Player Discussion Alex DeBrincat

[GCK]

Feels like when we went years trying to find a winger for Spezza.... Michalek, Greening, Buttler, we even tried Regin.

I'm not saying we absolutely need to keep DeBrincat, but I think he's less of a nice commodity and more of a solid piece of the puzzle as we go down the road. I also think we're being quick to discount a player in what could easily be a down year.

The wild part is people are saying his past production is just him getting fed by Kane, meanwhile there's a not insignificant portion of the fanbase saying Stützle will be the best offensive player in franchise history, so put two and two together maybe those two can find similar chemistry through both their primes.

Anyways, I guess it all comes down to cost for me, if he takes the Fiala contract, I'm ok with re-signing him.if he's looking for 8.5+ that's a non-starter for me.

Different situations. It’s more about cap space vs cash with new ownership coming in. If we re-sign Debrincat and keep Chabot we are basically committing to patchwork goaltending and using our own developmental players to fill in the bottom 6 and bottom pair.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I heard you man, I did.

I think it’s dumb, I think you making a huge hole again on D with the solution of just “signing a cheaper RD” as not only laughably unrealistic, but also puts us right back into the spot we have been for years.

We have a nicely Balanced D. We have three top line LD’s who look like they all would pair nicely with a much cheaper defensive RD.

The smart money would be to ADD this easy “cheaper RD” and partner him with one of the star LD’s. Then we’d have a contenders D.

Also I don’t know if we can find a another good defenceman.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Different situations. It’s more about cap space vs cash with new ownership coming in. If we re-sign Debrincat and keep Chabot we are basically committing to patchwork goaltending and using our own developmental players to fill in the bottom 6 and bottom pair.

Bottom pair is usually cheaper guys and patchwork guys that fit. I’m not worried about that.

Goaltending absolutely tho. Bottom 6 I’m also not too worried. Pinto Joseph greig Kastelic gauthier. Is not world beating but I think it can do a fine job in support of a very strong top 6.

Goalie is the hang up tho. We’re not always going to find a 2.75 mil tender to save our ass like we did last year in forsberg. And I don’t know if we can count on forsberg to come back and be the same as he was. Sogaard needs more time.

But then again if you’re not getting one of the best goalies I don’t believe on paying any sort of serious money.

 

[Micklebot]

Different situations. It’s more about cap space vs cash with new ownership coming in. If we re-sign Debrincat and keep Chabot we are basically committing to patchwork goaltending and using our own developmental players to fill in the bottom 6 and bottom pair.

For next year. The cap is going to go way up after that, heck even next year there's a chance they'll come to an agreement and create some extra wiggle room for teams.

Idk, if there's a legit long term starting goalie that we can get if we open up space by moving on from DeBrincat, that's certainly worth considering.

But the bottom 6 and bottom pair is exactly where you want your own developmental players, it's exactly where we shouldn't be overpaying for UFA.

Anyways, I just don't see this as a simple decision, especially now that we have Chychrun who's on a bit of a sweetheart deal while we have our crunch.

It would be nice if we could have Sanderson extended prior just so we have cost certainty, but he can't be extended for another year.

 

[Crosside]

I wonder if he would accept two years at 7M and if he perform give him the money

 

[GCK]

For next year. The cap is going to go way up after that, heck even next year there's a chance they'll come to an agreement and create some extra wiggle room for teams.

Idk, if there's a legit long term starting goalie that we can get if we open up space by moving on from DeBrincat, that's certainly worth considering.

But the bottom 6 and bottom pair is exactly where you want your own developmental players, it's exactly where we shouldn't be overpaying for UFA.

Anyways, I just don't see this as a simple decision, especially now that we have Chychrun who's on a bit of a sweetheart deal while we have our crunch.

It would be nice if we could have Sanderson extended prior just so we have cost certainty, but he can't be extended for another year.

Sanderson can sign July 1st.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Different situations. It’s more about cap space vs cash with new ownership coming in. If we re-sign Debrincat and keep Chabot we are basically committing to patchwork goaltending and using our own developmental players to fill in the bottom 6 and bottom pair.

