4th Overall the Senators Take Brady Tkachuk

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

Like you said, M Tkachuk was dominant. That's the big difference here. All those other guys were far from dominant in their draft years, they were just very good. Brady wasn't truly dominant in his first NCAA season ( 18 yo) like a Keller or Eichel.

No I said the line was dominant, so all 3 players. It's not like Matt was superior to Marner or Dvorak but that they collectively came together to be amazing, each offering different qualities. Brady had Greenway, a natural winger who converted to center last year, as his C and his team all together didn't have close to the offensive firepower that London had... you're just grasping at straws here. Keller + Eichel are both centers, meaning they can have more ice time and a bigger impact on both ends of the ice compared to a winger. Plus Eichel is in a whole other tier of player so why the hell bring him up?

 

[HSF]

Funny think is M.Tkachuk got a lot of heat in his draft year cause people thought he was being carried by his linemates and he didn't have the 'skating' to take his game to the next level of course these were just fans looking for flaws and not actual experts who watch these guys play all the time

 

[HSF]

No I said the line was dominant, so all 3 players. It's not like Matt was superior to Marner or Dvorak but that they collectively came together to be amazing, each offering different qualities. Brady had Greenway, a natural winger who converted to center last year, as his C and his team all together didn't have close to the offensive firepower that London had... you're just grasping at straws here. Keller + Eichel are both centers, meaning they can have more ice time and a bigger impact on both ends of the ice compared to a winger. Plus Eichel is in a whole other tier of player so why the hell bring him up?

bingo and when Tkachuk played with quality players in the WJC guess what he did? Put up points

 

[topshelf15]

We are due to have a stud forward and a high pick pan out.....

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

No I said the line was dominant, so all 3 players. It's not like Matt was superior to Marner or Dvorak but that they collectively came together to be amazing, each offering different qualities. Brady had Greenway, a natural winger who converted to center last year, as his C and his team all together didn't have close to the offensive firepower that London had... you're just grasping at straws here. Keller + Eichel are both centers, meaning they can have more ice time and a bigger impact on both ends of the ice compared to a winger. Plus Eichel is in a whole other tier of player so why the hell bring him up?

The comparison to Keller and Eichel are relevant in that we look at what they did and know what elite talent looks like on the ice and on paper. Tkachuk doesn't meet their standards because he is for from elite. He's more comparable to Luke Kunin than to Clayton Keller as a prospect.

 

[Solarion]

the first team up with an opportunity to pick Zadina went elsewhere

next team up with both available went BT

next team up with Zadina on the board went elsewhere

so notwithstanding what the publications felt, three teams had a crack at Zadina and went elsewhere

You're ignoring the fact that both Montreal(3) and Arizona(5) were drafting based on positional need(centers). While not what I'd have done with a 3rd overall, the Habs choice of Kotkaniemi is understandable given that many saw him as the top center prospect in the draft. Arizona, IMO went completely off the reservation by choosing Hayton at #5 and I think they'll regret it. Their choice was, again IMO, far worse than Ottawa's. Tkachuk is a better hockey player than is Hayton, but time will tell how all this pans out.

Here's Scott Wheeler's take on how the current top 50 draft prospects rank:

Tkachuk comes in at #24, only two spots behind Kotkaniemi...Hayton doesn't even make the list. The problem is that #5 is Zadina, and IMO he belongs there.

Wheeler: The Top 50 drafted NHL prospects ranking, 2018...

 

[NyQuil]

Tkachuk comes in at #24, only two spots behind Kotkaniemi...Hayton doesn't even make the list. The problem is that #5 is Zadina, and IMO he belongs there.

Yeah, I read the article.

He's not a fan of the Tkachuk pick - mainly based on his weak shot and inability to score goals, something that has been discussed around here for sure.

 

[Solarion]

Ottawa was #25 in GF last year(with Hoffman)...Montreal was 29th and Arizona was 30th. These are teams that desperately need an elite scorer....but passed on the best shot in the draft.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Bro you said that preferring Zadina is “not supported by any scouting publications”. There’s no missing the forest for the trees here, that’s a flat-out incorrect statement.

I've definitely gone overboard a bit bro!

