Alexander Burmistrov "will almost certainly return to NHL"

[Grind]

There aren't many 1st round picks around that would make a deal about Burmi + Buff/Kane for 1st a good deal for us Probably no team with a top 5 pick would do it and outside the top 10, it's an easy loss for us.

More like top two.

Kaane is a top five pick and isperforming as one. Nurmi is a mid 6 player that's a year younger then Kane. The idea wed he shipping those two for a pick is ridiculous. Even if Nurmi is just a third liner, he's a 22 year old third liner. That's valuable

 

[Jet]

A couple points from that story:



Then play nice with Chevy, and ensure that he can get the most return for you, Alex. Or, wait until you're an NHL UFA.




I hate reading these translations - I can never tell if the player is as full of themselves as it sounds. I liked his game, but I think he has a slightly over-developed ego if this translation holds true. Is this a hold-over from the Noel usage of Burmi? Is this a call to be allowed to play 'his game', instead of the team's game?

Like it or not, if he does come back to Winnipeg, I can't see him slotting into a C position anymore. With Little, Scheifele and Perreault, he'll have to be content with either a 4C position, or a position on the wing, IMHO.

So sad - I hope he either returns and contributes, or we turn him into another asset via a trade.

Here's my interpretation:

First of all, it's Russian people speaking Russian. There will be some nuance lost in translation, and we are talking about a very different culture here. Their bluntness is not seen as arrogance over there. They are just stating facts in a way that we might not find especially tactful. That has often been the case when North Americans try and disseminate Russian conversation.

Secondly, I'd bet the farm Burmistrov is high on himself. I'd say every pro athlete is high on themselves. You HAVE to be to get to that level, to perform at it, and attaining it just feeds your ego. I think the difference lies in the way the cultures handle that self-belief and ego. You even see a difference between how Canadians and Americans handle ego and self confidence through expression. Imagine how much more starkly the contrast is between that and Russian culture.

 

[StronGeer]

More like top two.

Kaane is a top five pick and isperforming as one. Nurmi is a mid 6 player that's a year younger then Kane. The idea wed he shipping those two for a pick is ridiculous. Even if Nurmi is just a third liner, he's a 22 year old third liner. That's valuable

I agree grindphone. Not only is Nurmi a 22 year old third liner, but he's very good at what he does, when what he's doing is driving possession.

If we're trading for picks straight up in 2015, Kane is a top 5, Buff a top 10 (due to contract status). Adding Nurmi bumps them up a few picks. Problem is that teams that will be picking top 5/10 don't want a rental like Buff. There may be interest in Kane though.

 

[Grind]

I agree grindphone. Not only is Nurmi a 22 year old third liner, but he's very good at what he does, when what he's doing is driving possession.

If we're trading for picks straight up in 2015, Kane is a top 5, Buff a top 10 (due to contract status). Adding Nurmi bumps them up a few picks. Problem is that teams that will be picking top 5/10 don't want a rental like Buff. There may be interest in Kane though.

Agreed.

I'm also having trouble figuring out why my phone believes Nurmi is a word....

 

[jetkarma*]

The attitude is key. I don't blame Noel too much for Burmi leaving. What coach would accept that 'I will play my way' crap? Burmi wasn't thrown out. He left of his own will. Noel could possibly have communicated better but the language problem works both ways and if Burmi was stubborn what could he do?

It wasn't just Noel , Burmistrov pushed back against direction and suggestion from others , including management and staff. Not to rehash things but as we move further from his time here , we're seeing less and less from people blaming anyone but the player.

His future is in his control , so he can determine the direction he wants it to go , hopefully he decides he wants to put the team first.

 

[WaveRaven]

I fail to see how anything would any different than last time.

His issue is he wants to do what he wants and see's himself as a "star" when in reality he is not.

Anyone remember why he was sat, what the problem was ? Wouldn't do what was asked ..... and when put back in he did the exact same thing.

Sound coachable to you ? Type of guy you want in your locker room ?

Burmi's solution to this problem ..... go to an inferior league where he is top 6 ........ That says it all to me.

