Rumor: All Purpose Trade Proposals, Speculation and Rumours - 2023/24

[DRW204]

Ya I agree about scheif morrissey and especially Helle being the most important players on the Jets. But Connor is up there, him and Helle are the only players the Jets have who are top 10 for their position in the league. I don't think Chevy considers trading away a player like that who contributes in a way that is the teams weakness (scoring) unless he won't re-sign in Wpg

He's up there but I think a step below those 3. For instance we've seen this team's performance in recent years (POs+reg season) w/o scheifele. His absence is noticeably felt and seen.

If cornerstone is considered your most prolific or important piece to go forward it's those 3 w/o a doubt in that tier.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

I’d go Helle Josh Scheifele as cornerstone pieces. I’d have Ehlers 4th ahead of Connor cuz he drives his line and KC is a passenger.

 

[trebendan]

How about this?

Heinola & Iafalli for Lyubushkin and a 2nd

 

[Weezeric]

How about this?

Heinola & Iafalli for Lyubushkin and a 2nd

This makes we want to vomit.

 

[WolfHouse]

How about this?

Heinola & Iafalli for Lyubushkin and a 2nd

Massive overpayment for lyubushkin

 

[LowLefty]

I really think Connor is the 2nd most valuable forward after Scheifele. I am sincerely interested in why you would take those other forwards over him, it seems like it's based on xG or some other advanced stats? If you'd be down to share a link to the stats or explain why you value that stat more would be interesting to me.

But also to clarify I agree that all of those guys are valuable and would like to see them all stay long term. And also I'm not trying to argue, just have a conversation and learn where you are coming from if you have time or are interested in sharing.

If you were to ask the org who they rank as the number two forward, they'd likely agree with you - KC is a dynamic player.
If you were to ask most other fan bases who number two is and who they fear the most, it's likely KC again.

When a team goes into a scoring funk, the goal scorers tend lose their shine and end up with other moniker's such as "passenger" or "defensive liability".
And once we start scoring again, that usually fades away and the fanbase will recognizes him for what he is rather for what he isn't.

He's the most consistent YOY scoring talent on this team - and the way he scores makes him very fun to watch.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the vast majority of the fans that pay to watch the Jets, love him and the excitement he brings to the the game.
There's probably a lot of value in that.

You're not alone in thinking he might be the 2nd most valuable forward on the Jets.

 

[Cotton Eye Joe]

How about this?

Heinola & Iafalli for Lyubushkin and a 2nd

Lyubushkin is 29 and not alot of talent.
I still say if the Jets give Ville a shot he will pleasantly surprise everyone.
I think he is a top 4 D with alot of offense to his game.

 

[KingBogo]

If you were to ask the org who they rank as the number two forward, they'd likely agree with you - KC is a dynamic player.
If you were to ask most other fan bases who number two is and who they fear the most, it's likely KC again.

When a team goes into a scoring funk, the goal scorers tend lose their shine and end up with other moniker's such as "passenger" or "defensive liability".
And once we start scoring again, that usually fades away and the fanbase will recognizes him for what he is rather for what he isn't.

He's the most consistent YOY scoring talent on this team - and the way he scores makes him very fun to watch.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the vast majority of the fans that pay to watch the Jets, love him and the excitement he brings to the the game.
There's probably a lot of value in that.

You're not alone in thinking he might be the 2nd most valuable forward on the Jets.

I hate getting caught up in the Ehlers - Connor debate as they are my 2nd two favorite players after the big 3 of Helly, Scheifele and Morrissey. But if you were going to lay a bet on who gets the bigger next contract, Connor would be a heavy favorite. The league pays goal scoring over just about everything else behind top pairing defenseman who can put up points and #1 centers.

 

[surixon]

If you were to ask the org who they rank as the number two forward, they'd likely agree with you - KC is a dynamic player.
If you were to ask most other fan bases who number two is and who they fear the most, it's likely KC again.

When a team goes into a scoring funk, the goal scorers tend lose their shine and end up with other moniker's such as "passenger" or "defensive liability".
And once we start scoring again, that usually fades away and the fanbase will recognizes him for what he is rather for what he isn't.

He's the most consistent YOY scoring talent on this team - and the way he scores makes him very fun to watch.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the vast majority of the fans that pay to watch the Jets, love him and the excitement he brings to the the game.
There's probably a lot of value in that.

