My initial point was that Kupari and/or Gus could be options for trading, because they are young players that are part of the pipeline.
I specifically wrote: "I also wonder about prospects / young players like Kupari and Gustafsson..."
Rumor: All Purpose Trade Proposals, Speculation and Rumours - 2023/24
- Thread starter Mortimer Snerd
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I specifically wrote: "I also wonder about prospects / young players like Kupari and Gustafsson..."
AtomicJets
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Yes, GA/60. Thompson is shit defensively and has had one really great offensive season. It's ludicrous to compare him to Kyle Connor, to be frank. He's not on the same level. If he were playing for the Jets, the complainers would be all over him on a nightly basis.
- Jun 10, 2014
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In fairness his 22 season was pretty good offensively too. After last season it looked like Sabres had struck gold, at least offensively. I had no idea what his 2 way game was like.
Makes it all the more strange that they are apparently shopping Mitts. You'ld think that Tage would be the one to move.
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Didn't mean to seem like I was disagreeing with your point. Not sure what value players like Gus and Kup might have. The same goes for prospects like Zhilkin, Rashevsky and Julien. But they might be bundled with other assets to make up a package with decent value.
I think Kupari and Gus have quite a bit more value than prospects like Zhilkin and Julien at this point, but less value than top prospects like McGroarty and Lambert. Hard to know about Rashevsky.
With Chevy trading a 1st to plug into the 2C role, it's evident that the Jets see that as a persistent and important gap. I don't see them turning that over to a young prospect like Lambert during this short-term competitive window.
That's why I wonder whether the Jets might consider a bigger trade either at the TDL or in the off-season to try to come up with a longer-term solution for the 2C. Mittelstadt seems like the best option out there, but he's going to be expensive. Maybe something like Vilardi and Iaffalo and a good prospect (sort of like the PLD deal). In that case, perhaps Kupari and Lambert are candidates for RW slots, at least in their early NHL careers.
Something like this would be pretty good:
Connor-Scheifele-Ehlers
Perfetti-Mittelstadt-Niederreiter
McGroarty-Namestnikov-Lambert
Barron-Lowry-Appleton
WolfHouse
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Trading vilardi in the offseason now.... because that's totally chevy's style to make a blockbuster and then dump the key player
Comparing GA/60 when one has Helle vs the other having Comrie, UPL, Craig Anderson etc
Probably beneficial look at xGA and difference of GA vs xGA and then compare the two
Probably beneficial look at xGA and difference of GA vs xGA and then compare the two
Not only that it's contrary to how Chevy operates.
Don't think Buffalo wants fwds back for Mittlestadt.
Maukkis
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I wouldn't be so sure. Buffalo is one of those teams that needs a new system, first and foremost, but absent of that, they would probably benefit the most from another Tuch-like forward. They're doing fine at the skill department, but someone needs to commit to the other end too.
Funnily enough, they need everything and nothing at the same time. Have fun dealing with that, I guess.
Going off what the report said they want goaltending.I wouldn't be so sure. Buffalo is one of those teams that needs a new system, first and foremost, but absent of that, they would probably benefit the most from another Tuch-like forward. They're doing fine at the skill department, but someone needs to commit to the other end too.
Funnily enough, they need everything and nothing at the same time. Have fun dealing with that, I guess.
I don't think they're getting a starting caliber goalie in the season, maybe Gibson? Not sure. All the teams with good starters probably don't want to move them right now given they're gearing up for the PO's.
If they want a goalie I see it more of an offseason trade. I really don't see us moving Vilardi for Mittlestadt.
Maukkis
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I'm not sure they can fix their mess by getting a goalie. They'd have the assets for Saros, who should be available, but would he be able to make up for a non-existent team defense (and going to re-sign in 2025)? I don't buy it.
And yeah, Vilardi for Mitts seems like a tough sell for Chevy. He did well in the Dubois deal, but Gabe is the only thing we got that has done much of anything so far. It wouldn't be easy to give him up so soon.
I haven't looked at their defensive stats extensively so can't comment, but was going off the earlier reporting of wanting a goalie (take it fwiw)
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I had a few possibilities in mind other than Monahan at the TD. That seems a lot less likely now, but not entirely out of the question.
