World Cup: 2024 World Cup - rosters

[centipede2233]

Well, that's not at all what I said, and I've been pretty vocal in this thread or the other similar thread about Canada's lack of goal scoring wingers . You mentioned Stamkos as likely not being a factor in 2024...but he could very well be a big factor in 2024, both in terms of his one-touch scoring ability (especially on the power play) and his faceoff capability/defensive play. Stamkos is still a good triggerman.

So I like to look at the past in order to predict the future.
2010 Team Canada olympics:
top goal scorers

D.Heatley (28 yrs old)
J.Iginla (32 yrs old)
S.Crosby (22 yrs old)
C.Perry (24 yrs old)

2014 Team Canada Olympics

Only 2 forwards scored 2 goals or more, Jeff carter (28 yrs old) and Jaimie Benn (24 yrs old)

Not convinced?

2016 World Cup of hockey

Top Team Canada goal scorers
Crosby (28 yrs old)
Bergeron (30)
Marchand (28)
Toews (27)

Its a young man’s game. Not one 34 yr old on the last 3 best on best team Canada teams had a 34 yr old as one of their leading goal scorers.

 

[ORRFForever]

So I like to look at the past in order to predict the future.
2010 Team Canada olympics:
top goal scorers

D.Heatley (28 yrs old)
J.Iginla (32 yrs old)
S.Crosby (22 yrs old)
C.Perry (24 yrs old)

2014 Team Canada Olympics

Only 2 forwards scored 2 goals or more, Jeff carter (28 yrs old) and Jaimie Benn (24 yrs old)

Not convinced?

2016 World Cup of hockey

Top Team Canada goal scorers
Crosby (28 yrs old)
Bergeron (30)
Marchand (28)
Toews (27)

Its a young man’s game. Not one 34 yr old on the last 3 best on best team Canada teams had a 34 yr old as one of their leading goal scorers.

It is what it is, C.

All we can do is hope that some young Canadian players step up in the next 18 months and the older players make up for their lack of speed / goal scoring thru back checking, face off percentages and experience / playing smart / being clutch.

Any team that includes the Tkachuk brothers is far from perfect, so don't worry too much about the U.S. - maybe they run into a HOT goalie and get knocked out.

 

[ORRFForever]

So I like to look at the past in order to predict the future.
2010 Team Canada olympics:
top goal scorers

D.Heatley (28 yrs old)
J.Iginla (32 yrs old)
S.Crosby (22 yrs old)
C.Perry (24 yrs old)

2014 Team Canada Olympics

Only 2 forwards scored 2 goals or more, Jeff carter (28 yrs old) and Jaimie Benn (24 yrs old)

Not convinced?

2016 World Cup of hockey

Top Team Canada goal scorers
Crosby (28 yrs old)
Bergeron (30)
Marchand (28)
Toews (27)

Its a young man’s game. Not one 34 yr old on the last 3 best on best team Canada teams had a 34 yr old as one of their leading goal scorers.

Our first 2 lines are not old. It's the bottom 2 that worry me.

 

[Jukurit]

I really really wanna see that legendary 2016 WJC Puljujärvi-Aho-Laine line reunited at some point. Maybe next World Cup?

 

[illone84]

I really really wanna see that legendary 2016 WJC Puljujärvi-Aho-Laine line reunited at some point. Maybe next World Cup?

just missing Laine! Seabass looking jacked lol

 

[Miro4Norris]

Kotkaniemi and Armia wont probably even be on the team. You have the lineup quite wrong IMO. Hintz is a C too btw and play as such in Dallas. Kakko will for sure progress in 2yrs and will be a Top6 player by then. Heinola is progressing nicely and will probably also make our D.

Laine - Barkov - Rantanen
Teräväinen - Aho - Kakko
Granlund - Hintz - Puljujärvi/Kapanen
Lehkonen - Lundell - Puljujärvi/Kapanen

Lindell - Heiskanen
Mikkola - Ristolainen
Heinola - Hakanpää

So you think Kotkaniemi won't develop? He's 22(?) and projected to be Canes 2nd line center next year. Armia's roster spot wouldn't even be questioned without bad last year but I bet he bounces back.

Yes I know Hintz is center but I don't think Lundell should be wasted on 4th line so one of them or Aho should play on the wing imo, Hintz seems better on a wing than Lundell.

I hope Heinola can break it but rn he can't even make it on bad Jets defense, you think that in a year he will be better than Jokiharju who have played top-4 minutes since his rookie season and 1st-pairing minutes last season? I know it's Buffalo (and Chicago) but Jets d isn't much better.

 

[namttebih]

That's why I hate the NHL.