No thanks we don't need guys like that .... trade him.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

 

[Master Scheif]

Yeah, you know, Nalexander Nurmistrov.

 

[Jet]

I fail to see how anything would any different than last time.

His issue is he wants to do what he wants and see's himself as a "star" when in reality he is not.

Anyone remember why he was sat, what the problem was ? Wouldn't do what was asked ..... and when put back in he did the exact same thing.

Sound coachable to you ? Type of guy you want in your locker room ?

Burmi's solution to this problem ..... go to an inferior league where he is top 6 ........ That says it all to me.

No thanks we don't need guys like that .... trade him.

Yeah, that's a great way for a small market team with special challenges to succeed. Just be completely inflexible and unable to try and understand a different CULTURE and throw away talent.

Smart teams don't do that. How about try and understand that people around the world are different and a little understanding goes a long way?

It's absolutely stunning to me that no-one seems to want to try and look at it from Burmistrov's side? People just expect everyone around the world to be raised with the same social graces, attitudes and experiences.

I'm not going to get political but this is a microcosm of what is wrong with the world. Everyone wants other people to conform to their beliefs and experiences. It's completely unreasonable and very close minded.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

Yeah, you know, Nalexander Nurmistrov.

LOL of course! How silly of me

 

[surixon]

Yeah, that's a great way for a small market team with special challenges to succeed. Just be completely inflexible and unable to try and understand a different CULTURE and throw away talent.

Smart teams don't do that. How about try and understand that people around the world are different and a little understanding goes a long way?

It's absolutely stunning to me that no-one seems to want to try and look at it from Burmistrov's side? People just expect everyone around the world to be raised with the same social graces, attitudes and experiences.

I'm not going to get political but this is a microcosm of what is wrong with the world. Everyone wants other people to conform to their beliefs and experiences. It's completely unreasonable and very close minded.

I don't have an issue with him believing in himself or coming across as he does. Ni also don't have an issue with him shooting for a superior role on the team or thinking that he deserves it. I want players who want the top roles on the team.

Where I have an issue is in him not being willing to accept guidence, him not being willing to accept the help offered to him by the team with things like language etc... That has nothing to do with culture IMO. I would welcome him back, but he needs meet the team at least half way IMO. The team needs to show him that they will try to accommodate his aspirations and be more receptive to his specific culture if they weren't already doing it, but he needs to show some level of buy in to the team, as well as being receptive to teaching and criticism.

 

[ps241]

Here's my interpretation:

First of all, it's Russian people speaking Russian. There will be some nuance lost in translation, and we are talking about a very different culture here. Their bluntness is not seen as arrogance over there. They are just stating facts in a way that we might not find especially tactful. That has often been the case when North Americans try and disseminate Russian conversation.

Secondly, I'd bet the farm Burmistrov is high on himself. I'd say every pro athlete is high on themselves. You HAVE to be to get to that level, to perform at it, and attaining it just feeds your ego. I think the difference lies in the way the cultures handle that self-belief and ego. You even see a difference between how Canadians and Americans handle ego and self confidence through expression. Imagine how much more starkly the contrast is between that and Russian culture.

Yea I think the truth lies in the middle. I think the cultures are very different and it does lead to misunderstandings and on top of this I think Alex is a bit of a handful. I really want to see Maurice get his shot with Alex, I think he has a better chance at utilizing his skill set and communicating in a more effective way. If Maurice can't get it done I will be convinced Burmi is a head case Russian or not.

 

[Jet]

I don't have an issue with him believing in himself or coming across as he does. Ni also don't have an issue with him shooting for a superior role on the team or thinking that he deserves it. I want players who want the top roles on the team.

Where I have an issue is in him not being willing to accept guidence, him not being willing to accept the help offered to him by the team with things like language etc... That has nothing to do with culture IMO. I would welcome him back, but he needs meet the team at least half way IMO. The team needs to show him that they will try to accommodate his aspirations and be more receptive to his specific culture if they weren't already doing it, but he needs to show some level of buy in to the team, as well as being receptive to teaching and criticism.

