All Bruins rumors/proposals: Reset and Sweenified
- Thread starter Mr. Make-Believe
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Alberta_OReilly_Fan
Bruin fan since 1975
I think hamiltons wanting to leave... might have more to do with how boston treats soft skilled players. we can trace or history back to guys like thornton/wheeler/kessel/seguin... and even further back... our media leads our fan base into being very unforgiving to our soft skilled young players here in boston.
when Hamilton was drafted I was very impressed how smart he is. I hoped this would help him 'adjust' his style to what was necessary for success here. I hoped he would develop a larry robinson style of play. I never expected he would get a killer attitude on the ice, but I at least hoped to see signs that he would step up when necessary.
im guessing Hamilton really doesn't want to do that and he was 'smart enough' to see the writing on the wall. if he did resign here he would become public enemy number 1 and end up miserable.
a gm doesn't have much to do with that... its fans and media that have been turning on our young for as long as ive been a bruin fan. we own that. we can point our fingers at ourselves for that.
as for chiarelli giving out money to guys that wanted raises...
he didn't do that for boychuk and the fans here demanded he be fired for it. just imagine the uproar if he let krejci or Bergeron or chara or rask leave when they were up for their last contracts. its a fun fantasy to imagine these guys would sign for less than going rate but its really just a fantasy.
a lot of fans say chris Kelly is overpaid. I wish those fans can explain why matt stajan got paid... why did boyde Gordon get paid... why did lars eller get paid... why did brian bolland get paid... why did Brandon sutter get paid... why did jarret stoll get paid...
it turns out that these guys all got paid because that's what the market pays a thir line center that scores 15 goals and picks up 35 points.
our fans can freak out over the Kelly contract but all it really means is our fans are clueless to the reality of nhl contacts.
it actually turns out that when a team wins a cup... the players on the team have a lot of bargaining power because everyone wants them. when brian bolland becomes an ufa he gets 5 mill cause he won a cup in Chicago. when Andrew ference becomes an ufa a team like Edmonton jumps all over him.
if we need to deal rich peverly and the mess he was... we will find a taker because cup experienced vets will always be in high demand. Gregory Campbell and shawn thornton might be useless to us... but other teams lick their lip to get these guys.
our players were on fair contracts... the reason our cap is maxed is cause we have a deep team full of good players. when tsn ranks the top 50 players in the nhl last year boston has more guys in the list than anyone because we have a deep team with lots of good players
we have more playoff success than anyone in the nhl {along with Chicago and LA} during the chiarelli years because we have a good team with good players.
now.. time marches on. Chiarelli kept the core together for as long as possible to give us a chance to win. Las Vegas odds makers had us rated as the favorite to win the cup last year because they agreed chiarelli was doing one hell of a good job.
then injuries crippled us... chara and Seidenberg has career worst seasons... krejci was ineffective the entire season... no one stepped up for extradinary seasons to offset the loss of these 3 guys. iginla/boychuk were rightfully rewarded with new contracts to play elsewhere...
we got slammed but that happens... its happening to Chicago... its happening to LA... it happens...
chiarelli lost his job cause neely is power hungry. neely wanted to get rid of chiarelli for years. neely couldn't do it because chiarelli was too successful. a single season after going to the finals, neely pounced. it was 100% political move. neely hired his buddy to jump in and take over.
it might work... I like neely/Sweeney. I didn't like chiarelli... so maybe it will work??? I hope it will work... but its disingnerous to say that chiarelli was fired for just cause. chiarelli was hugely successful here. the second he was fired, he was given a huge contract to take over another franchise that bent over backwards to clean house of the owners best friends to make room.
this other market is very excited at the good movies chiarelli is making to turn their fortunes around just like he did the same thing for us.
it was chiarelli that completely rebuilt bostons defense in his first 2 years here... chiarelli that opened the doors for chara/ward/ference to form the new nucleus and then made the wise move to move out morris and bring in Seidenberg... who approved deals to take chances on boychuk and mcquaid who were minor league cast offs from other franchises...
chiarelli completely rebuild the defense... chiarelli hired Julien to come in and put in our system... chiarelli worked hard to find us elite goal tending...
then chiarell approved a system where our forwards were told to work their butts off to make it work.
if a player was very gifted offensively like wheeler/kessel/seguin but refused to buy into the team system that was successful... chiarelli had the guts to move these guys and bring in players that would play the bruin way.
you don't need to enjoy the style of play... but you must admit that the choices led to team success.
eventually Neely's desire for power tied chiarelli's hands. success and interference. we will never know what chiarelli could have done to continue the success because neely wanted him gone and was part of the process... neely and the younger Jacobs... both wanted a change and didn't really care that we were successful.
they grabbed power, so lets hope they can deliver. in the meantime I have no doubt at all chiarelli will make the oilers cup contenders within a couple seasons and keep them there for most the next decade.