My point is that the few posters that are saying that Zadina is a great player while BT is a much lesser prospect don't have support. You can prefer the guy for sure, but when you look at their draft positions across the various publications, scouting reports, and the actual NHL draft, there really isn't any support for this opinion.

 

[mianjo]

Brady Tkachuk on the #1 line for the USA with 67's forward Chemelevski his center

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DjYrEBBUwAA-S7y.jpg

 

[stempniaksen]

Brady Tkachuk on the #1 line for the USA with 67's forward Chemelevski his center

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DjYrEBBUwAA-S7y.jpg

Is it just me or does that team look weaker than normal? Tkachuk would have had a big role regardless, but it looks like he'll be one of the prime players this time around.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Is it just me or does that team look weaker than normal? Tkachuk would have had a big role regardless, but it looks like he'll be one of the prime players this time around.

I'm guessing that must be a split squad team. Canada has a split squad as well.

 

[Solarion]

I've definitely gone overboard a bit bro!

My point is that the few posters that are saying that Zadina is a great player while BT is a much lesser prospect don't have support. You can prefer the guy for sure, but when you look at their draft positions across the various publications, scouting reports, and the actual NHL draft, there really isn't any support for this opinion.

Pardon? I just put up Wheeler's chart with Zadina @ 5 and Tkachuk @ 24. As to actual draft positions, please re-read my previous post. Montreal and Arizona drafted centers...they were always going to draft centers.

Zadina @ #4 Filip Zadina Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #4 - Last Word on Hockey
Tkachuk @ #11 Brady Tkachuk Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #10

 

[JungleBeat]

bingo and when Tkachuk played with quality players in the WJC guess what he did? Put up points

He played with quality players all his life. He wasn’t just solely playing with Greenway as well, he spent time with Bowers and Harper too. He’s just more of a complimentary guy, you won’t see being a line driver.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

He played with quality players all his life. He wasn’t just solely playing with Greenway as well, he spent time with Bowers and Harper too. He’s just more of a complimentary guy, you won’t see being a line driver.

Greenway was also considered one of the best players in the NCAA and an Olympian... not like he was playing with scrubs.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

bingo and when Tkachuk played with quality players in the WJC guess what he did? Put up points

Hopefully Tkachuk and Brown (being childhood friends) can replicate what Brady could do along side Mittelstadt and other good players at the WJC.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

Pardon? I just put up Wheeler's chart with Zadina @ 5 and Tkachuk @ 24. As to actual draft positions, please re-read my previous post. Montreal and Arizona drafted centers...they were always going to draft centers.

Zadina @ #4 Filip Zadina Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #4 - Last Word on Hockey
Tkachuk @ #11 Brady Tkachuk Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #10

That's Wheeler's opinion on who he believes are the best prospects atm. He was high on Zadina pre draft and wasn't much of a fan of Tkachuk, but really it's just 1 guys opinion, so what's your point exactly? It was obvious that Habs drafted based on need and that Arizona's pick was a reach so again, you're not stating something extraordinary.. but collectively scouts had Tkachuk either 2-3-4 on most lists.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Brady Tkachuk on the #1 line for the USA with 67's forward Chemelevski his center

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DjYrEBBUwAA-S7y.jpg

Must be because the team sucks and/or Team USA doesn't know Tkachuk is already a bonafide first ballot hall of fame BUST

 

[Xspyrit]

Pardon? I just put up Wheeler's chart with Zadina @ 5 and Tkachuk @ 24. As to actual draft positions, please re-read my previous post. Montreal and Arizona drafted centers...they were always going to draft centers.

Zadina @ #4 Filip Zadina Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #4 - Last Word on Hockey
Tkachuk @ #11 Brady Tkachuk Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #10

I haven't followed the debate but have you just cherry picked that scouting source? Because based on all other sources, it seems that Tkachuk was always going to go high.

• NHL Central Scouting: 2nd (among NA Skaters)
• Future Considerations: 3rd
• McKeen’s Hockey: 5th
• Hockeyprospect.com: 5th
• ISS Hockey: 4th
• Bob McKenzie: 4th
• Craig Button: 2nd
• Jeff Marek: 4th

Personally, since Dahlin or Svechnikov were out of range, I wanted Zadina as a personal preference but was ok with Tkachuk or maybe even Wahlstrom or Dobson. I think pretty much all teams had Takchuk #3 to #5 on their list.

