Player Discussion Alexis Lafreniere

[zlev]

If that is an example of Lav having his man then things just got worse. Im sure Laf himself would be honest and say he needs to do better than that.

he gets completely left out to dry by Lindgren. at first Laf wants to cover Lee and Lindgren calls him off, so Laf is stuck in between while Lindgren watches Lee pass the puck into the slot. really it just looks like two players learning a new system. mouthbreathers will look at the last 2 seconds of the play and see Laf desperately diving to break up a pass and say "a durr bad backcheck durr" but really the play falls apart long before that.

 

[PANARIN BREAD FAN]

just a 13 sympathizer who is displaying one way of a coping mechanism-showing an example of the only one trick that 13 knows.

say that pic of 13 playing softball where he has the front of his backfoot is pointing towards the catcher - anybody here think that at bat was at best he grounded into a double play?

 

[ReddestRum]

he gets completely left out to dry by Lindgren. at first Laf wants to cover Lee and Lindgren calls him off, so Laf is stuck in between while Lindgren watches Lee pass the puck into the slot. really it just looks like two players learning a new system. mouthbreathers will look at the last 2 seconds of the play and see Laf desperately diving to break up a pass and say "a durr bad backcheck durr" but really the play falls apart long before that.

What? Watch it again. And then watch it one more time. Lindren tells Laf to cover the slot before he pressures the guy with the puck. Lindgren literally looks at both the Isles player and Laf before pointing at the Isles player and letting Laf know to hustle for the switch off.

Why are you guys making crap up now?

 

[Harbour Dog]

Laf having to make his social media private, cuts Man. Obviously all of us were hoping and expecting for more to this point, but he doesn't deserve to have to deal with the hate that is getting thrown at him from people who supposedly want him to succeed. I hope he's also been getting support from people too. f*** social media.

 

[LORDE]

The honest truth is that he's busting & there are 2 factions here... those that HATE it & see it & sadly know it...

& those that HATE it & see it & know it but won't admit it just yet.

 

[smoneil]

The honest truth is that he's busting & there are 2 factions here... those that HATE it & see it & sadly know it...

& those that HATE it & see it & know it but won't admit it just yet.

He's 21 and had 40 points last year. He may not be living up to expectations, but he's not busting.

The honest truth is that there are two factions here-- those that can see how Laf got here over the last three years, and want to give him the space to be the best player he can be (because we are actual fans of the team).

And those who somehow take it personally that he's not a Hart trophy winner by age 21, and have decided that they hate him as a player and as a person for not meeting their personal expectations (because they derive joy from the misery of others, and would rather their spite be validated than see the team/player succeed).


Side note--I'd be really curious to know how many of the people on the "trade Laf for a 7th round pick" brigade were also charter members of the "trade Chytil for nothing because it would be addition by subtraction" squad back when Chytil was 21 and having some struggles.

 

[Profet]

He's 21 and had 40 points last year. He may not be living up to expectations, but he's not busting.

The honest truth is that there are two factions here-- those that can see how Laf got here over the last three years, and want to give him the space to be the best player he can be (because we are actual fans of the team).

And those who somehow take it personally that he's not a Hart trophy winner by age 21, and have decided that they hate him as a player and as a person for not meeting their personal expectations (because they derive joy from the misery of others, and would rather their spite be validated than see the team/player succeed).


Side note--I'd be really curious to know how many of the people on the "trade Laf for a 7th round pick" brigade were also charter members of the "trade Chytil for nothing because it would be addition by subtraction" squad back when Chytil was 21 and having some struggles.

Living in denial doesn't make someone a bigger or truer fan.

Let's just squash that crap now.

 

[ReddestRum]

He's 21 and had 40 points last year. He may not be living up to expectations, but he's not busting.

The honest truth is that there are two factions here-- those that can see how Laf got here over the last three years, and want to give him the space to be the best player he can be (because we are actual fans of the team).

And those who somehow take it personally that he's not a Hart trophy winner by age 21, and have decided that they hate him as a player and as a person for not meeting their personal expectations (because they derive joy from the misery of others, and would rather their spite be validated than see the team/player succeed).


Side note--I'd be really curious to know how many of the people on the "trade Laf for a 7th round pick" brigade were also charter members of the "trade Chytil for nothing because it would be addition by subtraction" squad back when Chytil was 21 and having some struggles.

This is probably the shittiest post I've seen in the Laf thread to date.