What is so amazing about that? Both Kane and Toews just finished the contract Seguin is on now, 5 years @ 6.3M. Do you think Seguin's next contract is going to be for less than 10M? Let's compare apples with apples shall we?
Tarasenko is now on the contract that Sequin is on @ 7M.More money,but longer term than Sequin. Again not the same thing.
Pia8988
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Fair enough but he's comparing 2nd contract to what is 3rd contract for both Kane and Toews. If Seguin was starting his 3rd contract it wouldn't be for the 5.75 he now makes.
I don't really follow why the Bruins would care where they send Kelly. He's not good enough to "regret" the deal at any point, and obviously nobody cares about the return. The only way you get screwed in the deal is if you have to take him back!
So is it just because Boston literally won't make a trade with a divisional team? If so I find that dumb.
So is it just because Boston literally won't make a trade with a divisional team? If so I find that dumb.
nfld77
Registered User
So thats' +3M and means we need atleast 2M savingsI guess we have to have some room in the cap?
Just meant on that post that he is going to get anything between 3-5.5M and it means we need to find atleast that 2M cap, only 4 players can give us that without going close to rebuild mode.
Krug-Lou-Seidenberg-Kelly are the options,
-Kelly saves us the least, 2.1-2.3M(kemppainen/Talbot)
-Krug saves about 2.5-2.7M, (C.Miller/Morrow)
-Seidenberg 3.2M( or close to +/- 0 if we swap Franson to Seids. Around 3M cap left with that.
-Lou can saves us 1.25M if we put Kelly into his spot on the top9 or around 3.5M.(Koko/x)
The problem right now is the part of Lucic's contract we're still paying. Is it something like 2.7 million we're paying??
DominicT
Registered User
I have to start off by saying man, I respect your passion as a fan. Your thoughts are almost always well thought out and explained well.
Sometimes, all of us (not solely directed at you) we should all take a step back and really dissect everything. I know you speak from the heart and that's great, I enjoy that and your posts.
So it is with great respect that I say this:
First off, your opening line above is not how I see it. By the time you add a backup and your 13th forward and 7th d-man, your closer to $3 million then you are $4 million. This is if you are trying to calculate cap space available.
But if you are adding Franson without moving a d-man, you aren't adding a 7th d-man because you've already calculated for 7 d-men on the roster.
I go back to my original post that it's hard to figure out what has to go because we don't know what Franson is asking for. I'm sure management knows what it's going to take and how to get there. We, can only speculate.
What Franson might ask from Boston, will be higher than what he would ask from Toronto. Believe it or not, the cost of living in Boston is much higher than Toronto http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-livin...ronto&country2=United+States&city2=Boston,+MA
Just don't be fooled into thinking that the price for one team is the same as the price for another team.
The other thing I want to touch on briefly is speed because you refer to Sweeney's comments a lot when it comes to speed and the need to get faster.
Skating is part of it, a big part - the biggest. But there are other speeds the team needs to improve on. Puck speed for one. Paul Coffey on his best day couldn't out skate a puck. How quickly they think the game and make their decisions on the ice is also a factor. Skating speed alone doesn't change your transition game. If you can't think quickly enough on your feet, you'll get burned more often then not. The Bruins get burned a lot on the two man forecheck. Being able to move the puck quicker by players with the ability to do so is more successful than players that can skate it out.
BB88
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- Jan 19, 2015
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BB88
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I have to admit that you lost me on this one
This is one tough post to understand but I'll try.If we just add right now 13th forward+7th D+ backup goalie we are closer to 3M than 4M, but I skipped the D part and added Franson as our 7th D if we won't move anyone out, making it closer to 4M(just backup+13th forward) before signing Franson making it full roster.
Capfriendly has us having 6 D's against the cap who can very easily be next season, Chara, Seidenberg, Krug, McQ, K.Miller and Trotman, so we add Franson into that and we don't have to call up anymore D's and thats' our cap hit for D's.
