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Player Discussion Alexis Lafreniere

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Shesterkybomb said:
What are you talking about, nobody outside of Kakko and Cuylle had a good camp but everyone puts it all at the feet of one guy is my point. Basing a young players career on a camp where everyone was ass is dumb. Everyone has excuses for everyone else but with Lafrienere its because he was eating all summer and not working out, stupid things people made up with zero credibility. I don't know why people can't just let the season play out and see how it goes its not like hes 32 years old or something, has a long career ahead of him. The ridiculous posts of him getting a try out after his contract or getting traded for 3 or 4th rounders is asinine.
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No no...

I'm saying that he is a mid... dime a dozen third liner. You can't change that with a summer of training.
 
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Machinehead said:
Let's talk about grit. I do think they try. I appreciated their effort in the 2021 run DESPITE GETTING WOEFULLY OUTPLAYED FOR MOST OF IT AND THAT PART IS IMPORTANT!! If you say Lafreniere hits a lot, you're right. He does. The problem is, our brand of hitting is very much running into guys when the puck is gone.
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You can't say that!! When I said that most of his hits, and our team hits in general don't involve puck separation, I got laughed at.
- Hit are poorly tracked to begin with. (Does anybody believe McDavid out hit Matthew Tkachuk?)
- Grit doesn't just mean slamming your body into a player against the boards after the move the puck. Lafreniere does hit. But he also takes himself out of the play making those hits, and rarely does it involve a player coughing up the puck.
 
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Shesterkybomb said:
What are you talking about, nobody outside of Kakko and Cuylle had a good camp but everyone puts it all at the feet of one guy is my point. Basing a young players career on a camp where everyone was ass is dumb. Everyone has excuses for everyone else but with Lafrienere its because he was eating all summer and not working out, stupid things people made up with zero credibility. I don't know why people can't just let the season play out and see how it goes its not like hes 32 years old or something, has a long career ahead of him. The ridiculous posts of him getting a try out after his contract or getting traded for 3 or 4th rounders is asinine.
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I think the point is that the players that you listed that had a good camp DO have something to prove compared to the other vets which traditionally do not need to prove anything in camp.

This continues the narrative that laffy acts like he is in the group that has earned something or is entitled to something when he hasnt earned anything to this point. He should be cuylle/kakko grouping for effort right now

Profet said:
No no...

I'm saying that he is a mid... dime a dozen third liner. You can't change that with a summer of training.
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maybe not in one summer, but in 3 pro summers you should see improvements...
 
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Shesterkybomb said:
Maybe he's been nursing an injury since early in camp? I don't know if that's true but it could be a factor. I mean, Zib, Kreider, Panarin etc all looked like shells of themselves in camp but nobody is proclaiming their careers dead either.
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It's easier to say a player could bounce back when you've see that player already show effort, skill, and very good/elite talent. When you see a player show nothing, it's a little harder to look at that player and say he's going to break out this season after he learns the system.
 
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Also... let's dispel the whole "but he gets points" thing...

His linemates, Kakko and Chytil took massive steps forward in both GP and points. Both of them doubling the number of points they had the previous year.

Laf had an improvement of 8 points.

The dude is a passenger. Those 8 points are easily attributed to the progression of Kakko and Chytil.

Trade him now before the rest of the league realizes it.
 
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Profet said:
Also... let's dispel the whole "but he gets points" thing...

His linemates, Kakko and Chytil took massive steps forward in both GP and points. Both of them doubling the number of points they had the previous year.

Laf had an improvement of 8 points.

The dude is a passenger. Those 8 points are easily attributed to the progression of Kakko and Chytil.

Trade him now before the rest of the league realizes it.
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The league knows. I think he could be sent down and no team would pick him up on waivers because reasons (yes really). He is the NYR's headache for better and worse.

Best we can do is give him time to get back on track and see what he looks like later in the season/next playoffs. If he can get his focus straight and realize he has to work his socks off for any future success there's still a player there. If he keeps floating and being lost/disengaged/a step behind or outside the play he'll go down Gurianov's path before long and that would suck. And it will get ugly which nobody wants.

e: maybe some team would grab him off waivers to give him a shot, but I don't think many would.
 