This league is too imperialistic and hurts ice hockey.

Rather than leaving a window for the IIHF to organize world championships in September, the NHL is looking to crush.

Nope. The IIHF likes their championship in the spring. God forbid the North American teams can ice their best team possible. It's just not fair to the Germans and Swiss of the world. Every country deserves a chance to look like champions. Who doesn't want to see a second best on best tournament?

gO yUrP

 

[NordiquesForeva]

So I like to look at the past in order to predict the future.
2010 Team Canada olympics:
top goal scorers

D.Heatley (28 yrs old)
J.Iginla (32 yrs old)
S.Crosby (22 yrs old)
C.Perry (24 yrs old)

2014 Team Canada Olympics

Only 2 forwards scored 2 goals or more, Jeff carter (28 yrs old) and Jaimie Benn (24 yrs old)

Not convinced?

2016 World Cup of hockey

Top Team Canada goal scorers
Crosby (28 yrs old)
Bergeron (30)
Marchand (28)
Toews (27)

Its a young man’s game. Not one 34 yr old on the last 3 best on best team Canada teams had a 34 yr old as one of their leading goal scorers.

Again though, I agree with you that we lack goal scoring ability and depth, relative to recent tournaments and even relative to the U.S. I'm not arguing with that. My view is that the defense is not on par with 2010 or 2014 either, Makar notwithstanding (you could say that both Doughty and Keith were near Makar's level in those tournaments, and Weber wasn't that far behind when it comes to his superb international play). I'll also say that, even with the scoring depth we had in 2014, we barely beat Latvia 2-1 and needed to pitch the hockey equivalent of a perfect game to beat the U.S. in the semifinals.

But, those facts won't be lost on the management team that selects the roster, or the coaching staff that puts the players on the ice. We'll adapt. Goaltending gives me the most serious concern, but personally I have no concerns around the forwards or defense. The roster may not look as strong on paper as it did in recent tournaments, but it'll be strong and perhaps even more oriented to tighter checking and defensive play to mitigate the weaker goaltending. Someone like MacKinnon may get moved to the wing, we'll almost certainly see a younger player step-up their game this fall, etc, etc. I'm not worried. We'll probably go into the tournament as co-favourites with the U.S., and if they pull off a win, c'est la vie.

 

[ORRFForever]

But, those facts won't be lost on the management team that selects the roster, or the coaching staff that puts the players on the ice. We'll adapt. Goaltending gives me the most serious concern, but personally I have no concerns around the forwards or defense. The roster may not look as strong on paper as it did in recent tournaments, but it'll be strong and perhaps even more oriented to tighter checking and defensive play to mitigate the weaker goaltending. Someone like MacKinnon may get moved to the wing, we'll almost certainly see a younger player step-up their game this fall, etc, etc. I'm not worried. We'll probably go into the tournament as co-favourites with the U.S., and if they pull off a win, c'est la vie.

^^ Great paragraph. ^^ Agree, 100%.

In the last 20 years, Canada has been blessed. We produced a generation of players that were unbeatable.

Unfortunately, we've come down to earth and we'll have to live with that uncertainty in 2024.

Fortunately, the NEXT generation of GREAT players are (hopefully) on their way.

 

[Belloco]

Nope. The IIHF likes their championship in the spring. God forbid the North American teams can ice their best team possible. It's just not fair to the Germans and Swiss of the world. Every country deserves a chance to look like champions. Who doesn't want to see a second best on best tournament?

gO yUrP

World competitions are completely devalued because of the NHL. The KHL actively participates in promoting IIHF competitions, for example. If the NHL cooperated fully with the IIHF rather than seeking to crush other institutions, the world championships would have another significance.

Just the fact that the NHL organizes a World Cup under its organization demonstrates the imperialism of the NHL.

North American private leagues are killing international competition in Basket and Hockey. In team sports (Soccer, Rugby, Handball, Volleyball) there are real international competitions, organized by an international federation with the best players.

Professional hockey should be under the control of the IIHF. Not from the NHL.

 

[JackSlater]

World competitions are completely devalued because of the NHL. The KHL actively participates in promoting IIHF competitions, for example. If the NHL cooperated fully with the IIHF rather than seeking to crush other institutions, the world championships would have another significance.

Just the fact that the NHL organizes a World Cup under its organization demonstrates the imperialism of the NHL.

North American private leagues are killing international competition in Basket and Hockey. In team sports (Soccer, Rugby, Handball, Volleyball) there are real international competitions, organized by an international federation with the best players.

Professional hockey should be under the control of the IIHF. Not from the NHL.

