Prospect Info: 47OA: Brady Cleveland

[lidstromiscool]

110 minutes are too small of sample to derive any stats. Here are 24 minutes of his games - make your own opinions.

110 minutes worth of play is way too small of a sample size for analytics.

110 minutes is more than enough sample size of actually watching a player.

And since it's hard to find games of prospects, figured some posters would enjoy seeing them.

 

[izlez]

110 minutes are too small of sample to derive any stats. Here are 24 minutes of his games - make your own opinions.

Watching him play >>>>> Never seen him play

 

[newfy]

110 minutes worth of play is way too small of a sample size for analytics.

110 minutes is more than enough sample size of actually watching a player.

And since it's hard to find games of prospects, figured some posters would enjoy seeing them.

Its not too small of a sample size for analytics depending on what youre using those analytics for. For example, his puck battles won analytic? You can watch those 110 minutes and watch him win those puck battles, or just quickly use the stat to say the percentage of them that he won.

If you want to start trying to say what his WAR is or something like that based on 110 minutes, obviously it isnt enough. But if you know how to read a stat and understand context, you can absolutely use those "analytics"

Watching both those games of his, I saw exactly what I expected from the analytics. He came out of the puck with the corner most times he was in there battling, he threw his weight around, he got the puck up on the breakout and didnt really get beat much defensively. On the other hand, he did literally nothing offensively

 

[Dotter]

All opinions on Brady Cleveland, aside from 1 person, are based on the same sample size of ~13 minutes and 39 seconds of video available on the internet. Take them with a grain of salt.

That one person being the professional scout that actually went to watch him play enough to tell Yzerman "draft this kid, we got ourselves a 2nd round talent here!"

The internet shift by shift play I've seen shows signs why he was drafted where he was, and why I am perfectly fine with this pick. I hope he pans out. But, unfortunately, the likelihood of a 2nd rounder becoming something special has very low odds. I think everyone understands that.

But can we at least be excited about this pick? Afterall, there's a reason why a really smart hockey guy drafted him.

 

[lidstromiscool]

Its not too small of a sample size for analytics depending on what youre using those analytics for. For example, his puck battles won analytic? You can watch those 110 minutes and watch him win those puck battles, or just quickly use the stat to say the percentage of them that he won.

If you want to start trying to say what his WAR is or something like that based on 110 minutes, obviously it isnt enough. But if you know how to read a stat and understand context, you can absolutely use those "analytics"

Watching both those games of his, I saw exactly what I expected from the analytics. He came out of the puck with the corner most times he was in there battling, he threw his weight around, he got the puck up on the breakout and didnt really get beat much defensively. On the other hand, he did literally nothing offensively

For the sample size, all those stats which are per/60. When you've only played 110 minutes all year, it's not nearly as accurate as someone who played 600 minutes. I agree that he competes hard, tries to throw his weight around. He does have some intriguing characteristics, but being a blackhole offensively in college is tough. It led to him having a negative corsi in every single game except for vs UAA.

 

[newfy]

For the sample size, all those stats which are per/60. When you've only played 110 minutes all year, it's not nearly as accurate as someone who played 600 minutes. I agree that he competes hard, tries to throw his weight around. He does have some intriguing characteristics, but being a blackhole offensively in college is tough. It led to him having a negative corsi in every single game except for vs UAA.

This isnt me trying to say hes amazing if its coming across that way, just that I saw something pretty positive compared to 98% of this thread.

And yes, I understand its per 60 minutes... all I'm saying is that just like its a small sample size, so is the actual ice time for the eye test. Is someone who watched 2 games live, so roughly 25 minutes of hockey we'll say, going to be any more accurate than using those stats with context? No matter how you spin it, the sample size is small, but from the 2 games I watched, those stats kind of show exactly what I saw.

Would I say hes the most physical, or the best in puck battles in all of the NCAA based on that stat card? No, obviously not because of the sample size. But would I say that hes definitely physical and strong on the puck? Yes. Would I say he did a good job getting the puck up to his forwards? Yes

But would I make sweeping generalisations about his game or compare him to others with bigger samples? Obviously not, because I understand the context of those stats

 

[RabidBadger]

But can we at least be excited about this pick? Afterall, there's a reason why a really smart hockey guy drafted him.

