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Confirmed with Link: Adam Fox for 2019 2nd (NYR), 2020 3rd (cond.)

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Cassano said:
You're right, but it still doesn't make sense making this trade knowing he's going to sign here anyways. They just gave away picks for nothing.

It's not like the Erixon situation where we didn't know where he was signing.
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Well Erixon wasn’t going to be a free agent. He was going back into the draft.

There’s really no way of knowing he’d sign here 15 months from now. That’s a long time in the life of a college kid. If you had asked Jimmy Vesey where he’d end up in April of 2015, he probably would have told you Boston. The price is worth it.
 
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Alexei Kovalev 27 said:
I enjoyed that 'history lesson' from effen as well.

And I'm really glad you mentioned SAARELA - whom several miserable pessimists were jumping through elevator shafts about. A good reminder to let things play out. 18 months ago, I would have thought we had given away the next Jere Lehtinen, and instead he's probably the next Lias Andersson :sarcasm:
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Saarela's probably an NHLer for at least a few years but it's not a good sign when guys like Gregg McKegg (?) and Phil DiGuiseppe (???) got callups and bottom line time over him.
 
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effen said:
Saarela's probably an NHLer for at least a few years but it's not a good sign when guys like Gregg McKegg (?) and Phil DiGuiseppe (???) got callups and bottom line time over him.
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exactly - and point being, he's (likely) a replaceable piece and holds no true needle-moving value.
 
I'm staking my tent in the "fair value" camp. A 2nd alone for Fox would have been larceny. If it was a 2nd and a 4th, we're still on the win side of this trade. Fox is a top prospect. A 2nd and a 3rd is like a fair deal on our end. The conditional (you knew Gorton just HAD to, it's his calling card now) isn't harsh. Fox playing 30 games means he's established himself as an NHL player. With our current roster, we actually have a lot of roster players so Fox would have to have a McDounagh-esque training camp in which case we win. Unless we trade or buyout a bunch of players, it's likely he starts out in Hartford and plays his way on to the roster. Also a win for his development. If he takes longer to develop, we only give up the extra 3rd.

Any speculation about getting a better deal - you're talking about POSSIBLY getting Fox for a 2nd + 3rd instead of maybe two 2nds, is that that big of a difference to get upset about? We get him in our system a year early, into our system a year early, draft plans aligned early, he doesn't risk tcgetting injured in college, plays against better competition no matter where he plays, etc. All the positives far outweigh maybe acquiring him for a 2nd and 3rd instead of the maybe two 2nds we got him for today. And your kidding yourself if you think the price goes below that just because Carolina MIGHT be desperate a year from now. What if Fox scores 100 points in Harvard next season? The price goes up to two 1sts maybe?
 
Cassano said:
You're right, but it still doesn't make sense making this trade knowing he's going to sign here anyways. They just gave away picks for nothing.

It's not like the Erixon situation where we didn't know where he was signing.
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Even if all this is true, it's penny wise and pound foolish for a variety of reasons.
 
I've only read the first 3 pages of the thread (thus far) but how about we skate him in Hartford for the first 53 games of our season ensuring we don't lose that 2nd pick and also move Shattenkirk for a 2nd rounder before the trade deadline?
 
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shinchanuuhh said:
I thought the lsit of names made it clear but Im talking about these supposed "Steal pickup" offensive dmen and NCAA UFA's.

Also Stepan and McD were hyped a **** ton and met that hype maybe...for a season.

Kreider was hyped a **** ton and has never managed to meet everyone's pie in the sky dreams. Only McD was ever an all star.