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CLW said:
The league knows. I think he could be sent down and no team would pick him up on waivers because reasons (yes really). He is the NYR's headache for better and worse.

Best we can do is give him time to get back on track and see what he looks like later in the season/next playoffs. If he can get his focus straight and realize he has to work his socks off for any future success there's still a player there. If he keeps floating and being lost/disengaged/a step behind or outside the play he'll go down Gurianov's path before long and that would suck. And it will get ugly which nobody wants.

e: maybe some team would grab him off waivers to give him a shot, but I don't think many would.
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I don't think he passes through. The option is to trade him if you don't think he's going to benefit the team. You can't try and waive him.
 
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TGWL said:
I don't think he passes through. The option is to trade him if you don't think he's going to benefit the team. You can't try and waive him.
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I don't think there's much of a market. The Rangers had to give Buch away who is a much better player (I know about the cap hit). Every team has mediocre wingers out the wazoo. If he had had a strong playoff it would be something else but he didn't.
 
CLW said:
I don't think there's much of a market. The Rangers had to give Buch away who is a much better player (I know about the cap hit). Every team has mediocre wingers out the wazoo. If he had had a strong playoff it would be something else but he didn't.
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Buch was an RFA with no cap hit and was going to be getting close to 6 million or so in a very flat cap. He was also a lot older. Laf, for all his struggles, is still very cheap, and a bottom team would be foolish to not claim him. I don't think it's the same situation.
 
GENESISPuck94 said:
He scored 19 EV goals as a 20 year old while playing on the 3rd line averaging 15 minutes per game.

He scored more points last year than the year prior.

This season hasn't even started yet.
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It's also not about how many goals he has. It's the way he scores them too.

The majority of the goals in his career so far are like Peter Prucha goals. He doesn't look dangerous out there.

The thing is, I truly believe he's capable of more. But I gotta see this kid play with more of an edge. He's not good enough to play a low-contact game like he tries to 90% of the time out there.

In the fist shift of 2022 playoffs against the Penguins, Laf came out and threw a monster hit. In the third round that year he got into a fight with Stamkos.

Was he scoring? No. But I thought he cared. He skated poorly, but he was able to grind with Chytil and Kakko, and generate offense. They were able to actually hold onto the puck.

Laf has regressed since then even though he scored more goals last year. Those were Peter Prucha goals. Not Top 6 forward goals.

He's capable of more but is afraid of getting hit.
 
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The Crypto Guy said:
Don't think most people are saying Laf will be guaranteed a great player at all, the camp is saying it's way TOO SOON to think he will never amount to anything more than a 3rd liner because he is still 21 and not all players develop at the same speed. Especially given his usage the last few years.

Just look at Kakko. I bet most the the bashers were bashing Kakko the last 2 years as well but we can all see that him, now going into a NHL season at 22 looks like he primed to breakout.
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I always liked how Kakko played though. I understood Kakko's game even as a rookie or when he struggled to put up numbers. I have zero issues with being patient with him for the long haul.

I don't get what Laf is even doing out there half the time.
 
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Peltz said:
I always liked how Kakko played though. I understood Kakko's game even as a rookie or when he struggled to put up numbers. I have zero issues with being patient with him for the long haul.

I don't get what Laf is even doing out there half the time.
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He’s like Vesey with better passing
 
Greschner4 said:
He never should have bulked up. It didn't work and didn't take. He's thicker, slower, and less agile than he was in the WJC. If he bulked up to be better to be a third liner, because he was blocked from the top two lines and needed to be "good in the corners" and whatnot like a third liner, it's organizational malpractice.

I'm warming to the idea that a lot of this is the Rangers' fault.
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I really doubt it's the bulk. Even Jack Hughes needed to bulk up before he became a star.

Adding muscle didn't make Hughes slower. And I doubt it's making Laf slower. He's just not confident at all.
 
Kords said:
I've been popping in to check out this thread from time to time since camp opened and it's literally the same people saying the same things every time. It's one thing to vent, but it's starting to border on spam... Save some energy for the regular season folks, yeesh!
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Blame the NHL. The season starts way too late.
 
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