The 2025 1st has to be an option too. If we would trade the 24 one then we should also be willing to part with the 25 one - for the right situation of course. A 2C better than Monahan, with term would be the right situation.
The problem with Mitts is term. I would want an extension before paying a big price. With an extension I don't think your offer is good enough unless the prospect is the main piece in the deal. Lambert/Barlow + Vilardi + Iafallo maybe.
Without the extension my offer would be much less. It would be beaten by teams more confident of being able to extend him.
AtomicJets
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I mean judging a winger on xGA isnt a great way to go about things either - but since you asked, it's 2.93 for Thompson vs 2.91 for Connor over the same time period. Very close.
raideralex99
Whiteout Is Coming.
Flames are fighting for that last wild card spot ... they know they are losing Tanev so why not trade him for another D man and get a pick too. Schmidt and a second for Tanev. This way they still can compete for the wildcard spot and get an asset plus next year thy can pickup another pick for Schmidt at TDL.
I agree. On ice measures as a whole may not accurately depict an individuals play as well. However when comparing fwds/d GA stats its hard to just flat out ignore the big difference in actual netminders behind them.
AtomicJets
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yeah just to be clear - not trying to say or conclude thompson is better/worse than kfc. just don't think GA/60 is a proper determination given the stark difference in quality of net minders which is a pretty big deal.
even the xGA number: there's still lot of teammate/system influence there. but they're closer in that number, w/ kfc playing on the Jets' improved system vs thompson on the Sabres (no idea how the sabres rank as a team defensively). even if they are close to the same level of bad defensively, one plays W with the other playing C so different level of responsibilities and focus id think.
FWIW, I'd trade Connor for Tage Thompson straight up without much of a hiccup. Both are very good scorers, and that's their main contribution. Neither are good defensively. Thompson is a year younger, and on a better long-term deal. Also, he shoots right, and the Jets could use another RS forward.
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I don't think it works that way. How many instances are in your data set? Of those, how many times has he had the opportunity to flip the key player for a player of much greater need?
Not to even go into issues of production rates and injury histories. Just considering winger vs centre.
I wouldn't be so sure. Buffalo is one of those teams that needs a new system, first and foremost, but absent of that, they would probably benefit the most from another Tuch-like forward. They're doing fine at the skill department, but someone needs to commit to the other end too.
Funnily enough, they need everything and nothing at the same time. Have fun dealing with that, I guess.
IDK about that. I think they are a much different team with a goalie. It is not just the goalie himself, but teams play better in front of a goalie they have faith in.
They might be willing to consider other things but a goalie is what they need and I'm sure they know that.
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It is too late for a goalie to make enough difference for this year, so yes, off-season.
I think it is a goalie they want and that's why Mittelstadt is even being mentioned in the first place.
I certainly can't see us moving Vilardi in season but this off-season? I don't see why we would even hesitate to move Vilardi for a young 2C with term. Lack of term might be the only thing that would get in the way with Mitts.
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Not to mention that Thompson plays C.
TT has the advantage of being 1 year younger and under contract for 6 more years compared to 2.
OTOH, Thompson does not have KC's record of consistently potting 30++ goals year after year. To compare at roughly the same ages KC had 208 G to TT's 118. To be more fair to Thompson I would need to include his total at the end of this season so call it 130ish.
Also worth considering is that Connor has never shown (publicly) any interest in leaving Wpg of going to UFA. Of course that could change or there may be something we are not aware of.
Interestingly, both have trade protection kicking in after this season.
All things considered it looks like a pretty close thing.
Dubois? Tho I guess he was only traded because he didn't want to be in Wpg. I think I'd be ok with trading Vilardi for the right player, tho I do like him. Having both him and Ehlers taking up core contract salaries but missing ~25% of games each injured doesn't seem ideal.
You can use xGA/60 Rel or GA/60 Rel (naturalstattrick.com) to isolate the contribution from the individual player on defense.
These stats show both players in the same ballpark, and both among their teams two worst defensive forwards (edit: numbers from last three seasons).
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