All I am saying is we have to try and understand this guys struggle. He was a very young KID, probably in the league before he should have been, in a foreign land, with a different culture and language. He was used to being top dog on whatever team he played on.

It's a lot for someone his age to understand. I do agree that he has to come back with a slightly more mature attitude. I think he will. He will have grown some, and probably understands a hell of a lot more about his situation than he did.

 

[Grind]

I fail to see how anything would any different than last time.

His issue is he wants to do what he wants and see's himself as a "star" when in reality he is not.

Anyone remember why he was sat, what the problem was ? Wouldn't do what was asked ..... and when put back in he did the exact same thing.

Sound coachable to you ? Type of guy you want in your locker room ?

Burmi's solution to this problem ..... go to an inferior league where he is top 6 ........ That says it all to me.

No thanks we don't need guys like that .... trade him.

beyond the "understanding" angle that Jet has already covered, this is a terrible way to deal with the situation from the "resource" angle.

Burmi is a 22 year-old capable third line player at the worst. There's not a tonne of those around. He also would seem to have quite a bit of talent/untapped potential. That's a valuable commodity.

the only thing is, it's not that valuable when it's viewed as "the rights to a third liner playing int he KHL".

Burmi's worth way WAY more in trade if you get him under contract and give him 30-40 games (at minimum, preferably a whole season) to perform.

Even if the interpretation of "why he left" or all his inherent issues are true, he's still worth more on contract with some recent nhl games under his belt then just his rights.

There's a time for poo-pooing and a time for acting economical.

shooing him out the door because he's russian and a jerk and strangles kittens and what not is not economical.

 

[CaptainChef]

The attitude is key. I don't blame Noel too much for Burmi leaving. What coach would accept that 'I will play my way' crap? Burmi wasn't thrown out. He left of his own will. Noel could possibly have communicated better but the language problem works both ways and if Burmi was stubborn what could he do?

I think both Noel & Burmi can share the blame but really I put 75% on Noel and his weird ways of communicating & his insistence on playing Oli on all the best lines irregardless of how bad Oli played and how well Burmi performed. After a bit of that, Burmi had enough of Noel & his whole situation - personally can't blame the guy for checking out options elsewhere.

 

[StronGeer]

shooing him out the door because he's russian and a jerk and strangles kittens and what not is not economical.

Yep, that would be terrible asset management. And I don't much care if he's Russian/a jerk/strangling kittens. I care if he's a good/decent hockey player. Who am I to criticize how he increases his grip strength?

 

[StronGeer]

I think both Noel & Burmi can share the blame but really I put 75% on Noel and his weird ways of communicating & his insistence on playing Oli on all the best lines irregardless of how bad Oli played and how well Burmi performed. After a bit of that, Burmi had enough of Noel & his whole situation - personally can't blame the guy for checking out options elsewhere.

He always said it was his dream to play in his hometown. I'd much rather him do that these last two years (when we weren't realistically going to be competitive) than when we actually get our poop in a group.

 

[surixon]

All I am saying is we have to try and understand this guys struggle. He was a very young KID, probably in the league before he should have been, in a foreign land, with a different culture and language. He was used to being top dog on whatever team he played on.

It's a lot for someone his age to understand. I do agree that he has to come back with a slightly more mature attitude. I think he will. He will have grown some, and probably understands a hell of a lot more about his situation than he did.

Agreed, we are a better team with him on our team. I also am hopefully that he's grown as a person since then.

My own personal opinion is that TNSE tried to be accomdating to him but maybe lacked the personnel and/or experience at the time to really get through to him. The organization IMO has shown that it's willing to bring him back and work with him. Brining in Maurice who has experience in Russia is a sign to me that they want to be better equipped to handle players like Burmie.

I think it's really up to him now, the team has moved in his direction with Maurice and a spread out offensive system. He should have a coach who he can relate with and he will get close to the role he desires with plenty of potential for advancement. It's up to him now to bend towards the teams identy.