He also wasn't an undrafted free agent, a prospect refusing to sign an ELC or an offensive defenseman.
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I thought by the players I listed I was referring to my favorite players in 2014. Jeez, I guess I forgot to use the mind reading markups.
 
kovazub94 said:
Even if so, the main problem is that he’s the same type but lesser quality compared to ADA, now Fox and eventually Lundkvist (and of course Shattenkirk). Need at least one bigger body and so there’s simply no place for him (and Shattenkirk).
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Nothing is better than having too many RDs. They bring back a premium in every trade. A 6 RD gets you an 8 Winger.
 
wolfgaze said:
I've only read the first 3 pages of the thread (thus far) but how about we skate him in Hartford for the first 53 games of our season ensuring we don't lose that 2nd pick and also move Shattenkirk for a 2nd rounder before the trade deadline?
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If he shows he should be a NHL player getting NHL minutes you should probably develop him in the NHL and not hold him back in the AHL because you want to save a draft pick
 
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wolfgaze said:
I've only read the first 3 pages of the thread (thus far) but how about we skate him in Hartford for the first 53 games of our season ensuring we don't lose that 2nd pick and also move Shattenkirk for a 2nd rounder before the trade deadline?
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Penny wise and pound foolish. You'd lose a 3rd in your scenario anyway.
 
eco's bones said:
It was an issue last year when McQuaid and Pionk were the main guys and it will be an issue this year with the same personnel minus McQuaid and + Fox. After the deadline and McQuaid moved on Quinn was playing Smith on left wing and moving him back on RD to split the penalty killing with Pionk and an occasional appearance by Shattenkirk. Quinn very rarely used DeAngelo in that role. Really I thought Tony's D was a lot better at the end of the year but it'll be some of the same issues whether Pionk, Shattenkirk, DeAngelo or Fox--little guys getting knocked around by bigger guys. The only one of them that is really strong enough to handle big physical forwards is Shattenkirk.
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not to go off-topic but people constantly bring up mcquaid for why deangelo wasn't playing or hate pionk for the same reason. but it is pretty well established that he wasn't playing because Quinn set expectations for deangelo and what he needed to do. when he did them he played, when he didn't he sat...he didn't TDA so he could play mcquaid. he played mcquaid because he was sitting TDA. and I know lots of people disagree with this approach but imo he made him a better player...
 
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Edge said:
If they're looking to bundle their way to bundle the way to another high pick, the cost to get into range is still probably Kreider.
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Having a hard time imagining any of those particular teams picking in the #5 - #15 range justifying trading their pick for a Kreider with only 1 year remaining on his contract...
 
wolfgaze said:
Having a hard time imagining any of those particular teams picking in the #5 - #15 range justifying trading their pick for a Kreider with only 1 year remaining on his contract...
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Most of them probably would if you bundled Winnipeg's 1st with Kreider. Logic being in you fail in your PO run you can trade him for a 1st yourself at the deadline.

21st + next years 23rd (if you cant make the POs or sing him) for 13th or something doesn't seem too far off.
 
Leetch3 said:
not to go off-topic but people constantly bring up mcquaid for why deangelo wasn't playing or hate pionk for the same reason. but it is pretty well established that he wasn't playing because Quinn set expectations for deangelo and what he needed to do. when he did them he played, when he didn't he sat...he didn't TDA so he could play mcquaid. he played mcquaid because he was sitting TDA. and I know lots of people disagree with this approach but imo he made him a better player...
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I totally agree with this. The ice time was always there for DeAngelo if he did what the coach asked of him. Both him and Buchnevich are better players than they were to start the year.
 
Chris Drury is going to get time with him with team USA so that's a big positive for us going into next year as he will tell him what he needs to work on
 
Calad said:
If he wants a playoff run with his current contract, it won't be in NY. Playoffs next year is a pipe dream. We are going to be worse than last year.
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Probably. But we may be a playoff team in 2 years if the talent grows up fast.
 
Fitzy said:
I don't think we can quite make the "We got another top 10 pick" claim. Too early for that. I'd say Fox's value on the open market might be a late first.
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I will take a money bet with anyone here that Fox eventually becomes better than 3 of 5 guys drafted 8-12 this June. He's worth a #10OA pick. Those picks are overrated and Fox is a great prospect.
 
wolfgaze said:
Having a hard time imagining any of those particular teams picking in the #5 - #15 range justifying trading their pick for a Kreider with only 1 year remaining on his contract...
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Well, 5-15 is a hell of a range.

A team at 5 is right in the midst of gathering assets. A team at 15 is on the cusp of the playoffs, and watching teams with a handful of points more than them potentially making it to the conference finals.

The single digit end of that equation is definitely off the table.

The double digit end, specifically as you get closer to the mid-teens, isn’t terribly far off IMO.
 
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