Player Discussion: 2024 Vezina Winner Connor Hellebuyck

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think some of you expect him to be superman night in night out and that's not overly fair expectations for him.

Without him, we are waiting for the lottery to see If we keep our top 5 pick or move up or down. Instead waiting for game 5.

Whenever this thread gets bumped, it's just ridiculousness that follows and some sort of pretend expert knowledge from folks who have never done it.

Without Helle, we are golfing. Waiting for Chevy to pick Fantilli

His series sample size is irrelevant, has he been great? No. Bad? No. Average? I'd agree below but without him, it's all a moot point so the goalie topic annoys me because the goalie can really only do so much but watching the game, it seems like he's made lots of unreal how did he stop it saves too tho so it's a weird one. Jets appear to give up lots of shots In close or more bang bang... Vegas crashes the net too. Jets D hasn't been good since Josh got hurt

Least of the problems

He's the guy that I sign long term if I wanna reload instead of rebuild. The other Connor is more of a problem right now

His series performance is the only thing that is relevant right now. It has not been average. It has been weak. He doesn't need to be superman every night. He does need to be superman some nights. He is supposed to be an elite goalie, one of the best in the league. He needs to be better than the career backup he is facing in this series. So far he has not been.

I'm not criticizing his lifetime play, his play with the Odessa Jackalopes, his career play or his NHL PO play. I'm criticizing his play in this series. Hope that changes tomorrow.

 

[White Out 902]

His series performance is the only thing that is relevant right now. It has not been average. It has been weak. He doesn't need to be superman every night. He does need to be superman some nights. He is supposed to be an elite goalie, one of the best in the league. He needs to be better than the career backup he is facing in this series. So far he has not been.

I'm not criticizing his lifetime play, his play with the Odessa Jackalopes, his career play or his NHL PO play. I'm criticizing his play in this series. Hope that changes tomorrow.

well said.,

 

[blueandgoldguy]

about the same as Jack Campbell and Robert Luongo. Rather underwhelming. Certainly not worth much more than his current cap hit.

Roberto Luongo is considered one of the best goalies from 2000 onwards. His career numbers were great. He will likely be a first ballot hall of famer. Helly having similar numbers is actually quite flattering.

 

[SSCBLUEJET]

My bartender says Helle is God.
And I'm on the west coast.
Cheers

 

[Guffman]

Why'd you pick Vasilevskiy? Because he's a goaltender with pedigree. Posting abject nonsense then laughing at yourself and honking doesn't give you an edge. It just highlights that you're an unserious person with an axe to grind. I want Helley to succeed and do well, because then the Jets do well. He's been a complete rollercoaster stats wise in the postseason his entire career, and his last 10 games in the playoffs have been a dumpster fire. I would have personally given the man a handjob for him to steal us a game or at least give us a quality start Monday so my kid could have enjoyed a win. You look like a fool.

You can look at every goalie making more $$$ than Hellebuyck. Most haven't been in the playoffs for awhile. Only Vasilevkiy has recent performances spanning two years.

To look at only the last 10 games opens you up to these sort of comparisons and now you're balking at that comparison for some reason.

It's too bad your measuring stick only applies to Hellebuyck for some reason.

 

[Guffman]

His series performance is the only thing that is relevant right now. It has not been average. It has been weak. He doesn't need to be superman every night. He does need to be superman some nights. He is supposed to be an elite goalie, one of the best in the league. He needs to be better than the career backup he is facing in this series. So far he has not been.

I'm not criticizing his lifetime play, his play with the Odessa Jackalopes, his career play or his NHL PO play. I'm criticizing his play in this series. Hope that changes tomorrow.

He's a goalie. Do you think he's not giving the same effort or concentration he does when he's on a win streak? It's not like a skater who we can critique about being lazy, or not being defensive oriented enough or unwilling to go in the corners for a particular game or series of games.

If you find something flawed about his mechanics, perhaps you can share what he's suddenly not doing as well.

 

[White Out 902]

You can look at every goalie making more $$$ than Hellebuyck. Most haven't been in the playoffs for awhile. Only Vasilevkiy has recent performances spanning two years.

To look at only the last 10 games opens you up to these sort of comparisons and now you're balking at that comparison for some reason.