 

[Ice-Tray]

So to recap:

You: You guys are all crazy, going against concensus; every publication had Tkachuk ahead, We even know a bunch of teams had him ahead.

Me: Actually, you are incorrect; lots of publications had Zadina ahead, while others had Tkachuk ahead (this implies no concensus). The only team we know had Tkachuk ahead for sure is Ottawa, as they are the only team that directly chose one over the other.

You: You're missing the forest among the trees. There was no concensus, blah blah blah.

You seem to think I was implying Zadina was the obvious pick, but in fact, I was showing that both you and those who where on the opposite side of the spectrum were mistaken.

Oddly, I've been one poster to support the Tkachuk pick since before the draft, but you seem to want to lump me in with those who are ragging on the pick.

Ugh..... Buddy, I clarified my point in response to your post, and yet you come at me with this tripe? The consensus was that Zadina was not universally held as the better player, in fact BT was held as better in some cases. See you got all excited, as you do, but failed to actually follow the conversation. I'm not arguing that BT is better (though I like him more), I'm arguing that Zadina isn't some star in the making while BT is a grinder with intangibles (as some of our fans are arguing). I'm not sure what point you're trying to make beyond trying to argue with me. You doing you as usual.

Hahaha, yeah, I'm not implying anything about you, nor am I lumping you into anything. You are irrelevant to the discussion beyond making a correction to an overexhuberant statement I made. I have no idea what you think about Zadina or BT. Nice try interjecting yourself though.

 

[Masked]

Pardon? I just put up Wheeler's chart with Zadina @ 5 and Tkachuk @ 24. As to actual draft positions, please re-read my previous post. Montreal and Arizona drafted centers...they were always going to draft centers.

Zadina @ #4 Filip Zadina Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #4 - Last Word on Hockey
Tkachuk @ #11 Brady Tkachuk Scouting Report: 2018 NHL Draft #10

Posting links to spam sites doesn't prove anything.

 

[Tundraman]

Who the heck needs Zadina when you have Hoffman.....

Oh Wait.....

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

The comparison to Keller and Eichel are relevant in that we look at what they did and know what elite talent looks like on the ice and on paper. Tkachuk doesn't meet their standards because he is for from elite. He's more comparable to Luke Kunin than to Clayton Keller as a prospect.

I find Kunin and White more alike but no one will mistake Tkachuk for Keller that's for sure. Keller is a little dynamo.. I would have taken him over Brown in that Draft.

 

[JungleBeat]

I find Kunin and White more alike but no one will mistake Tkachuk for Keller that's for sure. Keller is a little dynamo.. I would have taken him over Brown in that Draft.

You wouldn’t have had a choice since Keller was drafted before Brown.

 

[Sens in Process]

McKenzie's draft list is closest approximation we have to definitive consensus ranking. McKenzie's access to head scouts and apparent integrity of the process has made his ranking the gold standard. His work represents a far better gauge of how prospects are viewed/rated than HFboard opinion or scouting publications.

Zadina was dropping on many teams list by the time June rolled around.

For example, while Zadina is still very much a consensus top-five pick, relative to the other prospects, five of 10 scouts surveyed by TSN ranked him outside their top five. Five scouts had him in the top five, including three of them at No. 3, but he had three 6’s, a 7 and a 9 as well. That’s a far cry from the mid-season polling, when all of Zadina’s marks came in between 2 and 4.

https://www.tsn.ca/kotkaniemi-surges-into-top-five-of-tsn-draft-ranking-1.1115400

So this talk that Zadina was the the consensus 3rd pick is patently false, we all knew that there was a real chance that Zadina would fall out of the top 5. Scouts had soured on him largely because things he couldn't control like positional bias(Montreal and Phoenix apparently had two centers in their top 5), and recency bias, along with the perception he didn't improve as the season progressed and he had limited athletic ability, among other things of course.

Tkachuk had 9 of 10 scouts polled put him solidly in the top 5. Beyond Dahlin and Svechnikov, according to Mckenzie's list, Tkachuk was only other prospect who really had a legitimate claim to be a consensus top 5 pick. I mean, scouts had Zadina ranked as high as 7 and 9.