Why would professional hockey be under the control of the IIHF? The IIHF went out of its way to antagonize professional hockey for decades, which is clearly a significant factor in terms of the state of international hockey. The IIHF devalued its own tournament for decades by not allowing professionals, to say nothing of the pseudo amateurs that also played for some time.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

^^ Great paragraph. ^^ Agree, 100%.

In the last 20 years, Canada has been blessed. We produced a generation of players that were unbeatable.

Unfortunately, we've come down to earth and we'll have to live with that uncertainty in 2024.

Fortunately, the NEXT generation of GREAT players are (hopefully) on their way.

2018 and 2022 OGs were squandered opportunities for Canada to compete for best-on-best golds with an incredibly strong nucleus.

 

[Belloco]

Why would professional hockey be under the control of the IIHF? The IIHF went out of its way to antagonize professional hockey for decades, which is clearly a significant factor in terms of the state of international hockey. The IIHF devalued its own tournament for decades by not allowing professionals, to say nothing of the pseudo amateurs that also played for some time.

These things are very old. It's been since 1977 that the IIHF has created a total opening for professional players.

NHL imperialism is much more recent. The absence of elite players at the Olympic Games is due to the NHL.

This World Cup is only legitimized by the fact that the NHL did not send teams to the Olympic Games.

In contemporary hockey, it is clearly the NHL that prevents players from competing in international competitions.

 

[JackSlater]

These things are very old. It's been since 1977 that the IIHF has created a total opening for professional players.

NHL imperialism is much more recent. The absence of elite players at the Olympic Games is due to the NHL.

This World Cup is only legitimized by the fact that the NHL did not send teams to the Olympic Games.

In contemporary hockey, it is clearly the NHL that prevents players from competing in international competitions.

Yeah they are old. Unfortunately the IIHF f***ed up for over half a century and the situation was set where the NHL's fanbase doesn't really care about NHLers going to what is still viewed as a second rate tournament. There is no reasonable way for the IIHF to fix its word championship problem, and the NHL has no incentive to do anything to assist the tournament. The IOC is a further factor that works against NHLers in the Olympics, notably in 2018, though at least the players themselves want to go and can force the issue somewhat.

In no world should the IIHF be "in control" of professional hockey, and most of the IIHF's problems regarding professionals stem from its own half century of idiocy.

 

[Belloco]

Yeah they are old. Unfortunately the IIHF f***ed up for over half a century and the situation was set where the NHL's fanbase doesn't really care about NHLers going to what is still viewed as a second rate tournament. There is no reasonable way for the IIHF to fix its word championship problem, and the NHL has no incentive to do anything to assist the tournament. The IOC is a further factor that works against NHLers in the Olympics, notably in 2018, though at least the players themselves want to go and can force the issue somewhat.

In no world should the IIHF be "in control" of professional hockey, and most of the IIHF's problems regarding professionals stem from its own half century of idiocy.

During this very old period, the NHL was'nt much. Listening to you, it's the fault of others, never of the NHL.

Yet IIHF also organizes U20 and U18 tournaments and who disrespects these tournaments by blocking best players ? NHL System. Strangely, IIHF and KHL and other European leagues have no cooperation problem and in other sports where there is no North American private league, everything is going well.

The NHL does n't respect other competitions by preventing players from playing for their federation. European leagues don't do that. Even in soccer.

The idiocy comes from the NHL because without its imperialism, hockey would have more visibility in the world.

The league is clearly closed to the idea of the existence of prestigious international tournaments that are not under its domination.

 

[JackSlater]

During this very old period, the NHL was'nt much.

Listening to you, it's the fault of others, never of the NHL.

Yet IIHF also organizes U20 and U18 tournaments and who disrespects these tournaments by blocking players ? NHL System. Strangely, IIHF and KHL and other European leagues have no cooperation problem.

The NHL does n't respect other competitions.

The idiocy comes from the NHL because without its imperialism, hockey would have more visibility in the world.

The league is clearly closed to the idea of the existence of prestigious international tournaments that are not under its domination.

Strangely in other sports where there is no North American private league, everything is going well. No cohabitation problem.

The NHL was by far the best hockey league in the world during that span, not something that "was'nt much". As in, the NHL had all of the world's best players for most of that span and yet the IIHF stupidly organized a tournament, called it the world championship, and banned professionals.