IMO decisions will have to be made there.
For me team needs are
3rd line depth. The lack of depth hurt us this year. Pinto at C .. Need to upgrade Joseph and add a winger or resign Formenton.
4th line we have covered and its not an issue to fill in there. Gauthier is a 4th liner not a 3rd liner.
Goaltending.

I would move Debrincat this summer ahead of the draft. Chabot decision will hold until we know Chychrun is resigning or we can secure assets including a top 4 RD.

 

[GCK]

IMO decisions will have to be made there.
For me team needs are
3rd line depth. The lack of depth hurt us this year. Pinto at C .. Need to upgrade Joseph and add a winger or resign Formenton.
4th line we have covered and its not an issue to fill in there. Gauthier is a 4th liner not a 3rd liner.
Goaltending.

I would move Debrincat this summer ahead of the draft. Chabot decision will hold until we know Chychrun is resigning or we can secure assets including a top 4 RD.

100% you don’t move Chabot until you have the top 4 RD.

There are 3 goalies who I would target. Saros, Hart and Demko. All 3 are kind of available apparently.

 

[DueDiligence]

IMO decisions will have to be made there.
For me team needs are
3rd line depth. The lack of depth hurt us this year. Pinto at C .. Need to upgrade Joseph and add a winger or resign Formenton.
4th line we have covered and its not an issue to fill in there. Gauthier is a 4th liner not a 3rd liner.
Goaltending.

I would move Debrincat this summer ahead of the draft. Chabot decision will hold until we know Chychrun is resigning or we can secure assets including a top 4 RD.

Goaltending is the big issue because Forsberg's health going forward is uncertain. Sogaard needs at least another full year to work on his consistency before he becomes a reliable alternative. And he might not ever become "that" guy.

 

[DrEasy]

Losing Norris for the season not only hurt Pinto (as I mentioned in another thread) but also DBC, because the 2nd line now looks like a typical Montreal line. I like skill, but skill needs space to express itself, and basically DBC is too busy evading checks to find room and time to create offensively.

Pinto is not small, but he still needs some time to develop and fill out physically, and be more engaged defensively. Not a good fit for DBC yet.

 

[aragorn]

Losing Norris for the season not only hurt Pinto (as I mentioned in another thread) but also DBC, because the 2nd line now looks like a typical Montreal line. I like skill, but skill needs space to express itself, and basically DBC is too busy evading checks to find room and time to create offensively.

Pinto is not small, but he still needs some time to develop and fill out physically, and be more engaged defensively. Not a good fit for DBC yet.

One could argue & I guess I will that losing Norris has helped Pinto take more responsibility & know what it takes to move up a line. I would also argue that while he didn't replace Norris offensive production he also didn't play like crap & there were times when his line was the best line in a game.

He has also been in the Calder race for most of the yr, how has that hurt him & as a guy playing in his first full season has put up 18 goals & should hit over 30 pts soon? That's not terrible, in fact, I would argue he has been great given the circumstances. DBC - Pinto - Batherson are not a typical small Montreal line either, both Batherson & Pinto are 6'3" & will hit & both will fight if they have to.
Glass half full.

 

[DrEasy]

One could argue & I guess I will that losing Norris has helped Pinto take more responsibility & know what it takes to move up a line. I would also argue that while he didn't replace Norris offensive production he also didn't play like crap & there were times when his line was the best line in a game.

He has also been in the Calder race for most of the yr, how has that hurt him & as a guy playing in his first full season has put up 18 goals & should hit over 30 pts soon? That's not terrible, in fact, I would argue he has been great given the circumstances. DBC - Pinto - Batherson are not a typical small Montreal line either, both Batherson & Pinto are 6'3" & will hit & both will fight if they have to.
Glass half full.

This is where size alone doesn't tell the story. Pinto may be tall, but he's still physically under-developed. Batherson has been a passenger most of the year, his physicality completely absent (except maybe for that last game against Colorado).

