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Prospect Info: 9OA: Nate Danielson

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lilidk said:
Please name any good picks outside first round since Datsyuk and Zetterberg
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Burger, Hronek, Janmark, Jarnkrok, Tats, and Nyke are all still in the league.

For Wings NA drafted players, Jensen, Mrazek, AA, Bert, and Givani are still in the league.

So I'd say he's done better than NA scouts in the same timeframe considering he got fewer picks. Too soon to tell with Yzerman era picks, right now we're looking at Mazur, Lombardi, Wallinder and Buch as potential NHLers (2 NA vs 2 Euros). If anything, I'm not particularly impressed by the NA or Euro scouts since Draper took over. It's not looking any better than the Holland era.

I have to say, I do like the first rounds picks, though I'm beginning to have doubts about Kasper after watching him this preseason.
 
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Guys with hits have misses. That like Goal-scorers normal day.

Really nice to see these Danielson videos.

I still don't have clear projection of him as a player, but I think he will be real good for us. He does the right things. I've always been a heavy stat-guy and now I'm gonna take some idea being away from that. Just trusting on my eye-test.

Danielson is maybe realgud. Better than Real good.
 
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Killerjas said:
Which misses? Please show us
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Go look for yourself. Any Euro that got drafted and didn't make it, counts as a miss, which is most of them quite frankly. The better question is for you, which ones since Datsyuk and Zetterberg have made it and been good!

What Euro drafted guys outside round 1 are even on our team or looking to be on our team? Or on other NHL teams and been good? 1999 is 24 years ago, and there simply haven't been that many Hakan picks that turned into stars. I think Hakan is a very good scout, but I also think Wings fans have placed him into this special bubble of legendary status which outside the two gems doesn't hold up.
 
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Oddbob said:
Go look for yourself. Any Euro that got drafted and didn't make it, counts as a miss, which is most of them quite frankly. The better question is for you, which ones since Datsyuk and Zetterberg have made it and been good!

What Euro drafted guys outside round 1 are even on our team or looking to be on our team? Or on other NHL teams and been good? 1999 is 24 years ago, and there simply haven't been that many Hakan picks that turned into stars. I think Hakan is a very good scout, but I also think Wings fans have placed him into this special bubble of legendary status which outside the two gems doesn't hold up.
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You don‘t make sense whatsoever. 2000-2018, Holland tenure, Wings spent a whopping one 1st round pick in Europe and hit out of the park. They spent 12 2nd round pick on European player 7 are full time NHLers (Berggren, Hronek, Tatar, Hudler, Fleischmann, Jarnkrok, Kopecky). 3 didn‘t make it, but were good enough to taste it (Jurco, Frk, Lindström), one is Grigorenko and just one(!) outright bust, who was very talented, but headcase - Dick Axelsson. That is legendary. Beyond that he drafted Franzen, Filppula, Nyquist, Mrazek, Jarnmark with low picks. But he didn‘t draft a HoF player in the 6th since Zetterberg.

The issue was never Hakan drafting, it is amount of high picks to his disposal
 
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DoMakc said:
You don‘t make sense whatsoever. 2000-2018, Holland tenure, Wings spent a whopping one 1st round pick in Europe and hit out of the park. They spent 12 2nd round pick on European player 7 are full time NHLers (Berggren, Hronek, Tatar, Hudler, Fleischmann, Jarnkrok, Kopecky). 3 didn‘t make it, but were good enough to taste it (Jurco, Frk, Lindström), one is Grigorenko and just one(!) outright bust, who was very talented, but headcase - Dick Axelsson. That is legendary. Beyond that he drafted Franzen, Filppula, Nyquist, Mrazek, Jarnmark with low picks. But he didn‘t draft a HoF player in the 6th since Zetterberg.

The issue was never Hakan drafting, it is amount of high picks to his disposal
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Mentioning players like Frk and Jurco isn't adding anything of value, as every scout has players that play a few games and aren't anything special. I also didn't say he was a bad scout, but he hasn't done league top stuff in awhile. Even some of his more recent guys aren't looking anything special like Albert Johansson who looks like at best a 6th defender maybe someday. Lindstrom is at best a fill in guy on a bad NHL team, and Berggren also hasn't done that much yet either. He has some nice skills, but that might be only as a good AHL player. Also, Berrgren is in the AHL and is not a full time NHL player right now.

We have lots of hopefuls sure right now out of Europe, but as is the case with every team, many of those won't make it. To me, to show him as good as he is made out to be, you have to show what other teams, top Scouts have done. Like I said, he is a very good scout, not saying he isn't, but Wings fans have locked him into legendary status and we wouldn't think that high of him if Datsyuk and Zetterberg hadn't smashed it out of the park. He hasn't had any 5th-7th gems recently either, which is where he is known for getting his two gems.
 
From 2009-2018, the last 10 years under Holland, Detroit made just 12 selections from euro leagues in the first four rounds. 8 of 12 made the NHL and 6 are still active in the league today. Considering how little they were given, I think the euro scouts did remarkably well..