It's too bad your measuring stick only applies to Hellebuyck for some reason.

Are you not seeing Tampas coach out there running defense for Vasilevskiy? He's getting torched so much for his awful goaltending his coach has to defend him.

This isn't a Helley thing. It's a competence and consequence thing.

 

[Guffman]

Are you not seeing Tampas coach out there running defense for Vasilevskiy? He's getting torched so much for his awful goaltending his coach has to defend him.

This isn't a Helley thing. It's a competence and consequence thing.

I’m still trying to figure out if your ”10 game playoff rule” analysis should be applied equally to all goalies or not. When I brought up Vasilevskiy, you brought up performances beyond those 10 games, which you are unwilling to do for Hellebuyck.

Perhaps you should take a few minutes to think this over and then let us know the consistent criteria we can apply to all goalies as well as your caveats (E.g., ”doesn’t count since he won a couple of Cups before that lol).

Thanks.

 

[White Out 902]

I’m still trying to figure out if your ”10 game playoff rule” analysis should be applied equally to all goalies or not. When I brought up Vasilevskiy, you brought up performances beyond those 10 games, which you are unwilling to do for Hellebuyck.

Perhaps you should take a few minutes to think this over and then let us know the consistent criteria we can apply to all goalies as well as your caveats (E.g., ”doesn’t count since he won a couple of Cups before that lol).

Thanks.

Do I need to use crayons? Even using your example of Vasilevskiy, who is a 2x Stanley Cup winning goaltender, is being eaten alive right now to the point where the TB coach had to go out and defend him and talk about how no one would be able to save his shots in the history of the NHL. Literally. No one is above criticism when its recent and relevant. You're welcome.

 

[Jets 31]

Can Helly play a little better right now? Yes, is Helly the reason we are down 3-1 in the series? absolutely not. We have too many injuries plain and simple. Some make it seem finding a A+ goalie is easy peasy when it's very, very hard. The Bruins most likely have this years Vezina winner and not only did he play shity last night he gave the puck away on the winning goal. Some on here would lose their shit if Helly had a game exactly like that in these playoffs.

 

[Guffman]

Do I need to use crayons? Even using your example of Vasilevskiy, who is a 2x Stanley Cup winning goaltender, is being eaten alive right now to the point where the TB coach had to go out and defend him and talk about how no one would be able to save his shots in the history of the NHL. Literally. No one is above criticism when its recent and relevant. You're welcome.

You should continue to use a pencil since it is a lot easier for you to erase what you previously said.

Let’s recall where this discussion started. I posted Hellebuyck’s career regular season stats (GAA and save %) and playoff stats that showed Hellebuyck’s playoff stats were actually better. This was done as a retort another poster who was incorrectly saying the opposite.

You waltz in and say look at the last 10 playoff games played.

No one was saying a goalie is beyond criticism for recent play. It doesn’t change the statistical fact that Hellebuyck is actually a bit better in the playoffs than the regular season in his career.

Maybe you just didn’t understand the discussion that was taking place or maybe you were just high on the haterade against Hellebuyck. Who knows. I should be mindful that many posters can’t follow a conversation and I therefore shouldn’t assume their posts were trying to contribute to that ongoing conversation.

 

[WpgSteve]

I'm not saying that Helle is bad or that he's the reason we are losing. I'm saying he is not an elite goaltender. I don't know how anyone who has watched this series (or the previous series against VGK for that matter) could seriously argue otherwise.

 

[tbcwpg]

I'm not saying that Helle is bad or that he's the reason we are losing. I'm saying he is not an elite goaltender. I don't know how anyone who has watched this series (or the previous series against VGK for that matter) could seriously argue otherwise.

I'd say someone watching the past 6 years of his career as opposed to defining it on 9 playoff games could seriously argue otherwise. And we could even call it 8 games because he kept Vegas to one goal until the pulled away in the 3rd of Game 1 in this series.

 

[Jet]

His series performance is the only thing that is relevant right now. It has not been average. It has been weak. He doesn't need to be superman every night. He does need to be superman some nights. He is supposed to be an elite goalie, one of the best in the league. He needs to be better than the career backup he is facing in this series. So far he has not been.

I'm not criticizing his lifetime play, his play with the Odessa Jackalopes, his career play or his NHL PO play. I'm criticizing his play in this series. Hope that changes tomorrow.