The NHL takes a big part of the blame for the players not going to the 2018 and 2022 Olympics. The NHL takes almost all of the blame for the 2016 World Cup tournament being a joke. Other than that there isn't much to say. The NHL allows players who are available to play in the IIHF world championship. It is unreasonable to expect the NHL to chance its schedule to accommodate a tournament that its customers by and large don't care about, which again is largely due to the stupidity of the IIHF. NHL teams can choose to release players for the WJC if they wish, and honestly the NHL indirectly has made the tournament more competitive for most of the tournament's history. The NHL has nothing to do with the U18 tournament so I have no idea why you mentioned it.

I couldn't care less what happens in other sports. The issues with hockey that you try to conveniently ignore are very old and when it comes to things like the IIHF world championship there is no reasonable solution from either side. The IIHF created a poor situation and to its credit it has taken steps to rectify the problem, but there is no fixing it when it comes to the world championship tournament. I would prefer the NHL owners to stop f***ing around with the Olympic tournament and just release all players for two weeks every four years but I'm not going to cry about NHL imperialism if it doesn't happen and I also won't ignore other big factors like history and the IOC.

 

[Belloco]

The NHL was by far the best hockey league in the world during that span, not something that "was'nt much". As in, the NHL had all of the world's best players for most of that span and yet the IIHF stupidly organized a tournament, called it the world championship, and banned professionals.

The NHL takes a big part of the blame for the players not going to the 2018 and 2022 Olympics. The NHL takes almost all of the blame for the 2016 World Cup tournament being a joke. Other than that there isn't much to say. The NHL allows players who are available to play in the IIHF world championship. It is unreasonable to expect the NHL to chance its schedule to accommodate a tournament that its customers by and large don't care about, which again is largely due to the stupidity of the IIHF. NHL teams can choose to release players for the WJC if they wish, and honestly the NHL indirectly has made the tournament more competitive for most of the tournament's history. The NHL has nothing to do with the U18 tournament so I have no idea why you mentioned it.

I couldn't care less what happens in other sports. The issues with hockey that you try to conveniently ignore are very old and when it comes to things like the IIHF world championship there is no reasonable solution from either side. The IIHF created a poor situation and to its credit it has taken steps to rectify the problem, but there is no fixing it when it comes to the world championship tournament. I would prefer the NHL owners to stop f***ing around with the Olympic tournament and just release all players for two weeks every four years but I'm not going to cry about NHL imperialism if it doesn't happen and I also won't ignore other big factors like history and the IOC.

A league of 6 teams until 1967 without any visibility in the world. Hockey did not develop in Europe thanks to the NHL but thanks to the international federations. Without them, there would still be an NHL made up entirely of North American players. There was still, during this time, the persistence of an idea that the sport should remain amateur and it could (should?) have been the case. But that in no way explains the current situation.

The reason why players playing in North America are regularly blocked today is not related to this very old precedent. The NHL is the only league to finish in June. Players are regularly discouraged from participating in IIHF tournaments. Even during the WJC, NHL prospects are forced to play low-stakes regular season games rather than representing their country.

The CHL is a satellite of the NHL and is a private league. And the CHL is blocking the development of the U18 tournament. Look at Team Canada. It's 100% the CHL's fault.

Even a guy like Mesar couldn't play for his country because he was forced to go to summer camp. When he has no chance. Just because in the spirit of an NHL franchise, the player has to focus only for his team. As little as possible for his federation and only when the franchise thinks it sees a personal interest in it. So very rarely.

In Soccer, Rugby, Volleyball and Handball, European leagues systematically release their players for international competitions. Systematically.

The NBA and NHL are the only leagues to block players. It requires a grueling fight to gain access for their players.

The expansion of hockey goes through international hockey. Not by the NHL. And international hockey needs the NHL to agree to let other competitions exist rather than trying to crush them.

Things must change. If hockey really wants to diversify, the NHL must invest massive support in the federations. Something it doesn't do.

 

[JackSlater]

A league of 6 teams until 1967 without any visibility in the world. Hockey did not develop in Europe thanks to the NHL but thanks to the international federations. Without them, there would still be an NHL made up entirely of North American players. There was still, during this time, the persistence of an idea that the sport should remain amateur and it could (should?) have been the case. But that in no way explains the current situation.

The reason why players playing in North America are regularly blocked today is not related to this very old precedent. The NHL is the only league to finish in June. Players are regularly discouraged from participating in IIHF tournaments. Even during the WJC, NHL prospects are forced to play low-stakes regular season games rather than representing their country.

The CHL is a satellite of the NHL and is a private league. And the CHL is blocking the development of the U18 tournament. Look at Team Canada. It's 100% the CHL's fault.

Even a guy like Mesar couldn't play for his country because he was forced to go to summer camp. When he has no chance. Just because in the spirit of an NHL franchise, the player has to focus only for his team. As little as possible for his federation and only when the franchise thinks it sees a personal interest in it. So very rarely.