It's hard to generate excitement for him after the year he had at UW. I haven't written him off but I'm definitely not getting my hopes up.

He does have some positives going for him: he's young, Mike Hastings has a preference for older players and leans on them much more. A change of scenery to CC might be a shot in the arm. If he can become a Matt Greene type player then you have a useful guy as your 6th/7th man on the backend. Shee-yit...lord knows we need a player that can keep the flies off our top line guys.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

CC should be a good spot for him to spend a couple of years. The team is in a really good conference and the new barn should help recruiting a lot (for a school that isn't easy to recruit to). While I don't know who they have coming in this year, I seem to remember them having a pretty small blueline.

CC has been recruiting pretty well lately. They tap into the traditional Minnesota pipeline pretty well, a growing California pipeline, and have started a Michigan pipeline since their head coach, Kris Mayotte, used to be the associate HC at Michigan and likely has a large network of connections in the minor hockey circles in Michigan.

 

[Killerjas]

We didn't draft him to score goals or get points.

We drafted him because he is big mean nasty f***er that likes to run people over.

I am pretty sure you can pick a guy like this from the local gym. Plenty of potential future bouncer hall of famers there.

 

[izlez]

Here are two of his games from this year so people can make their own opinions

It's honestly crazy to me that for a guy that has generated so much discussion, and with virtually no video available of him online, no one has shown any interest in watching him for themselves when given a chance.

In these, he looks better than I expected based on what the haters have been saying. He looks great at defending on the rush (and that's not something anybody off the street can do). Can see that he looks to activate offensively when he breaks up a play, but will also defer to other players in a hurry. He looks good at finding quick passes in the defensive zone to be able to create a breakout.

Definitely has a mean streak. Definitely sook out big hits rather than taking what was given and gets in people's faces if they try to get physical with him

He's clumsy with the puck but seems to show some flashes of decent hands being in there somewhere. Seems like at 6'5 we can at least use the standard "big guys need time to get used to their body" and give him a chance to grow some skills there. The IQ with the puck on his stick does not look good. If his option A or maybe B to dish off the puck isn't there, its not good. Need real improvement there

 

[lidstromiscool]

It's honestly crazy to me that for a guy that has generated so much discussion, and with virtually no video available of him online, no one has shown any interest in watching him for themselves when given a chance.

In these, he looks better than I expected based on what the haters have been saying. He looks great at defending on the rush (and that's not something anybody off the street can do). Can see that he looks to activate offensively when he breaks up a play, but will also defer to other players in a hurry. He looks good at finding quick passes in the defensive zone to be able to create a breakout.

Definitely has a mean streak. Definitely sook out big hits rather than taking what was given and gets in people's faces if they try to get physical with him

He's clumsy with the puck but seems to show some flashes of decent hands being in there somewhere. Seems like at 6'5 we can at least use the standard "big guys need time to get used to their body" and give him a chance to grow some skills there. The IQ with the puck on his stick does not look good. If his option A or maybe B to dish off the puck isn't there, its not good. Need real improvement there

I'd say thats a pretty fair assessment. I'd also say he loses his man quite a bit in the defensive zone as well as he gets lost when the puck isn't with his player. He has to learn to defend in layers, his hockey sense is awful as well.

 

[newfy]

It's honestly crazy to me that for a guy that has generated so much discussion, and with virtually no video available of him online, no one has shown any interest in watching him for themselves when given a chance.

In these, he looks better than I expected based on what the haters have been saying. He looks great at defending on the rush (and that's not something anybody off the street can do). Can see that he looks to activate offensively when he breaks up a play, but will also defer to other players in a hurry. He looks good at finding quick passes in the defensive zone to be able to create a breakout.

Definitely has a mean streak. Definitely sook out big hits rather than taking what was given and gets in people's faces if they try to get physical with him

He's clumsy with the puck but seems to show some flashes of decent hands being in there somewhere. Seems like at 6'5 we can at least use the standard "big guys need time to get used to their body" and give him a chance to grow some skills there. The IQ with the puck on his stick does not look good. If his option A or maybe B to dish off the puck isn't there, its not good. Need real improvement there

Exactly what I came away thinking when I watched both of those videos. Like the level of hate compared to what was shown in those videos are outrageous. Now I feel like I'm on some crusade and his biggest believer just because I'm saying maybe hes not the worst pick of all time and people should pump the brakes.