Yeah, I think this is where I land. I think the 'pro Helle' (I'd hope we're all pro Helle lol) crowd is taking offense to some of the ridiculous bashing happening and arguing against what most are saying here, which is; in this series, Hellebuyck has not played well enough, full stop.

Is he a great goalie? Yes
Has he been bad in this series? No
Has he always been bad in the playoffs? No
Has he had the type of playoffs yet that lift a team through the dips that every champion goes through to win it all? Not yet
Is Helle the only reason we are playing in an elimination game tonight? No

The fact that he has probably peaked a a player and is on the edge of signing a huge contract presents serious questions for the org, especially considering a significant retool is coming this offseason.

If the Jets need a mini rebuild at the least, they will be at least 3 or more years before they are in a position to contend, and that is on the optimistic end.

If they sign 37 to an albatross contract, that is going to cause new problems, and is a waste of money and cap space.

They'd be better off trading Hellebuyck to a contender and getting back a good young potential starter and high pick (s)

When all is said and done, as good as he's been, he hasn't been good enough to get us over the hump. True, if we had a stronger roster, he may be good enough to win us a championship, but that's not going to happen so you have to make the logical decision.

 

[Jets4Life]

Are you not seeing Tampas coach out there running defense for Vasilevskiy? He's getting torched so much for his awful goaltending his coach has to defend him.

This isn't a Helley thing. It's a competence and consequence thing.

I apologise for butting head with you yesterday, as I have to admit that of all the Jets players, I tend to be homer-ish for Helle. He has not been awful, but he hasn't been lights out either, and in this series, we really need to win the goaltending battle. I would have thought the Jets had the big advantage, of knowing Broissoit inside and out, having been on the Jets before.

I still have nightmares about the Pavelec years, and I truly believe that Hellebuyck will be the best Jets goalie of my lifetime, and I saw quite a few come and go during my childhood in the 80s/90s. He has to come up with a big game tonight.

 

[Jets4Life]

Helle has been a mix of good and bad in the PO. He has always been weak in our last series, thus it is our last series.

In other words, he is like most goaltenders in the NHL

 

[Guffman]

I'm not saying that Helle is bad or that he's the reason we are losing. I'm saying he is not an elite goaltender. I don't know how anyone who has watched this series (or the previous series against VGK for that matter) could seriously argue otherwise.

If we're going to cherry pick series, why not do the same thing for our other players and say how certain top end players suck based on their performances against Vegas in the two playoff series?

How about saying that Vasilevskiy is not elite based on the series against Toronto so far?

Perhaps you can share with us what criteria you would use to define an elite goaltender and then post a couple examples of some elite goaltenders.

Thanks.

 

[Do or Die]

No problem, get rid of Helly and pick up the next one off the ole Goalie Tree....

 

[Heldig]

Elimination game and of course a goal against in the first minute FFS.

 

[White Out 902]

The worst thing we can do as an organization is sign him to an extension where he's eating 10+million.
Best case:
1) you trade him for a haul in off season and rebuild
2) you let him ride it out, he's inconsistent as shit again next year, and hurts his bargaining power for extension and you keep his AAV

worst case:
you back up the truck and unload a 12 million extension

 

[Andreas Ferrari]

Three goals on the first 10 shots. All Hail Saint Hellebuyck!!!

 

[Jets4Life]

We needed above average goaltending in this series, if the Jets had any chance to win. Unfortunately, this will not go down as Helle's finest moments.

 

[winnipegger]

He was a non-factor this series, might as well have played the back up.

 

[Jetfaninflorida]

This post season was only going to be a good one, if Helle was otherworldly. He was just plain old worldly. He didn't lose the series by any stretch of the imagination. But he didn't win us a game either.

 

[kylbaz]

This post season was only going to be a good one, if Helle was otherworldly. He was just plain old worldly. He didn't lose the series by any stretch of the imagination. But he didn't win us a game either.

Exactly. We absolutely needed him to steal a game or two, and that's what top goalies do. Not his fault but the team in general, in two games let Vegas score on their first shot of the game. Look at game two where we were absolutely dominating Vegas in the first, another goal or two there and could have possibly changed the whole series.