 

[LokiDog]

He's 21 and had 40 points last year. He may not be living up to expectations, but he's not busting.

The honest truth is that there are two factions here-- those that can see how Laf got here over the last three years, and want to give him the space to be the best player he can be (because we are actual fans of the team).

And those who somehow take it personally that he's not a Hart trophy winner by age 21, and have decided that they hate him as a player and as a person for not meeting their personal expectations (because they derive joy from the misery of others, and would rather their spite be validated than see the team/player succeed).


Side note--I'd be really curious to know how many of the people on the "trade Laf for a 7th round pick" brigade were also charter members of the "trade Chytil for nothing because it would be addition by subtraction" squad back when Chytil was 21 and having some struggles.

Well, I mean, I started a thread on the trade forum asking the populace what’s the top value for Laf at this point and consensus seemed to be mid-late first pick plus a third-ish. So I don’t think there’s an “addition by subtraction” faction or a contingent that wants to trade anyone for a 7th, but there is a group that feels there is merit in getting something like 20th OA while we can over gambling on Laf beating the odds.

 

[LORDE]

He's 21 and had 40 points last year. He may not be living up to expectations, but he's not busting.

The honest truth is that there are two factions here-- those that can see how Laf got here over the last three years, and want to give him the space to be the best player he can be (because we are actual fans of the team).

And those who somehow take it personally that he's not a Hart trophy winner by age 21, and have decided that they hate him as a player and as a person for not meeting their personal expectations (because they derive joy from the misery of others, and would rather their spite be validated than see the team/player succeed).


Side note--I'd be really curious to know how many of the people on the "trade Laf for a 7th round pick" brigade were also charter members of the "trade Chytil for nothing because it would be addition by subtraction" squad back when Chytil was 21 and having some struggles.

I never, nor did anyone else say trade him for a 7th & no one hates him & EVERY SINGLE PERSON on this board IS a fan of this team. How ridiculous

 

[smoneil]

Living in denial doesn't make someone a bigger or truer fan.

Let's just squash that crap now.

Your posts are literally taking every opportunity, including intentional misrepresentation, to constantly shit on a player who, had he been drafted in a different spot, would have this fan base ecstatic. You give every impression that you would rather see the kid fail than be wrong, so yeah, mosey on over to the Devils forum, because constantly shitting on Rangers will make you quite popular over there.

This is probably the shittiest post I've seen in the Laf thread to date.

Says the guy who was all "Laf sucks because stats" until it was pointed out that the stats didn't really say that, and suddenly became the guy who was all "ignore stats! I meant eye test!"

Well, I mean, I started a thread on the trade forum asking the populace what’s the top value for Laf at this point and consensus seemed to be mid-late first pick plus a third-ish. So I don’t think there’s an “addition by subtraction” faction or a contingent that wants to trade anyone for a 7th, but there is a group that feels there is merit in getting something like 20th OA while we can over gambling on Laf beating the odds.

The main boards all think he's a bust because 90% of the main boards have an irrational hatred of the Rangers. When your franchise literally only gets ONE first overall (and two top 5) picks in a 60 year span, you gamble on Laf beating the odds. Particularly when the return (a player drafted at ~20th overall) is more likely to COMPLETELY bust than to even turn into what a 21 year old Laf is right now (a 40 point, 20 goal middle sixer).

I am baffled at how the narrative on these boards, for literal years, was all about how we needed to tank to get top 5 picks, and now that we finally have one, people are all "it's developing too slowly. Discard it and do better then next time you get a top 5 pick in 2078."

He's 21 years old.
He's had 3 head coaches going into his 4th season.
He's been buried behind two of the top players on the team since he got here.
He's being shifted to a new position which will take some time.

I get it. There's reason for frustration. But if people don't also see that there is at least SOME reason for optimism as well, then I'm sorry--those people just enjoy wallowing in their misery.

We have a player who is already pretty decent for his age, if not his draft position, and with some time to settle in to the new position and getting used to taking a few more chances, we may be able to get his development back on track. He's cheap on the cap, a good team/locker room guy. I don't get the rage about the kid.

 

[smoneil]

I never, nor did anyone else say trade him for a 7th & no one hates him & EVERY SINGLE PERSON on this board IS a fan of this team. How ridiculous

A lot of folks on here are fans of a team they don't seem to like very much. And if it's true that fans like that have basically harassed a 21 year old kid into locking down his social media? That's just pitiful.