He had dmen 3-5 years older than him that he was competing with for ice time, dealing with an injury, combined with the advanced analytics looking solid, and those videos where he looks solid and the people spewing the crazy vitriol about him look kinda silly.

He definitely looks like a guy that extra time college provides will be needed, and definitely has parts of his game to clean up... but you can see why the wings thought he was enticing as well

 

[Konnan511]

It's honestly crazy to me that for a guy that has generated so much discussion, and with virtually no video available of him online, no one has shown any interest in watching him for themselves when given a chance.

In these, he looks better than I expected based on what the haters have been saying. He looks great at defending on the rush (and that's not something anybody off the street can do). Can see that he looks to activate offensively when he breaks up a play, but will also defer to other players in a hurry. He looks good at finding quick passes in the defensive zone to be able to create a breakout.

Definitely has a mean streak. Definitely sook out big hits rather than taking what was given and gets in people's faces if they try to get physical with him

He's clumsy with the puck but seems to show some flashes of decent hands being in there somewhere. Seems like at 6'5 we can at least use the standard "big guys need time to get used to their body" and give him a chance to grow some skills there. The IQ with the puck on his stick does not look good. If his option A or maybe B to dish off the puck isn't there, its not good. Need real improvement there

If I want to watch Grass Grow...I'll go watch...grass?

 

[RabidBadger]

Now I feel like I'm on some crusade and his biggest believer just because I'm saying maybe hes not the worst pick of all time and people should pump the brakes.

The Mazur supporters on this board can talk you through this.

 

[newfy]

The Mazur supporters on this board can talk you through this.

I'm one of them, same with when Larkin and Bertuzzi were drafted lol.

Never said they were all going to be stars but the people who thought Bertuzzi could be had as a UDFA and was a nepotism pick didnt learn and spouted the same stuff about Mazur. Seems like a lot of the same people going on about Cleveland having 0 chance to ever make it

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

Now I feel like I'm on some crusade and his biggest believer just because I'm saying maybe hes not the worst pick of all time and people should pump the brakes.

hey now

 

[Gniwder]

I'm one of them, same with when Larkin and Bertuzzi were drafted lol.

Never said they were all going to be stars but the people who thought Bertuzzi could be had as a UDFA and was a nepotism pick didnt learn and spouted the same stuff about Mazur. Seems like a lot of the same people going on about Cleveland having 0 chance to ever make it

Good old HFB strawman. I'd like to see you quote one person that said they'd be available in free agency. The issue was that Bert and Cleveland were picked in the second round of deep draft classes. Many felt they'd be available in 3rd or later rounds.

Mazur was a 3rd round pick in a meh draft class. Only a couple of people complained, though one was very vocal. I'd be more enthusiastic about Mazur if he could bulk up this summer and be a bottom 6 player with some grit.

 

[newfy]

Good old HFB strawman. I'd like to see you quote one person that said they'd be available in free agency. The issue was that Bert and Cleveland were picked in the second round of deep draft classes. Many felt they'd be available in 3rd or later rounds.

Mazur was a 3rd round pick in a meh draft class. Only a couple of people complained, though one was very vocal. I'd be more enthusiastic about Mazur if he could bulk up this summer and be a bottom 6 player with some grit.

You cant quote old threads on HFboards anymore, but go back and read through the threads. Tonnes of people saying they could've gotten Bertuzzi in the 2nd round, tonnes of people saying it was the worst red wings pick in a very long time, players like him can be had as UDFAs etc etc.

Too be fair I may have worded that wrong, or youre misreading it, but I was saying about Bertuzzi being a UDFA, the nepotism part is what I meant about Mazur.

Honestly, the wings best picks the last decade have basically been picks that people have hated at draft time. Larkin was Helm with hands with no offensive upside, Bertuzzi 7th round pick, Seider no offensive upside. You would think people would learn flashy stickhandling on youtube isnt what makes a player effective

 

[Winger98]

You cant quote old threads on HFboards anymore, but go back and read through the threads. Tonnes of people saying they could've gotten Bertuzzi in the 2nd round, tonnes of people saying it was the worst red wings pick in a very long time, players like him can be had as UDFAs etc etc.

