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Player Discussion Alexis Lafreniere

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ReddestRum said:
What? Watch it again. And then watch it one more time. Lindren tells Laf to cover the slot before he pressures the guy with the puck. Lindgren literally looks at both the Isles player and Laf before pointing at the Isles player and letting Laf know to hustle for the switch off.

Why are you guys making crap up now?
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what? read my post. and then read it one more time. that's exactly what I said happened. Laf gets stuck in between because he initially goes to cover Lee. his backcheck is fine at this point, but Lindgren calls him off to cover Lee himself and now Laf is stuck covering nobody. Lindgren is also now covering nobody made apparent by the fact that Lee makes a pass to the slot undefended (because Lindgren is 4 feet away from him). Laf dives to break up the pass, he's only out of position because of the confusion between him and Lindgren.
 
We paid for a 1st overall... what we got:

1696259312159.png
 
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Bacon Artemi Bravo said:
Its fair to be disappointed in Laf thus far. Its also fair to be hopeful that he'll still be a very good player. Any person can be one or both of those things and not contradict themselves.
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Yes! I 100% fall into this category. I would also add that I am not at all hopeful he will turn into anything more than a mid range players based on his skill set, but I get your point.
 
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ReddestRum said:
LOL. You need to log off your computer for a bit. If you're getting this worked up about conflicting opinions on a million dollar 21 year old NHL'r by telling people they hate Laf as a player and a person (Hm. Not sure anyone has said they hate him as a person) and are here just to hate the team, then you need to take a breather bro. Hahaha. On every board across the internet there are fans that are voicing their doubts in every way possible, but this is probably the first time someone has told me that I hate Laf as a person. It's kind of pathetic.
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You are one of the most antagonizing posters in this thread towards anyone who doesn’t see things your way. I don’t know who you hate more, the player or the fans that are still holding out hope. You’re fake “hahahah’s” belie your actual feelings. If anyone needs to take a breather here, it’s you by a mile.
 
I'm definitely not optimistic with Lafreniere relative to the day we won the lottery, but I don't see a ton of separation between the better forwards in his draft year and him (Stutzle aside). I think it's perfectly realistic for Lafreniere to end up a similar tier of player to like Raymond, Mercer, Jarvis, Lundell, Perfetti. It's not how I imagined the first 1OA I ever lived to see would end up, but it could be much worse.

I do remember Kakko especially receiving a ton of the same criticism as recently as the 2022 playoff run: ie. what do he even do? Specifically I remember his rookie year and sophomore year having to argue pretty vehemently with many posters that he has plus-level hands. I was told nobody could see flashes. yadayada.

Whether Lafreniere has plateaued or finds another level... I don't think it was ever realistic to expect it to be decided in training camp. It's a long season; this is an entire team under very new directives, with very different leadership; and it's also a team with many more players than just Lafreniere having something to prove. Who knows how things shake out by December? What if Panarin's injury turns into something nagging and a top6 LW and PP1 spot opens up for a stretch? What if lines get shaken up and Lafreniere and some unexpected player find chemistry? IDK. Have to let it play out.

Personally, I would've traded him at the draft, but here we are. I'll be keeping an open mind and waiting and seeing, without expecting much either way.
 
But all of you are saying trade him now for whatever we can get, are looking at this in a vacuum. Even if he turns out to be a third line players with 40 - 50 point upside, isn't that a player that the Rangers need right now as they chase a cup run??? Why would we move him for picks while we have a Norris defenseman, a Vezina goaltender and a ton of young core players? Picks do jack shit for this team other than something to talk about on forums.
 
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bogans said:
But all of you are saying trade him now for whatever we can get, are looking at this in a vacuum. Even if he turns out to be a third line players with 40 - 50 point upside, isn't that a player that the Rangers need right now as they chase a cup run??? Why would we move him for picks while we have a Norris defenseman, a Vezina goaltender and a ton of young core players? Picks do jack shit for this team other than something to talk about on forums.
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Because we need something new to be disappointed in
 
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Shesterkybomb said:
Why did he need to do that? He's got a contract and a roster spot. What he needed to do was stay healthy and get used to the right side. Preseason is for bubble players to show their worth and for roster players to loosen up.
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He's statistically the worst 1st overall pick in 20 years showing very little signs of progression.

I would think he has a lot to prove to himself and the fan base. But that's the problem. He's just not good. No doubt he's trying and Saturday's game was the first time I actually saw visible signs of frustration from him instead of that weird smile.

Good. I want him pissed off. He should be watching Chris Kreider tape from the last two seasons four hours a day after practice. That's his ticket to being a 1st line player in this league one day. I'm sure Chris would love to work with him on his board play, cycling, and hands in tight. He's just not going to be a dangler, playmaker, or sniper at this level successfully.
 
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Profet said:
We paid for a 1st overall... what we got:

View attachment 748200
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Actually the Rangers ordered a real lambo but paid for the cardboard version with his latest contract is more like it.

bogans said:
But all of you are saying trade him now for whatever we can get, are looking at this in a vacuum. Even if he turns out to be a third line players with 40 - 50 point upside, isn't that a player that the Rangers need right now as they chase a cup run??? Why would we move him for picks while we have a Norris defenseman, a Vezina goaltender and a ton of young core players? Picks do jack shit for this team other than something to talk about on forums.
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Logical viewpoint. Agreed that trading him makes no sense now. It's also like some people want him traded so he can go develop in another organization only to further their point that the Rangers can't develop talent.
 