 

[aragorn]

This is where size alone doesn't tell the story. Pinto may be tall, but he's still physically under-developed. Batherson has been a passenger most of the year, his physicality completely absent (except maybe for that last game against Colorado).

Well they don't get pushed around very often & we have seen them both fight back against it when someone does challenge them which is good. DBC has 56 pts, Batherson has 54 pts & Pinto will have 30 pts soon, that's not terrible & they could have a lot more pts if DBC would score more often on the number of chances he gets every game. I'm not sure what you are getting at given they lost their #1 C & leading goal scorer last yr. I think they have done fine & it was never going to be a complete replacement in offence after the Norris injury, what were people expecting?

When was the last time Ottawa has had 5 guys over 50 pts? The yr Boucher took them to the Conference finals in 2016-17 season they had 4 guys over 50 pts & Dereck Brassard was 5th with 39 pts, let that sink in. The yr before the 2015-16 season they had 5 guys over 50 pts, what is that 8 yrs or seasons ago & they missed the playoffs? And then we have to go back to the 2005-06 season to find 5 guys over 50 pts & Schaffer & Redden both had 50 pts exactly. Now in a lot of those yrs there were guys who had 70, 80, 90 & Heatley & Alfredsson had over 100 pts. Go back & look at their history it's very interesting given that this team we all know can be better next season. It's rare to have five 50 pt players on this team over it's history.

 

[DrEasy]

Well they don't get pushed around very often & we have seen them both fight back against it when someone does challenge them which is good. DBC has 56 pts, Batherson has 54 pts & Pinto will have 30 pts soon, that's not terrible & they could have a lot more pts if DBC would score more often on the number of chances he gets every game. I'm not sure what you are getting at given they lost their #1 C & leading goal scorer last yr. I think they have done fine & it was never going to be a complete replacement in offence after the Norris injury, what were people expecting?

When was the last time Ottawa has had 5 guys over 50 pts? The yr Boucher took them to the Conference finals in 2016-17 season they had 4 guys over 50 pts & Dereck Brassard was 5th with 39 pts, let that sink in. The yr before the 2015-16 season they had 5 guys over 50 pts, what is that 8 yrs or seasons ago & they missed the playoffs? And then we have to go back to the 2005-06 season to find 5 guys over 50 pts & Schaffer & Redden both had 50 pts exactly. Now in a lot of those yrs there were guys who had 70, 80, 90 & Heatley & Alfredsson had over 100 pts. Go back & look at their history it's very interesting given that this team we all know can be better next season. It's rare to have five 50 pt players on this team over it's history.

Half those points are coming from the PP (for Batherson it's 25 out of 54, for DBC is 26 our of 56, only Pinto has a better split 7 out of 29 but then again he plays fewer PP minutes on the second crew), so it's not exactly the product of the second line working well. They're heavily in minus territory (-34 for Drake, -26 for DBC, -18 for Pinto), so we're well past the point of +/- being an unreliable stat. For reference, Gambrell is -5 and Brassard is +1... That second line has been a tire fire all year long...

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the point that Pinto has done well as a rookie. I'm merely saying that losing Norris affected every individual player (especially DBC and Pinto) negatively, which in turn affected the team results negatively. So while I'm sounding negative here, my ultimate message is a positive one, in that we do have incoming help for next season with hopefully a healthy Norris. If DBC is still with us next season, I expect much better results for him, and for our second and third lines in general.

 

[xVolchenkov]

Sign him for cheap and watch him rebound next year. Him under performing could be a blessing in disguise and we can retain him for cheaper than if he scored 40 goals this year.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Sign him for cheap and watch him rebound next year. Him under performing could be a blessing in disguise and we can retain him for cheaper than if he scored 40 goals this year.

I think he's rebounding for sure without question.

Too much pedigree and ability. We have also seen him have an off year and come back and score on pace for 50 goals and 40.

The question is:

1) Does he fit the mold of the team we are trying to have.
2) Do we want to be top-end offensive heavy.

Point 2 is like Tavares with the Leafs. Yea, another PPG weapon, cool. But assets on goaltending and D would have helped them far more.


