World Cup: 2024 World Cup - rosters

[Gold Standard]

So here is another one.. that cast of friends today is older than the cast of golden girls in season 1.

I think you got some bad pop trivia there. Where did you get that info?

Most of the cast of Golden Girls (3 of the 4) were born in 1922 and 1923.

Season 1 of Golden Girls was in 1985. That would have made them 63 or 62 years old in 1985.

None of the cast of Friends today (6) are older than 59. Lisa Kudrow.

 

[Silky Johnson]

Will Russia be able to compete? It’s not an IOC event

If Russia plays I boycott. That is assuming Putin is still breathing.

 

[Silky Johnson]

It would be great, if Russia could play there again. Personally, I would welcome it, as long as the following happens:

1. They stop what they’re doing
2. They return the state of affairs to how they were before they started doing what they are doing (2014).
3. They pay massive reparations for what they are doing
4. They deliver all those responsible for what they are doing to justice

If all that is true, I would start considering bringing them back. Gonna keep my fingers crossed.

Otherwise, I would bring Canada, US, Finland, Sweden, Czechs, Germans, Swiss and Slovaks. 8 teams. I would’t mind Denmark or Latvia either, but can live without them.

Best post of the thread.

 

[Silky Johnson]

That's why I hate the NHL.

This league is too imperialistic and hurts ice hockey.

Rather than leaving a window for the IIHF to organize world championships in September, the NHL is looking to crush.

I hate the IIHF.

They are useless and it hurts hockey.

I'm glad the NHL exists to organise a February World Cup. Hopefully this will be every 4 years in addition to NHL Olympic participation. Hopefully it will crush the stupid and useless IIHF World Championships.

Edit. If we could get a Euro Cup + Canada - USA Superseries in odd years all would be right in hockey. No need for the shitty World Championships at all.

 

[Silky Johnson]

World competitions are completely devalued because of the NHL. The KHL actively participates in promoting IIHF competitions, for example. If the NHL cooperated fully with the IIHF rather than seeking to crush other institutions, the world championships would have another significance.

Just the fact that the NHL organizes a World Cup under its organization demonstrates the imperialism of the NHL.

North American private leagues are killing international competition in Basket and Hockey. In team sports (Soccer, Rugby, Handball, Volleyball) there are real international competitions, organized by an international federation with the best players.

Professional hockey should be under the control of the IIHF. Not from the NHL.

Why should it be?

It should be under control of the people who can put together the best tournaments. NHLPA and NHL are those people. At least this group represents the best players who actually play in these games...

 

[JackSlater]

Discussed...so players are not automatically freed as I say.

And in general, NHL franchises rarely back down. In fact, only prospects and deep players are allowed to go there. In addition, the world championships take place during the playoffs. IIHF had to postpone the competition for two months to be able to exist.

One example among hundreds of others, the first one i took : the Sedin brothers. In 18 years in Vancouver, they have only been able to participate twice : the first during their rookie season, the second in 2013, during the half-season. When they played for Modo, they were systematically released. Yet the Sedin brothers were very motivated to play with Sweden and join the Triple Gold Club.

For the Olympic tournaments, we can also see that it is very complicated to obtain the release of NHL players.

No international competition bringing together all NHL players for 1 decade. Blame the NHL system.

There are obvious reasons that prevent this : the imperialism of the NHL which wants to crush hockey with all its weight to the detriment of other institutions.

What are you talking about? It is explicitly listed in the CBA - which is a legal document. I provided the document for you and told you where the rules are outlined. You can read it yourself.

And again, I want the players who were intimidated and prevented from going regularly when available according to the rules. Not your fictional accounts of things or assumptions after you refuse to read the document in question, but actual examples.

 

[JackSlater]

Ahearne didn't really have a chance, hockey's position as an Olympic sport was non-negotiable and Brundage wasn't ready to accept any professional involvement. The only thing he realistically could have done differently is oppose the 1969 compromise to start with, but I wouldn't fault him for trying.

I don't blame the IIHF for NHLers being banned from the Olympics until 1988.

 

[Gold Standard]

What are you talking about? It is explicitly listed in the CBA - which is a legal document. I provided the document for you and told you where the rules are outlined. You can read it yourself.

And again, I want the players who were intimidated and prevented from going regularly when available according to the rules. Not your fictional accounts of things or assumptions after you refuse to read the document in question, but actual examples.

I always admire your patience in dealing with the daily load of hf nonsense. You've been blessed with more patience than I can muster.

 

[Belloco]

I hate the IIHF.