If Laf busts and TWO of Kak/Chytil/Othmann don't become 80-100pt guys, we're going 'Rebuild Part II: Back to the lottery'.

I'm not feeling 7 more years of rebuilding. I want this kid to pull it together more than anything.
 
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bogans said:
But all of you are saying trade him now for whatever we can get, are looking at this in a vacuum. Even if he turns out to be a third line players with 40 - 50 point upside, isn't that a player that the Rangers need right now as they chase a cup run??? Why would we move him for picks while we have a Norris defenseman, a Vezina goaltender and a ton of young core players? Picks do jack shit for this team other than something to talk about on forums.
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It’s a fair question. I think the answer is, it depends a lot on the player. A 40-50 point winger can be a lot of different things. If it’s 40 points but great at helping hem the other team in for long stretches, reliably transitioning the puck, using speed to back off defenders and create space for others or getting in a tenacious forecheck, that has value. If it’s 40 points and great PKing that has value. If it’s 50 points and bad defense, kinda floating around, not knowing your role, being indecisive… is it helping the team as much? Can’t you sign an Athanasiou or Tatar for nearly league minimum every summer if that’s all you’re getting?

Obviously, this year that time has passed but what if you’d traded Laf for pick #13 at the draft, added a solid prospect in a deep draft and then signed Tatar for 900k on July 1st? The production Laf is going to bring this year is replaced by Tatar easily. Otthman SHOULD comfortably replace 40+ points long term (I say should because we’re having this conversation about Laf… clearly there’s no guarantees), and you also added a valuable asset to the cupboard.

If we’re just talking about points in a vacuum, Laf’s production can easily be replaced for near league minimum every summer. If we’re talking about the total picture of what a 40-50 point player brings, Laf doesn’t come with a lot of accessories. He’s not Grabner keeping defense on their toes because he’s a threat for 2 breakaways per game. If we’re not waiting on 65+ point potential anymore, which seems to get less and less likely, than a 40-50 point middle six option can realistically always be found to replace Laf’s production, we could feasibly get something else out of the replacement - like a welcome injection of speed, or strong penalty killing - and we can gain a quality asset giving Laf a change of scenery. If it looked likely Laf was heading for anything more than 50 points, I’d be less inclined to think this way, but it really doesn’t.
 
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Raymond, Mercer, Jarvis, Lundell, Perfetti. add quinn, rychel, peterka, evangelista, and even cuylie to the list. within the next 2 years it would not shock me the very least that they all surpass 13. what originaly was thought of as a weak draft could turn out to one that was not so bad afterall.
 
PANARIN BREAD FAN said:
Raymond, Mercer, Jarvis, Lundell, Perfetti. add quinn, rychel, peterka, evangelista, and even cuylie to the list. within the next 2 years it would not shock me the very least that they all surpass 13. what originaly was thought of as a weak draft could turn out to one that was not so bad afterall.
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Stutzle, Sanderson, Mercer, Raymond, Lundell, Jarvis, Quinn, Peterka, Schneider, Guhle, Drysdale, Evangelista, Greig, Faber, Reichel, Askarov, Nikishin. In 2-3 years Laf and Byfield both could be outside of the top 20. There’s a lot of additional strong names on the list.
 
It was his leg that got injured at the WJC right? Did he get hurt bad enough to impede his ability to improve his skating long term? :huh:

The first pre season game I thought his agility seemed a bit better but that quickly fell off
 
Mike in Houston said:
The RW experiment appears to be over again folks.
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And, yet again, he's exactly where he deserves to be.

Profet said:
Is he?

Yakupov: 0.46 PPG his first 3 NHL seasons.
Lafreniere: 0.42 PPG his first 3 NHL seasons.
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Well, we can use whatever selective stats to make our point(s).

Lafreniere had 39 points last year. Yakupov never achieved that despite looks on the PP that Lafreniere never got.

Saying he's better than Yakupov, also, isn't saying a whole lot. :P
 
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haohmaru said:
And, yet again, he's exactly where he deserves to be.



Well, we can use whatever selective stats to make our point(s).

Lafreniere had 39 points last year. Yakupov never achieved that despite looks on the PP that Lafreniere never got.

Saying he's better than Yakupov, also, isn't saying a whole lot. :P
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I get it.

But that said... they are pretty close in production.

So... if you were the oilers and had a time machine, would you have tried trading Yakupov after his first three seasons? Or would you have waited another year and taken the conditional 3rd pick?
 
Kendo said:
He's a middle 6 guy making $2.5 and trending upwards. That has value.

We'll see what he does this season. If he flirts with 50 pts, then at $2.5 next season he's a great piece. Even if that's his absolute ceiling, he's still a useful player.

Trading him for a late first that may never sniff 40 pts is even worse asset management, imo.


Shit on him all you want, but he has improved each season.
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How so? Just typing it doesn't make it true. How is he trending upwards?
 
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Profet said:
I get it.

But that said... they are pretty close in production.

So... if you were the oilers and had a time machine, would you have tried trading Yakupov after his first three seasons? Or would you have waited another year and taken the conditional 3rd pick?
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Honestly, I'm not sure he gets a first round pick at this point. I'm with @bobbop - if he gets a slow start then I think he's out of here at his own request.
 
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