Every report that I've seen have said that Franson is asking in the 5M range, every rumour has him close to that range, so if we go anywhere from 4.5+ we need to cut cap, and I see only 4 players that can be moved without hurting our team too much, (Krug), Seidenberg replaced by Franson, Kelly and lastly (Lou).
I like Seid but I feel that we have more D prospects being ready to step up into our lineup than we have winger prospects.
Basically if we are looking into adding any D then we should be looking at cutting some cap, we've been interested in Oduya and he will be a 3M+ guy, we need to have some cap room before we start the season?
We have a chance to be out of the cap nightmares' for a long time if Sweeney keeps doing what he has been doing, been really impressed with his signing skills and we have ton of prospects coming up in the next years who will be on ELC's which is important when you are living in a cap world, and those players can contribute.
Puck skills:
I always try to put for example: we need to be faster, have faster/better D-zone exits to provide more offense through that, that better for me has meant puck skill/ passing skills, I just have to try be more clearer with that from now on.
But thank you, my biggest weakness& strenght has always been that if I'm in on something I'm always in it with heart
Have a chance to say thank you to you too, I have a huge respect towards you and love reading your posts, I never knew when I joined here on january that I could learn so much, it has made me a better fan and I enjoy being a Bruins fan more.
edit: so this was my around savings we could have with these 4 players
-Kelly saves us the least, 2.1-2.3M(kemppainen/Talbot)
-Krug saves about 2.5-2.7M, (C.Miller/Morrow)
-Seidenberg 3.2M( or close to +/- 0 if we swap Franson to Seids. Around 3M cap left with that.
-Lou can saves us 1.25M if we put Kelly into his spot on the top9 or around 3.5M.(Koko/x)
But my priority #1 would be getting that top pairing D and future blueline leader, if Sweeney can find him then we are a strong team 2016-, have you heard anything what Sweeney thinks for our 1st pairing and how it's future will look like?
I've gotten the feeling that Sweeney is a smart man with the cap and doesn't want to push us into cap problems now and wants to have some breathing room to do improvements during the season if things go well.
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PatriceBergeron
Registered User
Tarasenko just signed his second contract @ 7.5M. Stamkos signed his second contract @ 7.5M. Kopitar signed his second contract @ 6.8M. Eberle and Ryan Nugent-Hopkins are making more than him on their second contracts..
Tarasenko and RNH are 7 years. Eberle and Seguin is 6. Stamkos is 5.
It's still super cheap and the one extra year doesn't really change that.
I thought Morrow was really solid when he was up. He was wider and stronger than advertised. Generally played it safe. We do tend to see what we want to see, especially with limited viewings. Goes both ways though.
Trotman was rookie in the AHL at 22 (Same age as Morrow now). He'll be 25 in August. 3 years college.... 3 years pro.... Not a knock. I just don't know if it's reasonable to expect more. Maybe the same can be said for Morrow. This year could be make or break for him.
Make these guys surprise and bump down a veteran or two. If there's a spot open, it should be 5/6/7 IMO.
Mr. Make-Believe
The happy genius of my household
If it's worth anything at all, I wasn't impressed with Morrow either. At his very best in Boston, he was a warm body. At his worst, a detriment.
There are people who contribute here whom I have a lot of respect for who dig the hell out of Morrow. Gives me hope that there's maybe more there.
But I haven't seen it.
DNE3
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There was a mini-movement, one year ago, to build up Warsofsky and at Morrow's expense, and then Warsofsky disappeared. This year, a vanilla-skills Trotman takes the place. Didn't work then, and won't work now. Morrow's main problem last year when called up was a head coach who neutered his puck-moving skills, in other words, don't do anything out of ordinary or your benched. Of course, par for the course with this head coach who also took same approach with Koko and Ferlin, first the bench, or the pressbox, and then gone. This year, Claude Julien doesn't have that kind of power. Look for more freedom for Morrow to be himself.
Not arguing that it's not a cheap contract but to compare it to Toews and Kane is simply not fair.
Patrice Krejci*
Pastafarian
Interesting post, not sure I agree 100% but you have some good points. This season will be very telling of Clode and many of the Bruins young guys trying to make the jump.
