4th Overall the Senators Take Brady Tkachuk

[BondraTime]

If this was 2010 and someone asked me if we wanted out top pick/prospect playing in London in his draft+1 year, it would be an enthusiastic yes before you could finish the sentence. But the last couple of seasons...we're starting to see a subtle shift. More and more top kids are staying in Jr A and going the NCAA route. College is getting stronger, while the CHL feels like it's starting to fall behind a bit.

I'm not sure what the solution is, but the super teams like London aren't quite the slam dunk they used to be.

London has in the past 4 NHL drafts had:
7 1st rounders
2 2nd rounders
2 3rd rounders
3 4th rounders
1 5th rounder
1 6th rounder
1 7th rounder

London is the spot you want your kids to play in the CHL, and have the best draft record in the CHL to show for it.

 

[topshelf15]

Huh?

London has in the past 4 NHL drafts had:
7 1st rounders
2 2nd rounders
2 3rd rounders
3 4th rounders
1 5th rounder
1 6th rounder
1 7th rounder

London is the spot you want your kids to play in the CHL, and have the best draft record int the CHL to show for it.

If he goes the OHL route, for sure this is the team to do it on...For me I wouldnt mind him playing a full AHL season with Brown ,and seeing how that works out for him...With a trip to the WJC as well...Iam unsure if he is ready for the NHL just yet,but let him play his power game against men

 

[bert]

TBH him playing in junior would be a step back from the NCAA,so its 3 options..Go back to school, or sign his ELC ,and play either in the NHL or the AHL...The latter seems to be the best choice,if we are going to actually ice a decent team in Belleville that is

Tkachuk scored 8 goals last year, playing in the AHL or NHL is not the place for him if the Sens are hoping to develop a top 6 forward. He needs to score goals. Id personally prefer London, he will experience winning, learning in a winning culture and a schedule that replicates the NHL far more than college.

This team has plenty of young players to prioritize in Belleville this year, overloading the team with too much youth is a surefire disaster waiting to happen.

Batherson, Chlapik and Brown all need prime icetime, having 4 of your top 6 forwards 21 and under is not going to go well.

London has in the past 4 NHL drafts had:
7 1st rounders
2 2nd rounders
2 3rd rounders
3 4th rounders
1 5th rounder
1 6th rounder
1 7th rounder

London is the spot you want your kids to play in the CHL, and have the best draft record in the CHL to show for it.

Thanks for bringing facts instead of winging it.

 

[Solarion]

Brady's father and brother are obviously going to play a huge role in his decision making process. He turns 19 in September and I believe the only thing the family has committed to is a summer training program with Gary Roberts. After that I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if BT heads back to BU for another year.

Whether or no that'd be any reflection on who drafted him, I cannot say, but if I'm the Tkachuk's I may be a bit hesitant about signing a contract with the Sens organization at this time.

...on the other hand, I believe Zadina signed immediately with Detroit.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

If this was 2010 and someone asked me if we wanted out top pick/prospect playing in London in his draft+1 year, it would be an enthusiastic yes before you could finish the sentence. But the last couple of seasons...we're starting to see a subtle shift. More and more top kids are staying in Jr A and going the NCAA route. College is getting stronger, while the CHL feels like it's starting to fall behind a bit.

I'm not sure what the solution is, but the super teams like London aren't quite the slam dunk they used to be.

London is building a new current super team.

Anyways, we're not seeing the NCAA or USHL/JrA route move ahead, it's just USA hockey moving to be on par with Canada. The QMJHL has been getting better and better and we're typically seeing a number of the too prospects coming out of there every year unlike in the decade previous.

Part of USA hockey moving forward is their focus on skills and skating development. Canada is rigid in its thinking always moving guys into projectable roles and not pushing the players to be more than stereotypes. Canada cares more about systems play than actual quality of individuals and that carrys over into the NCAA as well as teams get closer to 'professional' and not developmental. That's why a guy like Austin Matthews didn't have use for college and went to Europe.