They are useless and it hurts hockey.

I'm glad the NHL exists to organise a February World Cup. Hopefully this will be every 4 years in addition to NHL Olympic participation. Hopefully it will crush the stupid and useless IIHF World Championships.

Edit. If we could get a Euro Cup + Canada - USA Superseries in odd years all would be right in hockey. No need for the shitty World Championships at all.

Yes, so you defend the model of a private league that monopolizes everything.

For which significant events ? Apart from the playoffs, the NHL does n't organize anything exciting.

The event that arouses the most enthusiasm from July to April is the U20 tournament. Organized by IIHF.

 

[SanDogBrewin]

Yes, so you defend the model of a private league that monopolizes everything.

For which significant events ? Apart from the playoffs, the NHL does n't organize anything exciting.

The event that arouses the most enthusiasm from July to April is the U20 tournament. Organized by IIHF.

That enthusiasm was helped by North American hockey networks, that cover the NHL, and the NHL itself. Big reason its a hot tournament in North America. IIHF should not be the only entity that can hold international tournaments. Never heard of hockey fans complaining about the old Canada Cup.

 

[Belloco]

What are you talking about? It is explicitly listed in the CBA - which is a legal document. I provided the document for you and told you where the rules are outlined. You can read it yourself.

And again, I want the players who were intimidated and prevented from going regularly when available according to the rules. Not your fictional accounts of things or assumptions after you refuse to read the document in question, but actual examples.

Examples have already been cited. Tony Parker has talked about it often in his NBA podcasts. Listen to NHL players speak during podcasts.

The players are not free of their program.

Once again, I tell you that the agreement does not guarantee the release of the players. They have to negotiate and it's very difficult because the franchises block participation at the slightest pretext.

In fact, NHL players are not available for their federation. There is no allocated time slot like Soccer, Rugby, Handball or Volleyball.

We have two irreconcilable points of view.

You think that players are free to be able to play in selection and that their absence shows a deep disinterest in IIHF competitions because they suck.

I think that NHL players are blocked all year by an NHL program that does not share the calendar with other institutions to monopolize hockey.

Only two internationalized team sports have trouble organizing international competitions with the best players: hockey and basketball.

If we followed the logic of economic imperialism that you defend you'll get none Football or Rugby World Cup with the best players in the world. Two sports indefinitely more popular than hockey which have understood very well that international competitions were the main showcase for their sport. There is full cooperation between clubs, leagues, national and continental federations and FIFA.

 

[Belloco]

That enthusiasm was helped by North American hockey networks, that cover the NHL, and the NHL itself. Big reason its a hot tournament in North America. IIHF should not be the only entity that can hold international tournaments. Never heard of hockey fans complaining about the old Canada Cup.

In all other sports, including hockey, world competition is organized by an international federation.

That's what I blame: the NHL takes the work of other institutions.

NBA and NHL put FIBA and IIHF in difficulty.

Coincidentally, it is in these two sports that international competitions are the most neglected.

 

[Silky Johnson]

Yes, so you defend the model of a private league that monopolizes everything.

For which significant events ? Apart from the playoffs, the NHL does n't organize anything exciting.

The event that arouses the most enthusiasm from July to April is the U20 tournament. Organized by IIHF.

... Other then the playoffs? Yeah, the most important and compelling hockey event each and every year? Yeah, just that. Oh, and the NHL season, which rules.

There is a reason that the NHL generates the majority of hockey revenue in the world. Its product is the best. Its also the reason why it has all the best players under contract.

The NHLPA actually gives the PLAYERS a voice, something the IIHF doesn't do, and they with the NHL have the ability to put on the best competition in the hockey world. They are proposing to do so with the WC at the same time as allowing NHL participation at the Olympics. What are you bitching about?

You talk about cultural imperialism but that is horseshit. Its a for profit organisation and their employees representatives working together in their mutual benefit. This currently includes Olympic participation and another great best on best. What else do you want?

I would much rather have the players and the best hockey promotion in the world driving the bus them bunch of incompetent &/or impotent sports beaurocrats.

And your crap about the IIHF and the spirit of amatuer sports...give me a break.

 

[Belloco]

... Other then the playoffs? Yeah, the most important and compelling hockey event each and every year? Yeah, just that. Oh, and the NHL season, which rules.

There is a reason that the NHL generates the majority of hockey revenue in the world. Its product is the best. Its also the reason why it has all the best players under contract.