Too be fair I may have worded that wrong, or youre misreading it, but I was saying about Bertuzzi being a UDFA, the nepotism part is what I meant about Mazur.

Honestly, the wings best picks the last decade have basically been picks that people have hated at draft time. Larkin was Helm with hands with no offensive upside, Bertuzzi 7th round pick, Seider no offensive upside. You would think people would learn flashy stickhandling on youtube isnt what makes a player effective

To be fair about Larkin that rests entirely on Jeff Finley. I think fans were ready to really love the pick, and the first quote from a member of the Wings compares him to...Helm. It wouldn't have killed him to have compared him to someone like Kesler or just to no one at all. Just talk up his positives and gives the fans a reason to like the pick.

 

[Dotter]

You would think people would learn flashy stickhandling on youtube isnt what makes a player effective

Exactly. I remember Tomas Jurco had a viral YouTube video of something cute back when he was like 13 years old and people acted like he was the next coming of Datsuyk. Then hated the Bertuzzi pick a few years later.

I learned a long time ago to take peoples' opinion with a tiny grain of salt. Everyone talks out of their asses.

Statistically Cleveland won't develop into anything. But that doesn't make this a bad pick. His upside offers something unique. I'll take this choice over another redundant Jurco or Frk.

 

[heyfolks]

Exactly what I came away thinking when I watched both of those videos. Like the level of hate compared to what was shown in those videos are outrageous. Now I feel like I'm on some crusade and his biggest believer just because I'm saying maybe hes not the worst pick of all time and people should pump the brakes.

He had dmen 3-5 years older than him that he was competing with for ice time, dealing with an injury, combined with the advanced analytics looking solid, and those videos where he looks solid and the people spewing the crazy vitriol about him look kinda silly.

He definitely looks like a guy that extra time college provides will be needed, and definitely has parts of his game to clean up... but you can see why the wings thought he was enticing as well

<<<<<<< note avatar, and then pump the brakes. HAHA

 

[13to40]

Exactly. I remember Tomas Jurco had a viral YouTube video of something cute back when he was like 13 years old and people acted like he was the next coming of Datsuyk. Then hated the Bertuzzi pick a few years later.

I learned a long time ago to take peoples' opinion with a tiny grain of salt. Everyone talks out of their asses.

Statistically Cleveland won't develop into anything. But that doesn't make this a bad pick. His upside offers something unique. I'll take this choice over another redundant Jurco or Frk

Most people disliking this pick are stat watching and thinking he was picked for some kind of hidden offensive talent.

This is a kid who can develop into one mean SOB to play against. A goon #6 who nobody will want to match up against.

Gudas esque.

He is definitely a project type player and will need a long time to ripen and become a true pro, but it’s an exciting pick for a type of player that this team desperately needs NOW and going into the future.

 

[SCD]

People bitch all the time about the Wings needing to get tougher. Unfortunately, they expect the tough guy to be a 30 goal scorer. Don't blame the athlete for where he was chosen. Lets see where he is in 4 years.

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

Most people disliking this pick are stat watching and thinking he was picked for some kind of hidden offensive talent.

This is a kid who can develop into one mean SOB to play against. A goon #6 who nobody will want to match up against.

Gudas esque.

He is definitely a project type player and will need a long time to ripen and become a true pro, but it’s an exciting pick for a type of player that this team desperately needs NOW and going into the future.

Wings had a ton of picks and had already landed the guys they wanted. They figured they could waste a mid-2nd on the 1% chance this guy works out.

Picks past 40 aren't worth getting upset about.

 

[lilidk]

Good old HFB strawman. I'd like to see you quote one person that said they'd be available in free agency. The issue was that Bert and Cleveland were picked in the second round of deep draft classes. Many felt they'd be available in 3rd or later rounds.

Mazur was a 3rd round pick in a meh draft class. Only a couple of people complained, though one was very vocal. I'd be more enthusiastic about Mazur if he could bulk up this summer and be a bottom 6 player with some grit.

Oh , it was a lot of complaining about Mazur, based on Draper connection