Canada and the CHL will always be good and produce NHL talent but these other countries are catching up by focusing on areas Canada neglects.

 

[topshelf15]

[QUOTE="bert, post: 148527629, member: 5831"]Tkachuk scored 8 goals last year, playing in the AHL or NHL is not the place for him if the Sens are hoping to develop a top 6 forward. He needs to score goals. Id personally prefer London, he will experience winning, learning in a winning culture and a schedule that replicates the NHL far more than college.

This team has plenty of young players to prioritize in Belleville this year, overloading the team with too much youth is a surefire disaster waiting to happen.

Batherson, Chlapik and Brown all need prime icetime, having 4 of your top 6 forwards 21 and under is not going to go well.



Thanks for bringing facts instead of winging it.[/QUOTE]Meh,not really hung up on this as much as others...The kid will find the net he plays so damn close to it

 

[bert]

[QUOTE="bert, post: 148527629, member: 5831"]Tkachuk scored 8 goals last year, playing in the AHL or NHL is not the place for him if the Sens are hoping to develop a top 6 forward. He needs to score goals. Id personally prefer London, he will experience winning, learning in a winning culture and a schedule that replicates the NHL far more than college.

This team has plenty of young players to prioritize in Belleville this year, overloading the team with too much youth is a surefire disaster waiting to happen.

Batherson, Chlapik and Brown all need prime icetime, having 4 of your top 6 forwards 21 and under is not going to go well.



Thanks for bringing facts instead of winging it.

Meh,not really hung up on this as much as others...The kid will find the net he plays so damn close to it

Players that find the net alot better than Tkachuk need time to develop in jr then in the AHL. I am not sure why he is all of a sudden the exception from the rule.

 

[topshelf15]

Players that find the net alot better than Tkachuk need time to develop in jr then in the AHL. I am not sure why he is all of a sudden the exception from the rule.

His game is predicated on the physical play down low,he wont learn how to proper develop this against boys...Everything else about is game will feed off this,hence in my opinion the AHL would be the better route...Again its only my opinion ,and I have been wrong so so many times..lol

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Players that find the net alot better than Tkachuk need time to develop in jr then in the AHL. I am not sure why he is all of a sudden the exception from the rule.

Muh intangibles.

 

[topshelf15]

Muh intangibles.

If by being a punishing forchecker,as well as a bellow the circles nightmare...Than i love those

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

If by being a punishing forchecker,as well as a bellow the circles nightmare...Than i love those

As long as the end result is the puck going into the opposition's net. That's what actually matters. Not something Brady is good at built at least we can gave empty possession numbers. Yay.

 

[topshelf15]

As long as the end result is the puck going into the opposition's net. That's what actually matters. Not something Brady is good at built at least we can gave empty possession numbers. Yay.

Meh ,he racked up 31 apples..And without the puck you cant score,but we sure as hell can play shitty defense without it...BT will facilitate goals or put them in himself,this much Iam not too concerned about

 

[bert]

How would you compare Dylan Larkin to Brady Tkachuk? They have somewhat comparable production.

Brady Tkachuk


Dylan Larkin


*NOTE: Tkachuk's NCAA and WJC-20 production is prior to being drafted. Dylan Larkin's NCAA and WJC-20 production is the season after he was drafted.

Yet they were the same age in their NCAA seasons. Larkin and Tkachuk dont play a similar game at all though. Dont really see how they are good comparables to one another. Larkin is a speedster that plays center with elite hands, Tkachuk is a power winger.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Why in your eyes can't a goal scoring winger be a franchise player? Do you not value goal scoring?

I agree that they can be for sure, I'm just not sure if Zadina is that guy is all. Being a good scorer and not a franchise player is also valuable, don't get me wrong. I just think we chose the right guy for our team, and the right guy in general.