The NHLPA actually gives the PLAYERS a voice, something the IIHF doesn't do, and they with the NHL have the ability to put on the best competition in the hockey world. They are proposing to do so with the WC at the same time as allowing NHL participation at the Olympics. What are you bitching about?

You talk about cultural imperialism but that is horseshit. Its a for profit organisation and their employees representatives working together in their mutual benefit. This currently includes Olympic participation and another great best on best. What else do you want?

I would much rather have the players and the best hockey promotion in the world driving the bus them bunch of incompetent &/or impotent sports beaurocrats.

And your crap about the IIHF and the spirit of amatuer sports...give me a break.

I speak only in my name but it shows a lot on this site : many hockey fans watch many other competitions than the NHL. The regular season is extremely long and boring.

It's not about the product. It's a question of financial strength. If financial power moves elsewhere, the NHL loses its monopoly.

When I see the passion for international competitions U18 and U20, 10 years without major events among seniors, impressive waste. Thanks NHL.

I don't understand that guys defend an absence of event. Because concretely NHL has never done anything more than a week of exhibitions every 10 years.

 

[Silky Johnson]

I speak only in my name but it shows a lot on this site : many hockey fans watch many other competitions than the NHL. The regular season is extremely long and boring.

It's not about the product. It's a question of financial strength. If financial power moves elsewhere, the NHL loses its monopoly.

When I see the passion for international competitions U18 and U20, 10 years without major events among seniors, impressive waste. Thanks NHL.

I don't understand that guys defend an absence of event. Because concretely NHL has never done anything more than a week of exhibitions every 10 years.

If you find the NHL season long and boring that's fine but you are in a minority. Its a great product and is BY FAR the most successful product in hockey. That is objective fact.

Most NA fans like both NHL and Best on Best international hockey, but care the most about the Stanley Cup.

Last Olympics was lost due to covid. That was an NHL and NHLPA co decision.

For the rest of the problems in international hockey, blame the IiHF. It is their job to promote the international game. If they cannot create conditions (insurance, rights & revenue) favourable to having the most important league and players participate, that's on them.

The NHLPA & NHL are responding to fans by agreeing to participate in the Olympics and now a well conceived World Cup...AWESOME. Even though it is not their job they can get it done. Incompetent/impotent IIHF, not so much.

You not commenting on the lack of player input in international hockey does not go unnoticed. Maybe its one of the reasons why the IIHF is antiquated.

 

[Albatros]

I don't blame the IIHF for NHLers being banned from the Olympics until 1988.

Can you blame the IIHF for not wanting to be banned from the Olympics in the decades before? After all they changed the policy about as soon as it was politically realistic to do so.

 

[JackSlater]

Examples have already been cited. Tony Parker has talked about it often in his NBA podcasts. Listen to NHL players speak during podcasts.

The players are not free of their program.

Once again, I tell you that the agreement does not guarantee the release of the players. They have to negotiate and it's very difficult because the franchises block participation at the slightest pretext.

In fact, NHL players are not available for their federation. There is no allocated time slot like Soccer, Rugby, Handball or Volleyball.

We have two irreconcilable points of view.

You think that players are free to be able to play in selection and that their absence shows a deep disinterest in IIHF competitions because they suck.

I think that NHL players are blocked all year by an NHL program that does not share the calendar with other institutions to monopolize hockey.

Only two internationalized team sports have trouble organizing international competitions with the best players: hockey and basketball.

If we followed the logic of economic imperialism that you defend you'll get none Football or Rugby World Cup with the best players in the world. Two sports indefinitely more popular than hockey which have understood very well that international competitions were the main showcase for their sport. There is full cooperation between clubs, leagues, national and continental federations and FIFA.

You are lying. You have not provided examples. You lied and said that NHL players are regularly "intimidated" into not going - show when that has happened. Show the "podcasts" you are referencing. You are also lying about the agreement, because I gave you the document and it seems you have refused to even read it, instead intent on your fictional account of things.

Cite specific examples of players trying to play in the IIHF world championship and the NHL blocking them in violation of the CBA. Then give proof. Until you do that you are simply lying, or at least intentionally oblivious.

You also have no idea what I think. You don't even have an idea of the actual situation at play since most of your posts on the matter fall into the realm of fiction. But again: Cite specific examples of players trying to play in the IIHF world championship and the NHL blocking them in violation of the CBA. Then give proof. Until you do that you are simply lying, or at least intentionally oblivious.

 

[Belloco]

If you find the NHL season long and boring that's fine but you are in a minority. Its a great product and is BY FAR the most successful product in hockey. That is objective fact.