It's like I said, the "We hate Laf" club has been posting so feverishly that it feels like the f***ing Devils board lately. What does that tell you?

 

[ReddestRum]

A lot of folks on here are fans of a team they don't seem to like very much. And if it's true that fans like that have basically harassed a 21 year old kid into locking down his social media? That's just pitiful.

It's like I said, the "We hate Laf" club has been posting so feverishly that it feels like the f***ing Devils board lately. What does that tell you?

LOL. You need to log off your computer for a bit. If you're getting this worked up about conflicting opinions on a million dollar 21 year old NHL'r by telling people they hate Laf as a player and a person (Hm. Not sure anyone has said they hate him as a person) and are here just to hate the team, then you need to take a breather bro. Hahaha. On every board across the internet there are fans that are voicing their doubts in every way possible, but this is probably the first time someone has told me that I hate Laf as a person. It's kind of pathetic.

 

[PANARIN BREAD FAN]

so it finally got this far just recently that 13 locked up his social media acct? his common sense outside of the rink is just as slow as his skating. 13 should have locked up that acct after that overtime devils debacle.

 

[Machinehead]

He wasn't taken in a different spot. He was taken in a spot where a franchise player is a reasonable expectation.

 

[smoneil]

LOL. You need to log off your computer for a bit. If you're getting this worked up about conflicting opinions on a million dollar 21 year old NHL'r by telling people they hate Laf as a player and a person (Hm. Not sure anyone has said they hate him as a person) and are here just to hate the team, then you need to take a breather bro. Hahaha. On every board across the internet there are fans that are voicing their doubts in every way possible, but this is probably the first time someone has told me that I hate Laf as a person. It's kind of pathetic.

I expressed frustration over the constant negativity in a few posts. You've been part of a non-stop campaign against one of our own players. Which one is the "pathetic" one, "bro"?

When you post things that are intentionally false or misrepresent the player's development, then yeah, it makes it look like you have a personal problem rather than a fan problem. Case in point--I've been ready for Panarin to move on for a while. I think his lazy play has rubbed off on too many of the other players, and he makes far more money than he's worth. I might post something along those lines every now and again when discussing team building, but what I don't do is sit there looking for every possible play that I can use as an excuse to reiterate my disdain for a player (and Bread's goal-generating giveaway yesterday was far more egregious than Laf's defensive miscue). Bread is ON the team, whether or not I think it could be better constructed without his cap hit, so I'm going to celebrate the good things that he does, and hope that he gets back to the player he was 3 years ago. I'm going to be optimistic that a new system might accentuate his positive traits while reining in his negative ones. Because being a fan of the team is more important than being a critic of a player.

And I routinely log off, for several weeks/months at a time, because "fans" like you make this place feel like a Devils dive bar more than a place for Rangers fans to discuss the team.

 

[smoneil]

He wasn't taken in a different spot. He was taken in a spot where a franchise player is a reasonable expectation.

If your parents bought you a Subaru when you really expected a Lambo, are you going to give away the Subaru when the only other mode of transportation you have available is a Vespa? Don't bite your nose to spite your face.

 

[ReddestRum]

I expressed frustration over the constant negativity in a few posts. You've been part of a non-stop campaign against one of our own players. Which one is the "pathetic" one, "bro"?

When you post things that are intentionally false or misrepresent the player's development, then yeah, it makes it look like you have a personal problem rather than a fan problem. Case in point--I've been ready for Panarin to move on for a while. I think his lazy play has rubbed off on too many of the other players, and he makes far more money than he's worth. I might post something along those lines every now and again when discussing team building, but what I don't do is sit there looking for every possible play that I can use as an excuse to reiterate my disdain for a player (and Bread's goal-generating giveaway yesterday was far more egregious than Laf's defensive miscue). Bread is ON the team, whether or not I think it could be better constructed without his cap hit, so I'm going to celebrate the good things that he does, and hope that he gets back to the player he was 3 years ago. I'm going to be optimistic that a new system might accentuate his positive traits while reining in his negative ones. Because being a fan of the team is more important than being a critic of a player.

And I routinely log off, for several weeks/months at a time, because "fans" like you make this place feel like a Devils dive bar more than a place for Rangers fans to discuss the team.

I'm going to tell you something that will make you log off for about a year.

