Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière
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irishlaxburger2
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Based on watching them play. They’re dynamic. They try to make things happen, regardless of who they’re playing with. If Laff needs to be with 1st line players to look competent, or PP time to pad his stats, he’s not the player he was hyped to be.
The Crypto Guy
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- Jun 26, 2017
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Yea but you, and him don't like facts that he is still putting up decent ES numbers, the same as Kreider and Trocheck, so you skew the facts to the way you want, which is why it's tough to take too much seriously with your views. You can't have it both ways.
- Jan 18, 2012
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You tell me. League leading Boston with Quaider? Stanley Cup championship defending Colorado with Willsie and Reinprecht? Can I interest you in one of the female perspectives working for teams at the top of the standings?
Yes I'm comfortable putting Othmann and Sykora into this organization, lol. But I definitely have a different rubric for assessing hockey players than the points schmoints crowd.
True, Habs loaded with young D and trying to unload Druoin and Armia and Hoffman and probably some picks hard to say but not sure what his worth really is.
McRanger92
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zlev
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- Dec 21, 2015
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anyone remember when he looked real good in the preseason and then he got hit in the foot with a shot? i thought he was gonna be out 4-6 weeks when that happened, he left the game and did not return. i wonder if he has been playing through that all season. it would explain why he is so goddamn slow.
irishlaxburger2
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Good Intentions
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- Mar 30, 2018
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Play that out. What are you taking exception to?
13 is giggling his way through Year 3. A collection of video gamers insist he’s going to be great because of their PS4 dynasty season in 2029. Spare me. He absolutely sucks.
NoQuitInNewMexico
it's okay cause it's all just the way it should be
LORDE
I am Lorde, YA YA YA
Keep bangin that EV stat... it's all you have
If you watch the games and you just bottom line it you see what we're saying. There isn't anything there.
Just for shit's sake... what if we traded Bread and Kreider right now and Laf was #1LW forever and had PP1 time forever?
Where is he in a yr or 2 yrs?
Loki is posting stats and info to back up Laf's struggles. It's not about that he likes him or not. Laf is struggling, and for a 1stOA pick it makes it more of a concern.
Some folks here pencil in Laf over Kreider on the Top line. Loki brought up an excellent point. It's not about just the production which is still lacking for him, but the overall game of goals for and goals against. Kreider is better suited for that top line, because he can play against the tougher competition on both sides of the ice, and has also produced up there as well.
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It’s def looks like a conditioning issue. I feel like both he (and Kakko as well) look completely spent by the end of the game. This is something the org needs to address.
- Apr 16, 2012
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But you’re watching them when they’ve been already GIVEN the things we are talking about giving Laf now…
Listen, I can’t say you are wrong, because as I said it’s unknowable, but I’m not buying it. It doesn’t flow logically. If you can show me players from the draft class who have turned it on under the same usage and opportunity circumstances as we gave Laf you’d have more of a case. Using players who GOT top pick treatment doesn’t move the needle for me. But that’s me, not trying to tell you what to think.
At this point we deserve it. Hahahaha.
Basically that he thinks Laf probably didn't put in the work he needed to this summer and his game is suffering now because of it
I think I’ve done this though.
Dawson Mercer plays LESS 5v5 and the same PP time as Laf. He edges him slightly on TOI because he PKs. He has better ES production and has done more with his PP time, but getting beyond the statistics… Mercer, with less 5v5 time and identical PP time, even though the bottom line results are close (slightly favor Mercer) LOOKS like 3x the player Laf is. He’s infinitely more noticeable and looks much more promising. If you ask me today who will have the better career, I will comfortably say Mercer likely has the better career.
They’re from the same draft and are less than 20 days apart in age. Like I said, production is similar, so it’s not like he’s blowing Laf away, but he shows speed, tries to carry the puck and make plays, is overall more engaged in reading the puck and being involved in the play whether it’s a cycle, a forecheck, a backcheck, etc. and simply looks more like a legitimate NHL player at 21.