You're not alone in thinking he might be the 2nd most valuable forward on the Jets.

It's so clear that he's viewed as the second most important. All you need to do is look at usage.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

I'm interested in what Chevy would use for payment in another hypothetical trade.
With our first already gone and essentially all Jets trade line deals NOT including roster players.
If the Jets could acquire someone with enough value to command a 1st plus that means they'd either have to accept the 2025 1st or a combination of a 2nd ++.

If we pull the trigger like that then you'd have to think we'd be losing one of our top prospects.

 

[gojetsgo]

I'm interested in what Chevy would use for payment in another hypothetical trade.
With our first already gone and essentially all Jets trade line deals NOT including roster players.
If the Jets could acquire someone with enough value to command a 1st plus that means they'd either have to accept the 2025 1st or a combination of a 2nd ++.

If we pull the trigger like that then you'd have to think we'd be losing one of our top prospects.

probably mtl's 2nd

 

[LowLefty]

I hate getting caught up in the Ehlers - Connor debate as they are my 2nd two favorite players after the big 3 of Helly, Scheifele and Morrissey. But if you were going to lay a bet on who gets the bigger next contract, Connor would be a heavy favorite. The league pays goal scoring over just about everything else behind top pairing defenseman who can put up points and #1 centers.

I don't like getting into either - I was reading a few points made by others that always seem to pop up when the team is struggling - as if we need to re-evaluate our best players when things are off a bit.
Ehlers drives play, KC scores goals - they are both extremely important and fill different needs.

 

[Jet]

If you were to ask the org who they rank as the number two forward, they'd likely agree with you - KC is a dynamic player.
If you were to ask most other fan bases who number two is and who they fear the most, it's likely KC again.

When a team goes into a scoring funk, the goal scorers tend lose their shine and end up with other moniker's such as "passenger" or "defensive liability".
And once we start scoring again, that usually fades away and the fanbase will recognizes him for what he is rather for what he isn't.

He's the most consistent YOY scoring talent on this team - and the way he scores makes him very fun to watch.
I'll go out on a limb and say that the vast majority of the fans that pay to watch the Jets, love him and the excitement he brings to the the game.
There's probably a lot of value in that.

You're not alone in thinking he might be the 2nd most valuable forward on the Jets.

Really well put.

 

[Maukkis]

I really think Connor is the 2nd most valuable forward after Scheifele. I am sincerely interested in why you would take those other forwards over him, it seems like it's based on xG or some other advanced stats? If you'd be down to share a link to the stats or explain why you value that stat more would be interesting to me.

But also to clarify I agree that all of those guys are valuable and would like to see them all stay long term. And also I'm not trying to argue, just have a conversation and learn where you are coming from if you have time or are interested in sharing.

Natural Stat Trick and Moneypuck are good sources for this. And yes, lines with Connor on them tend to systematically lose in terms of expected goals at 5v5, which is a terrible sign for someone who plays 1st line minutes and doesn't seem to fall out of favour for any reason.

This would probably be a total non-issue, if this team's coaching staff actually took initiative and reduced KC's minutes in favour of players who actually defend and create chances. What Connor does in his role isn't something spectacular, but rather about what you'd expect from a guy playing 20 a night with all the PP time he can handle. We have several players who deserve those minutes more than him.

 

[Jack7222]

Natural Stat Trick and Moneypuck are good sources for this. And yes, lines with Connor on them tend to systematically lose in terms of expected goals at 5v5, which is a terrible sign for someone who plays 1st line minutes and doesn't seem to fall out of favour for any reason.

This would probably be a total non-issue, if this team's coaching staff actually took initiative and reduced KC's minutes in favour of players who actually defend and create chances. What Connor does in his role isn't something spectacular, but rather about what you'd expect from a guy playing 20 a night with all the PP time he can handle. We have several players who deserve those minutes more than him.

Then whenever Ehlers is put on top line for any length of time people are like "wow he has finally figured out his game" and "he finally learned how to use his line mates more and do X Y Z properly".

People are generally blinded by TOI and usage imo, along with end of season point totals.

To his credit, Connor was pretty good I thought with Dubois; wish the org would explore different setups more. Unsure why they see Connor as some kind of permanent top line fixture, but if he wasn't then people would see this player differently I think.