Tkachuk-Stutzle-Batherson
Barbashev-Norris-Giroux
Formenton/Greig-Pinto-Joseph
Kelly-Kaestlic-Gauthier

Chabot-Gudas
Sanderson-Zub
Chychrun-Hamonic

Saros/Demko/Gibson

 

[aragorn]

With Giroux leaving in two yrs the Sens will need to keep a good playmaker & goal scorer & it will likely force them to re-sign DeBrincat. Sure there may be others out there who might come here, but there are also a lot of players as we have known from the past that won't come here for whatever reason. It could be a situation of the devil you know versus the devil you don't know.

I like Greig for example as a potential DBC replacement but how long will it take for him to put up a 40 goal season if ever. What about Jarventie or some other prospect that replaces DBC's 50 plus pt potential? Idk DBC seems much more like a certainty while others are less certain or maybe.

 

[SquidNasty]

I think a 2-3 year deal would be perfect for both sides. Fits our window and he’d still be young enough to secure a bag in FA if he performs well. 7-8M range is ideal, not sure we can go any higher.

As I’ve said before, if he wants to maximize his earning potential he should take the 1 year QO at 9M and then secure a monster bag in FA (can’t blame him if he does I’d probably do the same). Hopefully he doesn’t go down this road and recognizes the assets we gave up for him.

 

[Mingus Dew]

I'm sorry but why on earth is he going to sign for cheap?

He has a $9mm QO. If we lowball him he's going to take that and walk himself to UFA. Why wouldn't he?

I'm fine with DBC on this team for like $6mm but he's not that dumb.

 

[Stutzlaaaa]

Why DJ never tried him on his off-side with Stutzle and Tkatchuk?
I mean put him with the player that create space for him and his one timer.
But for sure I agree that he suck this year but again probably related to coaching.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Why DJ never tried him on his off-side with Stutzle and Tkatchuk?
I mean put him with the player that create space for him and his one timer.
But for sure I agree that he suck this year but again probably related to coaching.

He is playing on his offside, LW, unless you mean his natural side RW.

 

[Stutzlaaaa]

Confirm

He is playing on his offside, LW, unless you mean his natural side RW.

Lol at DJ, didn't know he is a natural RW.

 

[Hale The Villain]

I'm sorry but why on earth is he going to sign for cheap?

He has a $9mm QO. If we lowball him he's going to take that and walk himself to UFA. Why wouldn't he?

I'm fine with DBC on this team for like $6mm but he's not that dumb.

It depends on what other teams are willing to offer him on a long-term extension.

If teams loaded with cap space like Detroit, Carolina, Anaheim, etc... are still willing to throw 7.5-8M per at him on a long-term deal I could see him agreeing to an extension with them, even if it's below his QO, as part of a trade.

We're talking about a player who has seen his shooting percentage drop massively during the only two contract years of his career - 2019/20 and 2022/23. Those two years he was shooting at 8.7% and 9.3% respectively, while the other years he shot above 15%. Massive difference.

For some reason he hasn't been able to finish when money is on the line. Would next season be any different? Perhaps, but two bad years in a row indicates a trend that would not help his ability to command a massive long-term deal.

If he can still get a 60M contract after the year he has had maybe he decides taking the 9M QO and gambling on a rebound year isn't worth the risk.

 

[Golden_Jet]

It depends on what other teams are willing to offer him on a long-term extension.

Would have to wait a year for other teams offers.

We're talking about a player who has seen his shooting percentage drop massively during the only two contract years of his career - 2014/15 and 2022/23. Those two years he was shooting at 8.7% and 9.3% respectively, while the other years he shot above 15%. Massive difference.

We are talking about DBC right.
Since when is his first year of OHL a contract year lol.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Would have to wait a year for other teams offers.

We are talking about DBC right.
Since when is his first year of OHL a contract year lol.

He's an RFA this summer and can sign an extension with a team he is traded to.

Any team trading for DeBrincat would undoubtedly want to talk extension with him before pulling the trigger anyways, given he's 1 year away from UFA.

No idea why I put 2014/15 when I meant 2019/20 - the year his ELC was ending.