I'm a fan of hockey more than I'm a fan of the Rangers. Hockey is a sport. It's a game. It's entertainment. It's something that fans pay in one form or another to enjoy. There's no f***ing way you or anyone in this fandom that will convince me that blind positive team allegiance is the only way to be a true fan of any one team. You're taking this way too personal if you're pointing fingers at people on the internet and saying they hate a player as a person because you don't like a stat debate.

You are the worst kind of fan because unlike anyone else in this thread, for or against Laf's play, you telling others how to be a fan in your holier than thou way is some loathsome shit that doesn't belong in any conversation on this forum or beyond. Seek help. I hope you're not like this to other fans IRL.

 

[Whoot Whoot]

Joe said, during the isles broadcast, that AL worked on his lower body and edge work this summer. Was there any more info on that ?

 

[EXTRAS]

Laf had 39 points last year as a 21 year old in the league.
He had 15m of icetime and 1:23m pp time.

Debrincat had 66 points.
He had 19m of icetime and 4m of premium pp time.

Debrincat had 4m more icetime and almost 3m more pp time per game.

With that extra icetime I don't see why laf couldn't get at least reasonably close to debrincats stats. Especially as he continues to develop.

Think people are overblowing this bust stuff. I think it is reasonable to believe Laf becomes a fairly consistent 55-60 point player.

 

[HabsAddict]

Outsider looking in....

His current value is mid 1st or less.

He doesn't improve, next stop is a 2nd.

He's not a bust but neither going to get a big return just because he's a former 1OA.

NO, the Habs don't want him or need him. We are going to have a surplus of defenseman but 1 don't think it's NYR need.

Good luck.

 

[Rongomania]

Laf had 39 points last year as a 21 year old in the league.
He had 15m of icetime and 1:23m pp time.

Debrincat had 66 points.
He had 19m of icetime and 4m of premium pp time.

Debrincat had 4m more icetime and almost 3m more pp time per game.

With that extra icetime I don't see why laf couldn't get at least reasonably close to debrincats stats. Especially as he continues to develop.

Think people are overblowing this bust stuff. I think it is reasonable to believe Laf becomes a fairly consistent 55-60 point player.

I think his ceiling is still higher than that. And of course I see him having a hard time the past 12 months. Despite this fact, he still progressed points wise last season. I'm not blind, I see him looking lost and not confident at times. Honestly, that's ok for a 21/22 year old finding his game. Is it under a magnifying glass because of his draft position? Absolutely, and that's ok too. I joke around a lot but I'm not truly ripping the Laf doomers. I just disagree with a lot of takes, like trading / giving up on a 21-23 year old 1st overall pick.

 

[bobbop]

Any solid info on this or is this just speculation based on how bad a fit he continues to be here?

Speculation on my part. I really haven’t plugged into anyone yet this year.

I'm reminded of San Jose moving Pat Falloon (second overall pick behind Lindros) to the Flyers at about the same point in his career. Ron Ryan, who was the Flyers President at that time told me they were sure (SURE!) they could turn Falloon around. They traded two picks including a first and a player for the privilege. They are still waiting. If Lafreniere doesn’t uptick soon, Drury will have to consider cutting his losses.There are teams that would be sure (SURE!) they could turn him around.

 

[RangersFan1994]

Outsider looking in....

His current value is mid 1st or less.

He doesn't improve, next stop is a 2nd.

He's not a bust but neither going to get a big return just because he's a former 1OA.

NO, the Habs don't want him or need him. We are going to have a surplus of defenseman but 1 don't think it's NYR need.

Good luck.

An upgrade over Harpur would be nice. After Miller, Gustaffsson, Lindgren (1 year left for Lindgren) not much depth if 2 are hurt at the same time.Zac Jones and then guys who are not ready and or not that good. I’d love Othmann’s former teammate Owen Beck. Doubt he is available but I’d be interested if I’m Chris Drury. Rangers can use more young center depth.

 

[Profet]

had he been drafted in a different spot, would have this fan base ecstatic.

Listen to yourself:

"If the facts were completely different you would be ecstatic."

Uh... Ok?

The fact is that Laf wasn't a lower draft pick and didn't exceed expectations. It's the opposite. And our franchise player is nothing but a 3rd liner.

I can't get ecstatic for that.

I'm a Rangers fan, that doesn't mean I have to agree with their decisions.

You don't throw good money after bad. Time to cut our losses on Lafreniere.