 

[Howard Chuck]

Agreed, we are a better team with him on our team. I also am hopefully that he's grown as a person since then.

My own personal opinion is that TNSE tried to be accomdating to him but maybe lacked the personnel and/or experience at the time to really get through to him. The organization IMO has shown that it's willing to bring him back and work with him. Brining in Maurice who has experience in Russia is a sign to me that they want to be better equipped to handle players like Burmie.

I think it's really up to him now, the team has moved in his direction with Maurice and a spread out offensive system. He should have a coach who he can relate with and he will get close to the role he desires with plenty of potential for advancement. It's up to him now to bend towards the teams identy.

I think it was a perfect storm of Noel/Burmi/Ollie. Noel was NOT a great communicator and Burmi didn't really understand english or the culture as he was just a kid (and still is). Burmi stated often that he didn't understand what the coach wanted him to do. I would think that a coach would make sure that was crystal clear, but we heard more than once from more than one player, that Noel didn't always make things clear.

Short answer, I would love to see Burmi get a fresh start here with Maurice.

 

[pondnorth]

I think it was a perfect storm of Noel/Burmi/Ollie. Noel was NOT a great communicator and Burmi didn't really understand english or the culture as he was just a kid (and still is). Burmi stated often that he didn't understand what the coach wanted him to do. I would think that a coach would make sure that was crystal clear, but we heard more than once from more than one player, that Noel didn't always make things clear.

Short answer, I would love to see Burmi get a fresh start here with Maurice.

After a season in Barrie,plus one in ATL,one in WPG,and one split between WPG and SJN he should be able to understand english.How could he not?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Paavo Nurmi - The Flying Finn

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Yeah, that's a great way for a small market team with special challenges to succeed. Just be completely inflexible and unable to try and understand a different CULTURE and throw away talent.

Smart teams don't do that. How about try and understand that people around the world are different and a little understanding goes a long way?

It's absolutely stunning to me that no-one seems to want to try and look at it from Burmistrov's side? People just expect everyone around the world to be raised with the same social graces, attitudes and experiences.

I'm not going to get political but this is a microcosm of what is wrong with the world. Everyone wants other people to conform to their beliefs and experiences. It's completely unreasonable and very close minded.

It still has to be a two way street. Nobody pushed Burmi out. He chose to leave. They couldn't put a gun to his head to keep him here.

 

[KingBogo]

Yea I think the truth lies in the middle. I think the cultures are very different and it does lead to misunderstandings and on top of this I think Alex is a bit of a handful. I really want to see Maurice get his shot with Alex, I think he has a better chance at utilizing his skill set and communicating in a more effective way. If Maurice can't get it done I will be convinced Burmi is a head case Russian or not.

Agree with this 100%. The truth is in the middle somewhere. Best case scenario the Jets offer him a fresh start with a fair (maybe slightly generous) contract, Burmi acknowledges some past mistakes and talks about maturing, wanting to be a team player, will accept whatever role coach asks him to play.

 

[garret9]

I don't doubt it to be real... Although his reasoning may be the missing part.

Burmi also has a guy who is both an additional training coach and help him with his English. He's had that guy since junior. He was the same guy Burmi was on ice with when Burmi had that pick up game with kids.

 

[Jet]

It still has to be a two way street. Nobody pushed Burmi out. He chose to leave. They couldn't put a gun to his head to keep him here.

Of course it does. My problem here is there is a big lack of understanding or willingness to try to see it from Burmistrov's angle. We are not talking about a corn-fed, Saskatchewan farm boy here. We are talking about someone who was raised in a tremendously different culture.

I feel like people don't get the concept of this. Try to imagine what you were doing as a 17 year old, then imagine moving to Russia to play hockey, not speaking the language, not understanding the ways of the culture, the nuances of interaction between people, the do's and don'ts.

This is not an issue that is strictly Burmistrov's. We have seen a LOT of young Russian players have this struggle. That proves that there is something more to this than Alex' own personal 'attitude problems'.

Players from other places in Europe adjust better but their cultures more closely align with ours.