2009-2018, Detroit picks in rounds 1-4:
1st round: 8 NA, 0 EU | 2nd round: 9 NA, 5 EU | 3rd round: 13 NA, 2 EU | 4th round: 4 NA, 5 EU

NHL:
2009.060 Tatar 789 GP
2010.051 Järnkrok 653 GP
2013.079 Janmark 492 GP
2016.053 Hronek 315 GP
2017.038 Lindstrom 129 GP
2018.033 Berggren 069 GP

former NHLers:
2010.111 Pulkkinen 83 GP
2014.106 Ehn 114 GP

didn't make it:
2015.110 (G) Van Pottelberghe
2016.107 Malmstrom
2017.100 Setkov
2018.084 (G) Eliasson

** I haven't triple checked this post, so there might be some errors.. quite a few euros were drafted from the QMJHL and USHL, (Frk, Jurco, Saarijarvi, ...) if they spent their draft year in NA, I count them as NA picks... went with a 10 year sample, but don't think the overall impression changes if you extend it.. if you go 11 years you add Nyquist for a 4th, 12 years Joker from a 3rd..

Yzerman 2019-2023:
1st round: 2 NA, 5 EU | 2nd round: 7 NA, 5 EU | 3rd round: 2 NA, 3 EU | 4th round: 5 NA, 3 EU

If "Hakan" comes close to the same success rate under Yzerman, even if there aren't many 'stars', there will at the very least be a lot of tradable assets to work with..

anyway.. Danielson looks pretty good!
 
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PenskyMaterial said:
From 2009-2018, the last 10 years under Holland, Detroit made just 12 selections from euro leagues in the first four rounds. 8 of 12 made the NHL and 6 are still active in the league today. Considering how little they were given, I think the euro scouts did remarkably well..

2009-2018, Detroit picks in rounds 1-4:
1st round: 8 NA, 0 EU | 2nd round: 9 NA, 5 EU | 3rd round: 13 NA, 2 EU | 4th round: 4 NA, 5 EU

NHL:
2009.060 Tatar 789 GP
2010.051 Järnkrok 653 GP
2013.079 Janmark 492 GP
2016.053 Hronek 315 GP
2017.038 Lindstrom 129 GP
2018.033 Berggren 069 GP

former NHLers:
2010.111 Pulkkinen 83 GP
2014.106 Ehn 114 GP

didn't make it:
2015.110 (G) Van Pottelberghe
2016.107 Malmstrom
2017.100 Setkov
2018.084 (G) Eliasson

** I haven't triple checked this post, so there might be some errors.. quite a few euros were drafted from the QMJHL and USHL, (Frk, Jurco, Saarijarvi, ...) if they spent their draft year in NA, I count them as NA picks... went with a 10 year sample, but don't think the overall impression changes if you extend it.. if you go 11 years you add Nyquist for a 4th, 12 years Joker from a 3rd..

Yzerman 2019-2023:
1st round: 2 NA, 5 EU | 2nd round: 7 NA, 5 EU | 3rd round: 2 NA, 3 EU | 4th round: 5 NA, 3 EU

If "Hakan" comes close to the same success rate under Yzerman, even if there aren't many 'stars', there will at the very least be a lot of tradable assets to work with..

anyway.. Danielson looks pretty good!
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Thing is when talking about top scouts it would be star players or higher end players which are the reason they are top scouts, which Tatar and Nyquist are the closest to but are also nothing special either as his most recent successes. Other teams scouts have drafted guys like Pavelski or Benn in the later rounds which would be pretty good scouting. Other teams scouts would also have guys who accrued lots of games. To me games played is not a great mark of whether the scout is good or not as there are lots of players that get lots of games in the NHL and aren't great players. Lindstrom being an example of this. Would he have even hit 75 games if not on any NHL team devoid of NHL players? He barely made our team and couldn't even crack Montreal's lineup.

Hakan is a really good scout, but I don't think he is the legend he gets made out to be around here.
 
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Oddbob said:
Thing is when talking about top scouts it would be star players or higher end players which are the reason they are top scouts, which Tatar and Nyquist are the closest to but are also nothing special either as his most recent successes. Other teams scouts have drafted guys like Pavelski or Benn in the later rounds which would be pretty good scouting. Other teams scouts would also have guys who accrued lots of games. To me games played is not a great mark of whether the scout is good or not as there are lots of players that get lots of games in the NHL and aren't great players. Lindstrom being an example of this. Would he have even hit 75 games if not on any NHL team devoid of NHL players? He barely made our team and couldn't even crack Montreal's lineup.

Hakan is a really good scout, but I don't think he is the legend he gets made out to be around here.
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Too bad Pavelski and Benn never played in Europe to be scouted by Hakan, but i guess if Hakan was truly legendary he still would have managed to pick them.

Let's forget for a moment that a standard more than 2 HoF level players from Europe in 5th round or below in 20 year is ridiculous and look actually, which superstars from Europe were available there. I checked and came up with Kaprizov and Bratt (I'm not even sure I'd go that far yet) in 21st century. So I assume to be legendary you'd have to pick one of two players over the span of almost twenty years while competing with 29 other teams. I think we can conculde that a statement "Hakan needs to pick superstars below 4th round more often than twice in 25 years to be truly legendary" is the most ridiculous take on this board. Truly an achievment, since ShanahanMan Yzerland and 17 incarnations of CaptainBob are posting here.
 