Most NA fans like both NHL and Best on Best international hockey, but care the most about the Stanley Cup.

Last Olympics was lost due to covid. That was an NHL and NHLPA co decision.

For the rest of the problems in international hockey, blame the IiHF. It is their job to promote the international game. If they cannot create conditions (insurance, rights & revenue) favourable to having the most important league and players participate, that's on them.

The NHLPA & NHL are responding to fans by agreeing to participate in the Olympics and now a well conceived World Cup...AWESOME. Even though it is not their job they can get it done. Incompetent/impotent IIHF, not so much.

You not commenting on the lack of player input in international hockey does not go unnoticed. Maybe its one of the reasons why the IIHF is antiquated.

Yet all the hockey podcasts I listen to share the same opinion.

The regular season is far too long and there are no stakes.

An international competition has the potential to be more exciting.

IIHF organizes international competitions every year. The success of the U20 tournament demonstrates the potential of international competitions.

Only there is an obstacle for IIHF competitions and it is the NHL which blocks the entire calendar. NHL players do not have easy access to international competitions.

Players are no more motivated by an NHL World Cup than an IIHF World Championship. It's just that they have no compulsion to play the World Cup.

If the NHL agreed to leave a slot at the IIHF World Championship, naturally this tournament would be valued. What works for Soccer, Rugby, Volleyball, or Handball would easily work for Hockey and Basketball.

I keep repeating the same facts over and over again.

Hockey is only for NHL.

 

[JackSlater]

Can you blame the IIHF for not wanting to be banned from the Olympics in the decades before? After all they changed the policy about as soon as it was politically realistic to do so.

I blame the IIHF for attempting to organize a world championship while banning the best players for decades, yes. I also know that once professional players started playing in the IIHF world championship nothing changed with regard to the Olympics.

 

[Belloco]

You are lying. You have not provided examples. You lied and said that NHL players are regularly "intimidated" into not going - show when that has happened. Show the "podcasts" you are referencing. You are also lying about the agreement, because I gave you the document and it seems you have refused to even read it, instead intent on your fictional account of things.

Cite specific examples of players trying to play in the IIHF world championship and the NHL blocking them in violation of the CBA. Then give proof. Until you do that you are simply lying, or at least intentionally oblivious.

You also have no idea what I think. You don't even have an idea of the actual situation at play since most of your posts on the matter fall into the realm of fiction. But again: Cite specific examples of players trying to play in the IIHF world championship and the NHL blocking them in violation of the CBA. Then give proof. Until you do that you are simply lying, or at least intentionally oblivious.

Listen big guy, I'm just telling you what Tony Parker or David Perron have said in the podcasts.

If the NHL encouraged its players to play international competitions, it would show. In fact, NHL players are absent from these events. Even Covid is a crummy excuse. The Covid was stronger in 2021 and that didn't prevent the participation of the best volleyball, handball players. KHL players were there at the Olympics

You prefer to think it's because they (players) have no interest in their country and IIHF competitions. I think it's the NHL that devalue international competitions and wants to take over hockey.

If the NHL was not imperialist, it would release players 2 weeks a year to let the World Championship live rather than imposing its own competition.

Hockey is only for NHL.

 

[Albatros]

I blame the IIHF for attempting to organize a world championship while banning the best players for decades, yes. I also know that once professional players started playing in the IIHF world championship nothing changed with regard to the Olympics.

Lord Killanin was a reasonable man and a weak IOC president whereas his predecessor Brundage made Ayatollah Khomeini seem moderate when it came to the defense of his key dogmas such as amateurism in sports.

 

[JackSlater]

Listen big guy, I'm just telling you what Tony Parker or David Perron have said in the podcasts.

If the NHL encouraged its players to play international competitions, it would show. In fact, NHL players are absent from these events. Even Covid is a crummy excuse. The Covid was stronger in 2021 and that didn't prevent the participation of the best volleyball, handball players. KHL players were there at the Olympics

You prefer to think it's because they (players) have no interest in their country and IIHF competitions. I think it's the NHL that devalue international competitions and wants to take over hockey.

If the NHL was not imperialist, it would release players 2 weeks a year to let the World Championship live rather than imposing its own competition.

Hockey is only for NHL.

Thanks buddy, now show me the podcast where Perron said that. And then show me the many other examples you must have, since you claim that it is a regular occurrence.

Again, you also don't know what my opinion is but that is beside the point. Now show that you are not lying by giving actual examples and proof for something that you claim happens regularly.