In Soccer, Rugby, Volleyball and Handball, European leagues systematically release their players for international competitions. Systematically.

The NBA and NHL are the only leagues to block players. It requires a grueling fight to gain access for their players.

The expansion of hockey goes through international hockey. Not by the NHL. And international hockey needs the NHL to agree to let other competitions exist rather than trying to crush them.

Things must change. If hockey really wants to diversify, the NHL must invest massive support in the federations. Something it doesn't do.

The typical Euro-centric post. The NHL has absolutely no reason to change its schedule to suit the IIHF's tournament schedule just like the CHL has no reason to change its schedule to support the IIHF U18 tournament. NHL and CHL fans do not want those changes, and a significant part of the reason is the actions of the IIHF dating back nearly a century ago. It's a lost cause. The NHL does not stop players from participating in IIHF tournaments provided their team is not active, and that's enough. The CHL does release players for the WJC, but obviously doesn't during its playoffs.

The IIHF organized its tournament stupidly by banning professionals and eventually taking an antagonistic approach to the NHL. Consequently there is little appetite for the IIHF world championships in Canada or the USA, particularly if it were to come at the expense of NHL hockey. Thus we have a situation where the NHL does not consider what the IIHF wants and more importantly has little to no incentive to do so. Whether other leagues in other sports are subservient to international governing bodies does not impact the situation for the NHL.

There is no reason that a very successful business like the NHL should alter its schedule to suit the IIHF when its fans do not even want that to happen.

 

[JackSlater]

2018 and 2022 OGs were squandered opportunities for Canada to compete for best-on-best golds with an incredibly strong nucleus.

I think that Canada 2018 would have been a huge favourite compared to any other country, as in Canada vs the field would be a good question. I don't think that would have been nearly the case in 2022. Countries like USA and Finland have never been closer to Canada in terms of roster quality. Definitely opportunities lost though.

 

[centipede2233]

I think that Canada 2018 would have been a huge favourite compared to any other country, as in Canada vs the field would be a good question. I don't think that would have been nearly the case in 2022. Countries like USA and Finland have never been closer to Canada in terms of roster quality. Definitely opportunities lost though.

Totally agree, 2018 Canada still had a 31 yr old Crosby, Marchand and Bergeron still elite, Weber and doughty at the top of there game. And matthews, eichel, tkachuks and most of the American kids still teenagers. 2022 would of been a different story.

You know who I think has a legitimate shot to make team Canada is E.Kane. A goal scoring power forward, that’s team Canada’s M.O. also playing with mcdavid and Holland picking the team, if Kane is still a 30 goal plus player and has no off ice antics, he’s a favourite to be on mcdavids wing in 2024

 

[ORRFForever]

You know who I think has a legitimate shot to make team Canada is E.Kane. A goal scoring power forward, that’s team Canada’s M.O. also playing with mcdavid and Holland picking the team, if Kane is still a 30 goal plus player and has no off ice antics, he’s a favourite to be on mcdavids wing in 2024

If we're going to include someone with an edge, I prefer Kadri.

 

[JackSlater]

Totally agree, 2018 Canada still had a 31 yr old Crosby, Marchand and Bergeron still elite, Weber and doughty at the top of there game. And matthews, eichel, tkachuks and most of the American kids still teenagers. 2022 would of been a different story.

You know who I think has a legitimate shot to make team Canada is E.Kane. A goal scoring power forward, that’s team Canada’s M.O. also playing with mcdavid and Holland picking the team, if Kane is still a 30 goal plus player and has no off ice antics, he’s a favourite to be on mcdavids wing in 2024

I think that three of the top four finishers in Hart voting would have ended up as bottom six forwards on Canada 2018. Potentially a ridiculous forward group with a very strong defence and Price still available. NHL and IOC made sure that never happened though.

 

[Zero Pucks Given]

I think that three of the top four finishers in Hart voting would have ended up as bottom six forwards on Canada 2018. Potentially a ridiculous forward group with a very strong defence and Price still available. NHL and IOC made sure that never happened though.

Very likely would've been the first Olympic 3-peat since the Soviets back in the day

 

[centipede2233]

If we're going to include someone with an edge, I prefer Kadri.

Kadri isn’t playing for Holland who picks the team and isn’t a natural goal scoring winger currently playing with mcdavid on an nhl team….

 

[ORRFForever]

Kadri isn’t playing for Holland who picks the team and isn’t a natural goal scoring winger currently playing with mcdavid on an nhl team….

Fair enough but, again, if I was picking the team, Kadri is a much better player.