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DoMakc said:
Too bad Pavelski and Benn never played in Europe to be scouted by Hakan, but i guess if Hakan was truly legendary he still would have managed to pick them.

Let's forget for a moment that a standard more than 2 HoF level players from Europe in 5th round or below in 20 year is ridiculous and look actually, which superstars from Europe were available there. I checked and came up with Kaprizov and Bratt (I'm not even sure I'd go that far yet) in 21st century. So I assume to be legendary you'd have to pick one of two players over the span of almost twenty years while competing with 29 other teams. I think we can conculde that a statement "Hakan needs to pick superstars below 4th round more often than twice in 25 years to be truly legendary" is the most ridiculous take on this board. Truly an achievment, since ShanahanMan Yzerland and 17 incarnations of CaptainBob are posting here.
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What does it matter where they played? The point is, he hasn't found anyone close to that level of player from Europe in a long time. The argument was also that he hasn't found top flight players from rounds 2-7, which he hasn't since Datsyuk and Zetterberg. The first round is the only round that people say he hasn't been given picks in, until Yzerman took over. That means round 2-7, he was getting to make picks, and Tatar, Nyquist and Hronek are his best players from any of those rounds. None of them achieved anywhere near as good a career as either Pavelski or Benn.

You seem to be taking it really hard that I said he was a really good scout and not legendary right now! Like are you his son? Or is being pretty good bad? You know pretty good is still a very high positive right?

Who is CaptainBob? I have had one account here my whole time, so if that is you saying I have alternates that makes you sound mighty foolish and plain WRONG.
 
Oddbob said:
Thing is when talking about top scouts it would be star players or higher end players which are the reason they are top scouts, which Tatar and Nyquist are the closest to but are also nothing special either as his most recent successes. Other teams scouts have drafted guys like Pavelski or Benn in the later rounds which would be pretty good scouting. Other teams scouts would also have guys who accrued lots of games. To me games played is not a great mark of whether the scout is good or not as there are lots of players that get lots of games in the NHL and aren't great players. Lindstrom being an example of this. Would he have even hit 75 games if not on any NHL team devoid of NHL players? He barely made our team and couldn't even crack Montreal's lineup.

Hakan is a really good scout, but I don't think he is the legend he gets made out to be around here.
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No scout looks good when compared against the combined drafting of 31 other teams entire scouting departments.
 
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God this thread is terrible. I love it.

First we get immediate overreaction to Danielson first 5-6 games, chock full of takes you know will age poorly.

Now posts going after Hakan who, as posters above have clearly shown, has an incredible track record and over the last 4-5 years has been given most of our premium picks (1 of which is a borderline star already) and half of all our picks. And people haven't even mentioned the Soderblom pull out of the 6th round!!!

:D
 
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Oddbob said:
What does it matter where they played? The point is, he hasn't found anyone close to that level of player from Europe in a long time. The argument was also that he hasn't found top flight players from rounds 2-7, which he hasn't since Datsyuk and Zetterberg. The first round is the only round that people say he hasn't been given picks in, until Yzerman took over. That means round 2-7, he was getting to make picks, and Tatar, Nyquist and Hronek are his best players from any of those rounds. None of them achieved anywhere near as good a career as either Pavelski or Benn.

You seem to be taking it really hard that I said he was a really good scout and not legendary right now! Like are you his son? Or is being pretty good bad? You know pretty good is still a very high positive right?

Who is CaptainBob? I have had one account here my whole time, so if that is you saying I have alternates that makes you sound mighty foolish and plain WRONG.
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how often do guys like Pavelski or Benn even exist in the later rounds, especially when you're also limiting it to just Euros?

lets look at Benn's draft(2007) for example:

what good Euros were even available past the 1st round in that draft? Evgeny Dadonov had a couple good years eventually a decade after he was drafted, beyond that you're literally already looking at guys like Carl Gunnarsson for next best

how about Pavelski's 2003 draft year? the Wings didn't have a pick until the end of the 2nd round that year who was the best Euro taken in the 3rd round or later? again no stars, Tobias Enstrom was pretty good for a while, beyond that you're already down to Jaroslav Halak and Jan Hejda and then random guys with like a hundred games played
 
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Crunchy said:
And people haven't even mentioned the Soderblom pull out of the 6th round!!!
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He's a long ways away from being an NHLer, he actually looked worse this preseason. He's got one assist in 6 games in GR so far this season, and Hirose is outplaying all of the prospects.
 
Brandon tied 1-1. Pretty ugly hockey. Danielson had one shift that was dominant could’ve had a goal and an assist. Other than that hasn’t been great. Getting worked in the dot.
 
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Brandon just constantly outmatched. Have about 4 forwards who are top 9 guys everyone else probably shouldn’t be playing at this level.
Have no Defense who can contribute on offense.
 
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