 

[Whileee]

probably mtl's 2nd

I also wonder about prospects / young players like Kupari and Gustafsson, or prospects like Chibrikov or Rashevsky. The Jets have a bit of a glut in their forward pipeline, considering how their forward roster maps out. Looking ahead, the Jets have about 4 forward slots that are likely to open in the next couple of seasons...

Monahan (2024)
Iafallo (2025, or sooner)
Appleton (2025, or sooner)
Namestnikov (2025)

Forward "pipeline":

Kupari (2024)
Gustafsson (2024)
McGroarty (2024)
Lambert (2024/25)
Chibrikov (2024/25)
Barlow (2025/26)
Rashevsky (2025)
Julien (2026/27)

 

[Adam da bomb]

Ehlers only has 16 goals after playing healthy to this point. I’d expect a top line player to have at least 20.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Do we have to waive somone if Chevy picks someone up on the TD? Rosters are expanded but I am not sure exactly when.

I have the same question. It seems to me that the rosters don't open up until the moment trades are forbidden. Somehow they all manage it every year though.

 

[Maukkis]

Ehlers only has 16 goals after playing healthy to this point. I’d expect a top line player to have at least 20.

There are nine players with 20+ ES goals this year. Ehlers ranks in the top 30 league-wide.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

It's so clear that he's viewed as the second most important. All you need to do is look at usage.

Yes. Absolutely.
But it is also true that he is a passenger and a defensive liability.
Goal scoring is hard to come by and you can't win without scoring. But you can't win if you give up more goals than you score.

His value goes up if he is playing with players who can keep the puck out of the D zone. I think that is the definition of a passenger.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Natural Stat Trick and Moneypuck are good sources for this. And yes, lines with Connor on them tend to systematically lose in terms of expected goals at 5v5, which is a terrible sign for someone who plays 1st line minutes and doesn't seem to fall out of favour for any reason.

This would probably be a total non-issue, if this team's coaching staff actually took initiative and reduced KC's minutes in favour of players who actually defend and create chances. What Connor does in his role isn't something spectacular, but rather about what you'd expect from a guy playing 20 a night with all the PP time he can handle. We have several players who deserve those minutes more than him.

I think you might be overstating it a bit. I agree that he is somewhat a product of his usage. A more sheltered role would better take advantage of his finishing ability. But I don't think we have "several" players who should play above him.

I think he would be better on the 2nd line (not the Lowry 2nd line, the other one). That line plays against weaker opposition and it needs a finisher.

 

[Maukkis]

I think he would be better on the 2nd line (not the Lowry 2nd line, the other one). That line plays against weaker opposition and it needs a finisher.

Agreed. It truly is a shame that this team is physically unable to try new things.

 

[AtomicJets]

Yeah, but the last 3 years they are pretty close together. Now look at their GA/60.

For what period? Last 3 years?

Kyle Connor 2.71
Tage Thompson 3.48

Connor quite superior there as well, thanks.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I also wonder about prospects / young players like Kupari and Gustafsson, or prospects like Chibrikov or Rashevsky. The Jets have a bit of a glut in their forward pipeline, considering how their forward roster maps out. Looking ahead, the Jets have about 4 forward slots that are likely to open in the next couple of seasons...

Monahan (2024)
Iafallo (2025, or sooner)
Appleton (2025, or sooner)
Namestnikov (2025)

Forward "pipeline":

Kupari (2024)
Gustafsson (2024)
McGroarty (2024)
Lambert (2024/25)
Chibrikov (2024/25)
Barlow (2025/26)
Rashevsky (2025)
Julien (2026/27)

Not sure about listing Gus and Kup as in the pipeline. They are more or less permanently on the roster. The acquisition of Monahan probably sees both in the PB when we are healthy but he isn't likely to be here next year.

Leave those 2 off your list and drop Rashevsky and Julien. They are pretty long shots. We are left with 4 out and 4 in. Of course a lot can happen in 2 years.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

For what period? Last 3 years?

Kyle Connor 2.71
Tage Thompson 3.48

Connor quite superior there as well, thanks.

Connor 195 games - 97 G, 106 A, 203 pts
Thompson 197 games - 100 G, 91 A, 191 pts
That looks pretty close to me.

Are those GA numbers? Neither is good but yeah, pretty big edge to KC.