 

[Silky Johnson]

Yet all the hockey podcasts I listen to share the same opinion.

The regular season is far too long and there are no stakes.

An international competition has the potential to be more exciting.

IIHF organizes international competitions every year. The success of the U20 tournament demonstrates the potential of international competitions.

Only there is an obstacle for IIHF competitions and it is the NHL which blocks the entire calendar. NHL players do not have easy access to international competitions.

Players are no more motivated by an NHL World Cup than an IIHF World Championship. It's just that they have no compulsion to play the World Cup.

If the NHL agreed to leave a slot at the IIHF World Championship, naturally this tournament would be valued. What works for Soccer, Rugby, Volleyball, or Handball would easily work for Hockey and Basketball.

I keep repeating the same facts over and over again.

Hockey is only for NHL.

Some random comments on podcasts do not make a consensus. The NHL season is fine. It also allows for a revenue generation that allows the NHL to dononate the hockey world financially. Something the NHL, NHLPA and I are just fine with. Most fans are happy with more hockey not less.

NHL playoffs are one of the best things in sport. Perfect balance of drama and volume. One of the hardest Trophies to win.

Both are why the NHL generates more revenue then all other leagues combined and facilitating a league with all the best players. This is why the NHLPA and NHL are the most important and powerful entities in hockey.

U20 is great, U18 is as well from a hockey perspective. What made U20 so successful is TSN and the money that is generated primarily from Canada. The fact that it doesn't really interfere with the NHL made that possible.

If players cared deeply for the World Championships they could force the NHL to change the season to accommodate. You see, in the NHL the players have a very important voice unlike in the IIHF (something that you don't seem to want to comment on). The players pushed the league into Olympic participation and also agreed to suspend it due to covid.

It looks like the league and players are going to get a rotating cycle of World Cups and Olympics going every two years. If successful it will continue and could finally fix international hockey long term. NHL & NHLPA doing what the IIHF couldnt do in a hundred years even when it's the IIHF's reason for existing....

People here who value international hockey should be kissing the NHL & NHLPA's ass rather then pissing and moaning about them.

 

[Belloco]

Thanks buddy, now show me the podcast where Perron said that. And then show me the many other examples you must have, since you claim that it is a regular occurrence.

Again, you also don't know what my opinion is but that is beside the point. Now show that you are not lying by giving actual examples and proof for something that you claim happens regularly.

Podcast Rds On Jase. He comes in regularly. But it's a generally shared view of the disappointing attitude of the NHL on this point. You just have to listen to the show this year, they will surely talk about it.

Now I am not at your command and subject to you.

I posted you my opinion concerning the responsibility of the NHL in the failure of international competitions.

It remains to be seen if this 2024 World Cup will exist. 4 years ago at the same stadium, the NHL had also promised a 2020 World Cup to compensate for the last Olympic Games. It has not happened. That's all.

You can't force me to submit to your point of view so let it go.

 

[Belloco]

Some random comments on podcasts do not make a consensus. The NHL season is fine. It also allows for a revenue generation that allows the NHL to dononate the hockey world financially. Something the NHL, NHLPA and I are just fine with. Most fans are happy with more hockey not less.

NHL playoffs are one of the best things in sport. Perfect balance of drama and volume. One of the hardest Trophies to win.

Both are why the NHL generates more revenue then all other leagues combined and facilitating a league with all the best players. This is why the NHLPA and NHL are the most important and powerful entities in hockey.

U20 is great, U18 is as well from a hockey perspective. What made U20 so successful is TSN and the money that is generated primarily from Canada. The fact that it doesn't really interfere with the NHL made that possible.

If players cared deeply for the World Championships they could force the NHL to change the season to accommodate. You see, in the NHL the players have a very important voice unlike in the IIHF (something that you don't seem to want to comment on). The players pushed the league into Olympic participation and also agreed to suspend it due to covid.

It looks like the league and players are going to get a rotating cycle of World Cups and Olympics going every two years. If successful it will continue and could finally fix international hockey long term. NHL & NHLPA doing what the IIHF couldnt do in a hundred years even when it's the IIHF's reason for existing....

People here who value international hockey should be kissing the NHL & NHLPA's ass rather then pissing and moaning about them.

Random podcasts featuring former NHL players.

Players obey the NHL format because the NHL pays their salary. But that doesn't mean they're happy with everything that's going on.

The NHL generates more revenue because the North American economy dominates the world. The day China dominates, things will change and it will quickly show in Sport. Hockey will not escape this. Especially since tomorrow's hockey elite will be mainly European.