Ice Nine
Registered User
to somewhat compound the message of this post with what dom concluded in his on this page, and with regard to morrow: he not only moves the puck intelligently, but a distinguishing part of his game is how quickly and decisively he moves it. if afforded the leeway to do so, he is a supremely confident transitioning D with, imo, the best 'first pass' of any bruins D prospect. apropos of the current projected top 6, he may very well be the best first pass guy in the organization, especially now that dougie is out of the picture.
trotman's got a very good shot that he doesn't know how to use and he plays a safe game, and he has certainly grown and refined his game arguably more than any other bruins D prospect over the past 2 seasons. however, he doesn't play a particularly up-tempo game and is not even in the same realm transition game wise as morrow. he just doesn't see the ice anywhere near as well.
somethingbruin
Registered User
I would love to see a back up for rask and let the kids play on D not Franson he is like Dougie and alot of leaf fans say maybe softer for a big boy if our guys produce we have a shot at playoffs if not Chara should be gone at deadline so we can re up Marchand Krug that will leave money next year to make a splash much like we did when we got Savvy and Z I can see the Bruins signing Byfuglien or Seabrook and Okposo next year either way if it goes off the rails quick sell some parts keep re stocking with picks and make a splash in free agency 16 Go Bruins Go
DitClapper
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Great post buddy!! Always enjoy reading your stuff.
I also liked it, but thought the Neely stuff was a bit much. I'm sure there was some stuff there, but I think all presidents watch what their GM's do.
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ODAAT
Registered User
Hamilton jumped into the play alot and often carried the puck up ice, problem is, his pinches were often ill timed
Gawd forbid a coach demands one of his defensmen actually plays some D
Dougie paired with Z on the first pairing couldn`t always be the riverboat gambler, when Z went down, had to be even more cautious and far too often last year (as you would see by tons of posts here in various threads) fans screamed (and rightly so) at the kid who`s pinches far too often left his team hanging out to dry
Krug probably got/gets a bit more freedom as he`ll often be going up against opponents 3/4th lines and the fact he, IMO, is far more intelligent as to when and where is the right time to take that puck up ice or pinch in
Alberta_OReilly_Fan
Bruin fan since 1975
I remember going all the way back to our cup win... and how there was all sorts of talk that chiarelli/Julien were going to be fired if we lose to montreal in round 1 that year.
I mean... in a way I understand it... because chiarelli/Julien are outsiders. they aren't bruin family. Jacobs/neely/Sweeney and their buddies are bruin blood. these are guys who go way back in boston being boston.
I personally... have often admitted I don't like chiarelli/Julien on a very superfiscial level. I have run out the idea of trading Julien to another team. I suggested that we hire guys like terry oreilly to gm here because he would bring back what it meant to be bruin.
so, im an idiot probably... but that said, I have to still call a spade a spade.
I second guessed chiarelli every step of the way and all he did is win us 1 cup... make us a cup favorite 5 years in a roll... give us one powerhouse team after another to cheer for...
the dude had a plan and stuck to it even at the cost of making very bold moves.
then in his last year here... neely basically hung him out to dry and some fans here thought they were so freaking cute mocking chiarelli for bad contacts and 'evaluating.'
I became tremendously embarrassed to be associate with some of these fans. thankfully most of them are band wagon jumpers and now that the team is likely going to return to the old mess we were before chiarelli... these fans wont be around anymore. me? I let this team control my every waking moment since around 1975... ill be around even in years like 1996 when we definitely didn't have anyone as smart as chiarelli running the show.
neely is one of my heroes. hes a true bruin. so im getting my wish now to see a true bruin running the show. if it blows up in my face I have to admit... I asked for it. if Hamilton wants out I have to admit... I asked for it. I like many of us old timers here, have a certain expectation of my team to live up to the bruin identity.
now we will all see whether or not that means success in playoffs. the chiarelli way meant success in playoffs. the dude deserves some credit for having given us one of the bet 7 year runs of bruin playoff in my 40 years as a fan
Alberta_OReilly_Fan
Bruin fan since 1975
its starting to feel like the bruins don't have a lot of bullets left in the gun... cap space is pretty much spent. tradable assets are pretty much traded.
I keep wondering if theres a move that makes sense of krejci for a dman but that move made way more sense when we still had soderberg as a fall back plan.
maybe if the devils were to ever part company with adam Larson or if Nashville suddenly made seth jones available... we'd have to kick tires on something like that.
overall though its hard to really see anything else happening now. the cody franson thing is interesting but ultimately I think the hold up is cap space. I cant really see franson being affordable unless the plan is to move on from krug.
I guess the team could still be shopping Eriksson since hes 1 year from ufa and has value... but feels to me he would have moved already if that was the case.
we did get a lot of bang for our buck already this off-season as far as moves go... might be time to just let things settle and see what happens
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