 

[Solarion]

How though? BT wasn't the BPA and he doesn't fill a particular need for the Sens. The choice is a head scratcher at #4 for me. I mean the answer is surely intangibles/character stuff, but I wouldn't personally reach for that stuff.

If they'd gone a bit off board and chosen Hughes or Dobson...I could understand that, particularly with EK likely leaving, but a winger that's not even the top gun on the board?

 

[Ice-Tray]

Sigh, I miss the days when our franshise players were elite level talents. And not just really good complimentary guys.

So much baseless disappointment. Ah well, at least you've given yourself a healthy margin to be impressed by.

Speaking of the old days. Tkachuk is the exact type of player that our soft group of top six forwards could have used to get over the hump, every year we pined for some aggressive forechecking and pressure down low in a skilled player.

Maybe we get it right this time, and maybe not, but our youth has me looking forward to what this team could turn into.

 

[bert]

So much baseless disappointment. Ah well, at least you've given yourself a healthy margin to be impressed by.

Speaking of the old days. Tkachuk is the exact type of player that our soft group of top six forwards could have used to get over the hump, every year we pined for some aggressive forechecking and pressure down low in a skilled player.

Maybe we get it right this time, and maybe not, but our youth has me looking forward to what this team could turn into.

Hossa is the best player in franchise history at what you're describing and they traded him for a one dimensional goal scorer. That teams problem was not a Brady Tkachuk away from being elite it was a first line centerman and a goalie that could make a save when it counts. The 07 team wasnt close to as good as the teams in the early 2000's but they had a first line center that could create offense and they had wingers that could finish. Goaltending wasnt really any better but there were less melt downs.

I get that this is what the general fanbase wanted but in reality they didnt know what they had at the time.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Meh ,he racked up 31 apples..And without the puck you cant score,but we sure as hell can play ****ty defense without it...BT will facilitate goals or put them in himself,this much Iam not too concerned about

No, he had 23 helpers. Anyway you cut it his numbers are pedestrian. We're simply hoping he'll do the almost impossible and become an offensive threat and develop skills that he's never really shown. If his dad wasn't who he was, no one would be putting these ridiculous expectations on him.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

So much baseless disappointment. Ah well, at least you've given yourself a healthy margin to be impressed by.

Speaking of the old days. Tkachuk is the exact type of player that our soft group of top six forwards could have used to get over the hump, every year we pined for some aggressive forechecking and pressure down low in a skilled player.

Maybe we get it right this time, and maybe not, but our youth has me looking forward to what this team could turn into.

Not really. We pinned for goaltending. Guys like Alfredsson and Hossa were monsters on the puck in their end. Revisionist history at best.

 

[topshelf15]

No, he had 23 helpers. Anyway you cut it his numbers numbers are pedestrian. We're simply hoping he'll do the almost impossible and become an offensive threat and develop skills that he's never really shown. If his dad wasn't who he was, no one would be putting these ridiculous expectations on him.

I trust our scouts,and like what I have seen from him in the WJC in which he showed very well in a best on best tourney

 

[Ice-Tray]

How though? BT wasn't the BPA and he doesn't fill a particular need for the Sens. The choice is a head scratcher at #4 for me. I mean the answer is surely intangibles/character stuff, but I wouldn't personally reach for that stuff.

If they'd gone a bit off board and chosen Hughes or Dobson...I could understand that, particularly with EK likely leaving, but a winger that's not even the top gun on the board?

How can you say that BT wasn't the BPA when virtually every single scouting publication, including Mac's NHL scouting group, had BT going exactly where he did, and sometimes higher?

I mean I can get people having their preferences, but this really wasn't a head scratcher pick in the slightest, and if you were to go by scouting reports you'd pick him at 4 or you would be passing on the BPA.

And then you go and say that you would understand more if they went off board and chose a player that was not a consensus #4 pick?

Trent already explained that they saw BT and Zadina as similarly skilled (different strengths but at the same level) but BT had a ton of intangibles and a playing style that made him a rare player in the NHL. His intangibles didn't make up the difference between him and Zadina, they were the bonus that made him the clear choice OVER Zadina.