Laf has 18 points, Mercer has 27.
Laf has 17 EV, Mercer has 22 EV (and 1 SH).
Laf has 17 EV points, average 13:48 EV per game.
Mercer has 22 EV points, averaging 13:05 EV per game.
Laf has 1 PP point with 1:17 of PP time per game.
Mercer has 4 PP points with 1:20 per game.
Mercer plays 1:10 per night on the PK and has a SH point; Laf doesn’t touch the PK.
Mercer is 16 days younger.
Which player so far is performing better? The one with 5 more EV points despite 43 seconds less time per game, who kills penalties and passes the eye test at the same time? Or the 1OA? Laf has 70 career points in 178 games. Mercer has 69 in 125 while playing less minutes for all of it.
You asked for an example from the same draft class with the same usage.
Daves a mess
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- Jan 8, 2014
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To me, Kravtsov looked better 2 years ago than he does now. Can't trade him ( no value) won't go back to the AHL ( hes above that menial labor) and 4 goals in 40ish NHL games is not keeping him as a top six winger on any NHL team.
Jimmy Vesey is a better skater, with better hands than Laf. Imagine saying that in Lafs D3 season.
Has Laf scored a skill goal this season from more than 10 feet from the net? Has he sniped a single goal this entire season. I must be forgetting. He had to right?
- Apr 16, 2012
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Technically I asked for playerS, because one could easily be an outlier, but I do appreciate the effort. These are this years stats, did they also get the same usage while developing during the last two years? Because Laf’s usage has increased. If Mercer has been getting more time all along that’s a benefit to him. But I’ll look that up on my own, just out of curiosity, it’s not your responsibility to do ALL the work for me. Haha. And you may be right, Mercer may end up having a better career, or he may not, May end up even being the best player from the draft, or might not, but that doesn’t make Laf a bust unless he stays below Mercer and Mercer has a meh career. Any way you slice it I think it’s crazy to give up on Laf at 3 months past his 21st birthday, with a whole 178 regular season games under his belt, with the usage he’s gotten. Most of the top picks we fawn over were developed under far different, more beneficial to the player, circumstances. We’ll know soon enough…
Again though, thanks for the effort and for being reasonable even though we don’t see eye to eye.
Edit: Mercer stayed in junior his D+1, last year he actually got more TOI than this year, by about a min. Only about 2 mins more than Laf, ~16 to 14, I don’t think that’s the issue here. I think you are correct, Mercer has just developed better under similar circumstances.
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Synergy27
F-A-C-G-C-E
Drouin haunts me when watching Laf. I feel like there is a contingent that thinks that failure is impossible for a 1OA. It should be, but there are so many recent examples.
Drouin has been a huge disappointment but he is still much better than Laf. Yes, he was a 3OA vs. a 1OA but is that really that big a difference? It’s only a huge difference when there’s a generational player at stake.
Who won the original Drouin trade?
I just don’t see the same “it” with Laff than I do with those other players. He never dominates a shift or creates his own scoring opportunity. He never has the puck on his stick or makes his line mates better. I’ve yet to see him undress a defenseman this season or explode through the neutral zone. But you’re right, there’s not proof or metric to back up what I’m saying. I just don’t think that the missing ingredient for Laff is PP time. Nothing about his game right now screams impact player.
I'm not drafting a kid top 10 if they aren't a mouthguard chewer.
I’m far from a Kravtsov guy but I think he’s done a good job so far. This is basically his rookie year as far as I’m concerned and the difference in his play today compared to the start of the season gives me hope he can be a legit top 6 guy.
- Apr 16, 2012
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Well off the top of my head he undressed Suter a few games ago, and Suter took a penalty punching him in the face to stop him. Hahaha. My take is not that top line time or PP time is a missing ingredient to him suddenly breaking out, but to his development. I havent been trying to convince anyone he’s been playing well or DESERVING of these things, I’m saying we are dragging out his development by not giving him these things.
But yeah its subjective, you see what you see.
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