team push gets it done.

This is a joke of a tweet. I could’ve tweeted this and it would’ve been true. We’re all hearing that at this point.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

pretty crappy return. surprised honestly that we make that deal.

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

pretty crappy return. surprised honestly that we make that deal.

That’s quite a change from the original ask of Hoglander. I don’t know if I believe the borg would change their minds so drastically.

 

[cptjeff]

Based on their actions, I don't think that the Carolina brass agrees with this take at all. Canes don't actually need cap space (again, Pacioretty fits with one Noesen to the AHL transaction) and they clearly think that he has more value than just waiver-fodder. You don't hold onto pieces for the right return if you think otherwise.

Looks like you might be overestimating the value of any warm body on RD. We had to retain *and* pay to get rid of him.

 

[LostInaLostWorld]

pretty crappy return. surprised honestly that we make that deal.

Throwing this out there with no knowledge whatsoever.

Perhaps it's become a distraction for the team. Not saying Bear is outwardly bitching and moaning but he's probably not Mr Happy Go Lucky in practice and locker room.

Sometimes you have to lose to win.

Or I'm just full of the Bo's Cajun biscuit I had for lunch.