Now that's from our head scout, so we already know what I team sees in him, and why they chose him. He was the clear cut BPA for our scouting team at the draft. You may not agree for whatever reason, but lets not start creating the narrative that we didn't choose the BPA, or that we thought BT was less skilled at hockey but made up for that deficiency with intangibles.

We're not looking for the top gun on the board, we're looking for the best hockey player on the board, and that was BT according to most. We've already gone for the single skill 'top gun' before in Puemple, and that didn't exactly work out. I mean we already had a guy that had one of the best shots in the game, and some of the best wheels, and he couldn't score goals with the best scorers in the league. It takes more than one of the best shots to score goals in the NHL, and we also know that guys can score consistently without one.

It's sad seeing how far some of our team's fans will go to diminish our top draft pick from this year. I'm just glad that we're niche voices and don't represent the fan base in general.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Muh intangibles.

Getting to the net and dominating down low are not intangibles.

 

[Solarion]

I trust our scouts,and like what I have seen from him in the WJC in which he showed very well in a best on best tourney

Absolutely. In a vacuum Brady Tkachuk is a fine choice...I said it before, and I'll say it again...I like this kid. However, compared to the guys still available at #4 this is not a smart decision imo. There's too much talent being left on the table here. Opportunity cost is still a cost and #4 picks don't grow on trees. If you're taking a winger in the top 5 he needs to ooze elite talent from every pore...imo.

How can you say that BT wasn't the BPA when virtually every single scouting publication, including Mac's NHL scouting group, had BT going exactly where he did, and sometimes higher?

Simple. I don't see him as equal value to Zadina, Hughes, or Wahlstrom. If those guys are still available(and they were) then you take them...and probably in that order.

How could he(Tkachuk) have gone higher btw? The Habs were taking a center and there's no way BT displaces Svech or Dahlin. No, #4 was already a reach for Brady, and higher still would have been madness. It may be fun to generalize about how these guys in the top 5 are "roughly equal", but the reality is that there was a big drop off after #2 and #3 was it's own tier in this draft. One could make the case that Wahlstrom, Hughes, and Tkachuk constitute a 4th tier and justify taking any of them...though in that case I would argue Hughes should be taken simply by virtue of position...but I digress.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Hossa is the best player in franchise history at what you're describing and they traded him for a one dimensional goal scorer. That teams problem was not a Brady Tkachuk away from being elite it was a first line centerman and a goalie that could make a save when it counts. The 07 team wasnt close to as good as the teams in the early 2000's but they had a first line center that could create offense and they had wingers that could finish. Goaltending wasnt really any better but there were less melt downs.

I get that this is what the general fanbase wanted but in reality they didnt know what they had at the time.

Yeah, Heater wasn't a one dimensional scorer at all, but he was never able to regain his form after the car accident. Having said that he was also a multiple 50 goal scorer, it's not exactly Hoffman level scoring, and not something anyone should be comparing Zadina to.

Hossa was a good forechecker, but was not the beast you're now remembering. He was not an aggressive player, and not one to stick up for his line mates. He was dogged after the puck, and with the puck, and had lots of great attributes, but he wasn't in the mold of a Roberts, Tkachuk.

Yes, we can all look at untimely goals against, but most conveniently forget that not only couldn't we score, but we were fragile, and were often pushed around by other teams in the playoffs. During the Yashin years and afterwards.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Tkachuk is going to be a good player. He is just not everyone's cup of tea as a hockey player ... Some people prefer the dipsy doodler , play with eggs in their pants and not break them kind of players, as long as they can make a quick move and score. IMO Tkachuk will end up being a more valuable player than Zadina. I would have much preferred Svechnikov but I would have chosen Tkachuk over Zadina so I have no issues with the pick. Dobson slipping out of the top 10 surprised me . I really like him as well.